PresidentDavid
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Posts posted by PresidentDavid
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Adding all of this to the RP just seems to over complicate it all. I think we are at a point to where we have developed our government and set down the needed rules for the RP. I believe at this point we should revert to having the GMs approve all votes and whatnot before they are written up and proposed because at this point (I'm not really talking about this one) it is becoming hard to keep up with and some of the things being proposed are a little detrimental.
If you haven't noticed, two people have quit. I would assume part of that has to do with the fact that there is more OOC posting than IC posting and more rule threads than RP threads...
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Or Admin... I suppose Mod is the layman's term.
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Hail Mod!
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You know what that's fine. Y'all do whatever y'all want I was just trying to be helpful. I wasn't starting some argument I was trying to put a few things in perspective. I don't need all of you &%$*@#&% at me.
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I agree.
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This entire "punish people" thing is silly... I'm sorry. I've been rolled twice I think, and I had to rebuild. There are about 30 people who had to start new in CNRP2 and they are doing just fine. But again Melech, that was directed at Triyun not you :v
Y'all do what y'all want, I was just saying what needs to be done to bring everyone together.
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Sorry I don't mean to mess up your thread. I just wanted to add this for perspective: We do not force anyone to RP anything internally unless it has to do with war. So if I want high-speed internet and I don't have the Internet Wonder, it does not really matter. I watch House of Cards on TexasNetflix just as fast as the Hawaiians.
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PD the problem with your vision here, is 1 and 2 points are contradictory. The areas you say people want to RP in are very small, and YET you ask that they be able to expand freely within those areas, which as mentioned are very small. Aside from cent none of the European states are all that big in either. Same with NA and MGL, and certainly neither monopolize land completely on either continent.
Now, as a point of clarification I guess you could say well you want a specific part of Europe or a specific part of North America open, but and I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess Rome or Ireland in Europe and Texas in America, but then what happens if another player has either of those, a lot of the areas you want are very small, and you can only slice it up how many ways. So you get it when the map is reset, and what if Cent wants it as his main area also? You fight, Cent takes it, you quit?
I don't really understand that logic for a reset and free expansion. What I can understand, and personally have done, is reduce and make it open for white space for new players. But as far as the right to expand freely, what about other new players behind you?
PD the problem with your vision here, is 1 and 2 points are contradictory.
1) No they are not. The first point I said that people are "freely RPing" and the second point I said that the map was reset. In the beginning we were not letting people claim huge swathes of land. If someone would have wanted to claim France, Andorra, Spain and Portugal the GMs/community would not have allowed them to do so.
2) I notice that most of the time when you are tying to prove someone wrong you claim they are contradicting themselves... This reminds me of Public Forum debate. I'm not sure if you were a debater but that is something we were taught to do even though most of the time the opponent was not contradicting themselves and we were full of $%#@. Anyway, just try to pay attention to what I said before you start critiquing it and telling me why I'm wrong. You made a suggestion and seemed to want to reason so that's what I'm trying to do here. I'm not your enemy :v
The areas you say people want to RP in are very small, and YET you ask that they be able to expand freely within those areas, which as mentioned are very small. Aside from cent none of the European states are all that big in either.
1) Small? Look at the CNRP2 map. We have 17 nations in the "small" expanse of Europe and there is still room for a couple more nations.
2) I do not think I ever said "freely expand". I did say, however, "freely RP". I think it's great that just about anyone can attempt to expand their borders and there isn't a singular superpower keeping them at bay but instead it takes the cooperation of multiple nations working together. But yeah... I don't think I said "freely expand" but correct me if I'm wrong.
3) "Aside from Cent" there are only 5 other European states and maybe room for a couple more. His borders are nearly identical to that of the Roman Empire at its height :V
Same with NA and MGL, and certainly neither monopolize land completely on either continent.
1) MGL IS one-third of North America and he is the 51 parts people would like to RP.
2) Until y'all had the great purge of land hogging a couple weeks ago yes they did monopolize land. MGL arguably still does. What land is left in NA? The sandy part of Mexico Tikal did not want and the mostly frozen part of Canada that likely no one but I would want.
