SWAT128 Posted August 17, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 [quote name='Peggy_Sue' timestamp='1282000877' post='2418360'] SWAT, nice spin. But as we chatted in a public IRC channel, we can go back to that for reference if need be. I told you there is too much money in your warchest to let you up ... I offered to let you up if you sent 3M to each of the small nations you warred ... 4 or 5 I think. That would have left you with maybe 12 million today... I'm guesstimating from last week when you told me the value of your warchest. You see, last I spied your warchest I extrapolated to last week and figured you still had many millions more than you claim. Why is that important to me? Because it is likely you'll come right back after these festivities end. I'd prefer to know your warchest is miniscule. [/quote] I'm not spinning anything, so I'm not sure where you get a comment like that from. If you want to go back on your word, then so be it. But UPN is not getting any reps from me period. If ZI wasn't enough for you then I guess we'll be at war for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted August 17, 2010 Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 (edited) [quote name='fluffyewunga' timestamp='1281992516' post='2418232'] Consiering the last 2 times UPN fought RnR i'd say your the last person to call out their fighting ability. Since the stats show they returned your burning allaince back to u on silver platters twice u'd best not embarress yourself any further. [/quote] hahaha what the heck? [quote]Why not accept him into CSN and force UPN to let him go? Maybe because they're not a 1/3rd of CSN's size? [/quote] Continued taunting will end well for you and your alliance. You have stressed relations with CSN enough already. Walk away and stop digging your hole before I bury you in it. Edited August 17, 2010 by Penkala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunder Strike Posted August 17, 2010 Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 [quote name='JWConner' timestamp='1281993128' post='2418245'] Why not accept him into CSN and force UPN to let him go? Maybe because they're not a 1/3rd of CSN's size? [/quote] I'm calling dibs for the RIA on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un4Gvn1 Posted August 17, 2010 Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 (edited) [quote name='SWAT128' timestamp='1282010574' post='2418537'] I'm not spinning anything, so I'm not sure where you get a comment like that from. If you want to go back on your word, then so be it. But UPN is not getting any reps from me period. If ZI wasn't enough for you then I guess we'll be at war for a while. [/quote] ZI with a large warchest left over and you insisting on white peace -- meaning you'd not agree to not declare on UPN nations again -- means you need to have the warchest depleted in addition to ZI. Simple. Edit: If Maroon senate had seen fit to sanction your trades, then ZI and 30-some million warchest would have been enough and we'd be done with these festivities. [quote name='Goose' timestamp='1281991246' post='2418210'] PZI/EZI is bad. [/quote] You brought that out of thin air. I do not condone PZI or EZI. NOTE to everyone that isn't directly involved in the matter that is posting in this thread: Please look at the "Display All Nations" page ... we are now down to 22,000 nations. Do you suppose the hostile environment of the OWF has anything to do with that? For every person that posts here I know about 4 that refuse to participate. Please try to get a clue. Edited August 17, 2010 by Peggy_Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted August 17, 2010 Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Peggy_Sue' timestamp='1282062949' post='2419774'] ZI with a large warchest left over and you insisting on white peace -- meaning you'd not agree to not declare on UPN nations again -- means you need to have the warchest depleted in addition to ZI. Simple. Edit: If Maroon senate had seen fit to sanction your trades, then ZI and 30-some million warchest would have been enough and we'd be done with these festivities. You brought that out of thin air. I do not condone PZI or EZI. NOTE to everyone that isn't directly involved in the matter that is posting in this thread: Please look at the "Display All Nations" page ... we are now down to 22,000 nations. Do you suppose the hostile environment of the OWF has anything to do with that? For every person that posts here I know about 4 that refuse to participate. Please try to get a clue. [/quote] Why does it matter? You're playing games to keep him at war longer for no reason. What is $6 or $12m less on his nation going to change? He could be aided that back again in one round. [quote]Do you suppose the hostile environment of the OWF has anything to do with that? For every person that posts here I know about 4 that refuse to participate. Please try to get a clue. [/quote] No, I'm guessing it has more to do with stupid stuff like keeping people at war for months for going rogue more than people criticizing your policy. If people are ruining their nations because they don't like a few people criticizing UPN's decision to PZI a nation (and that is what you're doing; ZIing a nation is just that. PZiing is continuing your attack past ZI.) then they don't deserve to lead their nations. And what the maroon senate does should have no bearing on the length of war. He's ZIed. You said at ZI he would get white peace. What, do you think you're punishing certain maroon alliances by preventing him from joining them? Once again, PZIing someone is a terrible idea, and using that in an