lmcfalcon12

[quote name='The Arbiter' date='08 July 2010 - 08:28 PM' timestamp='1278631683' post='2363930'] Are you saying that his opinions don't matter because a lot of people disagree with him? I guess you aren't really a champion of free speech... Shouldn't he be free to say whatever he wants, regardless of the amount of people on 13 pages who agreed with the fact that the punishment was harsh? What are you even talking about "get with the times?" What... Anyway, why don't you keep up with all the new material, two posts up from the bottom on page 14 has not been responded to. Thanks ahead of time! You are straying from the topic by talking about how atrocious I am at economics and how I am only 17 years old. That has absolutely nothing to do with the gag or anything to do with free speech. Letum has made the most intellectual and intelligent posts in this thread. He knows exactly what he's talking about. You on the other hand have gotten pretty much 70% of the facts wrong and post them as truth. You should stop posting until you "know." You think you were recruited because you were sheep? You're not that special, buddy. Recruiters send out mass messages to several hundred unaligneds a day. You were just one of those guys, you weren't singled out and virtually nothing was known about you other than your ruler/nation name when you were recruited. [/quote] You're corrupt. An authoritarian bully. You're in the MoE as an excuse to sit out in wars. You are a racist who's gotten away with countless racist incidents with no more than a slap on the wrist. Yeah maybe disobeying the government was a poor choice on my part, but disobeying you? Heh. Doesn't even come to mind as wrong. Maybe if you hadn't been such a __________ to me over the years like you are to so many other members, you'd have gotten a respectful answer, and compliance with your BB gag. I'm not going to say it anymore, because the majority of the cyberverse knows what I'm talking about. Legion should be ashamed to even have you in their ranks, let alone as a minister, a government official, and supposedly an example to the younger crowd. Get over yourself. When you can stop harassing people, foreigners, in their own IRC channels then start talking again, because that will show me you know how to deal with others. See because bashing PeggySue on their channel, while you are government, is something you would accuse me of being capable of. But I'm not that stupid. See at least I know how to interact with foreigners and friends of my alliance. Something you're not old enough to know yet apparently. If you've got a reason for bashing alliance leadership in their channels...I'm sure we're all waiting for a response. Thanks!

[quote name='The Arbiter' date='08 July 2010 - 05:38 PM' timestamp='1278621511' post='2363788'] I've never been fired as Minister of Economics. I was fired when I worked under another Minister of Economics but it wasn't because of skill. I resigned after almost a year with the title because honestly I was just getting tired. I took a nice break and I'm back now. It is really funny how many wrong things you've said in this thread while claiming to be a model, informed, super active member. You really don't know what went down... HymenBreach, it is much easier to grow an alliance of 15 people (most of which were in the Ministry of Economics) with 100% activity than an alliance of 400 people with 50% activity. 33% for your alliance is probably <1% for us. [/quote] I don't care what went down. I don't care about Legion anymore. The second you levied your retarded punishment for speaking my mind and basking in the glow that Legion had FINALLY achieved the biggest thing ever in that time, I stopped caring. You guys can continue to be as corrupt, savage, and backstabbing as you want. People already have their opinions of you and they aren't going to change. [quote name='Emperor Whimsical' date='08 July 2010 - 06:51 PM' timestamp='1278625893' post='2363861'] 500 tech is a savage way to punish people. BUUUUT, You disobeyed a direct order, from an alliance leader, regardless of who he is, or his background, you agreed to obey the Legion's government when you joined. Therefore, you must be punished as the Legion sees fit. [b]Also, Letum is spot on.[/b] PS: Why are people recruiting this guy? I mean, yes, Legion pulls some silly stunts. but this guy SHOULD be punished, from what I've read, the OP seems to have a knack for airing dirty laundry and disagreeing with direct orders, something that no alliance should ever look for in a person. [/quote] I disobeyed an order. Whoop de doo. Have you beat that into the ground enough? We've got 13 other pages of people saying, [i]"He broke a rule, but his punishment was out of control."[/i] Would you care to get with the times? Or could you just do us all a favor and stop posting if you can't stay in the present here? I know that only one page of replies has been added to this topic today. I know its going to be difficult to keep up with [i]ALL[/i] the new, fresh material, but if you could, that'd be great. Thanks ahead of time! Letum is spot on? I mean what? He couldn't stray farther from the thread if he tried. I think on page 11 or 12, he wanted to start a debate with me about civil liberties and freedom of speech. Really? I'm not interested in another debate about trivial, meaningless crap. If you want to debate something else, make another thread and discuss it there. Letum doesn't know WTF he's talking about and should do us all a favor and stop posting until he does know. And as far as why people are recruiting (already been recruited by an alliance thanks), maybe some alliances like members who are active, and not just sheep. Maybe speaking your mind every once and a while isn't such a bad thing. In my 6 weeks back at Legion and CN, I barely posted on Legion boards and never touched a CN board. That's why I got recruited. There's not a whole lot of alliances who like quiet, sheep like rule followers like you. Taking a few risks and growing some balls are a part of the game.

