Imperial Decree - New Polar Order

[HeinousOne]

If you believe this the NPO propaganda mill still works. "that one little stipulation" as you so cutely phrased it was the destruction of their ability to wage war for the foreseeable future, trading that for an extra billion in reps was an insult not an offer. If you are ignorant enough to think 60 nations all over 5k infra and many billions in untouched warchests are worth a billion dollars in cash you need to check your math.

I care not about the math. I care about what actually matters, Opinions.

That tide is no longer fully against NPO. People still do not like them but they are now seeing a new tyrant in town. Whether that is the truth or not really does not matter.

The ability for the NPO to wage war was that they had the majority of the world behind them and the rest was cowering. That is no longer the case thus you have already destroyed their ability to wage war in the foreseeable future. The truth is that is not what you wish to destroy but you wish to destroy them entirely and everyone else is beginning to see that. Thus they begin to not think you are any better then the NPO.

[WarriorConcept]

Go back and see the latest posts of LiquidMercury. You know who he is right? The General of Karma? That is just one example. You go ahead and deny such things WC but that will not change the truth. The lines being drawn are very obvious and it is the absolute inability of those still fighting NPO to control the situation that is causing the NPO to find strength in this horrible situation for them.

You can see this happening now, or you can see it after it has happened later. The OWF is where I reside, it is where I draw my conclusions from and I do indeed see a shift happening of opinion. There is also a very definate quiet where there used to be plenty of noise. When certain folks go quiet it is because they do not wish to give any further momentum to that which is swaying away from them.

I do not wish to see NPO empowered by all this, that is why I ask for those fighting them to stop being so hard headed and to actually observe and think. They have countered your maneuver so now it is time to counter theirs. You cannot continue with the same maneuver once it has been countered. That simply makes no sense.

I actually haven't seen any of liquidmercury's post, care to link to some?

Spare me your theatrics as well, I've been on these forums and the major back channels far longer than you ever have, and if you seriously think NPO is being "empowered" you're seriously delusional.

[TypoNinja]

Go back and see the latest posts of LiquidMercury. You know who he is right? The General of Karma? That is just one example. You go ahead and deny such things WC but that will not change the truth. The lines being drawn are very obvious and it is the absolute inability of those still fighting NPO to control the situation that is causing the NPO to find strength in this horrible situation for them.

You can see this happening now, or you can see it after it has happened later. The OWF is where I reside, it is where I draw my conclusions from and I do indeed see a shift happening of opinion. There is also a very definate quiet where there used to be plenty of noise. When certain folks go quiet it is because they do not wish to give any further momentum to that which is swaying away from them.

The shift in opinion is among those fighting NPO, it started with "We all want peace, lets work for it" and its slowly shifted to "Holy !@#$, these guys are arrogant !@#$%^&* even in defeat! I don't feel like doing them favours anymore."

Edited July 6, 2009 by TypoNinja

[enderland]

I care not about the math. I care about what actually matters, Opinions.

That tide is no longer fully against NPO. People still do not like them but they are now seeing a new tyrant in town. Whether that is the truth or not really does not matter.

The ability for the NPO to wage war was that they had the majority of the world behind them and the rest was cowering. That is no longer the case thus you have already destroyed their ability to wage war in the foreseeable future. The truth is that is not what you wish to destroy but you wish to destroy them entirely and everyone else is beginning to see that. Thus they begin to not think you are any better then the NPO.

I agree with everything you posted save the extent to which this has occurred.

[HeinousOne]

I actually haven't seen any of liquidmercury's post, care to link to some?

Spare me your theatrics as well, I've been on these forums and the major back channels far longer than you ever have, and if you seriously think NPO is being "empowered" you're seriously delusional.

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?a...sult_type=posts

This is a link to his profile. Look at the second newest post and tell me I am wrong. This is the damned General of Karma. One of the top dogs whom seems rather disgusted with the way things have went.

Please, go on continuing your denials, both you and Typo. Call me delusional and anything else you can conjure up but anyone who is a close follower of the patterns of the OWF will agree that the tide of public opinion is definately beginning to change.

[Starbuck]

Good post, some things I agree, others I do not.

The alliances that jump sides in the conflict do indeed still have blood on their hands, but their time will come and they too will get what is coming to them. As to Pacifica's terms nothing will justify what they have done to the community, you say your terms made you stronger, and thats good Polaris is a shining example of a turn around alliance, the terms that face pacifica will test their community, their resolve, but they are livable, they are meant to deal punishment that has been dealt from them for years.

[mike717]

I'll say again that my comment was not necessarily reffering to any particular terms previously offered or the precise situations surrounding them; it was only directed towards how the NPO dealt with alliances it deemed as a threat to it's hold on power and dominance. No leaders from KARMA's side have officially stated that their goal is out to wipe the NPO off the face of the planet forever. Once the terms are done the NPO is free to grow and carry on after that.

except you stated that no draconian terms would be offered. Please define draconian. If the highest reps ever paid in the histroy of planet bob is not draconian please tell me what is? because if that's how karma wants to play it, then NPO's "crimes" arent quite as bad as you'd like to make them out to be.

