Max Rockatansky
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Posts posted by Max Rockatansky
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Oh let's see for the negotiations/startup: Twisted Sister: Like A Knife In The Back
Karma Wages War: Manowar: Warriors Of The World United
Q/1V pretty much kicks out NPO:
or The Vandals: Let The Bad Times RollRomantic Dedications to NPO and Co.:
With such time tested ballads as:
And this classic:
As well as another personal favorite of mine:
And a very special dedication to Slayer from TPF:
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A very entertaining read. Although i didn't get what you were trying to say above that:
- There is a distinct political class in CN, and those within it tend to be more prone to conflict, and;
- Things go in cycles. Which i don't quite agree with in this instance unless your going all the way back to GW1.
But a good lunctime read nonetheless.
First point, Yep that's pretty much it. See disclaimer.
Second point, They do, and yes we must take the entirety of our history into account when trying to examine things from a logical perspective. I could be wrong though, hence the thread.
I'm glad you guys are picking up on the entertainment factor. I felt it was pretty obvious, but some things don't translate well from brain case to the public square. I'll take that as a compliment.
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No...with PZI you reroll and your good. With EZI you reroll, get caught, and ZI'd again.
I felt no difference between the two.
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[OOC] Disclaimer: The following is my interpretation of the geopolitical climate on Bob. I post this in the public forum to encourage thought and debate on the similarities and patterns in Bobian(Bobsian, Bobbite?) culture, as it is one of the most unique I've ever come across in my journeys. Think of me as sort of the Marlin Perkins(link) to CN's Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom(read the link, man. I'm not explaining who that guy is for three pages). I realize this doesn't apply to every single person but it's as close to an accurate generalization as I could make it. So please, sit back, relax, and enjoy...or don't. I'm not losing any sleep over it. Unless I am.[/OOC]
We're a couple days into what has become what I propose we call "WTF War 2009". 1 I've been back just over a month now, and it's pretty much what I've been saying to myself this whole time. How such a simple phrase can have so many different connotations is beyond me. A testament of the times and circumstances itself. Yet, it's not really that surprising. We live in a cyclical world, where we are used to things happening a certain way in a certain order. This is how the world works. This is because of who we are and where we live.
There are essentially three major identifiable classes here on Bob. The Politicians, The Working Class, and The Proletariat.. wait... wrong book.
There are essentially three major identifiable classes here on Bob. You see, you have the more active players on the political stage, your intermediates, and "The Non-involved" also known as "The Someone Else's Problem" Corps.2 Each one fulfills a vital part of this socioeconomic madhouse we call our collective home. As with any large, tribal, warlike, monstrosity we have developed certain patterns. This applies to everyone of us, in some fashion. We are creatures of habit.
The more active participants on the geopolitical scene tend to be blood thirsty. This cannot be avoided because it is just the sort of commitment Bobians (Bobsians? Bobbites?) demand in their politicians. The more active participants of the general population also tend to be warlike, fanatical, and loyal to the point of psychotic obsession. This brings us to the working stiffs of CN, who ,while blood thirsty fanatics in their own right, discovered that wars are fought with purse strings as well as pikes. Then there are the aforementioned S.E.P. Corps, who make up the rest of the population. Who just want to stay out of everyone's business and live in peace without the politician's kids drinking cheap whiskey, huffing gasoline, doing donuts in their yard and smashing their mailboxes. Each component is a link in a chain, which is wrapped tightly around the swinging fist that is our world. The entire thing makes a complete swing into a massive brick wall once every year or so. It is said there is cake on the other side, though some have stated that it is a lie.
Roughly around this time of year, give or take about 90 days or so we enter what I like to call "War Season". This is when all the rulers who were otherwise occupied with fiscal growth and other responsibilities(RL obligations) look out over all the beautiful land we've accumulated, all the infrastructure we've built, and technology we've developed, and suddenly develop an almost single-minded urge to destroy as much of it as they possibly can because of differing social mores. Until.. Sadly, there can be only one outcome.
On Bob we have three major components of warfare. Traditional, Non-traditional, and Psychological. Traditional warfare is exactly that. Straight up, no bones about it, fighting. Non-traditional warfare refers to clandestine intelligence gathering.3 Psychological Warfare occurs within the public arenas(Open World RP) where alliances tend to gather for day to day business. This tends to involve everything from airing allegations and adding evidence(or snippets of) evidence to the public record to accusing the opposing side's mother of being a woman of negotiable affection. This often occurs within the the same statement if not the first three sentences of the speech. Responses are dictated in a similar fashion.
It is worth noting that here on Bob, politician and proletariat alike both seem to enjoy the act of trading insults, and threats, allegations, and generic, meaningless, one liners based on current trends during their political and daily discourse. This seems to be a time honored practice, followed by the opposing side !@#$%*ing about it for what seems like years in some cases regardless of the intelligence and comprehension skills of the participants involved. This causes some to drink heavily while it drives others scream incoherent ramblings and obscenities at one another while the guy who read a book or two either exacerbates the entire thing or tries to get everyone else to calm down and go out for a smoke.
