The Pikachurin Conference

[Maelstrom Vortex]

One of Caudill's aides spoke in his ear after listening to some reports on his blackberry.

"The Exiled Nation of Tahoe has taken hostile action against the United States by landing in California and violating our domestic sovereignty. We hereby withdraw from this conference. Any diplomatic dialogue is no longer possible after this breach of trust. The Exiled Nation of Tahoe shall remain in exile for its impatience and unwillingness to resolve matters with fair and open diplomatic dialogue under no duress or threat."

The U.S. delegation gathered its things and left.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[AironthFlamewing]

We support the United States decision in this matter, it is a time for peace and resolution, not a time for petty squabbling and politicking, Both formations of Tahoe(OOC: Sargun and Mudd) should be ashamed of themselves for listening to their own hubris instead of the will of the people.

With that the Delegation from Delaware walked out.

[Triyun]

The Chinese Prime Minister watched this drama unfold with mild frustration. He sent messages to the J. Andres and York allies at the conference proposing to speak with them privately.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

"We call for J Andres to hold up its promise to ensure there is no threat to the U.S. on its watch."

ooc: I was even talking with Mudd on possible diplomatic solutions before it was pointed out he had invaded our coast.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Michael McBride]

Sinclair looked up in mild surprise at the news that Tahoe had sent operatives onto American shores. He quickly composed a message and fired it off to Syracuse. Immediately afterwards, a message from the Chinese Prime Minister flashed onto his screen. Looking over at the man for a moment, Sinclair nodded and walked over past him, asking a J Andres government worker if there was a smaller conference room where a private meeting could be held.

[JEDCJT]

Mercton groaned as he placed his face on his hands, disappointed. With the walk out of the USA representatives, the Pikachurin Conference had failed before it even began. However, Bethesda got up from his seat and hurried out of the room. He would catch up with the American delegation and try to persuade them to come back to the meeting and try to talk things out with the Tahoans.

“[i]Please come back. Do it, not only for your and our sake, but also for the sake of North America and the world![/i]” The Foreign Minister pleaded with the US delegation. “[i]At least, talk it out with them. Talk it out![/i]”

[quote name='Triyun' date='21 July 2010 - 01:30 PM' timestamp='1279747822' post='2383297']
The Chinese Prime Minister watched this drama unfold with mild frustration. He sent messages to the J. Andres and York allies at the conference proposing to speak with them privately.
[/quote]

At this moment, Mercton checked his Blackberry and saw that he had received a message from the Chinese Prime Minister. Glancing at the Prime Minister, Mercton excused himself and made his way over there where the PM was sitting. “[i]You wanted to speak with me privately?[/i]” He whispered.

[quote name='Pravus Ingruo' date='21 July 2010 - 01:37 PM' timestamp='1279748229' post='2383307']
Sinclair looked up in mild surprise at the news that Tahoe had sent operatives onto American shores. He quickly composed a message and fired it off to Syracuse. Immediately afterwards, a message from the Chinese Prime Minister flashed onto his screen. Looking over at the man for a moment, Sinclair nodded and walked over past him, asking a J Andres government worker if there was a smaller conference room where a private meeting could be held.
[/quote]

The government worker nodded. "[i]The room is that way. I will escort you.[/i]" He glanced at President Mercton, who was confering with the Chinese Prime Minister.

Edited July 21, 2010 by JEDCJT

[Maelstrom Vortex]

Caudill sighed, "They attacked us. What more is there to say? Very well.. tell them they better not do anything else rash." He stopped and returned to the conference room.

"The U.S. hereby issues a formal complaint about the aggressive actions of the Exiled Nation of Tahoe during this conference. It will play into our decisions as they have sorely breached with trust." Caudill stood by his chair and waited for all the delegations to re-assemble to be seated. "It is only in our benevolent intent to find some sort of peace that we have returned. The Exiled Nation of Tahoe is on its third strike. We suggest they do not use it or the world will be witness to its continued iniquity."

