Mark Ashton

[quote name='Jgoods45' timestamp='1296213649' post='2607283'] Maybe not... but their allies can. Quite easily actually. [/quote] That's not going to happen. They have been threatened by you guys for ages yet they still stand. I think your ego overestimates your power, but since CnG is on the downfall anyways I am quite certain this is the last war UBD has to worry about your meow meow threats.

[quote name='Comrade Craig' timestamp='1296184333' post='2606601'] It was nice knowing you, UBD. -Craig [/quote] So you claim that NEAT is able to destroy UBD? Yeah.....keep thinking that.

[quote name='HellAngel' timestamp='1296133937' post='2605457'] You were a part of Gremlins? Seriously? Anyway, my point still stands. If it was valid for Polaris, why shouldnt it also be valid for NPO? It is true that TOP was a long time ally of NPO. Thats pretty much because they were the first ally they had and NPO supported them in their growth. So we have this pretty good ally on one side. And then there was Citadel and pretty much every other ally TOP had at the time on Karma side. If you really hold it against them that they did not charge with rightous anger at their own allies, you must hold a grudge against pretty much every alliance that lasted a bit longer on planet bob. [/quote] Yes. Then you should have stayed neutral or canceled the treaty earlier. As far as I remember tC overwrote other defensive obligations. I don't want to argue the Karma war or anything though. It was justified. If you take that situation and the situation now, you can conclude that TOP made the same mistake twice. Instead of using some sense, you blindly follow your "allies" although you said that you'll do what's best for TOP. I think the best for TOP would be making some reasonable decisions.

[quote name='HellAngel' timestamp='1296132640' post='2605432'] What the heck are you talking about. Afaik, the Umb and FOK treaties were long gone when bipolar rolled around. At least it was obvious to us which position they would take. We did not betray anyone. Ever since the TPF situation slighty prior to Bipolar, sides were pretty much set. We were opportunistic, but we did not lie straight to anyones face like Polaris did. [/quote] No doubt I don't want to justify NpO's actions. As I said prior to this: They'd deserve a beatdown, coming from TOP. [quote name='HellAngel' timestamp='1296133136' post='2605440'] I've heard this claim so many times about so many alliances before its not even funny anymore. Care to elaborate why MCXA abondoned Polaris in the WotC? ... thought so. [/quote] You are pretty quick on this. I am a MCXA Member for 30 days, at that time, I have been (with you) a Member of Grämlins.And I was one of the few people actually supporting the war against NpO, and am still doing it now. You make it look like I am questioning your support for NpO's destruction, which isn't the case. I am questioning your support for NPO's destruction, which is btw also part of the DoW. And yeah, you have heard it many times because you and Rommel (again) fail to deliver a good reasoning yet call me dumb, question my alliance in order to avoid the actual discussion. [quote name='ROMMELHSQ' timestamp='1296133181' post='2605443'] Always good to have more blind supporters! [/quote] Blind people usually compensate this by having very sharp senses. Although being blind they can get a very real picture of how the world looks like.