effort to flip a certain maroon alliance the finger isn't going to work out well for you. [quote]Why not accept him into CSN and force UPN to let him go? Maybe because they're not a 1/3rd of CSN's size? [/quote] VA has 100 members. CSN has 130. Not our fault you can't deal with rogues and that 3 nations completely devastated your alliance to the point that you're less than 1/2 the NS of CSN. Don't piss off people and maybe your alliance will stop being leveled! Edited August 17, 2010 by Penkala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magicspoon Posted August 17, 2010 Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1282063889' post='2419801'] No, I'm guessing it has more to do with stupid stuff like keeping people at war for months for going rogue more than people criticizing your policy. If people are ruining their nations because they don't like a few people criticizing UPN's decision to PZI a nation (and that is what you're doing; ZIing a nation is just that. PZiing is continuing your attack past ZI.) then they don't deserve to lead their nations. VA has 100 members. CSN has 130. Not our fault you can't deal with rogues and that 3 nations completely devastated your alliance to the point that you're less than 1/2 the NS of CSN. Don't piss off people and maybe your alliance will stop being leveled! [/quote] For the record Swat has not been at war for months, it has been under 3 weeks. If you go rouge in CN you have to expect some consequences for your actions, and if that means your nation gets completely run into the ground for a month then so be it. Everyone seems to be forgetting that he has caused us a lot of damage as well and initiated this, so take that into consideration before you go feeling to sorry for him. And for your second comment about not pissing people off, maybe you should take your own advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted August 17, 2010 Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1282063889' post='2419801'] VA has 100 members. CSN has 130. Not our fault you can't deal with rogues and that 3 nations completely devastated your alliance to the point that you're less than 1/2 the NS of CSN. Don't piss off people and maybe your alliance will stop being leveled! [/quote] LOL. I love it. Actually, 1 rogue did damage. You were a pest, and psweet was dealt with in like a day or two. Don't lump yourself in with the damage that BK did. You just sat around the 3k NS mark and hit our little guys with bb guns. So stop the grandstanding. You didn't do anything other than annoy us...which happens to be what you're best at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWAT128 Posted August 17, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2010 [quote name='Peggy_Sue' timestamp='1282062949' post='2419774'] ZI with a large warchest left over and you insisting on white peace -- meaning you'd not agree to not declare on UPN nations again -- means you need to have the warchest depleted in addition to ZI. Simple. Edit: If Maroon senate had seen fit to sanction your trades, then ZI and 30-some million warchest would have been enough and we'd be done with these festivities. You brought that out of thin air. I do not condone PZI or EZI. NOTE to everyone that isn't directly involved in the matter that is posting in this thread: Please look at the "Display All Nations" page ... we are now down to 22,000 nations. Do you suppose the hostile environment of the OWF has anything to do with that? For every person that posts here I know about 4 that refuse to participate. Please try to get a clue. [/quote] This is my warchest [img]http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g50/MaverickSWAT/Mywarchest.png[/img] It is by no means large, so I'm still not sure what your problem is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Magicspoon' timestamp='1282077115' post='2420167'] For the record Swat has not been at war for months, it has been under 3 weeks. If you go rouge in CN you have to expect some consequences for your actions, and if that means your nation gets completely run into the ground for a month then so be it. Everyone seems to be forgetting that he has caused us a lot of damage as well and initiated this, so take that into consideration before you go feeling to sorry for him. And for your second comment about not pissing people off, maybe you should take your own advice. [/quote] A rogue action is relatively minor and inconsequential. If we ever have you on the losing side of a war I'll remember how you treated this, though. I'll be sure to recommend we continue the war until all your nations have less than $10m left and are at ZI. No rebuilding for UPN! You'd be cool with it if I did that, right? [quote] LOL. I love it. Actually, 1 rogue did damage. You were a pest, and psweet was dealt with in like a day or two. Don't lump yourself in with the damage that BK did. You just sat around the 3k NS mark and hit our little guys with bb guns. So stop the grandstanding. You didn't do anything other than annoy us...which happens to be what you're best at. [/quote] By my count my 'bb gun' did a hell of a lot of damage, since 8 of your members quit VA after I attacked them. Well, 7. You kicked one out and threw him to the wolves rather than pay me $3m reps. Then you aided the guy and now he's still a rogue but you owe me money anyways. That kinda backfired! Oh yeah, and this is the second nation VA kicked out for following orders and attacking us after a ceasefire. Way to throw your members under the bus, VA. Edited August 18, 2010 by Penkala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1282091119' post='2420659'] By