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[JEDCJT]

[quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' date='21 July 2010 - 01:45 PM' timestamp='1279748715' post='2383322']
Caudill sighed, "They attacked us. What more is there to say? Very well.. tell them they better not do anything else rash." He stopped and returned to the conference room.

"The U.S. hereby issues a formal complaint about the aggressive actions of the Exiled Nation of Tahoe during this conference. It will play into our decisions as they have sorely breached with trust." Caudill stood by his chair and waited for all the delegations to re-assemble to be seated. "It is only in our benevolent intent to find some sort of peace that we have returned. The Exiled Nation of Tahoe is on its third strike. We suggest they do not use it or the world will be witness to its continued iniquity."
[/quote]

Mercton, who was whispering to the Chinese PM, looked up as the USA delegation entered the room once again, followed by a harried-looking Bethesda.

“[i]Ah, welcome back, Mr. Caudill.[/i]” Mercton greeted before turning his attention to Bethesda. “[i]Good job, Mickey.[/i]” The President whispered to Bethesda, who grunted in response. Mercton then turned to the York observer, Vice President Sinclair and the Chinese Prime Minister. “[i]You want to come back and observe?[/i]”

By then, Bethesda had returned to his seat next to Richards. “[i]It was a close call there.[/i]” He muttered to Richards. “[i]Yes, it was.[/i]” The Prime Minister replied.

[Triyun]

Speaking privately with the two leaders the Prime Minister considered his words very carefully. "Yes, gentlemen, this conflict is deeply painful to China as we hold strong ties to both nations involved here. Both are MDoAP partners. I recognize that Tahoe may have fired the first shot, but I can't help but feel everyone deserves land to call their own. When we signed a treaty with the fledgling US we felt that having overcome the influence of foreign cultists and trying to forge a new pathway to national unity. They were the same as us. But with this action, I don't know... I can't help but feel the same thing we did about the fledgling US with the Tahoe people. Again though if this is correct Tahoe shoots first.

We have no desire to see a long or destructive war... we do not want to see this escalate. At the moment China is considering suspending its mutual defense and optional aggression part of its treaties with both powers till this crisis is resolved. We'd like to see our two remaining North American friends go neutral as well and work with us to find a peaceful solution to this crisis. This war can only serve to severely damage our interests and North American prosperity, and thus China's economy also."

[Maelstrom Vortex]

"The United States of America understands the United States of China's concerns and we greatly respect them and the support they provided us when we were still young. We also feel everyone deserves a homeland. At the same time, though this government of the Exiled Tahoe is reformed and we were prepared to trust them, these recent events have obviously frayed our nerves. We understand that the Exiled government sees the lands in the South West United States as their homeland, indeed.. we would have no objection to them even residing peacefully as residents with citizenship in the South West so long as they did not act against the United States."

"In regards to the legality of annexation...we have the voting record here with us.. and the vote was so important we even had the citizens provide nail clippings to affirm it is their identity when they registered the vote. With them is the telephone numbers of the voting citizenry who filed these votes. They willfully joined the United States. Any nation may request copies of this evidence, save of course the nail filings and may even take small samples of those."

"With the vote conclusive, we could not deny them peaceful annexation. It was their will. The United States is constitutionally bound to protect its states and states are not allowed constitutionally to secede from the Union, that said, we cannot surrender any of the territory which has sought our protection by domestic sovereignty law. Even if the exiled government's citizenry had been counted, they do not constitute a sufficient number to have over-turned the decisions of the domestic residents. We validated this based old population registers of the old Tahoe Republic and how many could have potentially left for exile. The South West States are legally part of this Union and under our protection, that is an aspect we cannot change, but we are open to other discussions about how this may be peacefully resolved."

"One idea I had is that we would have no objection at all to them peacefully settling somewhere in North America. We wouldn't even mind lending some financial assistance to get them off their ground in their reconstruction and reconstitution efforts. We would not inhibit the individual citizens ability to live in or visit their homeland."

