Minus 10k since Karma and possible reasons why...

[Kzoppistan]

[quote name='Fernando12' timestamp='1285983657' post='2471762']
He was MoFA of ROK, how is that lower Gov?
[/quote]

[quote name='Xiphosis' timestamp='1285985818' post='2471793']
It's lower gov considering that spot in RoK gets you nowhere near any of the higher backchannels.
[/quote]

[quote name='SpoiL' timestamp='1285987638' post='2471826']
Did Hoo tell you this? Might want to check with him first.
[/quote]

[quote name='Xiphosis' timestamp='1285988405' post='2471846']
I don't need Hoo to tell me who's in channels I'm in myself.
[/quote]

Are you sure? I didn't see you in there.








Hoo needs to revamp his old puppet sig.

Edited October 2, 2010 by Kzoppistan

[wickedj]

[quote name='We Are Not Alone' timestamp='1286046058' post='2472375']
From a former RoK'kers point of view I can tell you personally that Hoo has all the power. Hoo has his select few who he consults with and thats it. The rest of RoK is just his peons and lower gov to do the rest of the jobs that he doesn't want to do.
[/quote]
You sound mad.

how about instead of leaping to conclusions you let Hoo run his alliane and you all run yours...strange concept i know

[Xerxer]

[quote name='wickedj' timestamp='1286048516' post='2472406']
You sound mad.

how about instead of leaping to conclusions you let Hoo run his alliane and you all run yours...strange concept i know
[/quote]

U mad?

[Fernando12]

[quote name='Captain Flinders' timestamp='1286038946' post='2472291']
Given this insight, I'm amazingly thankful you're not running our government for I doubt we'd last very long. Maybe you were high enough in the world to become disenchanted but not high enough to know this, but Nordreich doesn't need to "force" our allies to do anything. Our allies, every single one of them, have given us unending support in all areas at all time. And we extend them the same. This is how allies work, at least, how they work for Nordreich.

You really must not have been as much in the loop as you thought you were if you thought Nordreich asked permission fro RoK to go to war.
[/quote]
Xerxer was the one that implied Nordreich or other allies needing Hoo's yes to do anything. I used the word force. Ok, I meant more make it clear to allies what the case for war is and let them know and not in any way ask if they would join a war or permission from them like if they say no then my alliance's grievance would just be pushed under the rug. If I believe a war is necessary then I would go ahead and do it even if allies didn't come along. I also said if IF war was worth it, the grievance would have to be such to merit going it alone even if allies didn't come along. Anyways, I have no doubt if Nordreich felt a need to go to war that your allies would be on board. You seem to have wrongly taken it as an offense or something, it wasn't my intent.

Xiphosis stated he doesn't care about whether "elite fews" control the world. I agree, I don't care either because it's the way the world works. What I am trying to get across is that maybe more nations would stay around if their alliances or if they themselves worked more to create their own "side". We have 2 sides, a strong and a weak. If war happened today with all big alliances involved we know the result. If some alliances with common treaties/friends would work to create their own "side(s)" I believe it would create more power players. Of course this would only work if these sides actually somewhat isolated themselves from the other sides.

For example: Having 8 power clusters could increase the importance of each of the alliances in each power cluster. I said it a while back in a thread I don't remember which but, the reason multiple power clusters won't happen is because the level of security would be very low. At any time 2-3 power clusters could decide to go to war against one and roll them. So, alliances maintain connections to the big treaty web. If their were 8 power clusters it would only be a matter of time before each cluster goes out to treaty one major alliance from the other clusters.

I think that could unstagnate Bob, but it's highly unlikely to happen. So power will be maintained by a few alliances and a few people. I believe it renders many nations practically useless. These nations get a they don't need me type of feeling and my nation will never be in the back channels of power so why stay. Soon the nation is gone. This and what I stated about Karma being the major climax for many of the victors and losers...the result of Karma was the end for many on both sides.

Edited October 2, 2010 by Fernando12

[wickedj]

[quote name='Xerxer' timestamp='1286049077' post='2472410']
U mad?
[/quote]
nah, i'd say WANA and Fernando are the maddest

[Xerxer]

[quote name='wickedj' timestamp='1286060677' post='2472558']
nah, i'd say WANA and Fernando are the maddest
[/quote]

That's pretty much an umbrella statement at this point.

[Shimmer]

I suppose everyone already knew this was a problem. Thank you Captain Obvious.

The real message here is be careful of who your friends are or you believe is trust-able. Some of them become washed-up and irrelevant and then proceed to attempt to log-dump themselves back to relevancy. I haven't been tracking alliance affairs for quite some time, but the game hasn't changed all that much.

Those in power do everything possible to remain that way, while trying to not step on those toes who could swing to the other side creating a momentum shift causing those in power to be rolled. This leads to the why we create paper thin CB's. They don't have to be good, but they have to be useful enough so the alliances in question can attempt to spin the CB as legitimate.

[Fernando12]

[quote name='TimLee' timestamp='1286071533' post='2472673']
...washed-up and irrelevant
[/quote]

Says you

You and FIRE are a perfect example of one of my arguments. FIRE returns and gets up to around 80 members and 1.6mil NS. It treaties the two major blocs. You promote the status quo. You don't forge your own identity. You make existence for the nations of your alliance boring and not worth it. Your high is over and FIRE is quickly burning out because of unimaginative leaders that are only representatives of FIRE and will be told what to do by the leaders of Bob. FIRE and countless other alliances are killing its own membership count. The stupid defense I can hear already is "if these nations are inactive then we don't want them." Maybe some are just horribly inactive, but maybe some were bored to death by you the unimaginative and unambitious "leaders" of <insert alliance here>.

September 4th - 1,623,593
October 3rd - 1,194,530
[img]http://i22.servimg.com/u/f22/14/32/95/80/fire10.jpg[/img]

[Xerxer]

So was FAR out there forging its own destiny? You guys were the frontier of the new age right?

[Qaianna]

Some of us LIKED being peons After all, if everyone's a leader, who's being led?

More seriously, tho, Ms Mann described how independence tends to be outside of stability; ironically, some think that they need independence to gain stability. (If that's the case, you may want to act on it ... ) Part, of course, boils down to how one defines 'independent'. Does it mean controlling your own destiny? Who really can do that anymore? Even at the height of its power, I think part of what kept the emperors of the New Pacific Order busy was making sure to carefully balance forces to allow its own policies to stay intact. Despite being 'the' power centre of the time, they had to toe the line.

And if someone is too independent, how can you really interact with them? One could argue that the Green Protection Agency is truly independent; aside from some participation in the colour-based United Jungle Accords, they remain apart from most of the world's politics. (I think.) They're pretty much as independent as you can get without merging with the Grey Council. How much respect is accorded them for this?