[quote name='Jrenster' date='08 July 2010 - 02:53 PM' timestamp='1278611607' post='2363581'] In an autocratic society, freedom of speech is not a right, it's a privilege. In my opinion, freedom has little intrinsic value. I believe in freedom for a purpose, not freedom for the sake of freedom. That being said, I agree that most gag orders are unnecessary. We are here to have fun, and being censored destroys that fun for a lot of people. While there may be some rare circumstances that they should be enforced, I don't think this was a situation that called for it. But I'm not here to determine Legion policy. I think it's always worse for someone to disobey orders. [b]Just because you dislike a policy doesn't mean you have to straight up confront it by disobeying it.[/b] There are always ways around something like this; such as talking to another superior or gathering support around yourself. [/quote] The Arbiter has been bullying me for years. This thread, me leaving, the refusal to pay the fine should not be a surprise to any Legion member right now. I made it perfectly clear that had ANY other government member ordered me to stop, I would have. The Arbiter has been jerking me over for years, so its not really a surprise where I told him to shove his individual gag order. It was only levied on me, though numerous other Legionnaires were posting "non funny" and "non productive" posts as well. [quote name='Penkala' date='08 July 2010 - 02:51 PM' timestamp='1278611450' post='2363579'] All I want to know is how many fines are going to be levied on members of Legion posting in this thread? [/quote] Okay...500 tech per member. And at least 12-14 members have posted here. But government is above the law and the rules, so subtract out 4. We're down to 8-10 members who will have to pay fines. So between 4,000 and 5,000 tech I'd imagine. I'm sure your [i]qualified[/i] MoE can get those payments out very soon. /sarcasm

[quote name='Hymenbreach' date='08 July 2010 - 12:02 PM' timestamp='1278601351' post='2363448'] Arbiter isn't that good in MOE. I left for Quantum and grew by about 33% in a month. [/quote] I was trying to rationalize but...meh. You're right. He's been fired before. Had he actually been good, he would have held his job the whole time.

[quote name='Lincongrad' date='08 July 2010 - 11:38 AM' timestamp='1278599879' post='2363429'] It wasn't just Arbiter who enforced the rule. It was the government as a whole. [/quote] That's what I don't understand is The Arbiter has some "alluring" power over you guys. You guys are mystified by is ability to run the MoE. Let me go back to the age thing for a moment; here's a tip don't let people put their age on your forums and then let them run for office or hold government positions. Most of the time people expect their government to act their age. Racism and bullying is typical of a teenage. Forgive me for thinking of anything else. I'm 22. We can spare each other the trivial jokes and jabs, but in my defense, I'm not supposed to be an example to anyone in your alliance. Your government is and they're a pretty sad one...as a whole.

[quote name='IronsightSniper' date='08 July 2010 - 11:10 AM' timestamp='1278598191' post='2363409'] I'm going to admit it LMC, [b]alot of people here didn't like you.[/b] This thread is the reason why. Legion is mostly that quiet kid with the thick skull and big muscles. Sure, we don't like it when Orc kids say mean things to us, but we have the will power and unity to just ignore them. But when loud-mouthed, trouble making members like you(or me for that matter) blabber on and on, "in defense of Legion", you're just feeding the trolls, manufacturing new material, and generally, setting us up for another downfall. The best way to counter act said trolls, is just to shut up and move along. Build your infra, collect your tech, produce them nukes. Trolls are never going to respect us. Not even if we have 100k Average NS, not even if our Nuke/Members ratio is 25. Trolls are gonna be trolls, and haters are going to hate. Our only goal was to achieve Sanction, and maybe get ourselves into a good bloc, and make good members. But again, blabbering on like what you have done, and what I'm doing now, only furthers the hate and revives that little Orc inside everyone of us, telling us to, "Hate, hate the Legion. Hate them for what they are. Hate them for who they are. Your hate for them knows no bounds, your hate for them knows no end. Whoever they thrive to be, whomever they become, hate them." And so, in conclusion, if you would of shut up, [b]we wouldn't have layed down the law.[/b] [/quote] Awww. People didn't like me because I tarnished what's left of their precious little image, which these days isn't much. We all seem to have different ideas of what it means to defend an alliance, and to boast a sanction. W/e that much is clear. As far as the last sentence... WE? Who is we? Not you, non-government member. The only person who decided to enforce a rule for once in 3 years was the Arbiter. Get it right now, I don't shut up. I don't give a crap what Arbiter said, what he wanted or the like. His opinion matters least to me. I'd ask Satan what he thought about something before I'd ask the Arbiter. He's a meaningless smashed tin can on the side of the highway to me. If I ever heard his name or had to talk to him again, it would be far too soon. [quote name='Hymenbreach' date='08 July 2010 - 03:26 AM' timestamp='1278570372' post='2363231'] Whatever happened to the 'Statement of Respect' I wrote for you guys, to help avoid this kind of thing? I see it isn't pinned anymore (though it could be in the private part, I suppose). LMC, take deep breaths and move on. If you have any feelings for the Legion, stop now. You've punched the walls on your way out, which is fine, but don't knock one of the walls down. Arbiter has confessed to having a terrible attitude and, lightning conversions aside, is not going to change his attitude overnight. [b]If you have anything to say to him, go have a pm fight or an Irc fight.[/b] As for the haters, The Legion will thank you. Your hate is their cement, always has been, always will be. Without you, Legion would have died years ago. [/quote] You are right Hymenbreach. What I think of Legion is perfectly clear and it didn't take 13 pages to outline it. They force out their good and experienced members and back stab. As for the bold part, he's not worth my time. I encourage anyone in the future who has been wronged in such a way to post another one of these threads. For one they are therapeutic, and for another no one will be mystified as to why you are writing one. Because they're all about the Legion and they still all involve the same old crap. Nothing ever changes.