my count my 'bb gun' did a hell of a lot of damage, since 8 of your members quit VA after I attacked them. Well, 7. You kicked one out and threw him to the wolves rather than pay me $3m reps. Then you aided the guy and now he's still a rogue but you owe me money anyways. That kinda backfired! Oh yeah, and this is the second nation VA kicked out for following orders and attacking us after a ceasefire. Way to throw your members under the bus, VA. [/quote] LOL. I am so loving watching you talk crap here. You seriously have no idea how much. If you only knew what was actually going on. Oh, and these "7 members" you ran out were inactive losses. Good job taking credit there. As for those that we released from VA....I love watching you make an *$* out of yourself. You have no idea how big my smile is right now. Maybe you should have a chat with some of your gov before speaking further (oh, and only the ones who are up to date with current affairs...you know who I'm talkin' about) So while I applaud your attempt at mockery, you failed quite wonderfully. Oh, and those reps....LOL! Edit: Oh...and if CSN gov that knows what is actually going on decides to get online, I'll be on IRC for the next 30 mins. We should have a chat... Edited August 18, 2010 by JWConner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bones Malone Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='Peggy_Sue' timestamp='1282062949' post='2419774'] ZI with a large warchest left over and you insisting on white peace -- meaning you'd not agree to not declare on UPN nations again -- means you need to have the warchest depleted in addition to ZI. Simple. Edit: If Maroon senate had seen fit to sanction your trades, then ZI and 30-some million warchest would have been enough and we'd be done with these festivities. [/quote] I try to rationalize UPN's current position this way: Were the shoe on the other foot, and Cat Land held certain UPN nations at ZI and kept attacking them even after publicly stating that ZI was as far as things were going to go, would I protest and call it an outrage? The honest answer is that it depends on the UPN nation hurr. In all seriousness though I would like to think that I would protest maybe a little (I'd probably be less vocal about it, but I wouldn't feel any less outraged). So, while I try to rationalize the position, I can't exactly come to terms with it and reconcile my own position with it. It just doesn't seem like a good idea. Maybe if the situation changed and began to look dire for UPN at some point, but nothing has really changed (except for the combatants' stats) since these shenanigans started. I would suggest that since certain opinions are never going to be changed for someone as seemingly convicted as SWAT is (they especially won't be changed by anything as silly as 'stats') that UPN either lay off or just accept their own villainy and admit to keeping him at ZI until he leaves the game or him and Peggy sit down and have a nice chat and the whole misunderstanding or understanding or issue that started all of this is resolved. There really isn't another option, because if they keep him at ZI until all his money is gone and then let him go they will always be looking over their shoulders for SWAT to come over that far hill swinging his big stick. If they keep him at ZI until he leaves the game they won't have to be afraid of SWAT coming after them any more, but they also would have to own up to the fact that they forced someone out of the game and the repercussions that that reputation will bring. The best option, in my opinion, would be for all concerned parties to sit and have a chat and try to address some of these issues. That probably will not happen though, because from the way she handles herself when she's frustrated I would say that Peggy could not peace talk her way out of a paper bag and would find the mere suggestion of such a course of action to be offensive. That's at least how I see things. Also: I would imagine that Maroon senators didn't sanction SWAT128 either because you never talked to them about it, you talked to them about it too late and they didn't feel like placing sanctions on a ZI or near ZI nation, or they like SWAT128 better than they like you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickedj Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='JWConner' timestamp='1282092142' post='2420688'] LOL. I am so loving watching you talk crap here. You seriously have no idea how much. If you only knew what was actually going on. Oh, and these "7 members" you ran out were inactive losses. Good job taking credit there. As for those that we released from VA....I love watching you make an *$* out of yourself. You have no idea how big my smile is right now. Maybe you should have a chat with some of your gov before speaking further (oh, and only the ones who are up to date with current affairs...you know who I'm talkin' about) So while I applaud your attempt at mockery, you failed quite wonderfully. Oh, and those reps....LOL! Edit: Oh...and if CSN gov that knows what is actually going on decides to get online, I'll be on IRC for the next 30 mins. We should have a chat... [/quote] You know regardless of their activity status they still left your alliance because of Penkala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='JWConner' timestamp='1282092142' post='2420688'] LOL. I am so loving watching you talk crap here. You seriously have no idea how much. If you only knew what was actually going on. Oh, and these "7 members" you ran out were inactive losses. Good job taking credit there. As for those that we released from VA....I love