Alterego

[quote name='TheNeverender' timestamp='1289685360' post='2512169'] It is wonderful for the Kingdom that we have such talented, apt, and insightful political pundits looking after our every move. Whatever would we do without such valuable insight? The Kingdom is addressing this matter privately with TFD. Had we felt the need to make a thread about it, we would have. And I promise you it would have been far more worthwhile reading than this. [/quote] Everything that happens in MK is open to public scrutiny. We will use microscopes, telescopes, periscopes, kaleidoscopes & cinescope to find our version of the truth

[quote name='Taget' timestamp='1289668318' post='2511908'] 4) The past is more of a straight jacket than anything else. Grudges of misdeeds and bitterness from three, four, five years ago do nothing. I've seen in other worlds the inability to finally get over them after they've long gone stale literally strangle the life out of them. It prevents folks from moving around, newcomers from understanding what is going on, and something new to arise instead of something that had grown tired long ago. [/quote] The whole premise for the karma war was revenge for things that happened years before. Now the same people are telling other alliances to just forget about gurdges, some of which are only months old and get together as friends to fight the three bigest blocs and their allies who probably out number us 2:1 or more.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1289651558' post='2511787'] We are not in absence of major incidents, events or political changes. We had a very big global war in the spring of this year and naturally people will need to rebuild and rework the new political climate. You can already see different sides forming and people are refinding themselves in this new political climate.[/quote] I see one side and another group being pushed together in the hope they will form a coalition. From what i've heard there will be multible sides and they will not want to be tied to each other or go to war for each other under any circumstances. I rebuilt months ago anyone left rebuilding is still under terms, remember that next time you want more than one war a year. [quote] I just hope that you and your likes can move from spouting the biggest nonsense, work out your differences, overcome your distrust of one another and start working together to bring us down but in a smart and intelligent way. [/quote] Forget it Im not going to befriend people I dont trust/hate just to give you a war. That kind of coalition can never exist & would crumble immediately once its clear it couldnt win maybe 4 days into a war. Then we can spend the next 12 months paying reps, sounds like fun (the ringleaders get that privilege) [quote] Playing the victim card in such a way (do you really think MK's request was worse than NPO enacting EZI and disbanding alliances?) will not only drive away more competent people from your side it is also cancerus (yes I made that up, deal with it) to our community. It's just plain awful to watch really. [/quote] I dont have a side Im not trying to form a side especially one whos function is to be sport for the SG/PB/MK group. They have grouped most of the strong alliances together, isolated NPO (not that people want to fight with them anyway) and still have TOP/IRON under terms but you complain that there is no unified opposition. There will not be one, not one against the SG/PB/MK group anyway. That WCE attempt was filled with alliances that will never fight together, they hate each other. Until SG/PB/MK group splits there will be no opposition and even then dont bet on it, 2011 is going to be just as boring as long as you have odds of 2:1 or 3:1 in your favour.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1289641508' post='2511757'] Man, you are not even trying anymore. Basically, people like you are part of the problem Alterego. Instead of actually building your coalition you drive them further away from you with your inane crap. Perhaps we should do Planet Bob a favour and eradicate you and your carbon copies. [/quote] Agreed, but look where we are today. In the absence of major incidents, events or political changes we are left with nothing to talk about except a stupid trade drop incident. Alliance leaders drive the game and they operate on autopilot these days. Dont try to blame me for ruining any coalition, I didnt even know about the last attempt until after it failed. Maybe we are at the stage where there is just too much history between alliances. How can you be in a coalition with alliances you dont trust and have hated for years when people who try fall over themselves to grass up each other before a meeting about putting a coalition together has even ended?

The reps doled out from the last two wars and the grouping of the three big blocs together on the same corner of the world has led to total stagnation.

The SF/C&G/PB/MK stranglehold on bob has led to total stagnation and has resulted in people leaving at a faster rate than any time in history. NPO might have crushed alliances from time to time but they kept things interesting and let you rebuild in a couple of months, the SF/C&G/PB/MK just huddle together and have done nothing of note all year except tie up the bigger alliances in chronicly high reps which resulted in total stagnation. Hell you cant even drop a trade with MK these days without being hit up for stupid reps, what chance do we have for war if people will be stuck paying reps for a year as happened in the last 2 wars against that group. Regarding moralism, you helped create an alliance for moral reasons to defeat NPO. YOU are one of the leading reasons the moral card is used to this day. If it was ok for vox and karma then its ok for the rest of us. Welcome to the post karma world in all its glory, thanks for everything.

[quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1289576301' post='2511164'] As for being slapped, nothing I can think of is worse than having to read the inane drivel of yourself, Fernando, HoT, Alterego, and Halfinger in both threads pertaining to this incident. I'd rather lose pixels but thats something, despite the outrageous and heinous actions of MK, that not one of our detractors had the stones to do. [/quote] Despite my detractor spewing drivel about me he and claiming he hates his infra he doesn’t have the stones to do something about it. Thats not an invitation btw I also like free tech for "injustices"

[quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1289421521' post='2509584'] Because the key to extortion was the "extortionists" not knowing what would happen if RV refused payment. Fortunately RV paid and we didn't have to go and find out what would have happened if he refused. That being the case, how is this extortion? [/quote] Another deflection, he couldnt know is the answer.

[quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1289416485' post='2509519'] He didn't care to know, this much we've established. [/quote] Like he said how was he supposed to know what MKs response would have been step by step to different scenarios relating to their attempted extortion when this is what MKs extortionists knew about each step. <Epiphanus> [b]Well that really depends,[/b] what matters is you are paying. <Yevgeni> [b]It isn't up to me to decide what will happen if you refuse to pay.[/b] We made a reasonable request and we never expected you to act like idiots about it and make a huge fuss out of it. Translation: We dont know

MK & Co are trying to provoke people into a war. Any reaction will result in a unified SF/PB/C&G group with the usual hangers on crushing a minority opposition. They are pushing harder and harder because the end of terms for some people is coming and they want to beat down any potential opposition before tht happens. They pushed and pushed before NPOs terms were up and in the end had polar start the war then switch sides once the larger alliances committed. If no one bites they will just attack someone for no reason or do another Polar style switcharoo or maybe help set up an opposition then step back and leak the logs as happened recently.

[quote name='AirMe' timestamp='1289328398' post='2508312'] I won't disagree with you that MK is in the wrong here. Though I can totally understand why they are angry that RV took this public. I am doubtful of the assessment that if this would have stayed private that they would have rectified the situation. The logs would have gotten perused once and then filed away. No one would have noticed that Yev and Epiphanus screwed up the negotiation. Evil? Really? This is a mistake for sure, but I wouldn't call it evil. What is more disturbing is that it seems that MK think's it's ok to make a mistake and to still get paid for it. [/quote] Extortionists and bullies generally dont like the limelight when they try and pass themselves off as good guys. You are being too apologetic by dismissing this as a mistake; this is not an isolated incident. You need look no further than MK government members telling non MK posters to shut up or else in this thread and the previous one to see what MK have become.

[quote name='Griz' timestamp='1289314399' post='2508013'] I am looking to do a tech deal, 50 tech for $3 Million. Nation Link [url]http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=431382[/url] [/quote] $3m sent

[quote name='TheNeverender' timestamp='1289286317' post='2507573'] You folks seem to think we were going to declare war if the deal wasn't paid. That's an interesting assumption. Not necessarily unreasonable, but most certainly an assumption. [/quote] Respond accordingly means what then?

[quote name='delendum' timestamp='1289285401' post='2507535'] On the contrary, I think we're handling it quite well - unless you consider backing down and pleading mercy to the demands of the mob as handling it better. [/quote] You are out of touch with reality. You handled it like a bunch of noobs on a power trip.

[quote name='Kalasin' timestamp='1289283902' post='2507454'] http://www.cybernations.net/search_aid.asp?search=29691&Extended=1 xfd As was just pointed out in #mushroom - look how quickly NSO paid up when they realised MK was serious Edit: God dammit, ninja'd. [/quote] You think extortion backed up by the threat of destruction id funny? If the shoe is on the other foot we shall see how funny you think it is ODN

[quote name='Stumpy Jung Il' timestamp='1289259844' post='2506725'] This is CN. All I have to say is this whole situation is unbelievably stupid. [/quote] I agree extortian is stupid and always backfires in the end.

