[We have a 2319]

Two of our members attacked SWF on 4/11 . Now our charter says "if a raid goes bad you forfeit your right to be defended, or you must deal with the consequences."

If SWF had come to us, sent a PM, or anything we'd have said alright there yours have at it. Or had some other talk about restitution. That was not that case. I went to be proactive, and mentioned to him about our attacks, with theirs in kind, and what we could do to stop it.

He responded with well stop this with reps for your initial attacks. That I shouldn't be surprised they attacked in return. I told him if he came to us before attacking our other members that could have been a viable option. Then I said we can have peace for all nations involved with reps to the two nations attacked, and our nations that were attacked, then we can have peace. That offer was thrown back at me without any new offer.

Though we understand that every AA has the right to defend their members from a raid as they see fit, we have no qualms with that. So SWF should have no qualms with or decision to attack them as an alliance on the while, just as they attacked our members in return.

We here by declare war on SWF

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/We_f822d2_366710.jpg

[Breaking the Top 100]

I mean, I guess this is an accomplishment. 

[Another Kaskus Annoucement]

Doesn't any alliance, by default, have this document?

[Sanctions!]

Mogar started this, Cuba put him in check, Mogar whined and tried to claim he unjustly suffered agression from Cuba and tried to play a wordgame to paint DBDC as hypocrits, but that failed and I think most people can see through those attempts.

 

 

 

Depends on if you play this game IC, or OOC.

 

IC he was well within his rights to protect his money he was sending as an investment to another nation, and an NAP should not be considered violated.

 

OCC, of course this looks like he tried to intentionally mess with DBDC, and try to use the sanctions to his advantage; the NAP can be considered violated.

[Sanctions!]

This is a perfect example of the IC/OCC divide we have created for ourselves. 

[Society Tech Sellers]

We have nations that have been with us, and completed inside deals before we wanted them to complete outside deals, and they've done that with aplomb. 

 

 

These nations have open slots for 6/100 deals

 

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=563148 - 4

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=568201 - 1

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=569606 - 4

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=554028 - 4

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=572103 - 5

 

 

All deals are done with said nation, and not via the Society. We're just giving you information of open slots. 

 

[RIP WAG]

Your heart will go on. 

[Flying Sabres: Where Ferrets are Golden]

You all should just join an alliance, and learn the game. Your total NS is less then 3k ns. LOL

 

This is funny come from you, and your alliance. Especially when you asked me, and my alliance to merge into you, when you had 10 nations that didn't even equal to 30k. Remember where you came from, and don't be rude to the same type of alliance size from where you started from. 

[We are Here to Build Our World]

I'm curious about your attacked by a singular aggressor policy, and how well it will work out for you guys attacking that aggressor on an AA. Though good luck, hopefully this time works out for you. 

[Spartan Treaty Announcements]

I knew I could have liked you guys more. 

[Dear whoever created my wiki page]

The little wiki edit actually got the exact desired response. When someone takes to wiki vandalism, the fact that it's even noticed is probably enough.

 

 

Unless you were the vandal, you have no idea what the desired response was. 

[Dear whoever created my wiki page]

 
He's pretty worked up to try and bring in the "you need to get a life" !@#$. Granted, I haven't looked at what was on the wiki, but unless it was a few pages long there's no real time taken to make/edit a wiki page; Saying that as someone who doesn't even do wiki !@#$.
 

 

I would have done the same exact thing in his place, egging the person on more. I have no idea how you can see this as pretty worked up. 

 

Yeah, I'm the one who responded to getting a wiki page made by coming onto the OWF frothing at the mouth. My point, by the way, was that this thread isn't gonna stop the kid from getting the !@#$ trolled out of him if that's how he responds to it.

 

 

It was never meant to stop the kid...you missed the point of this thread entirely. He didn't know who did it, so by happens stance if the person actually comes to the OWF, they'll see that their little wiki edit didn't get the desired effect. He even mocks the kids for making a full grammatical sentence... you're the only person who doesn't see the irony, vituperous way he mocked the kid. There was no frothing, no anything but subtle jabs.