Its always nice to see someone swallow their pride when necessary and admit when they are wrong. Props to you. This world and CN could use more people like you.

Double post..FTL. Sorry.

[quote name='The Arbiter' date='08 July 2010 - 12:53 AM' timestamp='1278561220' post='2363111'] [b]Explain to me how falcon was a rival to me.[/b] Explain to me what exactly my "clique" is and who is in it. Explain to me how you know that the gag order wasn't going to be the end of it. You seem to know a lot of things about me and the Legion that I don't even know... I'm honored that you think I'm a king, however in truth I hold no more power than any of the other three consuls and certainly hold no power over the proconsul or imperator. We agree on a lot of things but that doesn't mean I am the puppetmaster... [/quote] You've disliked me since day one, for whatever reason that much is clear. [quote name='Gamemaster1' date='08 July 2010 - 12:08 AM' timestamp='1278558462' post='2363050'] Hey, while the rest of the thread really isn't too much my business, real MoE people fight alongside their alliance while aiding. Then they usually have the cash to rebuild after doing so. [/quote] Take a note Arbiter ^ as you've already admitted that you did not fight, nor did you have the financial resources necessary enough to fight nor to provide aid wartime, or otherwise. You seem to have talked yourself in a circle. [quote name='Lincongrad' date='08 July 2010 - 12:10 AM' timestamp='1278558593' post='2363054'] If I remember correctly the government as a whole decided to impose the punishment on lmcfalcon, not just Arbiter. Other members in the government know Arb's history, and take that into account when taking recommendations from him, and yet still decided on this punishment. To my knowledge we've never had someone violate a BB gag before, because everyone else has realized it's a bad idea, or complained about the gag on our forums (sometimes successfully). When lmc disobeyed the gag gov as a whole put together what they thought was a fitting punishment. It was by no means Arbiter acting alone. [/quote] Woe is me. I disobeyed the government. I elected to NOT take orders from a corrupt economic minister who's a racist and a power hungry psychopath. Like I said, he acts like he runs your alliance. Get him on a leash before your situations become any worse. Since things ain't lookin' so good right now. Truth be told, anyone could have written a thread like this about you. I'm not the first to attempt it, and it would be foolish to think this will be the last. But let me tell you, if I was on the outside reading this, it would just add to the miserable reputation your alliance already has. And to solve any misconceptions, I didn't just start thinking the Legion was bad because of the haters. Its become apparent over the last 6-12 months that you guys choose to ignore all the misconduct, harassment etc. [quote name='Rebel Virginia' date='08 July 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1278559456' post='2363075'] [color="#0000FF"]In every government there is always a supreme ruler, uncontested in his wisdom, a few high ranking yes-men (whom the other yes-men say yes to), and then your average yes-man. Which one of these are you? And don't think you can fool me. I know who's running the show over at Legion, and it certainly isn't you. Also, a gag order? I've seen how well those work in the past. Not only does it peeve the members, it also allows your critics to rail at you unchallenged. Whatever they say becomes truth, in time, as there is no counter-argument. Why do you think Vox was so effective? Sure the anti-NPO sentiment that had brooded over the years helped, but NPO simply saying nothing to oppose Vox also helped. How incompetent is Legion's government to realize it is making ineffective policy? [b]If anything Falcon should have been commended for standing up against the blatant idiocy of his government, which clearly is not fit to govern.[/b][/color] [/quote] There we go. He said the magic words. If you don't occasionally speak up against what's wrong and try and defend your alliance and the rights of its members, you're a tool. And you deserve to be chastised in one of these threads. If you want to accept what's wrong as truth and reality, then I feel very sorry for you, because though this is an internet game, you're probably letting RL injustices roll you over because you're too timid to say anything. Apologies for standing up against an injustice. [quote name='RePePe' date='08 July 2010 - 01:53 AM' timestamp='1278564816' post='2363169'] The obvious question that comes to mind here is that, [b]if falcon is so ridiculous and is clearly in the wrong, how come 12 pages and counting have passed, and not only is the issue not dealt with, but it's been made considerably worse? [/b] Instead of slapping a band-aid on that paper cut, it's been slashed open wider. Now, this is either an incredibly unintelligent move, or one of the most brilliant decisions ever! I think I'll wait a bit to see which. [/quote] You know that's what I always ask for sometimes is to just give me a tiny bit more credit then you [i]think[/i]I deserve. [quote name='Lezrahi' date='08 July 2010 - 02:02 AM' timestamp='1278565324' post='2363174'] [i]Lezrahi nodded slowly.[/i] All right, Arbiter. Fair enough. Except... Taking into account your already-publicised and admitted-to propensity for racial outbursts, not only to other Legionnaires, but toward those part of other alliances, I find you to be in violation of The Legion Code of Conduct. By the Code's context and wording, lmcfalcon12 was in complete keeping with the Code because he refused to follow the orders of a Legion official who [b]violated international codes of conduct[/b]. I hereby recommend that The Arbiter be stripped of his ranking and reeducated in the proper behaviour that Legionnaires are expected to uphold. [/quote] I recommend that too. For too long has he been above the law, allowed to get away with continual harassing and racist comments, and yet he always gets a slap on the wrist, he's always allowed to give his opinion, and he's never demoted, or fined for any of his conduct. It just AMAZES! me. Arbiter look in the mirror, because me telling you to get over yourself and where to shove that BB gag, is nothing compared to all the garbage you have gotten away with. Do us a favor and impose a BB gag order on yourself. You're not doing the Legion any favors and any response you have, someone always has a clever rebuttle. We could go on forever. Look at your code of conduct and tell me if you've been following it every step of the way. You're no angel and as far as this whole issue is concerned, no one's better at overriding the rules than you.

