The Disregard for Europe

[La Hire]

Hello My Friends,

I am posting here today to inform you all of an injustice committed by the alliance LoSS. Recently a [url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=358743"]member of our alliance[/url] (The European Union) was attacked savagely and without provocation by a member of LoSS. My alliance and I then proceeded to speak to the leaders of LoSS and the attacking nation, both of whom have ignored our messages and refuse to offer any response to us, or to contain the activities of the nation attacking our alliance. After several repeated messages and a period of several days, leaders at LoSS have continued to treat our alliance with disregard and avoid speaking of this matter at all.

It seems that LoSS refuses to take responsibility for its actions committed, and would rather hide than admit wrong doing on their behalf...

[Vilien]

Do you guys have forums or an IRC channel?

[Bob]

Have you talked to them over IRC? And who have you messaged? Did they open it, and how do you know they have not asked him to stop?

[La Hire]

We do not currently have IRC, but we made our MSN Messenger information available. We do have forums however.

[quote name='Penlugue Solaris' date='10 February 2010 - 10:26 PM' timestamp='1265855191' post='2173661']
Have you talked to them over IRC? And who have you messaged? Did they open it, and how do you know they have not asked him to stop?
[/quote]

We have not discussed this over IRC, messages were to sent to Co God Ben at LoSS (the messages were opened). We are certain that they have not asked him to stop, due to the fact that they have read our messages, and that the attacking nation has also read our messages.

[Jyrinx]

Hello La Hire,

In addition to what I sent you via private message, I would suggest you again try and get in contact with LoSS government, preferably via IRC as it appears a decent bit of government is online right now. Their public channel is #loss btw.

[La Hire]

Thank you for your message!

Unfortunately however, we do not have an IRC channel set up due to previous problems with it. I will however, see if I can hop onto it using mibbit.

Edited February 11, 2010 by La Hire

[Jyrinx]

OOC: In that case, you can run a java applet that will connect to coldfront here: http://www.coldfront.net/pjirc/chat.htm Once it connects, type /join #loss

Edit: nvm, missed your editing of your post.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Jyrinx

[legion-x]

i just found out about this yesterday, if you have a problem come talk to me about it im on almost all day and i would appreciate it if you dont make assumption about my alliance without proof. give us the respect of private channels and not the OWF.

[Locke]

[quote name='legion-x' date='10 February 2010 - 10:24 PM' timestamp='1265858695' post='2173801']
i just found out about this yesterday, if you have a problem come talk to me about it im on almost all day and i would appreciate it if you dont make assumption about my alliance without proof. give us the respect of private channels and not the OWF.
[/quote]
I believe they tried that:
[quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 09:29 PM' timestamp='1265855361' post='2173666']messages were to sent to Co God Ben at LoSS (the messages were opened)[/quote][quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 09:29 PM' timestamp='1265855361' post='2173666']the attacking nation has also read our messages.[/quote]

[Baldr]

[quote name='legion-x' date='10 February 2010 - 09:24 PM' timestamp='1265858695' post='2173801']
i just found out about this yesterday, if you have a problem come talk to me about it im on almost all day and i would appreciate it if you dont make assumption about my alliance without proof. give us the respect of private channels and not the OWF.
[/quote]

One of your nations declared war on one of their nations 6 days ago, they made attempts to contact you, and they got no response whatsoever. They came to the OWF because you were ignoring them.

Personally, by now I'd have 3 nations attacking the guy who attacked one of my alliance mates.

[Sam Winters]

We found out about it yesterday.

We are currently at war with 3 alliances, one war can easily go unnoticed.

From what has been posted in our government section, the offending nation has NOT read the PM sent from the government to explain/stop their attacks.

If you really want to resolve an issue, and really can't come on to our IRC, then why not come to our forum?

[La Hire]

[quote name='Sam Winters' date='10 February 2010 - 11:52 PM' timestamp='1265860345' post='2173849']
If you really want to resolve an issue, and really can't come on to our IRC, then why not come to our forum?
[/quote]

Because we had not received any reply from your alliance whatsoever, not even a link to your forums or your IRC channel.

I will however state, that LoSS has now began to acknowledge our messages and have been engaged in dialogue with us on IRC, however little progress was made beyond acknowledging the problem at hand. I am hopeful that a solution will be reached very shortly, as we have waited long enough. The ability to resolve this is in the hands of LoSS, not myself or my alliance... we have made every effort to contact you guys and finally had to resort to the OWF.

A member of your alliance, was unprovoked and attacked our alliance... we are seeking a diplomatic and peaceful end to this dispute and yet you chose to ignore us.

[Sam Winters]

[quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 10:03 PM' timestamp='1265861023' post='2173861']
Because we had not received any reply from your alliance whatsoever, not even a link to your forums or your IRC channel.
[/quote]

Did you ask for any of that information?

[quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 10:03 PM' timestamp='1265861023' post='2173861']
...we have made every effort to contact you guys and finally had to resort to the OWF.[/quote]

A few PMs to the same person is NOT every effort. Our IRC and Forum information is located on our Wiki, amongst other places.

[quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 10:03 PM' timestamp='1265861023' post='2173861']
A member of your alliance, was unprovoked and attacked our alliance... we are seeking a diplomatic and peaceful end to this dispute and yet you chose to ignore us.
[/quote]

From what I'm told occurred on IRC, I'm not sure if I want to help you anymore. Sorry.

[Sargun II]

Why so touchy about it being on the OWF? If you honestly did nothing wrong, nothing bad will come of it. It's obvious they tried to contact you through at least some proper diplomatic channels* and if they had received a timely response in the first place this entire thread could have been avoided.

[size=1]*ooc: in-game[/size]

[legion-x]

we have never not acknowledge it, and seriously one of the people you guys talked to wasnt even gov . im trying to be nice here so please dont throw subtle jabs at my alliance or insuanate false claims about my goverment

[La Hire]

[quote name='legion-x' date='11 February 2010 - 12:13 AM' timestamp='1265861622' post='2173873']
we have never not acknowledge it
[/quote]

How is not replying to something, and letting unprovoked attacks continue despite repeated attempts to end the violence "acknowledging it"?

[quote name='Sam Winters' date='11 February 2010 - 12:08 AM' timestamp='1265861331' post='2173868']
From what I'm told occurred on IRC, I'm not sure if I want to help you anymore. Sorry.
[/quote]

The fact of the matter is, a nation in your alliance attacked a nation in our alliance without provocation and we have attempted to reach a solution with you for several days, with you ignoring our messages.

Regardless of the whole ignorance issue, as an alliance you need to acknowledge this issue and see that these unprovoked attacks are ended.

Edited February 11, 2010 by La Hire

[Neuronia]

Dear European Union,

Your actions indicate to me that you are new to alliance politics. That's OK; everybody makes a diplomatic mistake every now or then. People won't remember this bit of silliness for more than 24 hours. To avoid future faux pas like this one, I suggest that you study up on diplomatic protocol. Consider this situation. A more appropriate step toward resolution would have been:

[b]A. Registering a diplomatic account on the LoSS Forums (http://www.cn-loss.net)[/b]

This action officially opens diplomatic channels. It's much more efficient than complaining on the Open World Forum because you can actually speak directly to the people with whom you have a grievance. On the Open World Forum, you're talking to anyone who cares to hear you. On an issue like this, there aren't many of those "anyones".

[b]B. Finding a LoSS government official on IRC[/b]

The LoSS IRC channel is located at #loss on the Coldfront IRC server. This is the easiest and quickest way of doing things. Come on in and say "May I speak with a LoSS government official?" Someone of the appropriate rank will be right along to address your complaint.


I was sorry to discover that this issue had been blown out of proportion. I wish you the very best of luck in your future political dealings.

-ThePresident of Neuronia

Edited February 11, 2010 by Neuronia

[Sam Winters]

[quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 10:18 PM' timestamp='1265861883' post='2173880']
Regardless of the whole ignorance issue, as an alliance you need to acknowledge this issue and see that these unprovoked attacks are ended.
[/quote]


Follow what Neuronia wrote. Seriously.

And that said, how exactly do we stop someone from attacking you if they don't read our messages? Please do let me know, so that in the future I can deal with things like this.

[La Hire]

[quote name='Neuronia' date='11 February 2010 - 12:21 AM' timestamp='1265862067' post='2173885']
Dear European Union,

Your actions indicate to me that you are new to alliance politics. That's OK; everybody makes a diplomatic mistake every now or then. People won't remember this bit of silliness for more than 24 hours. To avoid future faux pas like this one, I suggest that you study up on diplomatic protocol. Consider this situation. A more appropriate step toward resolution would have been:

[b]A. Registering a diplomatic account on the LoSS Forums (http://www.cn-loss.net)[/b]

This action officially opens diplomatic channels. It's much more efficient than complaining on the Open World Forum because you can actually speak directly to the people with whom you have a grievance. On the Open World Forum, you're talking to anyone who cares to hear you. On an issue like this, there aren't many of those "anyones".

[b]B. Finding a LoSS government official on IRC[/b]

The LoSS IRC channel is located at #loss on the Coldfront IRC server. This is the easiest and quickest way of doing things. Come on in and say "May I speak with a LoSS government official?" Someone of the appropriate rank will be right along to address your complaint.


I was sorry to discover that this issue had been blown out of proportion. I wish you the very best of luck in your future political dealings.

-ThePresident of Neuronia
[/quote]

The diplomatic means of communication was through CN messages, which is still an acceptable form of alliance communication.

The main topic at hand however, is that LoSS -even now, after acknowledging this issue- has not made effort to bring an end to the unprovoked attack.

