Why I am a Pacifican

[Wa Mu]

I am not sure how to respond to this one. Are you OOC?

I will walk this road. There is not a lot to the actual game of CN. 15 minutes at update and your CN nation runs smoothly for years.

I play CN to be a part of NPO. If NPO was gone, I would give my 15 minutes to another game.

I belonged to a hand full of other AAs before joining NPO. Not one of them could hold a candle to NPO.

Considering this is an OOC forum, yes I was OOC.

You have stated that if NPO, the alliance, was to disappear, you too would disappear. Forget the people who make up the alliance. Those are the people who make up the alliance. Couldn't you just create an alliance with friends, and I assume you have friends, and still play? You point of view is that the NPO is the game. I find that somewhat disturbing. It is as if the rest of us are little peons that run around flailing our arms.

Edit: Forgot to take some irrelevant quote out.

Edited June 16, 2009 by Wa Mu

[muffasamini]

You have stated that if NPO, the alliance, was to disappear, you too would disappear. Forget the people who make up the alliance. Those are the people who make up the alliance. Couldn't you just create an alliance with friends, and I assume you have friends, and still play? You point of view is that the NPO is the game. I find that somewhat disturbing. It is as if the rest of us are little peons that run around flailing our arms.

I too would simply leave this game. I've been playing this game for two years, but after experiencing the NPO, I would never do anything else. To me, your correct NPO IS the game. I probably spend 99% of my CN time running or participating in internal NPO biusness, (which includes extensive ambassador duties) and maybe 1% on the actual CN website. Getting trolled in this cesspit, or acting like an over-caffineated hyena to troll others isn't really my idea of fun.

[A Soviet Attack]

NPO are still trying to convince the world that they're superior. Hooray!

[Letum]

We're so arrogant, we love our alliance to the death.

[Matthew Conrad]

We're so arrogant, we love our alliance to the death.

It's more like you're so arrogant because you tend to be blind to your alliance's faults.

[Zombie Glaucon]

We're so arrogant, we love our alliance to the death.

Christ, let's hope so.

[raincoat]

NPO are still trying to convince the world that they're superior. Hooray!

If you want real gems on this check Sarai's posts in the Imperial Decree thread around page 208 where she argues that because the NPO community is bigger and better than the smaller alliances they have attacked, NPO does not deserve these terms.

[KingEsus]

Are you trying to tell Karma that letting the NPO rebuild in any way will end up being a cause for regret?

By the logic of the current Karma reps it would not even need to be the NPO. Just some third party who reckons they are doing Bob a favour by making Karma pay for 'past crimes' they had nothing to do with.

To re-iterate, I like the OP, its been a dark few weeks. Its good to see some positives. And yes, i do believe that the NPO is special. It's deeper. It's it's own thing. Th alliance is not based on a popular film or sci-fi series. Its fully IC, old skool like GATO, NAAC, Legion. No OOC references in it's make up. How many other alliances have flags and tattoos. Some of the recent topics on our boards, pledging allegiance give me the creeps tbh. But i guess if they are all IC, it just goes to show how strong we are.

Edit: Oops forgot to reply to OP.

Edited June 16, 2009 by KingEsus

[kevin32891]

It's more like you're so arrogant because you tend to be blind to your alliance's faults.

That's like... Your opinion man.

[Wa Mu]

That's like... Your opinion man.

Then let me say as a member for half-a-year up until a little after the outbreak of the Karma War, that what he said is true. The Pacifican is blind to the wrongdoings of his or her alliance.

[kevin32891]

Then let me say as a member for half-a-year up until a little after the outbreak of the Karma War, that what he said is true. The Pacifican is blind to the wrongdoings of his or her alliance.

Doing good or evil is a point of view.

[Wa Mu]

Doing good or evil is a point of view.

So you are going to write off the wrongdoings of Pacifica as only possibly evil?

[Letum]

So you are going to write off the wrongdoings of Pacifica as only possibly evil?

This is an OOC forum, so you are not seriously going to claim that the players pushing buttons in a game are actually evil, are you?

[Wa Mu]

This is an OOC forum, so you are not seriously going to claim that the players pushing buttons in a game are actually evil, are you?

I'm only using the terms he is using.

Edit: As for evil, no, I don't believe it is evil. Disrespectful, I believe.

Edited June 16, 2009 by Wa Mu

[Matthew Conrad]

This is an OOC forum, so you are not seriously going to claim that the players pushing buttons in a game are actually evil, are you?

Are you in turn, arguing that the everyone behind the screen is a perfect angel? People do bad things. Whether that's part of their character or not doesn't change what they've done.