[quote name='The Arbiter' date='07 July 2010 - 11:34 PM' timestamp='1278556427' post='2363029'] The IG position is useful as it audits ministries and makes sure things are efficient. Konkrage is not hated nor ridiculed. A lot of people want the job, that's why many people nominate themselves and only one person is elected. I fought in the 2UJ war and took 14 more nukes to add to my 20 total. I guess you're right though, I sit back and relax. Because sifting through 300 war aid requests and then organizing reps is a cake walk. I can understand if you don't like me, but don't say that "working in the Ministry of Economics is just an excuse to sit back." Nobody who works for the Ministry of Economics sits out in wars. Bankers used to sit out in wars but that policy was revoked several months ago while totem was MoD. I guess you were just too inactive to notice... I was reiterating something you said, which is why I said "indeed." It has nothing to do with me being MoE or Imperial being Imperator, I was simply answering your concerns in the order they were stated. This is what you said, "I am a drama queen that much is true. That alliance never ran smoother than when you were imperator and Arbiter was not MoE. Remember those days. Because that was the smoothest, calmest, and most cohesive I ever saw the Legion." [b]Yesterday your comments were funny and absurd but now they're not funny anymore.[/b] [/quote] Probably cause the truth isn't funny. I was one of the most active members you guys ever had. I partied on IRC all the time and busted my you know what doing work for the MoD and totem. Contrary to what you "do" which is very little besides mock and ridicule me and other members, you do sit around and pretty much do nothing for war time. You end up giving orders as to where the aid will go rarely paying out any yourself. I forget how selfless it is to watch your brothers go into battle, but to not join them yourself. The bottomline to summarize it all is, inactive and useless leaders are glorified with the Legion, hardworking and active members are ridiculed, belittled, embarrassed and forced out with petty punishments, and alliances with horrible rep never get it back...even four years later. Especially when their conduct has never changed. I rest my case. You guys are a joke and judging by responses from other alliances...you always have been. Congratulations on absorbing a near defunct alliance to boost your scores. Enjoy your sanction. Huzzah. Right now you have the most members I've ever seen Legion have...by like 8. I guess recruiting isn't the way to go. Better put out the word that absorbing dying alliances is the way to pay the bills. [quote name='Gopherbashi' date='07 July 2010 - 11:42 PM' timestamp='1278556902' post='2363033'] Just because you piss and moan about something for years doesn't mean it's going to be changed just to suit your desires. If it was just you complaining, and 400 others who aren't complaining, it shouldn't come as a huge surprise that things don't change overnight. [b]And to be honest, one person complaining time and time again does not automatically make their complaint legitimate.[/b] [/quote] Ah true, but when other members complain about the same person time and time again as well, kind of makes you wonder as to whether maybe there isn't a bit of truth involved with the banter.

[quote name='The Arbiter' date='07 July 2010 - 11:08 PM' timestamp='1278554866' post='2363007'] I'm sure they'd be willing to expel me in exchange for you, someone who whines constantly [b]and does no work for his alliance.[/b] Really, do you think you're special enough to have someone forced out simply because you don't like him? Konkrage is not government although as the Inspector General it is his duty to handle situations like yours. Wouldn't you know that, Mr. Deputy Inspector General? You are indeed a queen of drama. The alliance never stagnated more than when Imperial was Imperator and I wasn't MoE. I'm not blaming that on Imperial, I'm blaming that on incompetent MoE's. Not saying I'm great, just saying I'm not inactive and the alliance is growing. I thought both Imperial and Hubb were great Imperators, and served under both of them, although I believe that the alliance was smoother under Hubb. This is simply due to internal circumstances and lack of certain key troublemaking members under Hubb. Also, Hubb's reign was shorter. [/quote] The IG's position is a waste of pixels and forum space. Its a position that once you get it, you're ridiculed and hated. No one wants the job, and the people who take the job have it for like a month at a time. As far as the bold part is concerned, I practically ran the MoD during the Karma war. You're Commodore was a mere, inactive figurehead taking a tag just to make it look like you had a 2nd in command for that ministry. I was up till 2 AM sending out target lists, organizing squads, assigning squads, taking battle reports, and fighting my own battles, while you hid in peace mode because you were a bank nation. Don't give me your bull. Working in the MoE is just an excuse to sit back and watch your fellow alliance members get the crap kicked out of them. You sit and don't fight, which as hard as it may be to believe, I've never sat out a war for Legion...no matter how stupid the cause. That's more than can be said for you or your ministry. You also mention me as a "queen of drama". Reiterating something I already said is a waste of time. Also, you state the sentence, but don't elaborate on it. What does me being a drama queen have anything to do with you not being MoE or when Imperial was imperator? Absolutely nothing.