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Manetheren]

If there was a properly conducted vote on the future of California, Nevada, Utah and Arizona, we would participate. However, only pre-war Tahoan citizens could take place in the election as part of the United States. While no doubt a Tahoan nationalist part would win such a vote, those four states would pledge to remain in the United States of America.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

"No non-tahoan citizen was permitted to vote in the initial vote as it stood. This was purely a reckoning of those who lived in those domiciles."

"Or am I misunderstanding what may be a proposal for your to participate in domestic elections?"

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Manetheren]

Without Tahoan overseers, we cannot and do not accept the results of the vote. If democracy is so important, why not allow another? Thats right, the President of the Tahoe Republic is offering to allow a vote on the status of the states WITHIN the Tahoe Republic.

Besides, I present to you a document the loyalists, North Tahoe and South Tahoe agreed upon. Christopher Bogart can agree Arturo Chavez participated in talk to join the Tahoe Republic.


[quote]An Rialtas na hTahoe
The Government of the Tahoe Republic


Executive Branch
Comhairle an Rialtais (Government Council)

The Government Council of the Tahoe Republic has three members, one elected from the citizens of North Tahoe, one from South Tahoe and one elected from the nation as a whole.

The three members of the Government Council are:
Príomh-Aire (or Taoiseach) na hTahoe Thuaidh (Prime Minister of North Tahoe)Chris Bogart
Príomh-Aire (or Taoiseach) na hTahoe Theas (Prime Minster of South Tahoe) Arturo Chavez
Uachtarán (or Taoiseach) na Tahoe (President of Tahoe) Sean O'Deaghaidh

Essentially the names don't matter. If we go with Priomh Aire for the North/South people then I prefer Taoiseach for the third seat, otherwise Uachtaran is preferable.

The two territorial seats represent the people of their geographic constituency and have veto power over the state governments. They are elected by the governors of the states. The third seat is popularly elected by the people of the entire nation. All three have cumulative veto power and two can overrule the third. That is, if Oregon bans sex and Vince vetoes that bill but Sargun and I don't like sex and agree with the original bill we can overrule Vince's veto. Obviously internal affairs don't make much of a difference but the only real important thing will be in international affairs where two of us have to agree. The rest, including names and how they are selected is just RP. No one seat is more valuable than the other.

For reference South Tahoe is California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico with the federal territory of Lower (Baja) California. North Tahoe is Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Columbia (Tahoan Canada) and Alaska.

The center of Tahoe is California but Oregon and Washington are the second and third most populated states and Washington has the second largest economy. Thats just so you two can wave your peens at each other and brag about whether north or south is better

Legislature
National Assembly of the Tahoe Republic

A bicameral legislature. Upper house is the Senate, lower house is General Assembly. Seat numbers don't matter but each state gets X number of seats in Senate elected from proportional party lists (thats how we do it in Ireland. Means if there are 10 seats per state each party gets a number of seats proportional to the percent of the vote they get). Lower house is proportional. Bills can be vetoed by two thirds majority of Council.

Each state has their own government system as long as it is republican and representative. Basically how it is in the United States.

Judicial

Supreme Court. Yawn

Other Stuff like Demographics
How it was before war in regards to language. English is lingua franca of school, business and government. Irish is taught in schools and spoken at home. More predominant in lower income and rural areas. All areas have Irish and English names but one is used more commonly than another. Example: San Francisco is Drogheda in Irish but almost always called San Fransisco.

Religion is Christian as official religion but tolerant of most others as before. Catholicism is state supported as before. And other such stuff you can suggest stuff. I'd reduce the non-European population to around 10% with the addition of new territories (since it was only 20% without Oregon and Washington, both of which have big populations in Tahoe). [/quote]

Furthermore, there is zero evidence of Tahoan fighting in California. Zero. Nothing more than propaganda.

OOC: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=62869&view=findpost&p=2383378

Edited July 21, 2010 by Emperor Mudd

[Maelstrom Vortex]

"We may, but there has been a lot of distrust sown after this recent incident. You would understand that it would give us grave concerns to allow elections involving an entity that has only recently dis-respected the sovereignty of the nation? While I understand the motivation and intensity with which you want your homeland back we had agreed to peaceful meetings here and I come to discover acts of espionage are already in progress in our country.. that's a lot of mixed signals. My decision also is not the final one, any proposal such as discussed here has to be approved by the people via congress. I am only their voice and servant. This would not be a very fast or immediate process if it were agreed to. Are you willing to be patient with us to allow the wheels of our government to process your requests in a way that allows fair representation of all thoughts and opinions on the matter?"

