Firestorm Posted June 12, 2009 Report Share Posted June 12, 2009 (edited) "Gentlemen, I come before you with a problem. Earlier today we dealt with the crisis of the 7th Reich. This nation of German interlopers trampled upon the rights of the native Africans to manifest their own governments and destinies. I believe we need to come to some accord regarding the rise of new governments in our protected regions." "Do we want these governments under the control of non-Africans?" "I for one want to see the rise of African governments. Far to many cultures, languages, tribes, and so forth have been trampled under the heels of foreign colonialism. Native Africans should not be subjected to the rule of a minority non-native government. We ask that protected lands be protected from the predations of these non-African groups. Likewise, we do accept that enclaves of non-Africans do exist and that their rights need to be protected as well. However, given the disparity of population and the native rights to self-government we do not believe that protecting the rights of non-African enclaves to govern over larger groups of native Africans." "I know open the floor to discussion," comments Bob's Mother. (OOC: just start talking dudes) Edited June 12, 2009 by Firestorm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2009 LAVO is invited to this as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykep Posted June 12, 2009 Report Share Posted June 12, 2009 "Do we want these governments under the control of non-Africans?" Yes, plan and simple. If they are going to have a European leader, it must be a democracy to show the people want it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 (edited) We have no objections to a democratically elected leader no matter what the nationality. However, we do object to a mass migration of non-natives who impose their cultural values upon the native population. What transpired in the 7th Reich was the colonization of the protectorate lands held by the Rebel Army. These colonialists, of German extraction, did not in anyway seek to hold open elections as I highly doubt the natives would seek to elect a newly arrived foreigner to a high government office. It just doesn't make any sense. In short, we wish to ensure no more attempts at colonization, such as the one that was prevented earlier, in the protected lands. If those lands should choose to organize, grow, prosper, and then for whatever reason they decide to elect a foreign leader that is their choice. (OOC: In short this is to prevent these wandering tribes of Europeans from setting shop and promoting cultural imperialism. I have no objecting to someone democratically electing a foreigner, despite it seeming highly implausible. If it is well role played then I support it as good role play. These takeovers of African territory by European groups who push European governments onto the natives stink of all sorts of objectionable issues. In short this is the manifest destiny of the Protected Lands of Africa. Current governments will not be affected, as they shouldn't be.) Edited June 13, 2009 by Firestorm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpacingOutMan Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 The United Mechodamian States, which exists now in Africa under the former guise of The Republic in Western Africa, may be a newly formed state, but our leadership consists of mutually different racial profiles, ranging from Caucasian to African-born to even Asian in our Finance Dept. Naturally, of course, all have had multiple generations finely ingrained in Africa. So it is in our best interest that African states, nations, and countries be afforded the opportunity to be ran under leaders whom they see fit. [OOC: Dunno if this doesn't apply to me, but yea. I'm in Africa, so yep.] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vedran Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 "New governments that arise in the protectorate regions should be formed from the local population and not up for grabs for foreign powers. That is why we established the protectorates in the first place instead of leaving them as 'white space'." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serg92 Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 "We also believe that the government should be elected by the native persons of said land. They are also no longer in protected lands in Rebel Army but south of My own border in once called Transvaal in former Southern Angola and Zambia." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vedran Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 "We also believe that the government should be elected by the native persons of said land. They are also no longer in protected lands in Rebel Army but south of My own border in once called Transvaal in former Southern Angola and Zambia." "This meeting is to discuss the possibility of further incidents like the one today and how they should be handled. Since the '7th reich' is in Transvaal's sphere of influence they are Malan's problem now, not the TADP's concern." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 The United Mechodamian States, which exists now in Africa under the former guise of The Republic in Western Africa, may be a newly formed state, but our leadership consists of mutually different racial profiles, ranging from Caucasian to African-born to even Asian in our Finance Dept. Naturally, of course, all have had multiple generations finely ingrained in Africa. So it is in our best interest that African states, nations, and countries be afforded the opportunity to be ran under leaders whom they see fit.[OOC: Dunno if this doesn't apply to me, but yea. I'm in Africa, so yep.] OOC: SOM I didn't know you did CNRP. Welcome.. IC: The Republic of Free Somal wishes to visit this UMS to watch your government in action. The multiple generations of habitation and peaceful coexistence is of interest to us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthey Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 Just to interject an alternative opinion, why should they have to be a democracy? As long as it serves the interests of their people is the government not just? Nationality, race and what not are irrelevant and outdated things built upon bad science, and predudice. Who cares what the chemical composition of a person's skin is or where they were born, they are humans none the less, and as long as they work to protect the lives of the people they are responsible for and better them materially who are we to judge them for that? That being said I say we watch, if they can't act to our standards then they go; its a fairly simple litmus test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 (edited) Again it comes down to Imperialism. The Republic of Free Somal is not going to sit idly by while outsiders impose a regime on the natives of Africa. Existing