[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1289259545' post='2506720'] Yes, and his response you paraphrased was not an attempted negotiation. RV has already said in this thread that he made no attempt to negotiate, so i'm not too sure where you're trying to go with this. [/quote] Im wondering why they couldnt answer. What RV said in this thread was unknown back then. By all appearaces it was an attempt to negotiate but they couldnt deviate from their original figure and said nothing.

[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1289258934' post='2506708'] Your attempt to turn the tables is going nowhere, either you are completely naive when negotiating is concerned or you are aware how weak this argument is. Why would MK say "we want 15m, now let's negotiate this price down?" The onus is on the NSO to do that. As i said before, we aren't in the habit of holding people's hands. [/quote] When he asked what would happen if they didnt pay that price there was no attempt to negotiate the figure was set in stone.

[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1289257319' post='2506655'] Yes, because RV accepted the sum and didn't question it. We are unable to negotiate on his behalf and hold his hand as that does go against the entire point of negotiating. [/quote] [b]<Yevgeni> 3m-50t for each of the trade partners. <Yevgeni> So 15m-250t.[/b] <Yevgeni> Shouldn't be too complicated, a single nation can pay that within a single cycle. [b]<Rebel_Virginia> You'll get your money, but know we ain't happy about it.[/b] <Yevgeni> Understood. If I may offer a word of advice, next time, tell your colleagues not to try to take the other party for complete morons. <Rebel_Virginia> Is that supposed to mean something? <Yevgeni> That whole episode where they denied the guy's membership was really ridiculous. <Rebel_Virginia> Are you a bit upset that you did not get the respect you believe you're entitled too? [b]<Rebel_Virginia> Just out of curiosity, what if we did refuse to pay?[/b] <Yevgeni> When I deal with another alliance, I don't expect them to try to !@#$%^&* me about the status of one of their long-time members. <Yevgeni> Much less spend one hour denying overwhelming evidence. <Rebel_Virginia> Now, what about my other question? <Rebel_Virginia> Also, if he was more or less a masked ghost. [b]<Epiphanus> Well that really depends,[/b] what matters is you are paying. [b]<Yevgeni> It isn't up to me to decide what will happen if you refuse to pay. [/b] MK came in with a demand. RV said you would get it and asked what would happen if they didnt pay [b]that price[/b]. You didnt say it was open to negotiation. Thats the price you were told to demand, you had no other information thats why they couldnt give an answer about any consequences of failing to pay the full $15m and 250 tech.

[quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1289257043' post='2506642'] We at least sought mediation and tried to negotiate despite that feeling, Airme. Yes, we are monsters for our deeds. We also stole NPO's baby recipe and perfected it. [/quote] Negotiate? You just made a demand and that was that.

[quote name='lebubu' timestamp='1289256498' post='2506623'] We have far more guts than you can handle. [/quote] True, 1 person v a sanctioned alliance is a sure defeat. However, I was talking about MK attacking other medium to large alliances with no CB.

[quote name='Heft' timestamp='1289255985' post='2506604'] This is just weird. Can't fault MK for a lack of audacity, I suppose. Subtlety, on the other hand..... You guys would've been better off just skipping ahead to the declaration of war if you were really that desperate. [/quote] They dont have the guts & want to pretend they are the victim again.

[quote name='Sal Paradise' timestamp='1289247662' post='2506449'] Funny to see their tough-guy image juxtaposed with an over-sensitivity to perceived insults. It's straight from the bully playbook. [/quote] They went from no more excessive reps, to excessive reps for past crimes, to excessive reps for pre-emptively attacking during a war and are now at excessive reps for dropping trades. Imagine what they will try next.

[quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1289244106' post='2506373'] Because I was the one who came up with the amount. [/quote] You dont need to come up with the figure to know how it was [s]reached[/s] arrived at.

[quote name='AirMe' timestamp='1289243373' post='2506349'] Who cares about all of that? They should have to repay the 3 mill and that's it. It is a trade circle. [b]Why does NSO have to pay 3 m and 50 tech per trade circle member over a dropped trade?[/b] It is extortion. It really doesn't matter how NSO acted in this situation unless they told you to flip off. Which they didn't do. [/quote] I believe this is the answer. [quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1289240860' post='2506301'] It would appear that the amount owed is dependent upon the number of hurdles that have to be jumped to get an answer. [/quote] Your sig is becoming the truth, well 2 out of 3 ain't bad.