2.5) I cannot blame MGL or Cent for doing so because if I had that much power/influence I would do the same, but that is why I emphasized before that y'all would need reform if you wanted this schism to end. Having power disparities is a good aspect for our nation-RP because it adds flavor to the game, but essentially having a few superpowers and then a peasant class at the bottom is like living in Mexico before the turn of the century.
Now, as a point of clarification I guess you could say well you want a specific part of Europe or a specific part of North America open, but and I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess Rome or Ireland in Europe and Texas in America...
1) It seems like you are making this about me. I was just using my own wants as an example. Justi wants Russia, Cent seems to like Europe, Eva likes China/Japan, and I so happen to like Ontario, Ireland, Great Britain, the Isle of Mann, Vatican City, Texas, Louisiana, or even Iceland when I can RP that there are a bunch of old growth trees there. Most people are not blessed to be like Sarah, TBM, or (God help me) Rota who can either RP anywhere because they have a general knowledge of most cultures, they are extremely creative, or they actually like RPing in those places most other people avoid like Africa or South America.
...but then what happens if another player has either of those, a lot of the areas you want are very small, and you can only slice it up how many ways.
1) Firstly, my ability to RP is not limited to Texas and Ireland contrary to what a small group of you seem to be convinced of...
2) I highly doubt anyone would be looking at Texas, Ontario, Louisiana, or Ireland (immediately) if all of Europe is suddenly opened up.
So you get it when the map is reset, and what if Cent wants it as his main area also? You fight, Cent takes it, you quit?
1) I think you skimmed what I wrote because I explained in the 2) point and in my Conclusion that you would need to bring reform to CNRP1 so that there aren't these massive military disparities between players and so I may actually have a chance of defending myself against Cent. If you really want to fix this problem, do what we did and make a simplistic technology scale that ends at present day.
2) This is also something a lot of people have pointed out when CNRP2 was being made. A lot of players saw you and Cent as the enemy to RP because no matter how the rules were made to transformed, y'all would somehow still mind-&%$* everyone with "lolteching" or just generally but forceful and imperialistic in regards to war. I do not think y'all do this on purpose but it mostly has to do with your size and the power you have - I think most of us would take advantage of that if we were in your shoes and would push people around as well. Y'all would either need to change your goals for the RP and shift more towards cooperation and character roleplay as opposed to singular-domination and global imperialism - if that cannot be done then I cannot see an end to this schism or the schism allowing both of you in the end.
2.5) That one was kind of long... But I think you wanted someone/me to explain what needed to be done and I truly think that is one of the main points.
I don't really understand that logic for a reset and free expansion.
1) Covered this; especially explaining "free expansion" and how I never said it. But I think I understood what you were shooting at, it's all up there ^.
What I can understand, and personally have done, is reduce and make it open for white space for new players.
1) It makes sense that you understand your own actions and I know that you opened up vast swathes of land for new players including: the tundra of Alaska, Australia, parts of Oceania, India, the sandy parts of the Arabian peninsula, Antarctica and that awkward part of the world East of Iran that looks simply terrifying to have a nation in IC or RL. I understand that you did that as an olive branch and I think it was the right thing to do considering it did look very greedy to have all of that land; however this in no way alleviates a single problem I mentioned in my original post.
2) Most new players immediately want to jump to the area they would want to control in real life. I would assume for most people that would either be somewhere in the United States, Europe, possibly Japan/China, or maybe even Australia all of which is locked up except for Australia and England (not including Iceland because who really wants to RP other than me and that one other guy?) So I do not think that really looks appealing to new players and looking at the number of new players y'all have gotten these past weeks... I think that can act as evidence that that is not really working.
But as far as the right to expand freely, what about other new players behind you?
1) You keep bringing up this "expand freely" thing that you seem to believe corrupts all of the other unaddressed points I made. I will clarify one last time - I do not think I ever said "expand freely" but I did say "RP freely". There is not a huge, singular-superpower that is waiting to stomp on you if you try to expand, yes that is true, but I mentioned more along the lines of people have A LOT more leeway to RP their government how they want and implement their own policies without having to worry about someone urinating over their RP just because it doesn't line up with a bigger power's political beliefs/agenda.
Conclusion
A) I really felt like you either skipped over many of my main points or didn't address them because you were hung up on this whole "free expansion thing" so I tried to bring them back up in regards to what you said in your reply.
