JimKongIl's Blog

Would you mind taking a brief moment to outline the crimes as Gramlins see it against IRON?

Their complete, 100% unwarranted attack on our friends. Their complete, 100% lack of remorse for doing so.They're only sorry they lost.

If you hold that standard do you not see guilty alliances everywhere?

A] not everyone attacks our friends.B] not everyone who attacks our friends gets declared on, unfortunately. TOP and the others will eventually fall to their own karma, I believe.

Personally, I am wearing the IRON AA solely for the reason of helping IRON/DAWN get peace. I saw two alliances that desired peace but they were being denied until they agreed to surrender unconditionally.

You can't be talking about IRON. They certainly don't desire peace or they wouldn't have declared an unprovoked, unwarranted, completely aggressive war without any remorse whatsoever. You can't punch someone in the face and then declare yourself a pacifist who hates violence only after you start getting your $@! kicked.

I would never surrender unconditionally and I don't think anyone should be required to do so as a prerequisite to peace.

If we were the aggressors and IRON the defenders, I'd probably agree with you. But since IRON was the one who violently initiated this war, and has absolutely no remorse from having done so (other than regret that they lost), they cannot now turn around and claim to be some peace-loving alliance who needs you to make sure they get that peace. It is the height of arrogance, and completely disingenuous.

The moment that the war dynamic changes so that IRON/DAWN takes white peace off the table or no longer desires peace from Gramlins

Again, you can't just stab a dude in the face and then claim to be against violence. If you really believe that IRON wants peace, why don't you ask them? Ask them: "If you guys want peace so badly, why'd you attack the Grämlins' friends for NO !@#$@#$ REASON?" Go ahead, see what lies they come up with for you.

Personally, I am wearing the IRON AA solely for the reason of helping IRON/DAWN get peace. I saw two alliances that desired peace but they were being denied until they agreed to surrender unconditionally.

You can't be talking about IRON. They certainly don't desire peace or they wouldn't have declared an unprovoked, unwarranted, completely aggressive war without any remorse whatsoever. You can't punch someone in the face and then declare yourself a pacifist who hates violence only after you start getting your $@! kicked.

I would never surrender unconditionally and I don't think anyone should be required to do so as a prerequisite to peace.

If we were the aggressors and IRON the defenders, I'd probably agree with you. But since IRON was the one who violently initiated this war, and has absolutely no remorse from having done so (other than regret that they lost), they cannot now turn around and claim to be some peace-loving alliance who needs you to make sure they get that peace. It is the height of arrogance, and completely disingenuous.

The moment that the war dynamic changes so that IRON/DAWN takes white peace off the table or no longer desires peace from Gramlins

Again, you can't just stab a dude in the face and then claim to be against violence. If you really believe that IRON wants peace, why don't you ask them? Ask them: "If you guys want peace so badly, why'd you attack the Grämlins' friends for NO !@#$@#$ REASON?" Go ahead, see what lies they come up with for you.

I think I have made it clear that my desire is to help them achieve peace and it is not to "take out Gramlins firepower" as DAWN stated. I understand your points but even MK wants the war to be over. I don't see why you don't just give them the reps demand and be done with it.

I think I have made it clear that my desire is to help them achieve peace

I don't care about what DAWN blithers on about. I'm talking about what YOU said. If they really wanted peace, they wouldn't have violently struck our friends. Have you asked them why they attacked our friends? You won't get an answer, because there was NO reason. There is no "why" because it was a completely unwarranted attack.And yet, they now claim to want peace? Come on man, surely you don't believe that !@#$%^&*.If your desire is truly to help them achieve peace, then you'd be ghosting the Grämlins, not IRON.

I think I have made it clear that my desire is to help them achieve peace

I don't care about what DAWN blithers on about. I'm talking about what YOU said. If they really wanted peace, they wouldn't have violently struck our friends. Have you asked them why they attacked our friends? You won't get an answer, because there was NO reason. There is no "why" because it was a completely unwarranted attack.And yet, they now claim to want peace? Come on man, surely you don't believe that !@#$%^&*.If your desire is truly to help them achieve peace, then you'd be ghosting the Grämlins, not IRON.

Agree to a temporary ceasefire... not white peace, and I will voluntarily leave the IRON AA.

Agree to a temporary ceasefire... not white peace, and I will voluntarily leave the IRON AA.

Otherwise you'll continue to support the people who didn't want peace, and so they decided to start a war.For no reason.Yeah, smooth move there dude.

Soo..tl;dr Ram is !@#$% crazy?

Agree to a temporary ceasefire... not white peace, and I will voluntarily leave the IRON AA.