You don't get both sides of this moral high ground. Either you want to punish them with the same types of terms they handed down before, and say screw what we were standing for, or, you don't. What the world would like is for you to decide which it is, and you're actions have shown which side you come down on.

[TypoNinja]

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?a...sult_type=posts

This is a link to his profile. Look at the second newest post and tell me I am wrong. This is the damned General of Karma. One of the top dogs whom seems rather disgusted with the way things have went.

Please, go on continuing your denials, both you and Typo. Call me delusional and anything else you can conjure up but anyone who is a close follower of the patterns of the OWF will agree that the tide of public opinion is definately beginning to change.

Second newest? It doesn't seem like thats the one you wanted, why don't you link directly to the post you mean?

As for the 'new tyrant on the block' Karma cant be, because theres is no Karma. It's a handy label. There is no Buddhist Truth treaty forming us into a bloc, when the war is over so is Karma

[DarthLurtz]

While on the subject of Orwellian behavior...

My former alliance, TDSM8, lost our military organizer, beloved poster Campbell88, because part of our surrender terms to TPF (on behalf of NPO, because we all know how NPO preferred to fight) was to let the leaders of the opposing alliances comb our forums for "objectionable" behavior.

Having posted in a thread of Mudkips (it's TDSM8, yay!) a mudkip with a swastika on it's head, and based on the numbers at the end of his username, Campbell was declared a neo-nazi, and put on the PZI list. If we did not submit to allowing him to be PZI'd (i.e. continuing to fight, which was allowed for in Karma's terms for NPO) our entire alliance would not be allowed to surrender.

Please, continue to whine about tech percentages and infras. Please tell us how it will take a month of sledding to regain former standings in Bob. I'm eagerly awaiting more comparisons of how Karma's terms in any way measure up to the bull$*t, alliance-destroying, and random destruction to all alliances not allied to NPO that was the normal state of affairs for the past two years.

[SonOfHoward]

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?a...sult_type=posts

This is a link to his profile. Look at the second newest post and tell me I am wrong. This is the damned General of Karma. One of the top dogs whom seems rather disgusted with the way things have went.

Please, go on continuing your denials, both you and Typo. Call me delusional and anything else you can conjure up but anyone who is a close follower of the patterns of the OWF will agree that the tide of public opinion is definately beginning to change.

You mean this?

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...p;#entry1668895

How does that equal 'The destruction of NPO' ? He has quoted someone else saying once honour erodes so does KARMA.

Also, we have a General of KARMA?

[TypoNinja]

Also, we have a General of KARMA?

Actually its news to me too.

[kulomascovia]

The shift in opinion is among those fighting NPO, it started with "We all want peace, lets work for it" and its slowly shifted to "Holy !@#$, these guys are arrogant !@#$%^&* even in defeat! I don't feel like doing them favours anymore."

I disagree. Those who waged war upon the NPO wanted to destroy the NPO in the first place. No one offered to do the NPO any favors. As far as I can see, those fighting the NPO have not changed their opinions of the NPO.

[HeinousOne]

Second newest? It doesn't seem like thats the one you wanted, why don't you link directly to the post you mean?

As for the 'new tyrant on the block' Karma cant be, because theres is no Karma. It's a handy label. There is no Buddhist Truth treaty forming us into a bloc, when the war is over so is Karma

I just clicked the link again and it is. It is him fully agreeing with

QUOTE (Matthew PK @ Jul 6 2009, 12:49 AM) *

Karma has nothing but a mission.

It was not bound by treaties, it was bound by honor.

As that honor erodes, so will any authority held by Karma.

The cyberverse will not stand for it; and when the time comes I'll stand with the cyberverse.

by saying

"Very well said and I most whole-heartedly agree."

It is right there in the link I provided and it is blatently obvious that one of the two signatory leaders of Karma no longer appears to approve of this final phase of Karma. You guys wanted examples well I brought you one hell of an example. If you want more then all you are seeking to do is to keep me busy looking up quotes and posting less of what I am posting. An interesting attempt, unfortunately it was unsuccessful as I already had an example of such ready and waiting.

[enderland]

I disagree. Those who waged war upon the NPO wanted to destroy the NPO in the first place. No one offered to do the NPO any favors. As far as I can see, those fighting the NPO have not changed their opinions of the NPO.

I have seen very little reason for them to have changed their opinions of NPO, and I would imagine they have not either.

[WarriorConcept]

I just clicked the link again and it is. It is him fully agreeing with

QUOTE (Matthew PK @ Jul 6 2009, 12:49 AM) *

Karma has nothing but a mission.

It was not bound by treaties, it was bound by honor.

As that honor erodes, so will any authority held by Karma.

The cyberverse will not stand for it; and when the time comes I'll stand with the cyberverse.

by saying

"Very well said and I most whole-heartedly agree."