governments are not of a concern to us. This smugness that some bring to the table is all pervading in the attitudes of some foreigners that only they seem to know what is best for Africa. I reject this notion and call upon the signatories of the TADP to consider making a formal position against the colonization of Protected lands in the manner that the 7th Reich attempted. This is a move to ensure that our future actions are guided as one rather than an ongoing dispute whilst the indigneous people's rights are torn from them by yet another 'well meaning' outside power. I think Africa has suffered enough at the hands of these 'well meaning' individuals. Edited June 13, 2009 by Firestorm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpacingOutMan Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 OOC: SOM I didn't know you did CNRP. Welcome..IC: The Republic of Free Somal wishes to visit this UMS to watch your government in action. The multiple generations of habitation and peaceful coexistence is of interest to us. OOC: Yep, Mykep convinced me and so here I am, in CNRP to kill time while CN stagnates again for another year IC: The UMS has no qualms with such a request, but we encourage all parties interested in our racial demographics to be patient as we draft our official charter in which we organize government. At the current moment it is a rag team of members who helped support and advance our dissolution from The Republic. I do believe though that despite the color of one's skin or their lineage, if they are African-born they should be instantly granted the right to exist as a nation of free people. The UMS understands what the Europeans have done to our fair continent and we understand the plight that many have undergone. Our states (OOC: Gambia & Senegal) have suffered a great deal throughout the history of mass imperialism. We will not, and shall not, allow such acts of belligerent colonization to ever occur again to our people. However, there are pockets of European-descended Africans, such as myself, Kilik Torqameda, who disseminated through the generations over the years. They, and their populace, should be given the chance to sovereignty, even for a test period. With that in mind, though, to have a foreigner enter and try to gather a rebellious group of individuals to create a nation state for unknown and possibly nefarious reasons should be unacceptable. The UMS shall do whatever it can in its power to support Africa, despite our racial divide that ultimately allowed our cessation from The Republic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vedran Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 (edited) An explanation directed at iamthey: "Mr. Mad Dog's (or Bob's Mom's?) views here stem from the centuries of colonization and exploitation that Europeans inflicted upon Africa. Arctica's reaons are different while still sharing the same view on which course of action should be taken. Our interest is simply the stability of Africa and the continent's non-alignment in relation to international 'bloc politics' and superpower conflicts which would tear us apart (as they have other regions) if allowed to exist here. Our issue with the 7th Reich is not that they were not natively African. Arctica's own government is largely composed of Europeans who migrated here from the frigid north. Our issue is that they were specifically German, and a 'reich', and thus most likely to align themselves with the GNR, and thus we opposed their land claim in Libya because it would go against Arctica's desire of seeing the continent being free from foreign powers." Edited June 13, 2009 by Vedran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 OOC: Yep, Mykep convinced me and so here I am, in CNRP to kill time while CN stagnates again for another yearIC: The UMS has no qualms with such a request, but we encourage all parties interested in our racial demographics to be patient as we draft our official charter in which we organize government. At the current moment it is a rag team of members who helped support and advance our dissolution from The Republic. I do believe though that despite the color of one's skin or their lineage, if they are African-born they should be instantly granted the right to exist as a nation of free people. The UMS understands what the Europeans have done to our fair continent and we understand the plight that many have undergone. Our states (OOC: Gambia & Senegal) have suffered a great deal throughout the history of mass imperialism. We will not, and shall not, allow such acts of belligerent colonization to ever occur again to our people. However, there are pockets of European-descended Africans, such as myself, Kilik Torqameda, who disseminated through the generations over the years. They, and their populace, should be given the chance to sovereignty, even for a test period. With that in mind, though, to have a foreigner enter and try to gather a rebellious group of individuals to create a nation state for unknown and possibly nefarious reasons should be unacceptable. The UMS shall do whatever it can in its power to support Africa, despite our racial divide that ultimately allowed our cessation from The Republic. The Republic of Free Somal is pleased that you identify these descendants as Africans, rather than Europeans that live in Africa. The situation which arose earlier was blatant imperialism. Your situation has the appearance of seeming very different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthey Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 (edited) Again it comes down to Imperialism. The Republic of Free Somal is not going to sit idly by while outsiders impose a regime on the natives of Africa. Existing governments are not of a concern to us. This smugness that some bring to the table is all pervading in the attitudes of some foreigners that only they seem to know what is best for Africa. I reject this notion and call upon the signatories of the TADP to consider making a formal position against the colonization of Protected lands in the manner that the 7th Reich attempted. This is a move to ensure that our future actions are guided as one rather than an ongoing dispute whilst the indigneous people's rights are torn from them by yet another 'well meaning' outside power. I think Africa has suffered enough at the hands of these 'well meaning' individuals. As this bloc was formed to promote a sense of brotherhood I hope you are alright if we speak frankly... Anyway, that is precisely my point, its not imperialism unless we make it so. There is no outsider, there is no native, there are only people; what makes them native or what makes them the "other" is just our own conception of what native is. The attitude you express is no different than that of a racist westerner who wants to keep the Hispanic, or the African man out as he fears they are a detriment to the native ideal. Just