Otherwise you'll continue to support the people who didn't want peace, and so they decided to start a war.For no reason.Yeah, smooth move there dude.

I'm not supporting them I am working for peace there is a difference. Did I help them attack MK? no Did I voluntarily leave TOP before the war because I disagreed with the direction they were headed? yesSo peace is good enough for MK who was the one attacked but not for Gramlins?I do not believe that IRON had justification to attack MK but I believe that is atoned by defeat in battle and reps. That does not give you the right to fight them indefinitely. This view is shared by virtually ever citizen of Bob except the remaining Gramlins.If you have no desire to negotiate then discussion is pointless. We can all just go back to the battlefield and die to satisfy your sense of moral justification. I am ready willing and able. You obviously have no desire to compromise so we really have nothing to discuss. I am tired of countering insults with civility. If Gramlins wants to take me down for standing with IRON you know where to find me.

I'm not supporting them I am working for peace there is a difference.

Yes, and the difference would be if you were not on their AA. As long as you are on their AA, you are supporting them, period.

Did I voluntarily leave TOP before the war because I disagreed with the direction they were headed?

There's a few words for that. Traitor, !@#$%, infra-hugger....Leaving your alliance because you disagree with the direction they're heading, instead of trying to do something about it...yeah, that's just about as pathetic as it gets in a game.

So peace is good enough for MK who was the one attacked but not for Gramlins?

MK doesn't give a crap about anything, so yeah...a tech bribe is fine for them. Remember that IRON was kicking their $@! so Easter didn't come fast enough for them.

I do not believe that IRON had justification to attack MK but I believe that is atoned by defeat in battle and reps.

Even though there's nothing in the ESA that even MENTIONS the history, cause or blame for the war? IRON gets off completely scot-free; all they have to do is unload some tech. Big !@#$@#$ deal.

That does not give you the right to fight them indefinitely.

We don't want to fight them indefinitely. We would've been much happier if they had surrendered on April 4th. Too bad they care more about winning they about doing the right thing.

We can all just go back to the battlefield and die to satisfy your sense of moral justification. I am ready willing and able.

Notice how you say "we"? You count yourself among IRON. You are supporting THEM, and their violence. You don't care any more about peace than they do, which is to say, not at all.

If Gramlins wants to take me down for standing with IRON you know where to find me.

If IRON wants peace, they know where to find us.

There's a few words for that. Traitor, !@#$%, infra-hugger....Leaving your alliance because you disagree with the direction they're heading, instead of trying to do something about it...yeah, that's just about as pathetic as it gets in a game.

I left my alliance under a banner of peace after several public posts stating my position. When I left I stood on none for almost 5 months. Did you really just call me a traitor for that?Also by "We" I am referring to everyone wearing the IRON, DAWN, and Gramlins AA.

Also by "We" I am referring to everyone wearing the IRON, DAWN, and Gramlins AA.

That means IRON, DAWN, Grämlins, and you. One of these kids doesn't belong.

Also by "We" I am referring to everyone wearing the IRON, DAWN, and Gramlins AA.

That means IRON, DAWN, Grämlins, and you. One of these kids doesn't belong.

I agree.

That means IRON, DAWN, Grämlins, and you. One of these kids doesn't belong.

That kid would be you dude. You've admitted that you are supporting IRON. I've shown you that IRON was the one who started the war. So if you really want to try to get peace, then you'd get off the IRON AA and quit supporting their violence.Everyone flying the IRON AA right now is saying to CN: "I support random acts of violence and war".You don't want to say that, do you?

That means IRON, DAWN, Grämlins, and you. One of these kids doesn't belong.

That kid would be you dude. You've admitted that you are supporting IRON. I've shown you that IRON was the one who started the war. So if you really want to try to get peace, then you'd get off the IRON AA and quit supporting their violence.Everyone flying the IRON AA right now is saying to CN: "I support random acts of violence and war".You don't want to say that, do you?

I'm not a kid nor am I a traitor. This is a game and you don't seem to get that.Your insults have only strengthened my resolve.Unless your purpose is to just hurl insults back and forth there is no point in this discussion and nothing good has come from it. Lets just let it die.

Everyone flying the IRON AA right now is saying to CN: "I support random acts of violence and war".

Even if IRON surrendered unconditionally today would you really feel like you won?

Surrendering unconditionally is how IRON wins. They win their honor. Right now they are winning the war...winning the force of arms...but losing their honor, if they had any.We already feel like we've won, because we've kept our honor despite everything arrayed against us. Seriously though, We first requested unconditional surrender on March 27th. If IRON had surrendered then, they would've likely been finished with their peace terms from us by Easter. Given that, you simply cannot say with a straight face that they're looking for peace.

