Redoran Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Could anyone tell the me the maths behind how your population is decided? Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redoran Posted March 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Bump.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Irwin Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Hmmm...not exactly, as it's somewhat complicated. The most important factor is infrastructure. Land also directly contributes, but at a much lower rate. Other factors: Clinic +2% each Hospital +6% each ADP Land bonus increased from .2 to .5 DRA +3% NEO +3% NRL +5% UHC +3% Cattle +5% Fish +8% Pigs +3.5% Sugar +3% Wheat +8% Military - the more you have, the fewer citizens you have (but the higher the population) Sometimes events effect population as well. There may be more, but I tried to list everything I could think of. The easiest way to determine the equation is to buy a bunch of infra and note the population change, and same for land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raskull Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 http://forums.viridianentente.com/showthread.php?t=7018#27 (sorry non-Viridians) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uaciaut Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Base is 7.5 citizens per point of infra and 0.2 (0.5 with Agriculture Development Program) for land All other bonuses are applied afterwards. For example, for me: (7.5*8510 + 0.2*3781)*1.05(cattle)*1.08(fish)*1.08(wheat)*1.05(affluent pop)*1.10(clinics - notice that the bonus from improvements of the same type gets added first rather than multiplied like the rest)*1.06(hospital)*1.03(DRA)*1.05(NRL)*0.9(border walls)*environment multiplier Alas i don't know the environment multiplier, maybe VE does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacky Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Base is 7.5 citizens per point of infra and 0.2 (0.5 with Agriculture Development Program) for landAll other bonuses are applied afterwards. For example, for me: (7.5*8510 + 0.2*3781)*1.05(cattle)*1.08(fish)*1.08(wheat)*1.05(affluent pop)*1.10(clinics - notice that the bonus from improvements of the same type gets added first rather than multiplied like the rest)*1.06(hospital)*1.03(DRA)*1.05(NRL)*0.9(border walls)*environment multiplier Alas i don't know the environment multiplier, maybe VE does Actually I believe the base citizen rate is 9. (Zero Infra/Zero Land) Then infra and land increase it respectively by their base rates and modifiers of which as you pointed out there are many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raskull Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Actually I believe the base citizen rate is 9. (Zero Infra/Zero Land) Nope, it is definitely 7.5 as uaciaut stated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janquel Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Nope, it is definitely 7.5 as uaciaut stated. Yep. Also, one more tip for those who want to figure it out: environment isn't the last remaining factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacky Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 (edited) edit: nevermind talking about different things Edited March 17, 2009 by Blacky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackyseto123 Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 I heard this from my game mechanics guy a while back that when you buy a new Improvement or get a new resource that improves citizen count, the way you see how much more citizens you'll get is different than you might think. Instead of just taking the citizen count you have right now and multiplying it with the percentage of increase that improvement or resource says it'll give, you take your base citizen count(the count you'll get without all of your citizen boosting things) and multiply that by the percentage of increase your new improvement or resource will give. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otis Smith Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 (edited) Yep.Also, one more tip for those who want to figure it out: environment isn't the last remaining factor. I know troop level has an impact as well. Isn't there a ratio for this? Edited March 17, 2009 by Otis Smith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raskull Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 (edited) I heard this from my game mechanics guy a while back that when you buy a new Improvement or get a new resource that improves citizen count, the way you see how much more citizens you'll get is different than you might think. Instead of just taking the citizen count you have right now and multiplying it with the percentage of increase that improvement or resource says it'll give, you take your base citizen count(the count you'll get without all of your citizen boosting things) and multiply that by the percentage of increase your new improvement or resource will give. Yes and no. What you're describing is stacking. Like improvements stack (2 hospitals = 1.04, not 1.02*1.02), but different improvements, and resources, multiply with each-other. So your first Clinic will increase your population by 1.02 (modulo ththe other hidden factor), but your second will increase it by less since since it's 2% of your citizens before the first hospital. tl;dr: uaciaut's formula is right (again, modulo hidden factors) I know troop level has an impact as well. Isn't there a ratio for this? Yep, it isn't a fixed ratio though (troop level will affect some nations more than others). Edited March 17, 2009 by raskull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otis Smith Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Yep, it isn't a fixed ratio though (troop level will affect some nations more than others). Have any more info on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redoran Posted March 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Is there a simpler formula that could be used, say to work out the approximate no. of citizens in an alliance. Like, just by using the figures on the Alliance Stat Page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janquel Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 (edited) Have any more info on this? Admin didn't publish the equation, so I think that most of us hesitate to do so publicly. It shouldn't be too hard to figure out with a little bit of tinkering Most of the necessary information is in this thread already. Is there a simpler formula that could be used, say to work out the approximate no. of citizens in an alliance. Like, just by using the figures on the Alliance Stat Page. Depends on how accurate you'd like it to be. Land and infra are both available, but there's no way to tell what resources each person has, nor how that infra is divided amongst the people who have the pop increasing improvements/wonders. It wouldn't be surprised if someone could develop something is at least somewhat close, given a few variables to tweak depending on the general makeup of the alliance (for example, flexing things based off of ANS), but even then you'd still likely be pretty far off. Edited March 17, 2009 by Janquel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackyseto123 Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Yes and no. What you're describing is stacking. Like improvements stack (2 hospitals = 1.04, not 1.02*1.02), but different improvements, and resources, multiply with each-other. So your first Clinic will increase your population by 1.02 (modulo ththe other hidden factor), but your second will increase it by less since since it's 2% of your citizens before the first hospital.tl;dr: uaciaut's formula is right (again, modulo hidden factors) Yep, it isn't a fixed ratio though (troop level will affect some nations more than others). Eh, it's been half a year since I had anything CN related so my thing be rusty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Shepard Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Yep, it isn't a fixed ratio though (troop level will affect some nations more than others). Are you saying two nations with identical troop to citizen ration could be affected differently by their troops? or that the differing troop percentage is what causes some nations to be affected more than others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janquel Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 (edited) Are you saying two nations with identical troop to citizen ration could be affected differently by their troops? or that the differing troop percentage is what causes some nations to be affected more than others? Yes, two nations with identical troop to citizen ratios could be affected differently by their troop counts. What we're referring to isn't the impact that soldiers have on environment, but something separate Edited March 17, 2009 by Janquel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman Cao Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) Environment and soldier counts both have different effects on top of the multis already discussed. I'm not gonna give the forumla for either out here since they took a lot of effort to derive, but I will say that the environment factor is very simple, while the soldier effect is logical but not a straightforward ratio. Edited March 19, 2009 by Chairman Cao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecoli73 Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Environment and soldier counts both have different effects on top of the multis already discussed. I'm not gonna give the forumla for either out here since they took a lot of effort to derive, but I will say that the environment factor is very simple, while the soldier effect is logical but not a straightforward ratio. chuckle...so secretive. The other effect from # of soldier is population density for land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janquel Posted March 20, 2009 Report Share Posted March 20, 2009 chuckle...so secretive.The other effect from # of soldier is population density for land. Not what we're referring to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecoli73 Posted March 20, 2009 Report Share Posted March 20, 2009 Not what we're referring to I reread...I thought soldier effeciency vs population was covered...guess not.. soldier effeciency < 60% citizen is best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janquel Posted March 20, 2009 Report Share Posted March 20, 2009 (edited) I reread...I thought soldier effeciency vs population was covered...guess not..soldier effeciency < 60% citizen is best Soldier efficiency/working citizens is part of what defines a nation's environment. What we're referring to is something which is not part of what defines a nation's environment. Edited March 20, 2009 by Janquel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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