B) I do not want to see one CNRP where there are over 30 players and another where there are over 10 but only a handful that are active. I would rather see one CNRP where everyone is together with a balanced system of nation/war-rp.
C) Is what we have in CNRP2 perfect? No. There are some things that I do not like, but even with Tywin or a couple of the loony rules that exist I still would rather be here than sitting in CNRP1 waiting either for MGL to go inactive or Cent to quit the game.
You need to face the reality that CNRP1 is not in good shape player-wise and it is because of the long-standing OOC rules that have allowed massive disparities to exist for so long (you are a Democrat, you should know massive disparities are bad!). If you want to have some type of CNRP3 where everyone participates together then there are going to need to be some changes in regards to the rules and also a map reset.
But I already read Eva's comment and I'm sure most of you in CNRP1 like how things are. If that is the case then don't change anything. It just seems like some of you would like to see everyone together so I was offering what I thought was a pretty simplistic way of accomplishing that goal.
Regards,
PD
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From my knowledge you were voted out of CNRP2 and are no longer a member. You cannot contest anything :V
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No, you did not get ignored, even though I haven't replied in over two weeks. Not like much happened where it'd matter. Mostly, I had three reasons to not respond. First, I'm going to admit, I had trouble to understand the third point, as most likely due to a lack of language skills, I did not get the meaning of it. Second, I'm skeptical on making OOC agreements on how people conduct themselves ICly like this. If I write long posts, it is mostly to give encompassing arguments that overall are understandable, so that people adjust their actions out of their own interest. That's also why I never said you can't act in your own interest, just that to me, the interest of Tianxia is with having global order and to enforce that, so that the status quo endures, not some Ron Paul-esque turn away from hegemony. Third, I'm just bad at organising community efforts, and working on this thing on my own is pretty much doomed to fail to achieve much.
As non of the three have changed though, even with a reply, you won't get a CoC from me at this point of time (and maybe never).
Triyun you have my sincerest apologies. I never saw that post and it was not brought to my attention.
I somewhat feel like Eva because I don't want to change you nor do I think I could change you.... But really I don't think that would fix the "problem"... I feel like you're asking me to force you to sign some type of Magna Carta or something.... Really the only thing I would ask that you and all others adhere too is that one's territory (including their protectorates) cannot exceed their IG stats. That, and I think there would need to be a map reset. CNRP2 is great and everything but there are primarily two reasons why people are so active in it:
1) People are freely RPing and - for the most part - no one large power is forcing/threatening them to do anything or stay within their lands. I could elaborate on this topic all day really, but no one is being shamed or excluded for the IC-internal policies of their nation for the exception of Tywin who seems to be a Polynesian-Supremacist/troll. It is so refreshing to be able to RP a nation and not have to ask for permission or worry about someone forcing me to make my government a certain way, or worry about someone invading me because my nation doesn't support abortion or because my nation is more conservative or is more liberal etc. It's just very nice not being rolled just because someone knows they can and want to show off how big their &$#@ is to their buddies (not saying you exclusively did that but mostly every bigger power in CNRP has done it at some point). That being said, those actions may eventually start to take place in CNRP2 but I think it would be extremely difficult because even a massive IG nation like Lynneth still does not have superior forces to a nation like the (IC) United States because two players control it. The fact that no one is really dominant - or the fact that no one can be dominant - makes me personally feel at ease.
2) The map was reset. I don't mean to blow my own horn but I recommended this several times in CNRP and it went nowhere - but hey no hard feelings. I want you to take note of all the people that have poured into Europe. There are more people on the continent of Europe in our game than there are in CNRP1. Why? Because people want to RP their own nations in Europe and RP places that they find romanticized like Paris or Rome or Vatican City or London or Dublin or Berlin. And on top of that, they want to RP there and be respected as a sovereign nation. They do Not just want to RP there because a massive power is just allowing them to exist. I am not criticizing Cent, but that is how it is in CNRP1 in regards to Europe. It is not his fault but that is simply how it is - a big guy allowing a few people to exist in Europe but only because he lets them. If people cannot RP in the places they want, then they either wont RP, they'll RP in a place temporarily while they wait for the other place to open up, or they'll slugishly RP somewhere they don't want to be just because they are addicted to RPing nations on these forums.
