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The Economic Realities of Tech Deals


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It seems that the majority of Tech deals are void of any economic realities concerning the laws of supply and demand. The standard 3mill/ 100 tech deal nets a profit of around 1.35 million for the seller. With five aid slots this equates to less than 7 million per month.

My argument, however, is not that this is unfair. It is perfectly fair, especially considering that a defacto contract is agreed to when aid is accepted with understanding of repayment. My argument is simply that the laws of supply and demand are not in play.

I argue that unnoffical price controls have been set by the Tech buyers. Conciously or unconciously, experienced buyers recognize the desire for funds that many new nations have, which is why a 3 mill per 100 tech deal is possible. However after a nations income reaches that of a couple hundred thousand per day (which can be done in a couple weeks very easily), demand for these deals should decrease.

As a seller, it is often ridiculously easy to establish deals with the standard profit of 1.35 mill indiciating that there is also an extremely high demand of technology from the buyer. Perhaps it is time for tech sellers to raise their prices in accordance with the demand of tech buyers, rather than have the terms dictated to them through tradition and standard deals. If demand is really high enough then tech sellers should be doing the intelligent thing and raising their prices accross the board. The amount of money saved in a 3mil/ 50 tech deal for the buyer is still incredible, however a newer nations growth is not as impeded.

I am certainly not arguing for controls, or violations of contract. I myself, will most likely continue to contract through the generally accepted standard deal. I am not angry about it. I am just curious as to other thoughts on the subject and why the cybernations economy is able to ignore these economic realities.

Sincerely,

Sludder McGee

Edit: I am obviously fairly new to the game, and oblivious as to past changes. Only commenting as to what I see in the present. Any enlightenment as to past changes and how they have affected the game would be appreciated.

Edited by Sludder McGee
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This already happened when the standard price went from 3mill/150 to 3mill/100. There's not enough of a difference to change to 3mill/50 yet, and the recent war will certainly delay it.

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Supply and Demand is and always has been in effect. As stated before it used to b 3 mill for 150 tech as the standard going rate. Already you see several 3 mill for 50 tech deals going through. The reality is there are more sellers as a result of the war and this will continue to be for a while until the number of buyers exceeds the number of sellers so much that is must change.

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$3m/50 will be the standard in a few months. At that price, the buyer will receive an average of 150 tech every 10 days (with a DRA). At $3m/100, it's 200 tech every 10 days. So it's less efficient and it costs more, but if you can't find enough sellers to fill all of your slots $3m/50 will start to look pretty good. In reality, it's a vicious circle, because $3m/50 will greatly speed up the growth of tech sellers, which means there will be even less tech sellers after a while because the influx of new nations can't keep up. $6m/50 here we come?

Edited by Viluin
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If new nations manage their funds and backcollections properly it is entirely possible for them to grow to a level of 3999.99 infra within 50 days under the "standard" $3m/100 tech deals that are mentioned in the OP. This fact means that the number of nations available for tech deals will continue to fall and will thus drive up the price further, which will in turn further lessen the amount of time required to get up to what I would call "self sustainable income levels" (~3999.99 infra and above).

Price inflation has happened in the past and will happen in the future, the only things that can arrest or reverse the price inflation are invasions into the game of large amounts of players or global wars that reduce the average level of money and tech in the game dramatically.

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This already happened when the standard price went from 3mill/150 to 3mill/100. There's not enough of a difference to change to 3mill/50 yet, and the recent war will certainly delay it.

Yeah, unfortunately this happened right about the time I went from being a seller to a buyer :( Almost all my deals as a seller were for 150, and very soon after starting to buy, I had to settle for $3M/100.

I am starting to struggle with filling my slots at this price though, so it won't be long before I start to offer more, I imagine.

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If new nations manage their funds and backcollections properly it is entirely possible for them to grow to a level of 3999.99 infra within 50 days under the "standard" $3m/100 tech deals that are mentioned in the OP. This fact means that the number of nations available for tech deals will continue to fall and will thus drive up the price further, which will in turn further lessen the amount of time required to get up to what I would call "self sustainable income levels" (~3999.99 infra and above).