[Dear whoever created my wiki page]

Good questions, all around! Gold star!

So, Margrave, do you think user Blade 619 getting so worked up that he comes onto the OWF to divulge that, oh my, he ~has a girlfriend~ will work in protecting him from such acts in the future?

 

Worked up? Not at all. Mocking the person who did it? Yes. 

[The Entente DoE and Protectorate Announcement]

Since when has treating brand new alliance leaders, and alliances like they're 4k days old nations that have been alliance leaders for years been the norm? 

 

We should foster new AAs that bring activity to our community as TheBoss has done. I for one welcome you, despite DS, and Riot's differences, I wish you the best of luck with your new AA. Hopefully being allied to DS works out for you in your best interest. Though. As other's have pointed out, DS may not be the best fit for you just by reading your charter, then again that may just be how I see it, and not yourself. 

 

 

Good luck, the Entente. 

[Riot Society]

Still looking?

[The FARKLAND war]

I honestly don't even know why any of you are arguing this. What a stupid point to nitpick and defend.

 

I guess anyone will post insane arguments to blindly support their side or allies.

 

As hunter said, which point are you talking about? Because if me pointing out Fark lied, and is continuing to lie about going to every alliance (when we had the same amount of deals that WFF did, yet never came to us) tech dealing with DT, and only attacking the one alliance who stopped (which is false as well); then yes, I like to nitpick. 

[The FARKLAND war]

Also, yea. I made an argument like 10 pages back that if the tech is going to people out of range of FARK then they don't a pot to piss about those deals. I mean, !@#$, sooner or later fark is gonna be so low that they'll have to fight just our sellers so tech would become irrelevant at that point. They'll have to complain about our God tier reigning down aid which they couldn't do !@#$ about.

 

At least fighting all your sellers, or talking to all your sellers would mean they can objectively say they didn't attack one of them for being the weakest, and only ones to stop dealing with DT.

[why isnt 9mil/100 tech deal the standard]

 

actually all my war wonders where bought while i was at war, I've spend 175 million while at war getting on the SDI and MHP and still have plenty to keep fighting and rebuild on my own after the war.

 

alliances need to do 9/100 to make their small nations self sufficient so they can rebuild on their own don't have to rely on rebuilding aid and can get right back to selling tech after the war is over

 

 

You're missing my point where I said you weren't attacked earlier. Though you can keep intentionally missing all my other points I brought up, as a singular nation only conforming to you, especially when your topic was brought up for all tech sellers. Not just you. 

 

This isn't about you, but all tech sellers. So do you believe that all tech sellers, and new nations will be able to do what you did? If so when all tech sellers reach a sufficient level to maintain their own income, where/when do you buy tech? Because if all sellers are doing this at 9/100 they will all get to a level of where selling tech doesn't make sense to them anymore, and they'll look to buy. Thus leaving only maybe 10-20 new nations a day, 5-8 that actually stick around, and sell tech. It's all about making the game self-sustaining, not just one portion of the game. 

 

Or you can address the numbers that caustic brought up. 

[why isnt 9mil/100 tech deal the standard]

 

that's not true, i started tech dealing as soon as started, the faster a nation can get to 4999 (the gravy train infa lvl) the faster it can become self sufficient, i manged to get a huge warchest at that size, and since money wont be a problem that nation can concentrate on war wonders instead of eco ones, this will allow an alliance to quickly make a solid mid tier fighting nation with a good set of military wonders and a decent warchest. 

 

look at my nation for example this is my first war, wouldn't you rather have a ton of nations like me fighting for you then a couple of bloated whales sitting on a 20 billion warchest that they never use because they run into peace mode when war starts?

