Denial

[quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1299376690' post='2653973'] No significant alliances acted without any treaty at all. (That is to say, Mr Damsky declared war without a treaty. Good luck squeezing reps out of him. You should probably get them right after thedestro sends UPN some reps.) Alliances who attacked GOONS due to mandatory treaty clauses: Invicta Legion NSO Olympus TPF Alliances who attacked GOONS due to optional treaty clauses: 64 Digits Avalon CoJ The Last Republic NAC Sanitarium That's it. [/quote] ... And your point is what, exactly? I really do wonder whether you just make up posts in your mind to respond to, or just entirely misinterpret everything anyone ever says. If you look back to my post, you'll notice I said "when alliances make a clear choice to be involved in the counter-attack - that is, they acted though optional treaty clauses, or no treaty at all". So uhh, thanks - I guess - for providing me with a concise list of all those who will be subject to a higher degree of punishment following the war's conclusion (those entering on optional grounds, i.e. made the choice to enter). [quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1299377577' post='2653985'] Actually, yes, that is how it works. Reps only exist when alliances decide to pay them. If no alliances decide to pay reps, then that does actually eliminate them from planet Bob. [/quote] If a tree falls in the forest, but nobody is there to hear it, does it really make a sound? makes u think...

[quote name='Vol Navy' timestamp='1299367832' post='2653851'] And alliances on this side pretty much say flip you and your terms. We've saw that even massive reps make not a single bit of difference other than to strengthen your side for the next time you decide to roll us. I would personally rather be at bill lock and triple Z than to see a single unit of technology flow from here towards PB/DH. This planet is old and withered and if my nation must perish off it after nearly 4 years, so be it. [/quote] Enjoy burning.

[quote name='Vol Navy' timestamp='1299365468' post='2653811'] I agree completely, you were extremely aggressive in starting this coalition war. GOOns shouldn't complain when they are responded to after starting an aggressive war. You were all for no treaty at all being required for Sparta earlier in the Polar front. Now everyone from your side complains that GOOns are responded to by actual treaties. It's bold faced hypocrisy. If you don't want to be responded too, don't start aggressive wars just because you don't like someone. [/quote] As far as I see it, neither GOONS nor Doom House as a whole have a single issue with the act of being counter-attacked. Yet, when alliances make a clear [i]choice[/i] to be involved in the counter-attack - that is, they acted though optional treaty clauses, or no treaty at all - they better believe they are going to receive a swift and devastating reprimand for such action upon losing the war. Just as I would have expected Doom House to receive quite harsh terms had we lost this conflict.

[quote name='Vanilla Napalm' timestamp='1299305967' post='2653247'] What about Umbrella? more importantly, what about GOONS!? [/quote] You've had your turn, greedy GOONS

[quote name='deSouza' timestamp='1290689309' post='2522974'] one playground less for MK's children. [/quote] Won't somebody please think of the children!?

I wonder if this one will receive 50 pages of "nobody cares" and "ur just trying to divert attention from ur bleeding pr meow meow meow ". Anyway, despite how late this reaction is, it is a welcome one. Let's hope it all escalates!

[quote name='NotYou' timestamp='1290646421' post='2522565'] Good luck Daks and the rest of TOOL [/quote] Why do you feel it is necessary to threaten TOOL?

I must admit I wasn't aware TOOL still existed. You guys have been quiet.

[quote name='bros2' timestamp='1290572917' post='2521799'] We also do not punish members for spilling their alcoholic beverages on it [/quote] tbh we'd probably punish members if they actually owned a flag in general

[quote name='SoulVici' timestamp='1290569653' post='2521734'] The lenses of jealousy blind one from the truth. [/quote] I see you got the Fisher Price Kit of Pacifican Posting for your birthday.

I remember when bros used to make these "I remember..." threads.

[quote name='SoulVici' timestamp='1290563531' post='2521659'] It's less the flag itself and more the fact that it's NPO's flag. Which naturally makes it awesome. We could have a plain white flag and it would still be the best flag on bob. The white flag example is also why we, contrary to popular belief, won karma. [/quote] You're trying way too hard.

[quote name='SoulVici' timestamp='1290556208' post='2521570'] Congrats on the new flag MK. Unfortunately all the effort is for not as NPO still has the single best flag on bob. [/quote] You guys should have stayed with the 'Strength, Peace, Prosperity' one imo.

There's nothing I don't like about this announcement. It's an absolute pleasure to see, and our artists did a great job with the flag and new signatures. But I'm particularly proud to finally see The Enclave established; it's tempting me to get involved in government again somewhere down the line. Watch your back, SomeGuy

So, it appears the New Pacific Order is harboring a failed usurper of the throne. I sincerely hope we respond to this heinous act with martial means.