[quote name='T.Hubb' date='07 July 2010 - 12:21 PM' timestamp='1278516043' post='2362439'] LMC- You PM'd me one time, bro. Once. You were upset about the BB Ban and wanted to appeal it. You also CC:d it to Watcher. Watcher responded to you rather quickly. I did not feel the need to do so, which is known as [i]delegating[/i]. I was pleased with Watcher's response to you, and did not see a need to respond with the same type of statement. You can bash me all you want, and you've done a fairly good job in doing so. That's fine. I'm not mad anymore, because this is a game. I guess I didn't respond enough to your comments about how to get a girl you've been stalking for three years to like you in our public forums. C'est la vie. [/quote] Oh yeah, because a post in your special lounge is really what this is about. Bringing up my personal life and an issue I wanted a little bit of advice on is not real classy. So I guess we're both lowered to the same level now. Don't ever bring my RL issues to the BBs or up to me again. Very poor show. And as far as responding to my thread in the public forums...what? You never responded to me period. An effective leader is an active leader and one who "pretends" at the very least to give a damn. Its not about you passing of my concerns to other members. I messaged you about how outraged I was with the racism...not a reply and no one said "boo" about it. I heard you were going to start lowering the boom on some of the rowdy members, i.e. your MoE and your MoD. Alas, I was misinformed by other members of your government. I'm sorry about whatever is going on in your RL with your wife, baby etc. That's not an issue anymore. Because if someone had told me WTF was going and why you were rarely, if ever online, I would have had more sympathy for you never responding to a PM, being online, or roaming on IRC. [quote name='T.Hubb' date='07 July 2010 - 01:00 PM' timestamp='1278518389' post='2362464'] You know what? I admit when I'm wrong, and I was wrong to say that last part. It was unnecessary, and I apologize. The rest, however, stands. Good day. [/quote] The rest does stand. Poor show regardless. If you want to bite back on this thread, leave my RL life issues out of it. Sorry for asking your people for a little bit of advice. I'll know better next time. Any respect I had is gone. You got a shred of it back with that apology, but the rest. Whatever dude. And don't come back with the "I don't have any respect for you," or "I've lost all respect for you," because I've heard the same old song from your members and your government for far too long. [quote name='aboooe' date='07 July 2010 - 11:48 AM' timestamp='1278514063' post='2362411'] Hai LMC Man I enjoy these threads. Shoot me a pm when you reroll. [/quote] What's up dude?! Been a long time. I will definitely shoot you a PM! [quote name='assarax' date='07 July 2010 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1278529159' post='2362597'] [b]Lmcfalcon12 has been an off-and-on member of The Legion for quite some time. He has left time and again due to differences with leadership and our charter, but still continued to return time and again.[/b] If he felt so wronged each time, why would he try to return? And upon returning, [color="#FF0000"][b]he never did a lick to try to implement changes;[/b][/color] he waited until something happened that he disagreed with, or an insult from another member, blew it out of proportion and stormed out of the building like a jilted ex. I'm sorry you felt that the actions levied against you were inappropriate lmc, but there were other avenues for expressing your distaste than in this public way. You knew what this would do, and you did it to stir up more angst and drama against our alliance. On that note, I hope you enjoy your time in Hydra; I'm sure you and Jacapo will have a lot to talk about. Not that any of it will be of any quality or relevance. [/quote] Let's see...the bold parts are true, the bold red part is not. You, like the others are blind to the fact that I pissed and moaned about Arbiter's conduct for years...literally years. I submitted multiple complaints to the IG's office and so since Konkrage is either too lazy or too ignorant to take care of them, I was ignored. Just because you get sick of hearing the complaints doesn't mean you ignore them. That means something's up and you probably oughta get up and do some research because it probably holds some legitimacy. So don't sit there and [i]attempt[/i] to save face for your alliance by lying and said I didn't try and levy some change. I asked for an environment where we could all get along and be respected. You choose not to see the countless posts where Arbiter and others called me out, blackmailed me, belittled me in the private forums, visitor wall areas, and worst of all in public. Need I say more? Legion's image continues to be tainted. Four years of existence and yet most of the garbage I hear from the general population is true. What a surprise. [quote name='Jacapo Saladin' date='07 July 2010 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1278531827' post='2362639'] Expel arbiter and your problems will dissolve. Seems pretty straightforward. [/quote] Had they gotten rid of him, I had would have had no qualms about living in the alliance for the rest of my days. But he's above the law and I forget that. Silly me to think that we should all be treated equally and be forced to follow the same rules. [quote name='The Arbiter' date='07 July 2010 - 07:56 PM' timestamp='1278543387' post='2362833'] Again, I had nothing to do with the fine. It was a little high [b]but I'm sure if Lmcfalcon12 was willing to talk about it instead of whining and leaving us angry messages, Konkrage would have lowered it.[/b] [/quote] Konkrage is not government. Its outlined in your charter. He can relay punishments but not dish them out. I did discuss it with him countless times, both in an irate manner, and several calm attempts. He ignored all opportunities to work out a payment plan, or lower the punishment. I didn't start leaving angry messages till I started receiving harassing messages about paying the tech when you know damn well that a 6 week old nation can't snap their fingers and cough out 500 tech. It doesn't happen. [quote name='Imperial' date='07 July 2010 - 09:17 PM' timestamp='1278548258' post='2362921'] [b]Dear Lmcfalcon12,[/b] I apologize for overreacting in my initial posts. You are still a drama queen though (). That said, I do sincerely hope that we will take seriously what you have said. I know we've got much to work on, but we've also had a lot more to overcome than most. Ultimately, many of our key decisions will lie in the new Legion leadership, especially as it pertains to government personnel and reasonable application of the law. While I may disagree with lot of the OP, disagreement only kills pixels. As you said its a game and its not worth it to get worked up over. If you do have any suggestions you wish to relay or just want to chat, you know where to find me. I wish you well whether you stay or leave the game. Best, [i]Imperial [/i] [/quote] I am a drama queen that much is true. That alliance never ran smoother than when you were imperator and Arbiter was not MoE. Remember those days. Because that was the smoothest, calmest, and most cohesive I ever saw the Legion.