And sure there is plenty of white space, but at least for me it is not space where I want to RP. I mean look at where almost all of the nations are in CNRP2; Europe and North America. That is where A LOT of people want to RP. That is where I want to RP for sure. I may say something stupid or ignorant every now and again, but I'm not racist. I do not care what your color is or what your religion is along as you don't care what color I am or what religion I am - but if you do care then you can burn in hell and I don't care what anyone calls me for disliking you for it. THAT BEING SAID, I do not want to RP in Africa or South America or Asia (Sarah has drilled me for this before but really I do not want to. I have no interest). I know nothing about Africans, South Americans, or Asians and I do not know anything about their cultures. Some people might say "Well then this is a great learning experience." What do I say to that? "No screw you, this is a game and I don't want to learn I just want to have fun." Really, I just want to RP a people/culture I know or make up my own that is totally unique. But the problem is that if I do that, I might be called a racist or committing genocide for just inventing a new people... I think that's idiotic but that's just me.
In Conclusion: As a player in CNRP2, the only thing that could make me go back to CNRP1 is if there were a map reset, nations can only maintain/own/administer/claim/control as much land as their IG stats would allow, and there were some type of limits to prevent these massive soldier/aircraft/naval disparities you have in CNRP1. I like the system we have in CNRP2, but yeah.
I hope this helped. This is just my opinion, so I don't care what anyone else has to say about it and you are an idiot if you are about to critique what I just said because again - it is my opinion :v. I hope that helped Triyun, I didn't mean to "ignore" you before I just didn't see your post.
EDIT: After saying all of that I want to add one more thing. If you want to try to bring CNRP1 back, don't do it by just trying to poach players from CNRP2. The only way to make this work is to bring both RPs together because otherwise there is going to be a lot of resentment.
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What for? I made an effort to join you once, but people were clearly willing to shut me out. I'm not desperate to RP with you and I at least tried to join. That's more than a good few can say about CNRP, which you all are so quick to denounce. At least there, people don't insult me constantly, just to tell me then that I'm the one who's toxic for the community.
I apologize on behalf of any idiot that used the word "Toxic". You are a good RPer, that is without doubt.
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Eva has expressed she doesn't even want back. Horo isn't gonna RP without Eva.
Imo, this topic is redundant.
I wish they would come back :/
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From what I understand, Eva and Horo are technically free to come back since 50k+ nations do not have to be approved. However, a nation that was voted out for a reason other than be 50k+ would still be out.
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After close consideration, the Senators originally in favor of the Embargo Hungary Act of 2014 would vote against the bill because current events changed. It would be the first proposed piece of legislation to fail in the Congress.
However, House Bill 2 would easily become law.
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I propose effective immediately anyone who posts logs are to be removed from the game.
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Kingdom of Axum Announcement
Due to this belligerence against a friend of the Kingdom, all Hungarian ships passing through the Red Sea will be stopped and seized. The funds raised from the sale of the ships and cargo will be handed over to Tikal to assist with their ongoing expenses in the matter of the rapture.
Given the rapture event, the possibility exists that terror organizations are spreading whatever it is that caused this dreadful event. Tikal's efforts to uncover these events are not to be trifled with and the further sanction of allowing letters of marque to be issued on Hungarian ships found in the Indian Ocean is being instituted.
A bill would quickly be pushed through Congress to place an embargo on the nation of Hungary for putting aggressive "trade bans" on the Federation's closest ally, the Principality of Tikal. The votes in both chambers of congress would be taken shortly, and would only require a signature of the President to make it law.
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Calendar No. 1
1st CONGRESS
1st Session
S.7
To embargo the Nation of Hungary.
IN THE SENATE OF THE PLAINS FEDERATION.Senator Morgan would rush the bill into the foreign relations committee in order to get it in for a vote.
A BILL
To embargo the Nation of Hungry who imposed an aggressive "trade ban" on the Principality of Tikal.
SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.
This Resolution may be sighted as "Embargo Hungry Act of 2014". [OOC: or the "Make Hungary Hungry Act of 2014"]
SECTION 2 DEFINITIONS.
A. All civilian and government trade and transactions with the nation of Hungary are to end immediately.B. It is unlawful to import goods produced in Hungary.