[Letum]

I'm only using the terms he is using.

The relativism vs absolutism debate in morality is massive, and will not be solved in an online game. You were not using his terms, you were twisting them in order to say something about the New pacific Order.

Edit: As for evil, no, I don't believe it is evil. Disrespectful, I believe.

Ah yes. Back to your respect thing. You really have a fixation on that. I guess everybody gets to apply their own personal annoyance to CN's native Jews.

You know what I respect? Members of Karma that admit their objective has nothing to do with intangible paper wrappings, and all to do with cold hard reality of them not wanting the New Pacific Order to recover as a threat. I respect people who stand true to themselves. I respect Francesca, even though I stand absolutely opposed to every single thing she's ever done, from MCXA to VE and believe it to lack every ounce of honour. I respect men as diverse as Ivan Moldavi, Archon, Chris_Kaos, mhawk, and Electron Sponge, for being the people they are.

But my respect is not free, no matter how much people like you would like it to be. My respect is a sense of worth for the personal quality of a person; in a way very much detached from their ability, effectiveness or relative moral position. I do not respect as a default, no matter how much you might whine about it, and I never will.

And I do not respect you.

Edited June 16, 2009 by Letum

[Wa Mu]

The relativism vs absolutism debate in morality is massive, and will not be solved in an online game. You were not using his terms, you were twisting them in order to say something about the New pacific Order.

Ah yes. Back to your respect thing. You really have a fixation on that. I guess everybody gets to apply their own personal annoyance to CN's native Jews.

You know what I respect? Members of Karma that admit their objective has nothing to do with intangible paper wrappings, and all to do with cold hard reality of them not wanting the New Pacific Order to recover as a threat. I respect people who stand true to themselves. I respect Francesca, even though I stand absolutely opposed to every single thing she's ever done, from MCXA to VE and believe it to lack every ounce of honour. I respect men as diverse as Ivan Moldavi, Archon, Chris_Kaos, mhawk, and Electron Sponge, for being the people they are.

But my respect is not free, no matter how much people like you would like it to be. My respect is a sense of worth for the personal quality of a person; in a way very much detached from their ability, effectiveness or relative moral position. I do not respect as a default, no matter how much you might whine about it, and I never will.

And I do not respect you.

So, if I may so ask, how have I not stood true to myself and why do I not deserve basic respect as a fellow man?

[Deadshot]

)):

This thread is not about the terms. I could have sworn there was already a thread about that over in AA. We don't want another one here in someone else's thread. Cut it out.

Thank God.

Since the debate in this thread has no moved away from the OP again into the philosophical debate of right v. wrong, good v. evil, maybe someone would like to creat a topic about that?

[Letum]

So, if I may so ask, how have I not stood true to myself and why do I not deserve basic respect as a fellow man?

My respect is a sense of worth for the personal quality of a person

I am sure you can figure it out from that.

[Wa Mu]

I am sure you can figure it out from that.

For the sake of assurance, you say that I am worthless?

[Letum]

For the sake of assurance, you say that I am worthless?

Nope.

You're thinking on the right track though.

[Gn0xious Jr]

So, if I may so ask, how have I not stood true to myself and why do I not deserve basic respect as a fellow man?

Because you did not align your nation to the NPO. If you, as the player, have not aligned your fake nation to the fake alliance of NPO, then you do not deserve respect. :rollseyes:

[Wa Mu]

Nope.

You're thinking on the right track though.

Well, sir, you have defeated me. I am completely dumbfounded. My mind cannot fathom why you cannot respect me as a human. I ask you the following: why do you not respect me?

[Letum]

Well, sir, you have defeated me. I am completely dumbfounded. My mind cannot fathom why you cannot respect me as a human. I ask you the following: why do you not respect me?

Because the status of being a human with enough ability to be able to comprehend most of the things a human being comprehends over its lifetime and with enough resources to come here is not something I would respect.

I realise this is simply a difference in our moral backgrounds. It is probably one of many, though if your mind "cannot fathom" it, I must say you get even less points towards you.

To put it simply, you are not "good" enough for it. What is "good enough" is very subjective, just like the definition of "evil" is subjective. And much like all these insubstantial morality-related characteristics that surround conversations lately, there is no criteria by which you are examined against. This is not a test. I simply know it when I see it. And I see you as small. Not in terms of importance or ability (they have nothing to do with it), but in terms of your soul.

Don't try to find any rationality in it. Right, Wrong and the like are never about rationality.

[Wa Mu]

And to the players of Cyber Nations, I present evidence on the arrogance of Pacifica.