[quote name='DonVox' date='07 July 2010 - 09:23 AM' timestamp='1278505363' post='2362354'] Just before the Legion-UPN treaty was cancelled. [/quote] Heh. I was there for those shenanigans, but alas I didn't see our main government guru online discussing things. He must always slip out as I'm joining and vice versa. Funny how those things work. And then it gives others the impression that you're not doing anything.

[quote name='DonVox' date='07 July 2010 - 09:17 AM' timestamp='1278505050' post='2362350'] The old quote about how some animals are more equal than others suits well in this situation. Orly? Only a short moment later, Legion cancelled. Either Hubb was telling what he thought was the truth, and he was outmaneuvered by his ministers, or Hubb was lying. [/quote] See when was this? Because I've been on IRC a lot lately and haven't seen him on. Hmm. Oh well.

[quote name='Haflinger' date='07 July 2010 - 08:45 AM' timestamp='1278503139' post='2362332'] No, there wasn't. There was the threat of being kicked out of Legion. That's it. Which makes this whole thread turn into a great big bawfest. (Incidentally, currently lmcfalcon has 1.3K infra and 50 tech, and has all five slots filled with tech deals with The Legion. So I'm unsure what's going on here with regards to that.) [/quote] Two slots are 1x1s. One member is owed 50 still, and the other 100. They have been messaged and told that they will get their tech etc without a problem. [quote name='Hymenbreach' date='07 July 2010 - 04:12 AM' timestamp='1278486730' post='2362240'] I'm getting fairly tired of thinking 'Oh, Legion" when I come into one of these threads. @Lincon. May I extend your analogy? Sure, punish LMC for his bashing of other 'corporations', but what about the cancer in your mist that has never managed to be respectful to his fellow 'Employees'? As far as I know, he has never been punished, in fact he becomes more central to the Legion every month. He also had the temerity to quote the code of ethics in this thread. Alliances can deal with unusual characters in their midst in several ways. Several people who appear to be pains can have their energies channelled into useful areas. Others continue to be destructive, no matter how much you try. The Legion is better than this. Cut out that cancer and things will settle down. LMC, my postbox is always open. I have spoken to Legion privately about my concerns. [/quote] I hear you boss. I've been speaking of these problems for years...especially to you. You know what its like, and I know where your PM box is. [quote name='Watcher' date='07 July 2010 - 04:15 AM' timestamp='1278486909' post='2362241'] There is no threat of ZI and there isn't going to be one. That's just silly. He is free to do whatever and I wish him well. [/quote] Good luck to you. You're a great leader. I could tell when I came back you'd do something nice for the alliance. Thanks for the well wishes. [quote name='Jacapo Saladin' date='07 July 2010 - 03:46 AM' timestamp='1278485144' post='2362224'] Legion probably didn't have enough tech sellers to pay off those reps so they had to dole out punishments for trivial matters like this and force their members to payoff the reparations. [/quote] I get the whole, "serve your alliance" crap. For the record, no one ever approached me about selling tech to pay for reps, but inevitably that's all what it went to for the guys buying the tech. I wouldn't assist in cleaning up a mess for any alliance for a conflict that resulted while I was out dealing with RL things and didn't even have a nation. [quote name='Lord Fingolfin' date='07 July 2010 - 02:13 AM' timestamp='1278479588' post='2362147'] [b]Asgaard fought Quantum IIRC, LMC would have been in the roughly 50k range at the time, around where you were LW.[/b] But anyways, welcome LMC to the disgruntled Ex-Legionnaire club. We've got enough guys in it that I'm sure if we made our own alliance we could roll Legion. Oh and Joosh, I've got 50 tech that you will have joined our ranks before you reach a year tenure on the Legion AA. Do we have a bet? [/quote] I wasn't even involved when Quantum waged war in that one. So unfortunately lonewolf is mistaken as well. I had deleted my first nation do deal with RL stuff. Oh and as far as Jooshbox, I'd make that 100 tech. He thinks he knows so much and I doubt he's even been there longer than 6, 8 months tops. I'm not going to go back and try and check. Its amazing though how someone who has no clue what's going on can have such a high opinion not knowing both sides. At least people like Imperial, Arbiter and the others know both sides for the most part and have their respected opinions. The box doesn't even have a clue. Also I thought it was pretty funny how his first post on this topic, his BB post count was only 1. Good to see I've created a topic that has provoked people to get BB accounts. I guess welcome to the club indeed. I heard some junk about you when I came back and conveniently reversed it all in my mind while reading the stories. You had a solid rep while I was there. Not a surprise that they would try and taint your image after you left and I returned.