C. It is unlawful to export goods to Hungary.
D. All Hungarian ships found in the Gulf of Mexico will be commandeered and sold; the funds shall go to Tikal to replenish the Hawaiian islands.
E. Hungarian citizens shall no longer be permitted to enter the Plains Federation, and Federation citizens may no longer travel to or visit Hungary.
F. This bill will take effect immediately upon a signature from the President.
Senators Morgan, Sherman, and Stirling would vote yes.
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It was not the will of the community if the votes were fraudulently counted. TBM knew I would challenge any sloppiness so this is a case of his own negligence in not being thorough, taking a screenshot and listing a count of votes. His lack of effort to demonstrate his "count" beyond a reasonable doubt is what makes his vote count either negligent or fraudulent.
While the first was legitimate, I would be perfectly fine with having the vote again. But I do not think you would like what the outcome is now that there aren't 5 people who wish to roll you.
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My obsession is based on the fact that people try to use every dirty trick possible to "force people from the game." At that point it is no longer a collaborative roleplay and concrete rules need to be defined.
I searched "force people from the game" on the forums and you seem to be the only one that is saying it. I don't want to tell you what to do, but quoting yourself does not add legitimacy.
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"We come in peace and these are not your waters. Please stand away from our ship."
The crisis began to encourage heavy news coverage of events in The Ukraine with citizens keeping posted 24/7 on the French Aggression.
OOC: Heavy news coverage after 45 seconds of conversation?
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Calendar No. 1
1st CONGRESS
1st Session
H.2
To end the State of War between The Plains Federation and Hawaii.
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES OF THE PLAINS FEDERATION.
Representative Coin would propose the declaration of peace which the Speaker would send to the committees for Military Action and Foreign Relations.
DECLARATION OF PEACE
To declare a State of Peace between The Plains Federation and Hawaii.
SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.
This Resolution may be sighted as "Declaration of Peace with Hawaii Act".
SECTION 2 DEFINITIONS.
A. This Declaration of Peace is activating PART E of SECTION 2 of the "Declaration of War on Hawaii Act".
B. Of the remaining 10,000 soldiers, airmen, and seamen in the Hawaiian islands, 8,000 will return to the Plains Federation while 2,000 will remain deployed to man a new military facility on Ni'lhau island.
C. Part B shall take place following the completion of the military facility on Ni'lhau or earlier at the discretion of Admiral Edward Teach.
D. The Army Corps of Engineers will travel to Ni'lhau and continue construction on Ni'lhau to build naval, air force, and ground force facilities including defenses for the base itself.
E. Any foreign military attempting to invade, molest, or antagonize Tikal's holdings in the Hawaiian islands will be taken as an attempt to invade, molest, or antagonize the Plains Federation.
29 of the 36 Texas Representatives would vote in favor of the bill. Six would the remaining seven would abstain, and one would vote no.
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Confidential
The Army Corps of Engineers division of the Texas National Guard would travel to Ni'lhau to construct a military facility that would accommodate all air force, army and maritime needs. Some of the defensive weapons put up on the other islands would either be brought back to the Plains Federation or set up at the base in Ni'lhau. The remainder of the humanitarian aid would be distributed to civilians in Honolulu before a majority of the National Guardsmen would go to Ni'lhau to assist in building the new military facility.
Also, Tikal's military would be made aware that the Guardsmen still in the Hawaiian islands still stood at a total of four regiments, or 20,000 armed sailors and soldiers. Admiral Edward Teach would personally ask Tikal's head of military command in Hawaii if he or she believed it was safe to lower the number of troops. If so, the Admiral would order the first and second infantry regiments home which would leave the total number of Federation troops in Hawaii at 10,000. The number would be maintained until the military facility on Ni'lhau would be finished and it would then be brought down to approximately 2,000 soldiers/sailors/airmen.
In the meantime, aircraft and jets would be shipped to Ni'lhau and would hopefully never have to be used.
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I mean, when you accused Rudy of being power hungry that was the last straw for him. But whatever you say.
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That's not a GM issue, thats a forum rules issue, report it through the proper process rather than using it as an excuse to eliminate IC threats.
I know as a troll you would like to not be kicked out but... Yeah.
Cold War Compromise
in Open National RP
Posted
This really could have been handled in a PM between the parties.