Eventually, flowers bloom and lines are drawn in the dirt4 signaling that the War Season has begun. There is generally a ritual where one side decides to be a monumental jerk for some reason or another then the other side decides to be a jerk back and this generally goes on for roughly two to three months5, then it's over. Everyone goes back home or to new homes, pays the other side extortion money, or enters into a form of indentured servitude, or in some unnecessary cases, exile and endless war 6 then the circle of life is ready to begin anew.
1 I give credit to Lord of Destruction for the catchy title, unless someone else came up with it first and he stole it. Then I give credit to that guy, unless it wasn't him either.
2 A nod to all the Douglas Adams fans out there.
3 Planting spies in alliances. This type of thing tends to be frowned upon by the community at large. Though some choose to ignore that and do it anyway.
4 What the obsession is with the drawing lines, is beyond the author's grasp. We just seem to like the hell out of drawing them.
5 Unless you really want to be a dick, then you can make it last years.
6 Eternal Zero Infrastructure (EZI) or as some call it Permanent Zero Infrastructure (PZI), which is just semantic B.S. really because it's the exact same practice with synonymous names. It doesn't get much more permanent than eternity guys. This shouldn't be that hard to figure out. It doesn't matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd.
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Snip
Then you should have joined a neutral alliance if you didn't want war and politics. You were enticed by the prospect of hiding behind NPO's skirt with the rest of GGA and believed them when they told you nobody would ever think of attacking you. You made a mistake, time to learn from it. (Hey Kronos, see what i did there?)
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What part of "What goes around comes around" are these people failing to understand? I offer my mediocre explanation skills, but not tonight. I'm too tired.
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On the Nature of Absolute Morality Snip
Morality, that's an interesting notion. I've seen plenty on your side accuse people of being morally bankrupt scum(myself included), so allow me to retort.
I agree that notions of "morality" are absurd. I've witnessed what you lot champion as your own specific kind of "imperialist morality" and I say that we do away with the notion of morality all together for it is subject to a much broader interpretation that nobody can agree on. Nor will they ever. It's just not possible. However, I present to you this counter point. I've rejected the notion of morality for ethics.
See, I know I'm just a man. I know I make mistakes, for I am in imperfect being in an imperfect world. I've accepted that. I've learned a lot from NPO and what they consider moral and I'm truly sorry that we've never been able to see eye to eye on that. See morality is based on emotion. Emotion is the enemy of logic. Without logic, we cannot question that which is truly illogical and blatantly unnecessary.
I think that's what upsets you the most is not that we've really stated any truly moral reasons but what we feel are ethical ones based on our own logic. We, unlike you, don't stick to any specific party line as our interests in this conflict are varied from nation to nation, and alliance to alliance. We've got things we agree on and things we don't. We are united in that difference. For that is the only logical conclusion for us.
You see, when you tell people that this is the way things are going to be because you say so, people are going to complain about it. Why shouldn't they? If their alliances are truly sovereign then they have every right to present a counter point. When that counterpoint is met with " What are you going to do about it? Might makes right." for an extended period of time then the only ethical conclusion is that your motivations are not altruistic or malevolent in nature. This is because you have your own moral code that you are standing by no matter the cost. It's what any good zealot would do.
I seem to recall a signature one of you guys has..." If you want war so much why do you cry when we bring it to you?" or some such piece of braggadocio nonsense. I ask you the same thing. For years you asked us to bring it straight to you when we have a problem. We've granted your request. What more do you want?
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I say let FAN decide that if/when NPO surrenders to them. I personally, abhor the practice. It's too... Pacifican for my taste.
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Maybe you haven't done all of that.....yet But with the showing in those logs I think we know what to expect in the future now.
Yep, you now everything. Everyone else sucks but you. We get it. It's old. It's been old. It's so tired it dropped dead from exhaustion. You really don't have a point to make here do you? Anyway it's time to go prey at the altar of The Metal Gods( or you know, go to sleep). You got anything else to say other than what you're parroting from these other blokes you love so much, let me know. Otherwise, I'm not interested in repeating myself over several threads any longer. I want you to do me a favor though. Have yourself a great day, can you do that for me? Thanks. B)
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So the fact that Archon and his buddies are two faced jackals that spout !@#$%^&* from every oriface to make you think they are the harbingers of good while engaging in practices they themselves condemned is lost because of what I've done or not done in the past?
You sir are deluded.
Let me get this straight. I'm deluded because I choose to support people who demand an end to that which you champion. I've known a good chunk of the people I'm fighting with my entire CN career(Beginning in UJW... that's 2 years ago) They've stuck by me through the best and the worst, and through it all they've been there for me. If that makes me deluded then, welcome to the madhouse... I guess.
We have neither nor will we ever engage in:
EZI/PZI
Viceroys
forcing alliances to disband
unnecessarily long conflicts which serve absolutely no purpose other than mindless flexing
and the list goes on...
I think you need to get your facts straight before you start talking so much smack, because this isn't making you look very smart.
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You have no clue about me and NPO. Go back and read the GATO declaration thread or go ask Slayer how often we talked about things I thought NPO was wrong about.
You wanna bring up the past you better know what you're talking about first.