[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1296129221' post='2605366'] 1. Firstly, SF/C&G/PB are not hugely interlinked, they all have their own egos and their own views of the world. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to get more involved in game politics. Secondly, you are focusing on the present day situation. Immediately after Karma the world had Ex-hege (politically dead until bipolar), SF, C&G, FB and Citadel, all of whom were connected, none of whom held an upper hand. 2. It was two years ago, but it is still a change. This thread was brought up in response to the recent increase in posts talking about the events of two years ago, it's clearly still relevant to today. Also, his point is that anything is allowed within the game. EZI is outside of the game as it's preventing people from playing the game. 3. You just said the events of two years ago were irrelevant. These were 3 years ago, and the Umbrella triumvirate then don't even play now. 4. This makes no sense in the context of the rest of your post. I am glad we're getting you interested in destroying the mushroom kingdom. The entire point of Azaghul's post is that we need to make the game more interesting. Here you are, saying we've done this for you. [/quote] [i](I have inserted numbers to make the response clearer, hope you don't mind) [/i]1. In fact it's not about blocs being tied to each other, it's about the top alliances of these blocs being allied to each other. In our current situation especially you and Viridia are important. Since Karma you have done exactly what NPO has done since GWI - allying yourself with the most different sides of the treaty web in order to create a Hegemony; and Hegemonies are what stagnate the game. I personally think that a war cannot revive the game because wars always drive people away from the game and only last for a few weeks. What really keeps the game interesting is a balanced foreign development. 2. I think my point was a little unclear. I have never doubted that EZIing people isn't a very "human" move, however I have doubted the efficiency, the actual enforceability and I have pointed out that NPO has paid for their crimes during and after Karma, and since then not committed anything worth mentioning. (Please I left shortly after Karma (goal achieved) and just returned, I might be wrong here, I have not found anything they'd have done that were worthy attacking them) 3. Yes, call me a hypocrite for that, but the differences are: A. NPO has already paid for their "crimes". B. I actually don't want that Umbrella pays now, three years later, for what they have done to NPO, but I think it's funny they hit NPO for something they have participated in (and supported) yet not paid for. 4. No actually I want to retire

[quote name='ROMMELHSQ' timestamp='1296130488' post='2605393'] It is your fault for being dumb to think that treaties remain forever. [/quote] By [i]your definition[/i] I probably am dumb. But you miss the point. You have cut my argument in two pieces and have only refuted the second part of it. Doing that is [i]my definition[/i] of stupidity. I have not only questioned the cancellation of the treaty but also the time this treaty lasted. You have been allied to them for three years and you cancel the treaty when they are right before a losing war the first time within these three years... Now this [i]could be[/i] a coincidence. But I don't believe in coincidences. Your head was in NPO's ass until NPO got a beatdown, and I now bet 500 tech that your head will be in MK's ass until they are right before a beatdown. Because if it comes to this, you'll weasel yourself out again, and find another pathetic excuse to waddle away.History always repeats and MK doesn't deserve better, so keep going platy!@#$%s you'll always have my support

[quote name='ROMMELHSQ' timestamp='1296129739' post='2605377'] Man...you like to through the word betray around alot. Also, iirc, our treaty with FOK was gone before the war. edit: I guess according to your logic, we pre-emptively betrayed Umb and FOK [/quote] Call it whatever you want. It's not FOK and Umbrella are any better than you. So I am not really sorry that you did what you did to them. And you make it sound like as if it were my fault that your history is full of dumping old friends. Or do you want to deny anything of the said?

[quote name='HellAngel' timestamp='1296128754' post='2605361'] 1. I give you that, it kinda irks me too they didnt do it earlier. TOP itself was very split on the issue and they took very long to actually come to a decision. Because asking the question to cancel the MDP was a hurtful thing to do and would polarize the alliance. They (or we) should have done it earlier 2. Last time we preempted someone that didnt turn out so well... so give us the favour of the doubt here :> [/quote] No. I am aware that my good friend Rotavele is ignorant on a few points however you cannot doubt the core of his points. The Bi-Polar war was the only war you didn't stick with the side that in the end won. And I know that at the time of the Bi-Polar war Crymson was naiive enough to believe NpO, and you guys wanted to turn the sides in your favor in order to get rid of CnG - which in the end didn't work. So, by betraying Umbrella and FOK (because you know if you didn't they'd betray you at some point for MK) you changed sides again and tried to $%&@ your friends over again. And today, well today you have changed sides again, allied with your long hated ally, you are supporting a war without any reason at all. Please let's not pretend anyone in TOP thinks it's justified to hit NPO for committing crimes two years ago because since then, they have done nothing that would constitute them as a threat.