[quote name='jooshbox234' date='06 July 2010 - 10:16 PM' timestamp='1278465362' post='2361885'] I apologize. I thought you said you were kicked out of Quantum, that's my bad. And as a matter of fact, it looks like your definition of a hard-working Legionnaire is someone who praises you. That is sad. [/quote] As far as someone who praises me, I didn't explicitly say he was a hard worker. You can quote me if you want, but see below You know who you work for in the econ sector. That's your choice. You're either in or your out. Well I'm done replying to you and the others, since I've applied to a new alliance. Hopefully this time when I give respect, I will get it back. A-dios.

[quote name='Letum' date='06 July 2010 - 10:10 PM' timestamp='1278464994' post='2361867'] If I might match the tone of your high horse, the first place where I "am from" [i]invented[/i] the concept of freedom of speech before Western Civilization had even come into existence. The second place where I "am from" codified it centuries before the U.S's bill of rights even came into existence. I am well aware of what freedom is, and even more of what the "crushing tyranny" you so casually bring up is. You do not seem to truly know what freedom of speech is. What you are doing here is abusing the concept so that it can serve as your own personal shield. We all live in a society where every action you take has a reaction amongst those around you. Doing so comes with a sense of responsibility and, from the moment that you become a part of a more cohesive social unit, it comes with a social contract. When you sign up for a game like this, you enter a social contract you have to respect the moderation rules. Sanctions for violating them are not an infringement of "freedom of speech". When you sign up for an alliance, you enter a social contract where the benefits conferred upon you by that membership are matched by a contribution, which will often include acting within the alliance's interests. Sanctions for violating them are not an infringement of your "freedom of speech". Given the oft-cited (by your very self) attempts to seek action upon "racist" remarks, I am surprised you do not realise this. To violate your "freedom" of speech, Legion would have to actually take physical RL action that would restrain your ability to make such expressions, or attach harmful effects to it. What happens within a doubly private setting in an online game does not fit the bill. Certainly, you retain the freedom to speak in any manner you wish, but in this environment, with these social contracts, everybody else has the freedom to act in opposition. You cannot touch without being touched. Perhaps it is the RP nature of this game, where we have "governments" that gives rise to this mass confusion. An alliance here is not equatable to a real nation state. It is a private organization, and if you do not want to be sanctioned for violating its rules, then you should not be part of it. If you work somewhere, and violate company policy by insulting your boss, you get fired. If you are a General, and you insult the civilian leader you work for, you get fired. Freedom of Speech comes with responsibility, and therefore consequences for violating that responsibility. The reason why Freedom of Speech is so enshrined in modern western law is not in order to prevent any form of consequence, but in order to prevent the level of harmful consequence that would make the exercising of such freedom impossibly untenable in the first place. To pretend that intra-alliance drama in an online game even comes close to that level would be utter folly. [/quote] Um what? Watch my tone? Sorry did you not see the part that said; "I AM NOT ATTACKING YOU"? You wanted to turn this into a debate of countries and cultures. So if you would like to create posts in the future that further relate to the thread, I'll do you a solid and reply to them. Otherwise, I'm going to pass this off as off topic nonsense. Personally I don't care where you're from or what your opinion is on the matter. That's not what this is about.