It is right there in the link I provided and it is blatently obvious that one of the two signatory leaders of Karma no longer appears to approve of this final phase of Karma. You guys wanted examples well I brought you one hell of an example. If you want more then all you are seeking to do is to keep me busy looking up quotes and posting less of what I am posting. An interesting attempt, unfortunately it was unsuccessful as I already had an example of such ready and waiting.

So did the time come or what? Is Karma now a super evil bloc LM and TOP will be bringing down? Did Karma's "authority" go to waste already? You're seriously seeing what you want in those posts, and it's not what's really there.

[PrototyoeRuler]

And on behalf of my good friends in TDSM8, I can't not say with a clear heart that NPO doesn't deserve what they are getting. And with the display of Valhalla in this thread they deserve much worst than what they were given. I will admit I was wrong and letting them get away with "white peace" I should of raised my voice...

[HeinousOne]

You mean this?

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...p;#entry1668895

How does that equal 'The destruction of NPO' ? He has quoted someone else saying once honour erodes so does KARMA.

Also, we have a General of KARMA?

Karma is eroding as we speak. What Karma was in the beginning was a response to aggression. Now Karma has become the aggression and many former members of the Coalition of Karma no longer claim to be members of such thus Karma erodes.

I am sorry you did not realize that Liquidmercury was more then just a signatory on the Karma statements but perhaps you should speak with some of the alliance leaders that are still fighting and failing horribly at their staggers as to what difference Liquid made back when he was actively leading Karma.

Actually its news to me too.

Go talk to your leaders.

[ImaNewbie]

I just clicked the link again and it is. It is him fully agreeing with

QUOTE (Matthew PK @ Jul 6 2009, 12:49 AM) *

Karma has nothing but a mission.

It was not bound by treaties, it was bound by honor.

As that honor erodes, so will any authority held by Karma.

The cyberverse will not stand for it; and when the time comes I'll stand with the cyberverse.

by saying

"Very well said and I most whole-heartedly agree."

It is right there in the link I provided and it is blatently obvious that one of the two signatory leaders of Karma no longer appears to approve of this final phase of Karma. You guys wanted examples well I brought you one hell of an example. If you want more then all you are seeking to do is to keep me busy looking up quotes and posting less of what I am posting. An interesting attempt, unfortunately it was unsuccessful as I already had an example of such ready and waiting.

you sir have won the thread

[kulomascovia]

I have seen very little reason for them to have changed their opinions of NPO, and I would imagine they have not either.

Mhm. I agree with that. However, I question the notion that the people fighting the NPO earnestly wanted peace with the NPO and that they were inclined to do grant it any "favors".

[HeinousOne]

So did the time come or what? Is Karma now a super evil bloc LM and TOP will be bringing down? Did Karma's "authority" go to waste already? You're seriously seeing what you want in those posts, and it's not what's really there.

Here you go again with Might makes Right. If you are a major reason for the success of a system then one way of bringing it down is to simply no longer be a part of it.

As far as seeing what I want to, I suppose I could say the same for you and those who are dead set on the destruction of the NPO. In the end we are arguing over what is to come and all we can do I suppose is see what comes of this and then we will know which of us was correct.

[WarriorConcept]

Karma is eroding as we speak. What Karma was in the beginning was a response to aggression. Now Karma has become the aggression and many former members of the Coalition of Karma no longer claim to be members of such thus Karma erodes.

I am sorry you did not realize that Liquidmercury was more then just a signatory on the Karma statements but perhaps you should speak with some of the alliance leaders that are still fighting and failing horribly at their staggers as to what difference Liquid made back when he was actively leading Karma.

Having been there you really are giving him too much credit in being able to make effective staggers

Also it was always said from the beginning karma was a war-time coalition, I hope most of karma hates each other by the time the war ends anyway, it'll make this game much more fun than the world before it.

[WarriorConcept]

Here you go again with Might makes Right. If you are a major reason for the success of a system then one way of bringing it down is to simply no longer be a part of it.

As far as seeing what I want to, I suppose I could say the same for you and those who are dead set on the destruction of the NPO. In the end we are arguing over what is to come and all we can do I suppose is see what comes of this and then we will know which of us was correct.

I made no Might makes right assertion in my post, I was asking a valid question and you're responding with a throw-away answer that doesn't apply.

And yeah me and the leaders of Karma are dead set on the destruction of NPO, and your amazing evidence, or lack thereof actually, supports it

[o ya baby]

Where was this way back when NPO was the one giving out harsh terms?

o wait

Let them man up and take the harsh terms they've given out for so long like men.

[TypoNinja]

Mhm. I agree with that. However, I question the notion that the people fighting the NPO earnestly wanted peace with the NPO and that they were inclined to do grant it any "favors".

Are you kidding? most of us would be thrilled to see the war over. At this point its been mostly reduced to CMing tech off ZI'd nations. Do you have any idea how goddamn BORING that is?

[enderland]

Are you kidding? most of us would be thrilled to see the war over. At this point its been mostly reduced to CMing tech off ZI'd nations. Do you have any idea how goddamn BORING that is?

I'm sure that the larger NPO nations love getting multiple spy ops a day wasted on them too