[quote name='HellAngel' timestamp='1296128030' post='2605338'] How about we leave this to the alliances who are actually affected? I mean, no doubt NPO would say we betrayed them (because it suits their agenda atm), but other than that i dont think you would find an alliances saying so. [/quote] It's a fact that you didn't help NPO in their only losing war since 2006. It is also a fact that you were allied to them for three years. Now you can attempt to e-lawyer your way out of that, find "valid" reasons for the cancellation but come on: 3 years of friendship breaking right before the first losing war within these 3 years speaks for itself. I however agree that you were justified attacking NpO during the WotC and that you would have had a good CB now. The problem is that you didn't hit them but VE because of some manufactured bull. I always respected TOP for their reasonable decisions, however at the moment I can't get rid of the feeling that your head is so deep in MK's ass that you can't think straight anymore.

I disagree with almost all points. However, I'll not take the time to answer on all of them, after all there is a war to fight, however I want to respond to a few: 1. Bloc Situation Pre/After Karma. Pre-Karma we had the Continuum that was one power bloc. Today we have several power blocs - that is correct as well. However that doesn't mean the game is more dynamic because the more important factor, that there still is only one [b]power force[/b] remained. So in the end, you have just hidden that by having several blocs working tight together. It would have changed if you signed less treaties and/or if you decided to be on one side of the "bloc-web" - however after your mass-cancellation you ended up being allied CnG, PB, SF and additionally TOP as a strong alliance. The conclusion is that there is no difference between you and NPO in this point. 2. EZI / PZI: That was [b]two[/b] years ago. On one hand side you make them look like criminals for committing these "crimes" on the other hand you claim this is a game and everything is allowed. That doesn't make sense. I'd assume since this is a game you should be able to forget. Last I checked NPO didn't use any illegal strategies hunting the EZI-targets. So the people receiving the punishment made sure that there identity was discovered. VOX just showed that people could anonymously live within the main Hegemony powers at that time without being discovered. What you are doing is searching points to make NPO look worse than it actually is, because you need someone to hate to keep the kindergarten you call alliance interested. 3. I don't think it was part of the thread but it's part of the topic. Umbrella also attacked GPA in the Woodstock Massacre. Now, Umbrella [b]never paid[/b] for their crimes, and never lost a war. Although being ex Genmay (thus actually on NpO's EZI list) they managed to get protection from TOP, were able to hit Polaris in the WoTC, hit NPO in Karma, and when their actual protector needed them, they made sure to be on the opposing side in order to win. Now they announce how evil NPO is, although they committed the same crimes and although they never "paid". That's pathetic. 4. Don't pretend you are better than NPO, and we both know that change is the only spirit keeping this game alive. With this war you have made sure the last person in this game not kissing your ass has understood that you are a threat for everyones security and that you are in fact not better. No matter how this war will end, this will make that people on the other side reconcile and one day you and all your ass kissing treaty-partners, and their ass kissing treaty partners will get a kick in the butt they won't survive. This will be the day, I can happily retire from this game because everything is achieved.

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1296083143' post='2603441'] I never imagined that FAN would be cowards, if you had something against NPO why you didn't declare before? [/quote] They are cowards, that's why. Oh wait, that was a rhetorical question. I agree, you might a have a reason hitting NPO, but instead of fighting one on one, you chose to kick Pacifica, being already on the ground. That is very honorable of you. Also to all the people who argue with "get over it", "it's just a game" and "we are better than Pacifica because"... No you are not. You are exactly the same piece of !@#$ we got rid off in Karma, and I'd have never thought, that one day I'd defend Pacifica, but you commit what you accuse them of. And that doesn't make you any better, and I am glad that the only constant in this game is that at least the names always change. And I hope that when the name changes again, that you'll get stomped to the ground.