watching you make an *$* out of yourself. You have no idea how big my smile is right now. Maybe you should have a chat with some of your gov before speaking further (oh, and only the ones who are up to date with current affairs...you know who I'm talkin' about) So while I applaud your attempt at mockery, you failed quite wonderfully. Oh, and those reps....LOL! Edit: Oh...and if CSN gov that knows what is actually going on decides to get online, I'll be on IRC for the next 30 mins. We should have a chat... [/quote] Uhh, what? I know even more than you do regarding the events of our rogue attacks, and the aftermath each time. I am of course in constant contact with my government regarding you, and I am well aware of what is going on. In fact, if anyone 'doesn't know what's going on' it would be you. It got quite frustrating having your government send you to talk to us. You'd make a decision, then your government would completely reverse it. Perhaps it's best you remove yourself from the entire situation, stop trying to stir things up, and go back to the retirement home you came from. VA is incompetent enough without you !@#$@#$ things up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magicspoon Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1282091119' post='2420659'] A rogue action is relatively minor and inconsequential. If we ever have you on the losing side of a war I'll remember how you treated this, though. I'll be sure to recommend we continue the war until all your nations have less than $10m left and are at ZI. No rebuilding for UPN! You'd be cool with it if I did that, right? [/quote] Minor and inconsequential? Rogues can cause hundreds of millions in damages, last I checked that isn't exactly minor. I don't really care what your personal policy towards me is. And if we ever do end up on the opposite side of a war it won't matter anyway, because as far as I can see your of no importance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='wickedj' timestamp='1282095133' post='2420821'] You know regardless of their activity status they still left your alliance because of Penkala [/quote] Wow...just wow. That's interesting. So because someone is roguing an alliance, any inactive losses are due to those attacks? That's freakin hilarious. Talk about arrogance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1282102310' post='2421064'] Uhh, what? I know even more than you do regarding the events of our rogue attacks, and the aftermath each time. I am of course in constant contact with my government regarding you, and I am well aware of what is going on. In fact, if anyone 'doesn't know what's going on' it would be you. It got quite frustrating having your government send you to talk to us. You'd make a decision, then your government would completely reverse it. Perhaps it's best you remove yourself from the entire situation, stop trying to stir things up, and go back to the retirement home you came from. VA is incompetent enough without you !@#$@#$ things up. [/quote] All hail penkala. All knowing and all powerful. HAHAHAHA!! As most of Planet Bob does, I hold your opinions so very highly, so I think I'll walk off into the fading backdrop and forget I was ever here. But yeah, I actually had a good hand in most of the decisions made. But thanks for showing that once again, you dont know what you're talking about. But we wouldn't want you to make comments based on actual facts or anything. That'd be completely out of character for you. [i][b]/me hears a random alliance is being done wrong[/b][/i] Penkala, you should definitely go interject there. I hear they need someone with "look at me" abilities. Edited August 18, 2010 by JWConner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goose Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 /me sighs WickedJ, Penkala, this is not the appropriate place to get into a shouting match with JWConner about the issues between CSN and VA. This discussion is about Cat Land and UPN's apparent PZI of SWAT. [img]http://www.comicsreporter.com/images/uploads/08CATLAND.cover_thumb.jpg[/img] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un4Gvn1 Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='SWAT128' timestamp='1282084355' post='2420447'] This is my warchest [img]http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g50/MaverickSWAT/Mywarchest.png[/img] It is by no means large, so I'm still not sure what your problem is. [/quote] Thank you for providing the screenshot. I will declare peace as soon as the rulers respond. Cheers, SWAT. You are an interesting character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un4Gvn1 Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1282102310' post='2421064'] Uhh, what? I know even more than you do regarding the events of our rogue attacks, and the aftermath each time. I am of course in constant contact with my government regarding you, and I am well aware of what is going on. In fact, if anyone 'doesn't know what's going on' it would be you. It got quite frustrating having your government send you to talk to us. You'd make a decision, then your government would completely reverse it. Perhaps it's best you remove yourself from the entire situation, stop trying to stir things up, and go back to the retirement home you came from. VA is incompetent enough without you !@#$@#$ things up. [/quote] I don't remember the last time I saw you make any sort of a reasoned or logical or 'good cheer' kind of comment on this forum. Always antagonistic ... always sounding like you want to start a fight ... why so bitter All The Time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jer Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Peggy_Sue' timestamp='1282000877' post='2418360'] I told you there is too much money in your warchest to let you up ... I offered to let you up if you sent 3M to each of the small nations you warred ... 