 

 

One nation does not make a trend. Just because it's not true for you doesn't make what I said untrue. You're also a year old, and had time to collect those wonders before being attack, though good for you for not being attacked sooner. Some nations, newer nations, aren't that lucky. Why do you think raiding is so popular on new nations, and nations on the low end NS spectrum? When I first started my nation again, I would raid small end nations all the time that received tech deals. Mostly because they didn't know how to fight, and would spend their money on land, and tech. Which makes a great raid for me. So yes, nations with higher return of money on tech deals does not really help the alliance, it helps that nation if not attacked. 

 

I'd rather have nations at the higher NS level fighting than yours. Because the amount of damage done to high end, the medium end nations out does your medium to low end production in a war. War is about destruction lost, and nations lost that are able to help regrow, or send out aid during the conflict. If we can get a 60k nation to surrender, instead of a 6k nation to surrender, i'd rather have that. I'd actually like to have your type of nations on the opposite side. Nations your size, even with wonders, who grew too fast usually don't have a lot of money, and need to be brought up out of bill lock, or able to keep attacking. So i'd rather the side you were on pump money into you to do little damage. 

[The FARKLAND war]

MadMax of CoIS was talked to about their tech deals with DT and stated he would put up notice that all deals with DT were to be suspended until peace was reached. Later MadMax stated that the person continuing to send aid packages to DT faced possible expulsion over his actions in "line with our Disciplinary Action Rule of 'Three Days Notice'."
You know, like Fark attempted diplomacy first (as they did with WFF) and spoke a reasonable leader.

As for Riot Society, I don't see any aid going from them to DT. So I'm not sure how 0 is more than 0?

 

 

One incoming, so expect tech being sent to that DT nation, but did you know aid could be deleted, that doesn't show up anymore? Le gasp. There were four/five deals going on when you declared war. 

 

 

Also, CoIS person was never kicked out, and continued to do the tech deals. Though he did leave two days ago to join Riot Society, so there are more tech deals going on between that will show up on our aid screen. 

 

 

So in at most ten days, we'll have 300 tech going to DT, that's if the other DT nation doesn't send the aid to one of my nations to re-up their tech deal. So that's 400 tech, just as much as WFF had going on before they were attacked. I welcome your diplomates on my forums in up to ten days. 

 

 

 

https://cybernations.lyricalz.com/aid?nation1=568092&nation2=

 

Alone that nation has at least sent three rounds of tech to DT, and has a new one that just started. I don't feel like looking for any other nations who sent aid to DT as in tech deals. Because the first nation I found proved him wrong. We have a new nation that has two DT deals going on, so in ten days it'll be three or four deals going on with DT, just as many as you attack WFF for. You can continue to lie, or own up to not knowing, and being completely silly. 

 

Again, you can always send diplomates to us now, so you don't quote look as foolish as you are acting. 

 

 

Before you say, AuiNur of Auinarian, wasn't on DT went it was sent to him from our AA, he's a DT nation. 

[why isnt 9mil/100 tech deal the standard]

Sheesh, when I started I did 3/150 deals. 

 

I think of it this way, and try to explain it to people who only offer 6/100 deals for their AA when I come asking. Of course I make enough money for 6/100 9/200 9/100, though does it benefit the new player at all to grow so fast? Not really. From my point of view, working with new nations for quite a bit, it's hard to tell them not to spend all their money on tech, or growing right away. They want to grow, it's how they keep interested in the game. Though what happens if you grow, spend all that money, then get attacked. Have no money to defend yourself, and are at a higher NS where people might have wonders, and you only have an FAC, and DRA. After four months of playing. You get dropped down to where you were at a month ago, or two months ago (depending on which type of nation attacked you). Since you had no money, your AA had to dump more money into your nation to help you survive the attack, thus disrupting more tech deals (damaging your own AA's ability to fight). Then they have to start all over with those tech deals, which were disrupted for about a month to keep you on track growing. 

 

Most brand new nations don't know the ability of a war chest, or want to save their money. Very few i've come across actually do this. It's actually in their best interest in the game to do tech deals at the 6/200 rate. It allows them to have a schedule to come back to keep them in the game (because it's a months worth of work instead of 20 days). It helps teach them the game more, allows them to be relatively in the best NS range when people attack, or there is a war. It helps teach them about back collects, as well as improvement swapping. 