Wow, for something apparently no one cared about, this sure provoked a lot of discussion*! * albeit most of it mind-numbingly stupid

I completely agree. Whenever I post my feelings on this, however, it usually gets disregarded by the 'other side' as propaganda or a PR campaign or part of some invisible hegemonist plot, so it's nice to see it from someone who can loosely be associated with that 'other side'. Edit: I forgot to mention that, in my eyes, this line of thinking also applies to those in the dominant side who are content with enjoying the status quo and have an aversion to taking risks for the sake of fun. If I have any say in the matter (admittedly, I don't have much, with my self-imposed restriction to only low-level alliance positions due to time constraints), it won't be allowed to continue that way for much longer.

[quote name='lebubu' timestamp='1289499639' post='2510495'] I always come to these threads seeking clarification on my alliance's foreign policy and relations, don't you? [/quote] I just head straight to HeroofTime and Alterego posts for my enlightenment.

[quote name='uaciaut' timestamp='1289473996' post='2510310'] I don't know about NV but i'm sure glad you're not in the allied alliances membership base anymore. [/quote] Toad's Kitchen is certainly a better place.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1289374220' post='2509155'] <snip> [/quote] You should write novels or something. I would advise a great fiction, as you've demonstrated great capacity for making up stories. [quote name='WorldConqueror' timestamp='1289374224' post='2509156'] Except that it wasn't a smear campaign, you did request that NSO pay you a sum equivalent to 7.5 times the money you paid in the first place. [/quote] It is a smear campaign when it consists of hyperbole, misinformation and downright lies. Yes, we did make the initial demand of $15m and 250 tech, but no, that was not the final offer, and no, we were not looking for war. Yes, there was room for negotiation. A number of avenues were available to the New Sith Order, including going above the officials involved and appealing to the high government. [quote name='WorldConqueror' timestamp='1289374224' post='2509156'] Over an action that was taken by one nation, who, even if they were an NSO member at the time, was booted and free for you to attack at your leisure. And considering that no alliance has asked for 'reparations' from another alliance due to a nation skipping out on a paid-for trade circle before, I find your attempt to paint yourselves as the victim quite amusing.[/quote] This simplifies the situation in a manner that excuses the behaviour of NSO. They were intransigent, difficult to work with, and were purposely negotiating in bad faith in an attempt to one-up us - which is always to their own detriment in the end, and is a proven pattern of behaviour - as Yev explained above, but we called them on it. [quote name='WorldConqueror' timestamp='1289374224' post='2509156'] Demonstrating your resolve to continue on a ludicrous course isn't something laudable.[/quote] If our actions were being applauded by you and your ilk, we'd be doing something wrong.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1289372162' post='2509122'] Playing the [i]victim[/i]? [i]Really[/i]? "Oh, poor us, we were left with no choice but to keep trying to extort ridiculous sums from the NSO!" [/quote] That's not at all what Quiz said. Just a tip: when you attempt to spin someone's words, you need to at least leave [i]some[/i] of the thrust of the original message in. You're really quite bad at this. What Quiz is arguing is not that we had no choice in the matter. The Kingdom made quite a deliberate choice, a choice to demonstrate our resolve and make it clear that we do not capitulate in the face of smear campaigns and some righteous indignation from the usual faux moral crusaders. As I have explained previously, if the New Sith Order was interested in negotiating a lower amount of compensation, then heading to this forum and trying to score a few cheap PR points, rather than approaching MK high government with a reasoned and well-expressed case, was not the way to do it.

[quote name='Geoffron X' timestamp='1289370045' post='2509089'] Answer this, then. Why does bringing things into public, non-secret things mind you, have a cost? [/quote] It's not so much that it has a cost, it's that doing so ruins any chance of renegotiation. If bringing things out into the public arena and criticising Mushroom Kingdom had a cost, there'd be little tech left in alliances such as BAPS, 64Digits, Invicta, and so on. I realise that our detractors probably won't accept it, but the simple fact is - as has been explained on numerous occasions - there was clear potential to have the demanded sum reduced. That potential disappeared once NSO decided to commence a smear campaign. The Kingdom does not bow down to smear campaigns, negative 'PR', or the collective frothing at the mouth of faux moral crusaders. The Kingdom does, however, respond to reasoned debate and a clearly-expressed case. Edit: 'Kingdom' does not have an 'n' at the end

[quote name='Panic King' timestamp='1289360193' post='2508945'] Now this I can get behind.... you are an honorable man PK [/quote] You forgot the applause.

[quote name='Merrie Melodies' timestamp='1289359250' post='2508917'] Can we negotiate that amount? [/quote] It depends on whether you'll run off and start a smear campaign about it or not

[quote name='Merrie Melodies' timestamp='1289358730' post='2508908'] Nice to see some honesty out of MK, allow me to retort to your threat, there is absolutley nothing MK can do to me that hasn't been done in the past, there is nothing for me to watch out for, I know your hoodlums can roll me at will and I don't care. [/quote] That'll be 50 tech, thanks.