Price inflation has happened in the past and will happen in the future, the only things that can arrest or reverse the price inflation are invasions into the game of large amounts of players or global wars that reduce the average level of money and tech in the game dramatically.

You could get to 3999.99 in 50 days with maybe, just maybe, 3mil 50 tech. You can't do it with the standard deals. It's currently taking me 20 days to gain 1000 infra to go from 1999.99 to 2999.99. Oh, and odds are that I wont even hit the 2999.99 that I want.

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There is an artifical cap on how high the price can go, Tech deals only happen because sellers offer tech cheaper than they can buy it.

There will never be a shortage of tech in game because you can always buy it through the standard transaction screen, tech price increase is capped to the potential market the more the price of a tech deal rises the longer nations will wait before purchasing tech, also inter alliance tech deals are not about pure profit getting tech to the higher members of your alliance is a tactical decision. Money isn't the only force determining what the price of tech on the open market is. Alliances will always want to have a decent ratio of moving tech simply for their war fighting abilities lest they find them selves at a serious tech disadvantage when a war breaks out.

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You could get to 3999.99 in 50 days with maybe, just maybe, 3mil 50 tech. You can't do it with the standard deals. It's currently taking me 20 days to gain 1000 infra to go from 1999.99 to 2999.99. Oh, and odds are that I wont even hit the 2999.99 that I want.

Properly managing how the deals go you can absolutely do it in 50 days with the current $3mill/100 deals, I've personally coached a number of nations on ways to do this. You need to manage your deals in the proper manner and time your backcollects properly but it is 100% possible.

Edited by Lord Emares
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this is why "3x3" deals are what most large alliances do (or should if they want more tech growth) as their standard tech deals - it makes it so that nations stay smaller longer, as opposed to a 3-50-50 deal in which a nation can easily receive all the profit immediately (instead of staggered over several months).

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Properly managing how the deals go you can absolutely do it in 50 days with the current $3mill/100 deals, I've personally coached a number of nations on ways to do this. You need to manage your deals in the proper manner and time your backcollects properly but it is 100% possible.

Umm...no. Can you show me one nation 50 days old or less that is at 4000? And when I look at their aid screen I see something indicative of a 3x3? I don't see any nations at 4000 at 50 days period...

Edit: For the few nations that are close, if you check their aid screens you see 3 million pouring into every slot and no tech going out, and even those nations aren't at 4000 infra at 50 days. Fail. :)

Edited by kugelblitz22
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Umm...no. Can you show me one nation 50 days old or less that is at 4000? And when I look at their aid screen I see something indicative of a 3x3? I don't see any nations at 4000 at 50 days period...

Edit: For the few nations that are close, if you check their aid screens you see 3 million pouring into every slot and no tech going out, and even those nations aren't at 4000 infra at 50 days. Fail. :)

Yeah, I'm 61 days old (I've been playing for longer as my last nation was ZI'ed and deleted) and I'm not even past 1.5k infa. Even if I had aid for that whole time of 3 million, I'd probably be at around 3k infa.

I've been part of a 3x3 deal before and it does hinder growth among the Sellers. With a 3x3 I can get 3 deals +2 more single deals in 30 days, so that's 5 deals in a month. Selling direct gets me 6 deals and therefore more money in 30 days

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Yeah, I'm 61 days old (I've been playing for longer as my last nation was ZI'ed and deleted) and I'm not even past 1.5k infa. Even if I had aid for that whole time of 3 million, I'd probably be at around 3k infa.

I've been part of a 3x3 deal before and it does hinder growth among the Sellers. With a 3x3 I can get 3 deals +2 more single deals in 30 days, so that's 5 deals in a month. Selling direct gets me 6 deals and therefore more money in 30 days

As long as you have no empty slots it doesn't matter what combination of $3m/100 deals you do, they're all equally efficient.

