Yerushalayim

o/ OcUK. Mr. White, you're a !@#$@#$ !@#$. But the best !@#$ I've seen in this game.

Yup does not answer a question of "how?"

Nukes still have nothing to do with the CB. TPF set in motion an op that pretty much all of us can agree is unacceptable. They targeted an alliance they were not in open hostilities with. And they didn't think it would be a good idea to, y'know, inform Athens "Hey, so, we set this thing up, and it's done now, but you might want to watch those new friends of yours"? By the way, why Athens? Why not an alliance TPF was actually at war with? I ask out of curiosity.

Because nukes aren't a covert, deceitful, and underhanded attempt to infiltrate and destroy a community from within? And NPO didn't conveniently forget to mention that it used nukes?

It's Doitzel. He writes these things. They're amusing.

Good !@#$@#$ job. o/

This !@#$ is not amusing. I want my !@#$@#$ wars.

It shouldn't have even been started, and Athens is within their rights to smack TPF around for it. War is a fairly blood thirsty way to smack 'em down, but it's still a valid method.

I'm not overly worried about Athens being bloodthirsty. If they've got a decent CB (and in my opinion, it does seem that they do), they're free to be as bloodthirsty as they want.

So, I've been lurking and reading the threads about this war since it began, and I'm not sure if I have a grasp on the situation. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, as I certainly haven't read all of the infodumps and logs that were posted. The situation, as I understand it, is this: During the Karma war, TPF's leader discussed the possibility for a black op involving infiltrating and doing damage to Athens and/or RoK. The op itself was never carried out, but got far enough that the group intended to infiltrate Athens was, indeed, formed. The op ended sometime before the end of the Karma war, and wasn't mentioned again until ZH decided to inform Athens of it now. Athens, having not considered itself in a formal state of hostility with TPF, is understandably angry that this op was even started, regardless of its discontinuation. A war was launched to keep TPF from going into hippy, and diplomacy was abandoned in favour of this more militant approach. Athenian allies have jumped in, and TPF is now being smacked around. That the gist of what's happened? And the argument, as I understand it, is whether or not TPF's planned (and started) op constitutes an act of war, or if it was a valid wartime act during the Karma War. On the one hand (from TPF's side), I can see why it might be viewed as just another part of the Karma War. On the other hand (Athens' side), Athens wasn't formally at war with TPF, and this is a fairly underhanded tactic. Also, why would TPF choose Athens instead of another alliance they were directly fighting? Why wasn't Karma (or Athens in particular) notified that their new "friend" in ZH had originated as an attempt to do them harm?

I believe it's been made fairly clear that, no, this is not normal. Alyster pulled a big enough !@#$% move to warrant getting smacked around a bit. Spartans decided to give him what he deserved. We didn't ZI him, or stagger 'im, or keep the war going. We let him get out of it pretty fast. Moral of the story? Be a !@#$%, deal with the consequences.