[quote name='Sam Winters' date='11 February 2010 - 12:30 AM' timestamp='1265862651' post='2173903']
Follow what Neuronia wrote. Seriously.

And that said, how exactly do we stop someone from attacking you if they don't read our messages? Please do let me know, so that in the future I can deal with things like this.
[/quote]

You could have informed us that this was the case, from which point we could still mediate a solution to the problem.

Edited February 11, 2010 by La Hire

[Neuronia]

[quote name='La Hire' date='11 February 2010 - 04:35 AM' timestamp='1265862906' post='2173910']
The diplomatic means of communication was through CN messages, which is still an acceptable form of alliance communication.

The main topic at hand however, is that LoSS -even now, after acknowledging this issue- has not made effort to bring an end to the unprovoked attack.



You could have informed us that this was the case, from which point we could still mediate a solution to the problem.
[/quote]

Alas!

If only the CN messaging system was the right way to do things; I wouldn't have to remember so many passwords. Unfortunately, it's not- the best alliance leaders are generally not inclined to nation activity. See, for example, Ivan Moldavi of Pierconium- founder of three powerful alliances. We alliance leaders have other concerns. As such, it's better to use forum/IRC communication.

I really do hope that this has been an object lesson in properly executing inter-alliance discussions. More global wars have been averted by a bit of polite effort on IRC than by any threats.

-ThePresident of Neuronia

[Phoebus]

[quote]LoSS -even now, after acknowledging this issue- has not made effort to bring an end to the unprovoked attack. [/quote]

I told you twice that I will have to talk to CGB tonight to see where the situation stands. From what I have heard, CGB has sent the attacking nation a message to cease. If the guy wants to stop the attacks, we will have each nation send peace. If not, you guys can pummel him into the ground. Until then, we cannot do anymore. You said you would calculate the reps. Ok. Whatever. Calculate them. Please, in the meantime, find me a bag of magical fairy dust, so that I can sprinkle it over the offender and cease his attacks immediately. I'd hate to make it look like we are not putting any effort into it.

[Locke]

[quote name='Neuronia' date='10 February 2010 - 11:44 PM' timestamp='1265863452' post='2173925']
Alas!

If only the CN messaging system was the right way to do things; I wouldn't have to remember so many passwords. Unfortunately, it's not- the best alliance leaders are generally not inclined to nation activity. See, for example, Ivan Moldavi of Pierconium- founder of three powerful alliances. We alliance leaders have other concerns. As such, it's better to use forum/IRC communication.

I really do hope that this has been an object lesson in properly executing inter-alliance discussions. More global wars have been averted by a bit of polite effort on IRC than by any threats.

-ThePresident of Neuronia
[/quote]
The messages were read. Clearly, checking messages was not a problem for those who recieved them.

[Sam Winters]

Ah, another Locke living up to the name.

[Hunterman1043]

[quote name='La Hire' date='10 February 2010 - 10:35 PM' timestamp='1265862906' post='2173910']
The main topic at hand however, is that LoSS -even now, after acknowledging this issue- has not made effort to bring an end to the unprovoked attack.
[/quote]

Oh please, don't give me that garbage. We have sent him messages, he has been ignoring them. Obviously by his war reason, this guy wants to go out with some form of a fail bang. He probably thought he could hide from us catching him due to the several wars we are in.... Which he apparently was able to do for 5 days.

I did quite enjoy your OP though.... On how you tried to get as much sympathy as possible by using some pretty colorful adverbs to slander us a whole. Ya, because that really helps your cause.

So what do you want us to do? No one can physically control what he does, however we have tried to message him lots of times. He may look at them for a brief second, but doesn't respond. I don't know what you mean to accomplish by coming on here, but we have exhausted our efforts. I would bet that if he continues to ignore our messages and keeps up his attacks, that he'll be open to attacks. Don't quote me on that because I'm not in charge, but I would say that the likelihood is good.

[Dochartaigh]

wait, so the OP only messaged two people in LoSS whilst a major CN war is going on and then whines and complains how the European whatever is doing "whatever we can" to end this? frankly, doing whatever you can would include checking the OWF (which it seems the OP has no issues with) and looking for LoSS's IRC/Forums/other gov members. the fact that the OP only kept up with the same 2 people shows that they are only trying to slander LoSS's name instead of actually care about solving this issue.

any other reasonable person would have exhausted every single gov member of LoSS in an attempt at getting a response instead of only messaging the same person over and over again. not only that but again the OP is obviously familiar with the OWF and should know where to find alliance info such as IRC/Forums/Gov which is usually in the player created forums section.

La Hire is also not a new player given his CN forums date of Joined: 09-September 07 which means he should have a fairly good idea of how to go about things.

to me this reeks of just attempting to slander a good alliance's name over something that could have easily been resolved had La Hire actually attempted to do so.