feardaram

this really is pretty cool to see. best of luck guys.

looking forward to 21 more days of fun. go mk go.

[quote name='Lusitan' timestamp='1303422639' post='2695874'] Are you stupid? I ignored it because the person I was arguing with before you entered dumbass mode was not considering it to start with and there was really no need to bring it up to expose how retarded his logic was. And it should be the same for you, but you're more persistent and need people to bash in your face how much you fail at arguing. [/quote] HoT is just mad his former alliance has been annexed by the mighty Mushqaeda. We can't expect him to think clearly with all this stress (or ever).

[quote name='The Crimson King' timestamp='1303417130' post='2695785'] Well technically speaking given that HoT has been stripped and banished from his own alliance the responsibility now falls on Tamerlane to deliver the 20k tech from 64D to MK. [/quote] Excellent observation. You are correct, that is my mistake.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303414278' post='2695747'] Every individual is allotted One (1) "mindless hail" post per thread. You used yours on the previous page. Please come back when you have something substantial to say. [/quote]As the former leader of 64digits it might be better to focus your efforts on how you're gonna accomplish those reparation payments instead of nitpicking how many times we hail Allarchon.

It's good to see 64digits with a competent leader. This replacement was long overdue.

Allarchonu Akbar! May 64digits see the light!

[quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1303152628' post='2692760'] You haven't seen the peace terms. Believe me, if you read them, you'd understand that TOP would be very likely in far more than 7 wars the day after they were made official. [/quote]i have some level of understanding regarding the terms. either way, what does that have to do with this? TOP's current DOW has resulted in a total of 7 wars. claiming this entirely changes the situation is overreacting.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303151624' post='2692746'] Oh yes, we are quite well aware. Some people looked to peace as a possibility, but this latest move just further empowers the argument as to why we shouldn't give you anything. Meanwhile, all the goon newbies cry about how they're getting their asses handed to them. They try to put on a public face, but it just doesn't work when their primary recruitment source threads are viewable by the public at large. Why do they even need "pubbie tears" when they have so many of their own with which to quench their thirst? [/quote] that's cool, we can just keep this going if you'd prefer. i'm fine with it. plenty of pubbie tears for everyone to drink.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303150919' post='2692732'] It's the gesture, not the material happenings. The gesture is one giant middle finger in the air at us, and it violates the implicit trust that was building, a trust which is necessary to the acceptance of terms. [/quote] newsflash, this entire war has been a giant middle finger at your side. it didn't just start now.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303150384' post='2692725'] Well, you see, this changes things. This move was done specifically and intentionally to prolong a war that was on the verge of coming to a close. It is a calculated move to destroy trust that was building in private, and we can't very well accept a slap in the face like this like nothing happened. Every action has consequences, even the actions of you and yours, which is something you seem to forget. If we had come to an agreement a week earlier, MK would have ordered TOP into the fray a week earlier. It's really as simple as that. [/quote] i'm completely missing your logic where an additional 7 wars have a significant impact on peace, but that's ok. i really wasn't trying to talk you in to peace.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303149426' post='2692718'] The key point is that terms [i]were[/i] settled on. TOP's declaration comes on the eve of an agreement. We have every right to react negatively to what was clearly meant as a move designed to further provoke and delay peace. [/quote] i won't pretend to know any intimate details, so i'll go with what you're saying. if that's the case, then make it official, get it all signed, and publish it for all to see. TOP's DOW has no impact on your ability to make these peace terms official. TOP is only currently in 7 wars. yes, 7. react negatively if you'd like, it's certainly your prerogative. however, reacting negatively hurts you the most, not us. believe me, i'm not trying to talk you in to peace. i'm having fun. just don't act like this 7 war DOW now completely prevents you from peacing out. i'll be doubly amused if you do let this delay peace, only to end up agreeing to the same terms later after getting knocked around more.

[quote name='Letum' timestamp='1303148815' post='2692711'] If MK shuts the &"($ up about pretending that "the losing side is deliberately prolonging the war because DH has offered such [i]reasonable[/i] terms, we'll stop complaining about the suspiciously brownish mush in this sandwich. Deal? [/quote] hold up, i'll give you guys some credit here. i don't think it's all your fault that peace terms haven't been reached. i understand that those things can take time, effort, discussion, and consideration. i understand that the terms offered, and probably the terms you end up settling on (if that happens), aren't going to make you smile. that's all logical stuff. i'm on the opposite side but i get that. my point was that people are now threatening that peace won't happen because of TOP switching focus. this DOW only has an effect on peace if the people involved get butt-hurt over it and overreact. plus, is the threat of no peace really intended to be a punishment for us? come on.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303147917' post='2692700'] And then, there is the taunting from the membership of MK. And you want us to believe you're not going to strike us again 3 months from when the terms are signed? [/quote] believe what you want. i make no claims as to what will happen in the future, not that i'm in a position to make meaningful predictions anyway. the point is that you are the one bawwwing about how we, because of TOP's DOW, won't get peace like we are the ones that are truly in need of it.you are cutting off your nose to spite your face. either way this goes down is entertaining.