Even if IRON surrendered unconditionally today would you really feel like you won?

Surrendering unconditionally is how IRON wins. They win their honor. Right now they are winning the war...winning the force of arms...but losing their honor, if they had any.We already feel like we've won, because we've kept our honor despite everything arrayed against us. Seriously though, We first requested unconditional surrender on March 27th. If IRON had surrendered then, they would've likely been finished with their peace terms from us by Easter. Given that, you simply cannot say with a straight face that they're looking for peace.

Right now I am being swarmed by MK scoundrels in TE without a declaration of war. They used dishonor and obfuscation to hide their identities and it is the fourth rogue attack on my nation by them. They want the flag for Vanguard so they ghosted other alliances then all went rogue. I know you think they are your friends but they are as bad as whatever you think you are fighting for.Iron is looking for peace as they have kept white peace on the table throughout this whole mess.Iron will not surrender unconditionally and neither would Gramlins so lets all ride to hell together since you are blinded in defense of your pride.Do you love MK more than you love Gramlins? Do you really think MK would destroy their alliance to defend your honor long after the fact?

Right now I am being swarmed by MK scoundrels in TE without a declaration of war. They used dishonor and obfuscation to hide their identities and it is the fourth rogue attack on my nation by them. They want the flag for Vanguard so they ghosted other alliances then all went rogue. I know you think they are your friends but they are as bad as whatever you think you are fighting for.

That's a different game man, heh. You're crazy if you think that means anything here.

Iron is looking for peace as they have kept white peace on the table throughout this whole mess.

White peace is not peace. White peace is them getting away with starting a war. They're violent thugs and you KNOW they started this war for no reason. Offering white peace and having you say they're looking for real peace is like if I were to stab you and then say to the police "Oh now why continue this? Just let me go".

Do you love MK more than you love Gramlins?

Nope. Not doing this for MK. We would dishonor the Grämlins by not doing it.

Do you really think MK would destroy their alliance to defend your honor long after the fact?

I doubt it. But what they do or don't do doesn't matter much to what WE do.

So more IRON nations attacking our nations, yet you say they want peace? We haven't declared a single offensive war in weeks, and we have a clear offer of peace on the table. And offer being made to the wrongdoers, mind you. IRON's offer of "white peace" is the unjust party offering to the just. That's called a bribe. bribery - the practice of offering something (usually money) in order to gain an illicit advantageThe key word there is illicit. It's an illicit advantage. A wrong one. They want out of the war w/o admitting their guilt; they promised a payment of tech to C&G already (and C&G was all too happy to greedily suck it up), now they want to offer us "white peace" to get out clean. Is that the act of someone who is contrite?I tell you again; if they had accepted our offer on March 27th when I first gave it to Peron, they would've had peace with us by Easter. They refused. They refused the peace we offered them, and continue to do so, not because they're right, but because they are militarily able to continue the war. And so they will continue the war, because they WANT to do so.

So more IRON nations attacking our nations, yet you say they want peace? We haven't declared a single offensive war in weeks, and we have a clear offer of peace on the table. And offer being made to the wrongdoers, mind you. IRON's offer of "white peace" is the unjust party offering to the just. That's called a bribe. bribery - the practice of offering something (usually money) in order to gain an illicit advantageThe key word there is illicit. It's an illicit advantage. A wrong one. They want out of the war w/o admitting their guilt; they promised a payment of tech to C&G already (and C&G was all too happy to greedily suck it up), now they want to offer us "white peace" to get out clean. Is that the act of someone who is contrite?I tell you again; if they had accepted our offer on March 27th when I first gave it to Peron, they would've had peace with us by Easter. They refused. They refused the peace we offered them, and continue to do so, not because they're right, but because they are militarily able to continue the war. And so they will continue the war, because they WANT to do so.

No one with self respect would surrender unconditionally before even seeing terms. That's what this is about. Iron has no choice but to attack Gramlins. Before you say it, unconditional surrender is not a choice.

No one with self respect would surrender unconditionally before even seeing terms. That's what this is about. Iron has no choice but to attack Gramlins. Before you say it, unconditional surrender is not a choice.

I know it's not a choice, but what comes after it most certainly is.This isn't very different than an alliance saying: take it or leave it.The only difference is, we're offering a choice: after you surrender, either take our term(s), or don't. It's a clear path to peace either way. Whether it be peace with our term(s) or without, the choice is clear. IRON could end this right now, without even chosing to take our term(s), yet they refuse. They refuse the INSTANT path to peace. They refuse even the path that would've resulted in peace before Easter! Before the Easter Sunday Accords were even signed!That is not the action of an alliance seeking peace; they are merely seeking to capitalize on the PR blitz by known idiots such as Jonathan Brookbank, TheBigBad, BigWoody, IronChef, Alterego, BobJanova, etc. It is the move of a cold alliance with no principles.It's unabashed aggression and violence, not peace...and you're supporting it.