[quote name='Cataduanes' timestamp='1295865886' post='2596384'] Haha I must admit you made me fall off my chair in laughter (Sorry TOP). [/quote] Okey, then please lower our reps 500 Million and 10k tech levels. Thanks in advance

[quote name='DictatatorDan' timestamp='1295823699' post='2594691'] [color="#ff0000"]Wait? MCXA can get its inacitve member force to do anything? I am impressed.[/color] [/quote] [color="#ff0000"]Yeah, we are all completely inactive but [OOC]gave our passwords [/OOC] to SuperCoolYellow. That way we can pretend to be active. It's fun quoting your own posts all the time and discuss with yourself. Try it [/color] [quote name='rsoxbronco1' timestamp='1295827249' post='2594819'] The joke is MCXA. [/quote] Really, you made me laugh. Thanks for that. I saw the post, I read your name, and then I read your sig. [quote name='Feanor Noldorin' timestamp='1295844757' post='2595458'] The rule is that you don't hit one CnG alliance. You hit them all. [/quote] Next war. Either that, or we pull a TOP and kiss their asses

[quote name='Chief Savage Man' timestamp='1295857550' post='2596278'] meow meow meow meow there's another thread to debate this issue meow you should go there meow [/quote] Good to know meow is the only argument your side has. If I know something about the game, then it's that the time will come when [u]you[/u] will be on the receiving end, and I'll make sure to meow then. I think I have reminded you in another thread, that it is especially funny from someone whining about the Unjust War even years after it happened, coming up with such an ignorant response now.

Meanies! We should have invested more money in bouncers. I TOLD YOU SO SCY. Also thanks ODN, SCY owes me tech now!

[quote name='iamwalrus' timestamp='1295821630' post='2594560'] I don't see why such criticism should be given out the THL. They knew that they were fighting a losing battle with the amount of alliances piled on them. It was the wise thing to do. All I can say is that I am glad that our prayers have been answered for a quick peace and that not too much blood has been shed. [/quote] They knew this wouldn't be an easy thing before they declared. Also, they didn't really get a beat down. They haven't received a single nuke. I am sure there are rogues that did more damage. Now what they have done, is leaving their allies out in the dark, and I think doing that after you declare is even worse than not fighting at all, because their "allies" will have strategical difficulties now, and certainly such a behavior isn't good for your moral. Also, I have not seen a topic in this war both parties being so unified on an issue.

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1295820321' post='2594488'] This is one of fastest surrenders that I saw, just 15 hours after the DoW, you should be proud of yourselves The Hanseatic League. [/quote] Yeah,, honestly, if you intent to surrender after 15 hours then don't fight at all.....

[quote name='KingEd' timestamp='1295799841' post='2593955'] You know that alliance your currently fighting for? MCXA, I once led and went to ZI for it. Learn your history before trying to insult me - I didn't mean it as an insult and you probably took it as one. And yes, I'm very almighty, and No - we wouldn't win against MK, they have a 170 nation advantage over us. So in that regard, your comparison fails. What I meant, originally, is that strategically, MK is a stronger military opponent than MCXA and I dont think anyone would argue that - as such, it would make no sense for MK to go in against MCXA. Sorry if it came off as an insult, it was meant as a joke. my MCXA'ers - have fun out there, but I have to say - INT give em hell [/quote] I am [i]deeply[/i] sorry. I forgot that ex MCXA Chancellors are granted immunity. I forget we aren't allowed calling them out when they show nothing but arrogance towards our alliance. I am sorry I didn't get the almighty was "joking", and honestly, I don't buy that. If you were joking, your jokes are lame. Don't every try it again - it's embarrassing. You were sitting on your high horse, being arrogant and that although (which I have attempted to point out) you have no and absolutely no reason to be arrogant.

[quote name='halfChaos' timestamp='1295804120' post='2594015'] So ... we are stupid for being diplomatic because NPO is going to declare war on someone? And somehow that means we claim to always be on the winning side? Actually it sounds more like you claimed we were always stacked to the winning side. If you spent as much time on your war guide and recruiting as you do trolling the forums acting belligerent then maybe you wouldn't have these problems. Maybe you should've thought of that before you went to war. [/quote] What? Why would I spend time on recruiting or on MCXA's war guide. I am a Member there for 21 days, and SuperCoolYellow is CN's best recruiter[sup]TM [/sup]so that's not something I'd have to worry about. It was however a nice attempt to refute a point I was making. You have proven to the world that you lack comprehension skills, and then you insult my alliance. As if that made the position of your alliance any better. I was claiming that according to Hyperion, Sparta would reconcile with NPO if they were in a stronger position, just to save your little infra-pixels. That is also what I believe greenacres indicated, by claiming that you are full of politicians. Now take that, prove me wrong [i]by actions[/i] and stop playing dumb. Thanks.

