mastab Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 OOC: Technically he is on par with Marxist ideology and epistemology which rejects western conceptions of the state as tools of the capitalist class or the powerful in a nation to dominate the proletariat. His idea is that the proletariat elects and thereby controls the nation. What you describe is an idealistic conception of western attempts at democracy he rejects this as its fundamental system of capitalism always creates a ruling class which dominates the nation's wealth and people. Of course his country would by the west still be called state, though within his own framework its not as it is not existing to coerce or control the workers but rather only exists as an extension of them. Moreover you can't expect them to speak in western terms for to so and continue to describe their own critique of it would be impossible. In the same way you shouldn't argue with him for to describe western society in the way in which you wish to would further be just as impossible. Im not a communist lol but I have studied communist and postmodernist philosophy. OOC: I like you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manetheren Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Mindless rabble and peasants have no business running anything, much less a responsible nation. Only properly bred, educated and trained gentlemen have any of the great responsibility necessary to lead. The Confederate Navy and Air Force has been authorized to refuse passage by NAAC vessels and aircraft travelling through the Caribbean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deSouza Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Mindless rabble and peasants have no business running anything, much less a responsible nation. Only properly bred, educated and trained gentlemen have any of the great responsibility necessary to lead.The Confederate Navy and Air Force has been authorized to refuse passage by NAAC vessels and aircraft travelling through the Caribbean. The People's Democratic Federation of America (South)'s government sends a memo to the confederate Navy and Air Force saying that international waters and airspace are under no one's jursdiction, and attempting to deny passage of means of transportation through them are acts of war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The People's Democratic Federation of America (South)'s government sends a memo to the confederate Navy and Air Force saying that international waters and airspace are under no one's jursdiction, and attempting to deny passage of means of transportation through them are acts of war. The CSA owns all of the islands ringing the Carribean and therefore controls the waters ringing the Carribean, effectively controlling the entrie Carribean Sea. You have no right to enter thier territorial waters without their permission. Doing so would be infringing upon and violating their sovereignty and by extension an act of war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastab Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The CSA owns all of the islands ringing the Carribean and therefore controls the waters ringing the Carribean, effectively controlling the entrie Carribean Sea. You have no right to enter thier territorial waters without their permission. Doing so would be infringing upon and violating their sovereignty and by extension an act of war. The islands are not so many nor so closely spaced together that they can legitimately claim all of the Carribean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Orlov Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The islands are not so many nor so closely spaced together that they can legitimately claim all of the Carribean. The NSU backs this statement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The islands are not so many nor so closely spaced together that they can legitimately claim all of the Carribean. Please read and think before you issue a statement like this. We stated that they own the islands ringing the Carribean Sea. You will find that the gaps between the various islands are such that territorial waters of each island overlap each other, effectively making it a Confederate Lake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Orlov Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Please read and think before you issue a statement like this. We stated that they own the islands ringing the Carribean Sea. You will find that the gaps between the various islands are such that territorial waters of each island overlap each other, effectively making it a Confederate Lake. Controlling the islands between the Atlantic and the Gulf of Mexico does NOT give CSA control of the entire water body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastab Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Please read and think before you issue a statement like this. We stated that they own the islands ringing the Carribean Sea. You will find that the gaps between the various islands are such that territorial waters of each island overlap each other, effectively making it a Confederate Lake. Saying it doesn't make it true. It simply doesn't make geographical sense. Once again: the islands are not closely spaced enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Controlling the islands between the Atlantic and the Gulf of Mexico does NOT give CSA control of the entire water body. Once again, I ask that you read mroe carefully. The CSA controlss all access in and out of the Carribean Sea via the Atlantic Ocean and the Gulf of Mexico. Thus, the CSA has the ability to regulate traffic through the sea if it wishes to. Doing so would not be an act of war on their part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Saying it doesn't make it true. It simply doesn't make geographical sense. Once again: the islands are not closely spaced enough. Our cartographers can find no gap larger than 50 miles in the entire Carribean chain between islands. Assuming they claim 24 nautical miles as is common in many places, they control all access into and out of the sea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manetheren Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The Confederate States can control who can enter and leave the Caribbean, we own it. None can enter the Caribbean except by traversing Confederate Territorial Waters. Those who cannot pay passage, may not enter, and we do not expect the pitiful peasants to be able to afford the tolls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Orlov Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Once again, I ask that you read mroe carefully. The CSA controlss all access in and out of the Carribean Sea via the Atlantic Ocean and the Gulf of Mexico. Thus, the CSA has the ability to regulate traffic through the sea if it wishes to. Doing so would not be an act