Edited by Viluin
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as long as we can continue to get a steady supply of new people to the game,

the price of tech will probably stay at 100/3mil.... mostly because the newer

people don't know they could get better and then the other nations have to drop

their price to keep in competition.

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As long as you have no empty slots it doesn't matter what combination of $3m/100 deals you do, they're all equally efficient.

This is true, and I'm not sure what Hendrix was talking about (it's the same number of slots either way). enderlander is certainly also right though, in that it is more beneficial for sellers to do 1x1 deals. With 1x1 deals, they get $3M up front. Same amount of profit, but they essentially get the ~$1.5M of tech costs as an interest-free loan for 10-20 days (in addition to the ~$1.5M of pure profit that you get either way). Invested properly, this can be substantial in promoting the young nation's growth.

as long as we can continue to get a steady supply of new people to the game,

the price of tech will probably stay at 100/3mil.... mostly because the newer

people don't know they could get better and then the other nations have to drop

their price to keep in competition.

I'm not sure if we're really getting a steady stream of newcomers though. I'd be curious to see what percentage of the "new" players of late are truly new to the game (vs. rerolls). Those that have been around would certainly know the going rates. And note that the "standard" price has increased before, as discussed earlier in this thread.

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Yeah, I'm 61 days old (I've been playing for longer as my last nation was ZI'ed and deleted) and I'm not even past 1.5k infa. Even if I had aid for that whole time of 3 million, I'd probably be at around 3k infa.

Your last sentence in this paragraph is absolutely false as having 60 mill worth of aid managed properly can get you a lot further than 3999.99.

Umm...no. Can you show me one nation 50 days old or less that is at 4000? And when I look at their aid screen I see something indicative of a 3x3? I don't see any nations at 4000 at 50 days period...

Edit: For the few nations that are close, if you check their aid screens you see 3 million pouring into every slot and no tech going out, and even those nations aren't at 4000 infra at 50 days. Fail. :)

First I never said 50 days from nation creation as that is somewhat unreasonable, but 50 days from when they start tech dealing (Assuming 0 outside aid has been gotten previously prior to this). Second, why are you restricting sellers to 3x3s? 3x3s blatantly favour the buyer, whereas 1x1s favour the seller.

<snip>

EDIT: On Second thoughts I probably shouldn't have posted that as it lessens the economic advantage of those in my alliance. In any case it is entirely possible to get to 3999.99 in 50 days purely by doing tech deals at a rate of 3/100

Edited by Lord Emares
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This is true, and I'm not sure what Hendrix was talking about (it's the same number of slots either way). enderlander is certainly also right though, in that it is more beneficial for sellers to do 1x1 deals. With 1x1 deals, they get $3M up front. Same amount of profit, but they essentially get the ~$1.5M of tech costs as an interest-free loan for 10-20 days (in addition to the ~$1.5M of pure profit that you get either way). Invested properly, this can be substantial in promoting the young nation's growth.

Yeah, my math was a bit off there. Sorry. I still stand by my opinion that no nation can get that strong in just 50 days though.

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Do you have a nation link to back up this statement?

No as the nations that I have coached, members of BAPS, have in the intervening period since I coached them been through a large number of nuclear wars but are also significantly older nations now and thus don't have any record of their nation growth past that last 30 days. I haven't done any significant level of coaching in the past 5 months due to RL time constraints.

I did post a full nation plan to to back up my statement but have since taken it down, mainly due to the fact that it would reduce the economic advantage my alliance has with the ability to coach nations to get to that level without needing alliance aid. Now I saw this user: Mario766 reading the thread before I edited the nation plan out of my post. If they read it is another story but if they did they could verify that such a plan was posted.

Yeah, my math was a bit off there. Sorry. I still stand by my opinion that no nation can get that strong in just 50 days though.

They can. It not an opinion its a mathematical fact.

Edited by Lord Emares
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