 

You can explain everything to a new nation, first this, then that. Though do they always listen, because they've never had to deal with a rogue attack or an alliance war? No. It's simpler, and better for them to grow small instead of fast. and better for the alliance.

 

 

Also, more practical reason why that shouldn't happen. If every tech sellers does 9/100 and grows to 3,999/4,999 infra really fast, and we have nations trickling into the game everyday. Do they magically start becoming buyers, or do they stay sellers. All that will happen with higher return for tech sellers is that the line you need to get to, to buy just gets higher, and higher. Again, once you get high enough, and war comes around you could be at 5k infra in like 6 months, with no tech. Then you get attacked by someone with 1k tech, 2k tech, 3k tech etcetc you'll get obliterated. It's all about keeping the nation safe, and able to defend itself, and having higher returns for tech sellers just hurts them. Especially if the standard was 9/100 even 6/100. 

[The FARKLAND war]

So someone in this thread says they know a guy who said some things and that's your proof? You notice the post you quoted intentially excluded any specifics, right? Wonder why that was.
Even if specifics were available, the fact that his post also stats that we sent diplomats to discuss the matter with his secret alliance indicates that we did do something about the aid.
 
 

 

 

Hi, Evilone. My name is BringMeTheHorizon, and riot Society, which I lead, had the same amount of tech deals as WFF going on when you attacked them. You, nor anyone in Fark has come to me asking Riot Society to stop sending aid, or doing tech deals to DT. We currently have more tech deals going on with DT, have not stopped, because no one has come to ask us to stop. I await your response so I know that I am not imaginary, Would make me feel better about myself knowing i'm not invisible nor are my posts calling you out as a liar. 

 

A member of the Confederation of International States was doing four tech deals himself when you declared war on WFF, and you did go to them, and I can get the logs if you'd wish, where he said he was going to keep tech dealing with DT because they were his deals to finish, and that there was no reason for him to stop; or something around those lines (i mean it was three weeks ago).

 

 

So I hope this clears up any confusion on your part to why Fark has been lying since page one. 

[8 br aqua needs one]

Messaged 

[Top Five Worst Alliances of All Time]

I think, again, you're taking me/this way to serious. I'm not even trying to debate you, on anything. You can try to "stoop down" to my level, or what have you, especially when I just came here to say that it seems you're taking this way to seriously, more so than the other three you are currently "debating". 

 

The best/worst threads will always be subjective, even at it's heart in a rational debate. Once it delved into something not a serious "debate" on both sides, you continued to try to prove your point why \m/ was a horrible alliance, the others stopped trying to prove that it wasn't. That's when it became about you being too serious, and being upset et al. It just comes off that way when you continue to take something serious, and they stopped.

 

 

It's like what I do to my gun totting red neck friends about gay loving liberals trying to take their guns. If I start having a decent debate on gun control, then once it becomes futile, I just say things to keep them going. This is what I see happening here. You can keep saying or nah, bro, it's cool i'm just joking I ain't mad, nope. Doesn't make it any less, to me at least, that you were trying to hard, and they were just posting to keep you going. But I digress, I doubt you'll get it. 

[Top Five Worst Alliances of All Time]

 

heh. I love when people start using this. I guess it is similar to Hoo's argument against "bored and annoyed" style posts. It is what people want others to think when they fail miserably in the debate. "Oh I was just playing with him so the debate doesn't matter". It is pretty funny that after the serious tones that hakai, sqrt, and hoo all posted in, that all of a sudden, I am being "played with"... 

 

So no, i don't think any of the three individuals I was debating with were playing around in the slightest and the only one who I see even attempting to use that excuse is hakai and i still don't believe he was "playing". if he was, then he seriously sucks at it and should find a new hobby. 

 

 

 

I only find it funny because you're still taking this as a serious debate, I don't think you're bored or annoyed. It's obvious that maybe they once took it serious but that stopped some time ago, which they moved on to just messing with you to keep you posting.