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1303147115' post='2692694'] This is an outright lie. Not even a mere twist of the truth, just, a lie. There are so many factual errors I don't know where to begin. We had agreed on NPO's side, how much NS had to come out and for how long and from where, and we had settled on a number figure in monetary extortion. It was all done, just a few minor kinks to iron out. So yes, we were on the verge of peace. This slap in the face changes things. It proves that your coalition has no interest in peace and just wants to drag this war out forever. After shattering trust by declaring an unwarranted and unprovoked war of aggression, when people try to rebuild those bridges in the negotiation room, you just smash them again. At this point, I see no goddamn reason we should buy peace from you from such a steep price, when it's obvious you're just going to smack us again as soon as we finish paying. Rebuild on your own money, not ours. [/quote] cool. i really do enjoy smashing the occasional legionaire that ventures out of PM. either way it's win-win for me.

I really don't see the issue. No matter how close we really were/are to peace, the war is still going on. TOP's DOW just fills a few empty slots at lower levels and slightly eases the burden on lower level nations. Stop making this out to be some huge DOW that will instantly put Legion's already horrendous army in ruins. Although I see the benefit in us getting peace, I have to believe the other side wants/needs it more. If anything, this gives you all additional incentive to agree to terms, actually sign, and get this over with. The impact this DOW has is largely in Legion's hands.

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1300394373' post='2668100'] To be fair, I think both of you are assuming too much. Nowhere in the OP does it say X or "eternal war". Rather, the insinuation is that the least destructive, best method for NPO to obtain an end to this conflict is to exit peace mode, and an offer in accordance with that sentiment (which has no further conditions) has been made. [/quote] I suppose that is true. It was my interpretation that those were the 2 likely options/outcomes, but that could be very much incorrect. [quote name='Centurius' timestamp='1300394414' post='2668101'] Eh well from NPO's point of view, why trust DH? Would you trust the word of the bloc that attacked you without cause? [/quote] I can understand that. There is no absolute assurance that things would work out as stated. But is that worse than staying in PM literally forever (I'm using the an extreme example of course)?

[quote name='Centurius' timestamp='1300393956' post='2668093'] It worked for FAN. [/quote] did it really work? either way, that's a little bit different. assuming DH is being truthful, is 1 month of war a worse option than infinite/longterm peace mode? i'm honestly not advocating/pulling/calling out for either. i'm just putting myself in NPO's shoes.

[quote name='Hadrian' timestamp='1300393499' post='2668083'] Pathetic. Why you even offered such a thing, I don't know. Is it me, or do you actually think Pacifica is stupid? They aren't going to neglect peace mode just because you gave them an offer of war for a month and peace with no terms (C'mon, who are you [i]really[/i] trying to fool with this lie?). I don't know buddy, it seems to be saving them quite well at the moment. [/quote] is staying in PM forever, assuming DH can keep up their end to make that happen, a truly better longterm option?

[quote name='Chief Savage Man' timestamp='1300391602' post='2668042'] [img]http://i.imgur.com/UEiEz.png[/img] The Saint Patrick's Day Massacre (of rhetoric) [/quote] You are like McDonalds, because I'm lovin it.

[quote name='Hyperion321' timestamp='1300389527' post='2667995'] That's quite counter productive is it not? [/quote] That would depend on your goal I guess. If your goal is to maintain the strength you have, then it's not. If your goal is to rebuild, continue to grow, and continue to be relevant, then yes, the PM strategy is counter productive. If you have strength but can't use it, do you really have strength?

[quote name='Hyperion321' timestamp='1300388840' post='2667983'] So...what happens if they don't come out? [/quote]Then they've decided they no longer want to play.

[quote name='simon2269' timestamp='1300375179' post='2667734'] The problem with this logic is that the only thing you are satisfied with is the destruction or complete removal of NPO (see your earlier post). So let us assume you achieve your aim and get your month of war, what stops this happening again and again every time NPO dares to start to rebuild. Your only aim is to perma war NPO, the only slight difference in your version of PW is you pretend that peace is achieved then just up and declare again when ever you fancy for no reason. I see absolutely no reason why anyone should begin to believe you or anybody else in your alliance when you have continually stated your aim of destroying the NPO. Come out for a month and then you can peace out, honest its the truth. You will of course reserve the right to change your mind at a minutes notice either once PM has been exited or a nano second after the month has ended. [/quote] Fine (and I can see your point), then those nations can stay in PM forever and stop playing. It doesn't much matter to me. Neither option is supposed to be truly appetizing, but more the lesser of two evils.

[quote name='Doitzel' timestamp='1300373947' post='2667715'] From what I'm piecing together... They're probably talking about the bit where 'eternal wars are bad!' [/quote] It's not eternal if we could just get it over with.

Direct battle with top tier NPO nations would be more fun, direct, and a little less frustrating, but it doesn't really matter. Doomhouse has already won no matter how this plays out. Keeping those top NPO nations in PM indefinitely hinders their ability to grow and severely limits the options for nations of that size to contribute through their nation. Using PM as a long-term strategy isn't "winning," it basically ends the game for them. The top tier of Doomhouse will always be here waiting for the PM exit, and waiting for any low tier NPO nation to grow into the top tier. The two possible outcomes are to get destroyed or stop playing. Whatever floats your boat.