"And now you're lieing. Any satellite feed of any nation on earth could detect and validate the data regarding the incident. We have images of your people on our beaches after citizens tipped off local law enforcement and NORAD decided to snap photos just in case. We didn't even have to use our CIA. Such a large operation is going to be detected." Caudill sighed.

"I need another break. I'll be back in about 5 minutes. When you're prepared to fess up to your activities on our coastline.. of course. Then we can resume talks." He nodded to the USC representative and the J Andres representative.. the look in his eyes spoke volumes. He was getting intolerant of the semantics.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Manetheren]

OOC: You have no evidence of espionage. Check the GM's thread.

IC:

We grow impatient. Tahoe MUST be united or it will never be at peace. The time for diplomacy is almost over. Again we state that no hostile action on the Tahoe Republic took place. None. Spewing propaganda will not help us reach a peaceful solution.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Emperor Mudd

[JEDCJT]

Mercton cleared his throat loudly to catch everyone's attention. Standing up, the President heaved a sigh. "[i]Now this discussion is ougetting off hand. We are here to discuss about the status of the southwestern states that used to be part of the Tahoe Republic that is currently a part of the United States.

That, and there is no need to be spewing accusations at each other like monkeys flinging poo at each other. Pardon my expression.[/i]" Mercton paused as Ahmadinejad snorted in laughter. "[i]That is not a conductive to healthy discussions, especially when lack of evidence and the like could be taken into account.

Now...what shall we do to resolve the situation as it is?[/i]" He looked at everyone around the table. When Caudill stated that he needed a break and will be back in five minutes, Mercton nodded. "[i]Well...we'll have a short break too. This disussion will resume in five minutes or so.[/i]"

[Triyun]

[quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' date='21 July 2010 - 11:07 PM' timestamp='1279750052' post='2383365']
"The United States of America understands the United States of China's concerns and we greatly respect them and the support they provided us when we were still young. We also feel everyone deserves a homeland. At the same time, though this government of the Exiled Tahoe is reformed and we were prepared to trust them, these recent events have obviously frayed our nerves. We understand that the Exiled government sees the lands in the South West United States as their homeland, indeed.. we would have no objection to them even residing peacefully as residents with citizenship in the South West so long as they did not act against the United States."

"In regards to the legality of annexation...we have the voting record here with us.. and the vote was so important we even had the citizens provide nail clippings to affirm it is their identity when they registered the vote. With them is the telephone numbers of the voting citizenry who filed these votes. They willfully joined the United States. Any nation may request copies of this evidence, save of course the nail filings and may even take small samples of those."

"With the vote conclusive, we could not deny them peaceful annexation. It was their will. The United States is constitutionally bound to protect its states and states are not allowed constitutionally to secede from the Union, that said, we cannot surrender any of the territory which has sought our protection by domestic sovereignty law. Even if the exiled government's citizenry had been counted, they do not constitute a sufficient number to have over-turned the decisions of the domestic residents. We validated this based old population registers of the old Tahoe Republic and how many could have potentially left for exile. The South West States are legally part of this Union and under our protection, that is an aspect we cannot change, but we are open to other discussions about how this may be peacefully resolved."

"One idea I had is that we would have no objection at all to them peacefully settling somewhere in North America. We wouldn't even mind lending some financial assistance to get them off their ground in their reconstruction and reconstitution efforts. We would not inhibit the individual citizens ability to live in or visit their homeland."
[/quote]

OOC: I'm speaking privately with the leaders of York and J. Andres. that should be pretty clear.