because they happen to be a Caucasian, or because their ancestors are of European decent doesn't make it any less racist to discriminate them and drive them from the opportunity to lead. That being said there is no true native African, there are only people who happen to live in Africa. What makes these people any less worthy to rule than someone who's ancestors were born here? OOC: Also I think it sets a bad precedent to be wiping out RP's on the basis of internal storyline. (Unless its something serious like a genocide) I mean I have always operated under the assumption that ethnicity in a particular area didn't always correlate to RL ethnicity, and that culture, history ectra could be fantasy. Edited June 13, 2009 by iamthey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Minister Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 IC: The Nation of Nod formally rejects this pact, while simultaneously adopting an isolationist approach to factions that accept this...Any further attempts to push this pact on the NoN will be treated as coercion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime minister Johns Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 Novus Niciae is now a part of Africa and the Middle East for better or worse. We maintain that race is irrelevant in our society, we are all the same and we can all potentially archive the same if given the proper circumstances for growth. The Nician Government also maintains a policy that any person can access education and advance their position and standing in our society to the limit of their abilities. We do not consider ourselves to be an Asian, European or African nation, these are quaint notions that belong in the past, we are a Nician nation, a gestalt of all the peoples and cultures that the world can offer, we may have people descended from Africans, Asians, Arabs, Europeans or other groups, but they are Nicians first and they may follow their culture and religion without interference and enjoy our protection of their values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 As this bloc was formed to promote a sense of brotherhood I hope you are alright if we speak frankly...Anyway, that is precisely my point, its not imperialism unless we make it so. There is no outsider, there is no native, there are only people; what makes them native or what makes them the "other" is just our own conception of what native is. The attitude you express is no different than that of a racist westerner who wants to keep the Hispanic, or the African man out as he fears they are a detriment to the native ideal. Just because they happen to be a Caucasian, or because their ancestors are of European decent doesn't make it any less racist to discriminate them and drive them from the opportunity to lead. That being said there is no true native African, there are only people who happen to live in Africa. What makes these people any less worthy to rule than someone who's ancestors were born here? Spoken like a true outsider with his own interests to protect. The people of the Republic of Free Somal are Africans. We've suffered under the yoke of European imperialism. We can't abide by this lack of a united front against further aggressive expansionism. For this reason we immediately terminate out membership in this accord. The Republic of Free Somal will provide weapons and training to any native African groups who wish to attempt to overthrow their European governments no matter how benevolent they claim to be. African is for Africans and not those that are looking for an easy ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vedran Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 The Republic of Free Somal will provide weapons and training to any native African groups who wish to attempt to overthrow their European governments no matter how benevolent they claim to be. "Attempting to overthrow Arctica's government, when perpetrated or supported by a foreign power has always been considered an act of war on that foreign power's part. I caution you to reconsider your statements." The Republic of Free Somal has received a notice that all commercial shipping between Arctica and Somal is to cease immediately. Somalian ships already en route at the time the notice was issued will still be allowed to dock but will be subjected to excessive and possibly humiliating searches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestorm Posted June 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 (edited) "We absolutely had no idea commercial shipping existed between our two countries to begin with. However, do whatever it is that makes you feel better about yourself. And seriously, we weren't planning to provide arms and training to African resistance movements openly. When you catch us, come shake your nuts at us, but not before. Until then keep them in your pants, because we aren't interested." "And on that note our participation in this conference is finished," states the representative from the Republic of Free Somal as he stands and exits. Edited June 13, 2009 by Firestorm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vedran Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 The representative mutters something under his breath after the representative from Somal leaves. Then he addresses the remaining attendees of the meeting. "And now it might be prudent to turn the topic of discussion here towards Somal. Its sudden withdrawal from the TADP combined with its threats to support the overthrow of sovereign nations, its upcoming military buildup (they've put out a public offer to buy large amounts of armored vehicles), and the fact that its leader was or is a simple warlord demands attention. In light of these events, I think Somal has become a security risk." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo Shanofan Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 While we will not be joining in this pact we believe Somal's threatening actions should be met with force before his belief of being an "African protector" provides reason for any hostile action towards Africa itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelstrom Vortex Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 A Dragon Empire courier makes it known he wishes to address this council. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime minister Johns Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 The Republic of Free Somal will provide weapons and training to any native African groups who wish to attempt to overthrow their European governments no matter how benevolent they claim to be. We urge Free Somal to retract this statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelstrom Vortex Posted June 13, 2009 Report Share Posted June 13, 2009 ooc: They already did, different thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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