of war on their part. Yes but now your editing what you first stated. You stated it was a Confederate lake, and this is simply false. Yes they control the Carribean Islands and waters around them to an extent, nothing more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Yes but now your editing what you first stated. You stated it was a Confederate lake, and this is simply false. Yes they control the Carribean Islands and waters around them to an extent, nothing more. We said that it was EFFECTIVELY a Confederate lake. Note the emphasis on effectively. If someone controls all the access to a building, would you not say that they control the building? The same applies here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Orlov Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 We said that it was EFFECTIVELY a Confederate lake. Note the emphasis on effectively. If someone controls all the access to a building, would you not say that they control the building? The same applies here. The way we understood it was that you were claiming it was just that; a Confederate lake. A wading pool for their empire, when in reality only a small portion is truley under CSA control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The way we understood it was that you were claiming it was just that; a Confederate lake. A wading pool for their empire, when in reality only a small portion is truley under CSA control. Do you not understand the meaning of the word "effectively"? It means that their control of the Carribean Sea is implied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V The King Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 "We might as well note that Nueva Gran Colombia does have territorial waters in the Caribbean, though they are narrow and runs through the coasts of Venezuela and Colombia., A vessel can make it to UCA without having to touch Confederate waters if they pass through NGC waters." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Orlov Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Do you not understand the meaning of the word "effectively"? It means that their control of the Carribean Sea is implied. That would be a false implication. OOC: lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 That would be a false implication.OOC: lol OOC: I don't quite see what you're getting at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deSouza Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Please read and think before you issue a statement like this. We stated that they own the islands ringing the Carribean Sea. You will find that the gaps between the various islands are such that territorial waters of each island overlap each other, effectively making it a Confederate Lake.Our cartographers can find no gap larger than 50 miles in the entire Carribean chain between islands. Assuming they claim 24 nautical miles as is common in many places, they control all access into and out of the sea. America would like to remind CSA that NAAC has access to the caribbean sea as well, and that America considers the caribbean sea international waters,. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manetheren Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Yes but now your editing what you first stated. You stated it was a Confederate lake, and this is simply false. Yes they control the Carribean Islands and waters around them to an extent, nothing more. To the contrary, peasant, the Confederate Navy is much more technologically advanced than that of any others in the area, not to mention concentrated in that one location, whereas all others, the NAAC especially, must protect a long Pacific coastline as well. "We might as well note that Nueva Gran Colombia does have territorial waters in the Caribbean, though they are narrow and runs through the coasts of Venezuela and Colombia., A vessel can make it to UCA without having to touch Confederate waters if they pass through NGC waters." That is correct, Nueva Gran Colombia does have territorial waters in the Caribbean, however, the Confederate Island of Trinidad is close enough to effectively control that passage as well, if we so desired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jutopia la Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) That is correct, Nueva Gran Colombia does have territorial waters in the Caribbean, however, the Confederate Island of Trinidad is close enough to effectively control that passage as well, if we so desired. Are you saying that you will make an attempt to control my waters because you have a nearby island? We should make the effort to clearly define the borders between our waters in that area, seeing as it could escalate to an issue. Edited February 25, 2009 by jutopia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generalissimo Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) To the contrary, peasant, the Confederate Navy is much more technologically advanced than that of any others in the area, not to mention concentrated in that one location, whereas all others, the NAAC especially, must protect a long Pacific coastline as well.That is correct, Nueva Gran Colombia does have territorial waters in the Caribbean, however, the Confederate Island of Trinidad is close enough to effectively control that passage as well, if we so desired. Procinctia was not aware of a significant Confederale naval presence in el Caribe, or anywhere else. You're bluffing or exaggerating your naval strength. I know, I subscribe to Jane’s. Out of Character Information: CNRP-R Rule Regarding Naval Vessels 1 Ship= 1 Ship in game (class equivalence) Edited February 25, 2009 by Generalissimo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deSouza Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 To the contrary, peasant, the Confederate Navy is much more technologically advanced than that of any others in the area, not to mention concentrated in that one location, whereas all others, the NAAC especially, must protect a long Pacific coastline as well. The workers and peasants nation of America would like to remind the confederates that although their navy was being kept at its minimum due to costs, it is far superior in terms of technology than the confederates' navy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raritan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Procinctia was not aware of a significant Confederale naval presence in el Caribe, or anywhere else. You're bluffing or exaggerating your naval strength.Out of Character Information: CNRP-R Rule Regarding Naval Vessels 1 Ship= 1 Ship in game (class equivalence) OOC: Class equivalence doesn't mean that all navies are of the same strength. A WWII destroyer is no match for a modern destroyer. Same goes for every other ship class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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