[Fizzydog]

Sheynaynay had been listening closely, while writing down all people said. She looked up at Mercton, and wrote down what he said. The meeting to her was quite pointless; it seemed like nothing was going to be solved.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

Caudill came back, "Lets focus on being productive. Here is what I need. I need a formal written proposal by Exiled Tahoe on what they feel would be a way to go about finding a peaceful resolution to take before congress and to be reviewed by its parts. Then if there are any contested details I will need to return to this table with you and hammer them out. Eventually, hopefully, a final agreement will emerge. This decision cannot be mine alone as I am not a dictator."

[Manetheren]

As we have stated before, we cannot and will not accept the results of the election conducted by a violent and oppressive regime that has been controlling South Tahoe for the past few weeks. Therefore, we propose to the United States of America that new elections take place in the states of Arizona, Utah, California, Nevada and Colorado as soon as possible to allow for an internationally inspected elections. Obviously we will run our candidates and they will run theirs, but we are confident that the Tahoan people will support Tahoans, not Nico Crooks and his illegitimate regime.

As you can see, we support peace. We have no desire for war but to be perfectly honest the alternative to holding this vote is war. We see no other way.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

"In order for this to work you may need to attempt to field a peace with Mr. Crooks.. who is here with us as part of the U.S. delegations. I know the two of you are at conflict.. and it literally threatens to tear North America apart in warfare. Is there no way we could find some common ground between the two of you to resolve this grudge?"

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Fizzydog]

"I speak on behalf of South Sudan: my countr does not want to see another war break out on this continent. We support any ideas that will stop war."

[Triyun]

[quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' date='22 July 2010 - 12:05 AM' timestamp='1279753485' post='2383466']
"In order for this to work you may need to attempt to field a peace with Mr. Crooks.. who is here with us as part of the U.S. delegations. I know the two of you are at conflict.. and it literally threatens to tear North America apart in warfare. Is there no way we could find some common ground between the two of you to resolve this grudge?"
[/quote]

Tahoe is torn apart. While I understand your zeal, if this was the other way around you know you'd have the same position. In fact you supported us when we drove off the Northern Occupiers. The situation was not dissimilar to Tahoe's current plight. I think that it would behoove the United States to take its time to look at the circumstances under which it took in Southern Tahoe without consulting with ALL the Tahoe people. If Pennsylvania joined York tomorrow, how would you feel?

[Manetheren]

[quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' date='21 July 2010 - 04:05 PM' timestamp='1279753485' post='2383466']
"In order for this to work you may need to attempt to field a peace with Mr. Crooks.. who is here with us as part of the U.S. delegations. I know the two of you are at conflict.. and it literally threatens to tear North America apart in warfare. Is there no way we could find some common ground between the two of you to resolve this grudge?"
[/quote]

Nico Crooks would of course be allowed to run candidates that support him. While we fully expect those candidates to lose because of what he did to the South Tahoan people, he has no reason to be banned from the democratic process.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

[quote name='Triyun' date='21 July 2010 - 07:08 PM' timestamp='1279753708' post='2383473']
Tahoe is torn apart. While I understand your zeal, if this was the other way around you know you'd have the same position. In fact you supported us when we drove off the Northern Occupiers. The situation was not dissimilar to Tahoe's current plight. I think that it would behoove the United States to take its time to look at the circumstances under which it took in Southern Tahoe without consulting with ALL the Tahoe people. If Pennsylvania joined York tomorrow, how would you feel?
[/quote]

"They would have blatantly violated the constitution they had agreed to and there would be a civil war. From what we were aware however, S. Tahoe had peacefully separated and this decision to join the United States was theirs to make. We don't acknowledge political claims by the Exiled Nation of Tahoe to South Tahoe because the coalition had firmly driven them from these lands far before that happened. Historical, yes. Cultural, yes. Political, that was decided a long time ago."

"Facts are, unless we can persuade the two Tahoe to agree it would potentially cause a Civil War in the United States to force a union. We need to resolve these instabilities before we could allow a reunion. The only way I can see that happening is Mr. Crooks who is here with me and the representative from Exiled Tahoe who is sitting before me coming to a resolution of their differences. Both lead sizable constituencies with an interest in the region."

Edited July 21, 2010 by Maelstrom Vortex