[quote name='jooshbox234' date='06 July 2010 - 09:52 PM' timestamp='1278463958' post='2361848'] I was talking about your little "incident" with quantum. Funny, seems this sort of thing happens a lot to you. [/quote] I was never thrown out. Resigned with them too. That's when I rerolled and deleted and took 6 months off. I'm sorry that you're still misinformed. Stop posting if you don't know the whole story, which you obviously don't, and its getting really annoying. [quote name='Shoofly' date='06 July 2010 - 09:53 PM' timestamp='1278463981' post='2361849'] You were here for a long time, cared deeply about this alliance, and feel wronged. I for one, thank you for your service, actually respect your opinions, and wish you the best. It's a sad day for The Legion when something like this happens from an active member. I only hope that we emerge stronger. You did say some positive things in there. However, you only served in discrediting my home with this selfish post in the World Forums. This was something that I am sure you will regret later on. I only hope that if any good comes from this that you may gain a samll measure of satisfaction and/or feeling of justice which will help to aid you on your way in the future. [/quote] I only say I'm sorry when I mean it, and to you, I will give a sincere apology. When I made this post, obviously I didn't think of everyone...that much is apparent. And also its nice to be appreciated...even if its just by one person. I did do a lot of nice things and really didn't think I got my due. Oh well...that's the way things go. Perhaps I will regret this later, but Legion kept pushing and pushing and pushing, and not treating people equally. They let things go that shouldn't have been and then continuously harped on garbage like a 500 tech fine. I got Konkrage's 3rd note about my payment while I was trying to figure out how to fix my broken down car. Set over the edge? I think so. I apologize to you and the other quality members and I thank you for what you've done to help my battle. I will not say I'm sorry for this thread, because I know that what I said needed to be said. Concerns needed to be addressed and without shouting from the mountain tops, I was never heard. I hope they heard me this time because I've been trying for a long time to get some attention regarding some of garbage going on there. Its a game. Go to whereever makes you happy, because if you're not having fun, there's no point in playing anymore. [quote name='The Arbiter' date='06 July 2010 - 10:02 PM' timestamp='1278464514' post='2361859'] Lmcfalcon12, you are hereby gagged from this thread. [/quote] I wish you could have been more like that. Because that was funny. Would have made crap a lot easier. [quote name='jooshbox234' date='06 July 2010 - 10:00 PM' timestamp='1278464435' post='2361857'] Are you F***ing retarded? There have been plenty of people defending the Legion before him [/quote] Dude, people from the Legion, defending the Legion...doesn't count. Sorry to say. That should come standard. You SHOULD defend your alliance.

[quote name='The Arbiter' date='06 July 2010 - 09:48 PM' timestamp='1278463669' post='2361844'] I know, you're right. I'm just gonna head back to econ now. [/quote] That's the thing. I like what you've done. You're a quality leader when you're not going crap crazy and beating up on people and making racist cracks. I can't deal with it anymore dude. I have no idea what I did to cross your path in such a way to make things like this, but...that's it. That's all I can say. I like what you've done for your alliance, I just don't like what you are. I'm a real easy guy to get along with, so trust me, if someone dislikes me, its for a damn good reason.

[quote name='Jacapo Saladin' date='06 July 2010 - 09:44 PM' timestamp='1278463456' post='2361840'] LMC, check your IG messages when you get the chance [/quote] Link me in game. We just became best friends.

[quote name='Shoofly' date='06 July 2010 - 09:42 PM' timestamp='1278463354' post='2361834'] Falcon, I actually stood up for you on our own forums just now. Then I come here and read this. Coming to the BB's was really low dude. [/quote] How could you stand up for me on your own forums? And why would you if you knew what was going on? I posted this thread link in 2 areas. Don't defend me. I don't want anyone to defend me because anyone who defends me ends up looking like a moron later. You're a quality member dude, don't waste your time on me.

[quote name='Seth Muscarella' date='06 July 2010 - 09:30 PM' timestamp='1278462620' post='2361817'] Is that really the right term? XD I think the OP stated that he lost respect for legion, hence the posting of this thread. [b]Anyway man, i saw some legion people call you out publicly in the sanction thread, and that was both surprising and not well handled.[/b] It's good that you finally came to this realization of your alliance of 3 years, but as always, coming to the OWF rarely helps the situation get resolved. Also Arbiter, you may be a douche, but you're a funny douche. [/quote] They always do. Its amazing how they treat they people in their "brotherhood". Wish I had realized this three years ago.

[quote name='Letum' date='06 July 2010 - 09:27 PM' timestamp='1278462431' post='2361813'] "them"? I guess it might be nice to view the world through your tinted glasses, where everything is about you and your issues, but I was actually commenting on the wider problem of coddled humans who act as if [b]"freedom of speech" is a magic word[/b] that means they can act without consequence, yet magically spend an inordinate amount of time complaining about what others are saying. I could care less about what specific issue you have with Legion. I am just very, very sad that this type of hypocritical mentality of rejecting all forms of social limits has become so pervasive. Equating the self with righteousness, and thereby creating the link that any conflicting foreign authority is wrong and therefore something to take umbrage at. I see this type of thing online so much, and I always wonder "Is this how these guys are in real life? How the hell do they survive?" [/quote] You can't possibly be from America [and I'm not attacking you], but someone from America would have never said that. See that's the problem with this world...game, country where I'm from. Its a right they give you, but institute it when they deem it appropriate. There's not enough people like me to stand up to the right crushing tyranny of government like Legion etc. [u]EDIT[/u]: Hmmm. I talked myself in a circle at the end, and I see it now. Better late than never I suppose...

[quote name='Kryievla' date='06 July 2010 - 09:25 PM' timestamp='1278462316' post='2361809'] It's a shame that rule doesn't apply to you personally. I don't know what happened w/ you & this guy, but I've seen enough logs of you talking that I would believe just about anything. [b]My opinion is not representative of Valhalla government;[/b] many of your members are decent, & we like them, but I personally find your 'freedom of speech' abhorrent, and am appalled that you have the nerve to chastise ANYONE. [/quote] Sad that you have to post that. I guess that's where I went wrong. Guess I should have said that or, "if I have my opinion, The Arbiter would be upset with me and whine and cry that I said something he didn't like." Because the funny part was no one else cared that I was posting in that thread. Only him. Funny how that works. Just showing that since I came back he's the only one who still holds a grudge towards me.