[quote name='Hyperion321' timestamp='1295802916' post='2593992'] And? We don't desire power or influence over all others. Power does terrible, [i]terrible[/i] things to alliances, and we don't want to have anything to do with it. As for never fighting outnumbered, it's not our fault that the other side of the web constantly isolates itself by ragging on any fringe alliance that perceive to be "against" them. Maybe if they stopped being belligerent a-holes and [b]actually did some diplomacy [/b]to swing the fringes they could actually win a war for once. [/quote] You make it sound like it's all [i]their[/i] fault. Either I am completely clueless or you are on Viridias side of this conflict. And this time, [i]you[/i] are on the side of people not trying to use diplomacy. Your position is very black or white: We are always on the winning side, because the losing side is always wrong and too stupid to try diplomacy and win a war" sounds like an invitation to NPO to knock on your door and "try diplomacy" as soon as they are strong enough to actually win a war.

Honestly, I think NSO has a point. You have been one of the strongest alliances in the game for almost 3 years (?!). Basically since after you have left GUARD you have been part of the major powers yet you never had a say. No one ever mentions you when it comes to influence and backbone - not even your own allies. Also, you have [u]never[/u] fought outnumbered.

[quote name='Fyfe XIV' timestamp='1295762221' post='2593240'] Don't attack Athens! They might bring in MK [/quote] I doubt that the choice of the target was in our hands. What Tyga said. [quote name='KingEd' timestamp='1295762402' post='2593259'] Wasting MK on MCXA? C'mon! We both know better than that... [/quote] Coming from the almighty Triumvirate of the almighty TPE. I want to see your 36 nations fight against MK. Let's not pretend you are in a better position. [quote name='Dave93' timestamp='1295763228' post='2593328'] last I checked Int and Tetris have no connections to MCXA o/ Sirius [/quote] We love to play (with) Tetris [quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1295763616' post='2593351'] I liked you, scy. [/quote] No one likes him, don't lie! [quote name='Rextu' timestamp='1295785237' post='2593823'] I say SCY should be expelled from MCXA for going into anarchy so soon after posting a DoW [/quote] Maybe the FOK! traitor scum jammar warned them beforehand. In this case SCY is excused.

[quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1295713090' post='2591999'] This is exactly what happened. Please attack us? [/quote] Yeah Penkala, the fighter for "[i]justice",[/i] who is making 15 topics a day due to "subjective unfair treatment", is now part of the big guy and suddenly acting ignorant. Oh lord, there is a reason no one likes you. And trust me, you'll get your ass handed to you.

[quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1295712020' post='2591973'] Uh, sure ... we started the war, of course we are Alterego, you're running around all the threads still trying to claim that we 'ran' Lennox, even though he's clearly shown he's a free agent, and it was ridiculous even before then. Please go away. [/quote] it was debated elsewhere that spying is an aggression and thus VE is only defending itself.

[quote name='DevastationStation' timestamp='1295706337' post='2591836'] You misunderstand, nobody is completely innocent but for admin's sake, call this war for what it is, stop hiding behind this psuedo barrier of righteousness. Look, everybody got the war that they have been begging for for months, but at what cost I wonder? [/quote] no costs. I'd agree with Bob Janova, however I think that Viridia is the aggressor here. I don't doubt the validity of the CB however I think that since they didn't try diplomacy and since they made this trap up, they did he first move. That would e.g. perfectly justify RoK claiming they honor their [i]defensive[/i] obligations first.