4 or 5 I think. That would have left you with maybe 12 million today... I'm guesstimating from last week when you told me the value of your warchest. You see, last I spied your warchest I extrapolated to last week and figured you still had many millions more than you claim. Why is that important to me? Because it is likely you'll come right back after these festivities end. I'd prefer to know your warchest is miniscule. [/quote] This attitude makes you seem very insecure and weak, and it's pretty concerning because such fear and paranoia does lead to the regular use of PZI policies in my opinion, especially when we carry your reasoning to it's logical conclusion. If you want to eradicate any possible future threat from a nation, why would you stop at reducing it's warchest all the way down? He'll still have an MP, and it would take a very small amount of aid at any time to get him up to nuclear proliferation standards, so he's permanently a threat to your alliance by your own standards. This means that you'll have to permanently keep him down in order to keep your alliance safe, at which point we can all say hello to your set-in-stone PZI policy. A better course of action in my opinion is to let him off lightly the first time - never mind about future threats, just take your revenge for damage done - and be done with it. It'll reduce the chances of a bigger grudge forming, and it means that if your merciful response is thrown back in your face, you're perfectly justified to take a much stronger stance next time around. Edited August 18, 2010 by Aimee Mann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonVox Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 Having a few days of war after ZI is reached = PZI? In reference to what Bones said, if SWAT ZIed a couple of UPN nations and kept them there for a few days, I wouldn't call it a PZI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander The Second Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='Aimee Mann' timestamp='1282144663' post='2421597'] This attitude makes you seem very insecure and weak, and it's pretty concerning because such fear and paranoia does lead to the regular use of PZI policies in my opinion, especially when we carry your reasoning to it's logical conclusion. If you want to eradicate any possible future threat from a nation, why would you stop at reducing it's warchest all the way down? He'll still have an MP, and it would take a very small amount of aid at any time to get him up to nuclear proliferation standards, so he's permanently a threat to your alliance by your own standards. This means that you'll have to permanently keep him down in order to keep your alliance safe, at which point we can all say hello to your set-in-stone PZI policy. A better course of action in my opinion is to let him off lightly the first time - never mind about future threats, just take your revenge for damage done - and be done with it. It'll reduce the chances of a bigger grudge forming, and it means that if your merciful response is thrown back in your face, you're perfectly justified to take a much stronger stance next time around. [/quote] we only wanted some proof he can't just climb right back up and continue. 12 million is light enough to let him off. plus we all know he has enough friends, he wont be a super low NS for long after white peace... [quote name='Alexander The Second' timestamp='1280249638' post='2391327'] Honestly I don't think it matters either way. If he wants to continue it will continue If he wants it to end, he can try diplomacy, and if that fails the UPN knows how to stutter war's This is of course a predictable predicament, only 2 options, with 3 choices of how to go about it. [/quote] cause I called it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWAT128 Posted August 18, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='Alexander The Second' timestamp='1282146542' post='2421634'] we only wanted some proof he can't just climb right back up and continue. 12 million is light enough to let him off. plus we all know he has enough friends, he wont be a super low NS for long after white peace... [/quote] I didn't have any reason to continue the war nor do I now. But the way Peggy went about this whole ordeal hasn't done your alliance any favors in my mind. If you wanted me to have no warchest for peace, it should have been made clear by your alliance a long time ago. It wasn't, and that caused my view on your alliance to go down the drain. Hopefully Peggy learns to no longer says things she doesn't mean, because it certainly doesn't help your alliance in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonVox Posted August 18, 2010 Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='SWAT128' timestamp='1282148252' post='2421664'] I didn't have any reason to continue the war nor do I now. [/quote] I don't see how you had any more reason to start the war in the first place than you do now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWAT128 Posted August 18, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2010 [quote name='DonVox' timestamp='1282148714' post='2421668'] I don't see how you had any more reason to start the war in the first place than you do now. [/quote] Boredom does strange things to a person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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