No one with self respect would surrender unconditionally before even seeing terms. That's what this is about. Iron has no choice but to attack Gramlins. Before you say it, unconditional surrender is not a choice.

I know it's not a choice, but what comes after it most certainly is.This isn't very different than an alliance saying: take it or leave it.The only difference is, we're offering a choice: after you surrender, either take our term(s), or don't. It's a clear path to peace either way. Whether it be peace with our term(s) or without, the choice is clear. IRON could end this right now, without even chosing to take our term(s), yet they refuse. They refuse the INSTANT path to peace. They refuse even the path that would've resulted in peace before Easter! Before the Easter Sunday Accords were even signed!That is not the action of an alliance seeking peace; they are merely seeking to capitalize on the PR blitz by known idiots such as Jonathan Brookbank, TheBigBad, BigWoody, IronChef, Alterego, BobJanova, etc. It is the move of a cold alliance with no principles.It's unabashed aggression and violence, not peace...and you're supporting it.

I don't believe Gramlins would ever surrender unconditionally and I don't think IRON is any less principled than MK. If you disagree with either of these statements please let me know. I find it strange that you are indignant IRON has attacked Gramlins when you refuse offers of peace. You are even unwilling to discuss a temporary ceasefire. If you want your alliance to remain strong and you want IRON to admit guilt it is my honest opinion you need to take a different tack. Might may not make right but might but in battle it doesn't really matter who is wrong or right.

I don't believe Gramlins would ever surrender unconditionally and I don't think IRON is any less principled than MK. If you disagree with either of these statements please let me know.

1] I can't speak for current or future Conclaves, but I personally have no issue with unconditional surrender (the correct definition, not the OWF's ridiculous make-believe), especially to an alliance who has a Codex that prevents them from issuing harsh terms.2] I don't think MK is very principled either, but they're certainly more so than IRON. You see, MK just decided to extract as much free tech out of this war as IRON would agree to, because they figure IRON will continue being my idols in the future (attacking people for no reason, etc) and so they want the tech advantage and don't care about anything else. They don't believe IRON can be rehabilitated from it's current culture of just being dicks for 3+ years. With the Grämlins, at least we're offering IRON a way to have their slate washed clean. A clear path to peace, followed by an official policy stating that IRON is guilt-free. MK is convinced that IRON will just continue being complete my idols, and they'll have to get beat down again in the future.

I find it strange that you are indignant IRON has attacked Gramlins when you refuse offers of peace

We offered IRON peace on March 27th. If they had taken it, they would've been completely free of terms about a WEEK later. We continue to offer them that same peace. Yet IRON continues to refuse.

You are even unwilling to discuss a temporary ceasefire.

A ceasefire is actually PART of what we offered IRON waaaay back on March 27th, so ask IRON why they were unwilling to take our clear peace offer back then. I'm sure they don't want to take it now, because they have a military advantage, and to them, "might makes right".Since you didn't address anything I said in my last PM, I've copied it here for you to read again.

No one with self respect would surrender unconditionally before even seeing terms. That's what this is about. Iron has no choice but to attack Gramlins. Before you say it, unconditional surrender is not a choice.

I know it's not a choice, but what comes after it most certainly is.This isn't very different than an alliance saying: take it or leave it.The only difference is, we're offering a choice: after you surrender, either take our term(s), or don't. It's a clear path to peace either way. Whether it be peace with our term(s) or without, the choice is clear. IRON could end this right now, without even chosing to take our term(s), yet they refuse. They refuse the INSTANT path to peace. They refuse even the path that would've resulted in peace before Easter! Before the Easter Sunday Accords were even signed!That is not the action of an alliance seeking peace; they are merely seeking to capitalize on the PR blitz by known idiots such as Jonathan Brookbank, TheBigBad, BigWoody, IronChef, Alterego, BobJanova, etc. It is the move of a cold alliance with no principles.It's unabashed aggression and violence, not peace...and you're supporting it.

I think what Gramlins is asking for is a state of complete submission then they will tell IRON/DAWN what their punishment is. Am I wrong, Matthew?

You are wrong, and what's more, I've told you this myself at least 5-6 times. We're not asking for any state of submission AT ALL, and you know it. Why do you make a statement you KNOW is false?