Look who's talking there, Skippy. I also know that GATO was the victim of much worse than your precious NPO is receiving. Especially since I've had and continue to have friends amongst their ranks. Like Vercingetorix who was MoFA of Atlantis when I was his right hand. Of course we could go into ColPanic and his screenshots that he provided before he became a member of NPO( and currently still is). That would be contrary to your opinions though and I don't feel like screaming loud enough to overcome the fingers in your ears and the incessant "La, La, La's" You've produced in multiple threads anytime NPO's wrongs have been brought up. Oh, and I don't have to ask Slayer anything. Your opinions here and now will suffice.
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What the hell difference does it make where I was?
You are the one ignoring the issue at hand. Leave. No one wants you here anyway. Bring me someone that can actually debate.
It makes all the difference "Mr. Righteous Indignation". If you're not willing to stand for the rights of others, don't expect anyone to care when you go to bat for your lying, spying, buddies who beat their chests and tried to bully alliances like OV right up until the first ground attack. Then all of a sudden you want us to feel sorry for them. I have no pity for them, I have no reason to.
I've been debating...not sure what you're doing other than beating your chest and trying to look tough. If that's what you got to do, go for it. Doesn't bother me any. Have fun with it.
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Oh so it was all a big joke huh?
Real !@#$@#$ classy.
Classier than most, I'd say. At least we're not going to do anything like.. I don't know...keep them locked up in conflict for a year or better, or sentence the whole lot to EZI, or demand admin rights to their forums, or enforce a Viceroy,or anything honorable and noble like that.(This is my sarcasm face) It's obvious where you stand, and that's fine. I respect that, even though i find it illogical. It's pretty obvious magicninja that you're only seeing what you want to see, despite what anyone else says. If that's the case then it is you, sir who are the most like the NPO you so covet.
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NPO was soundly defeated in those logs. They were excepting every term thrown at them. They would've had very few allies left considering all the dropping of treties that happened.
Nope this was a chance for Archon and his ilk to show they truly did want a better CN. Instead they failed badly and have shown the world their true colors. This isn't about change it's about getting back at the NPO for whatever wrongs they feel they have taken. This is a revenge plot and nothing more.
Those you fight far have proved no better than the NPO and actually quite a bit less. At least we all knew what NPO was about. These people show you one face in public and show that ugly display in private.
They are hypocrites and liars themselves and since I genuinely believed they were better than that it's an awful sight to see. They've come down off their high horse and joined everyone else.
I'm sorry that's the way you feel, but you're not addressing the other side of the coin at all which leads me to believe that you really don't care what I have to say. That's fine. You talk about revenge, for some it is. Understand though, that for "revenge" to occur a wrong must be commited upon those who seek vengeance in the first place. It's not why all of us fight. I've already said that.
Since you keep repeating yourself without addressing any points I've tried to make, I'll leave you to your trolling as is your right. Oh, one more thing though before I leave you to scream at the door on my way out. You never answered the big question... Where were you when so much worse was being shoved down the throats of others, guided by the hands of your obviously beloved NPO?
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Since Alzheimer's has become rampant here on Bob, let me remind you of what happened the last time NPO entered into peace talks. It wasn't that long ago folks. I honestly don't see why this was even considered at this stage of the game given their track record, especially over the last couple of days. All agreements are built on mutual trust. It's obvious we haven't reached that point yet. I'm sure we will at some point, but it is way too early for that. A quick question to those playing "Devil's Advocate" though...
Where were you guys when this was happening to so many of us? Where was that righteous indignation at such wrong doings then? If you want to talk about fair play and all that, then it has to apply across the board. Otherwise, this is nothing more than another party line that has no intellectual merit.
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Go Greenland Machine!
(Ninja Turtles Reference for the uninitiated)
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Oh you're keeping the war effort just because? If this is true then you were the ones negotiating in bad faith not them.
Sham.
If you say so, though you would be wrong. In any event, my opinions are of my own reasons why I fight. If that wasn't clear enough then I apologize for the mix up. I can't speak for anyone else, as I am not them and to assume that I do so is to give me too much credit. I appreciate the thought that you would think me so influential, but sadly, this is not the case from where I stand.
I guess all the spying, lying, and bullying that NPO has engaged in means absolutely nothing and we should all just sit down, shut up and do as we're told right? It seems to me that this is the position you uphold. I wouldn't know, I'm not you. If this is honestly the way you feel though, we shall never find a common ground.
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I didn't think your quote was quite right, so I looked it up. It appears I was correct:
"He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he
thereby become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss,
the abyss will also gaze into thee."
-Nietzsche
Menwearpink, I like your signature.
I think that, no matter who beats the living crap out of who, someone is going to take NPO's place as Dictorial Alliance Supreme. It's both the Way of the World, and Human Nature, if there's a difference between the two. My point is, you can beat down NPO. Hell, take on IRON, TPF, GGA, and everyone else who ran from NPO at the first mention of war. Though whether or not they've truly run has yet to be determined. Regardless of that, you must realize that if you beat down everyone who could reign supreme, you yourselves will probably become the menace that you worked so hard to destroy.
please note: the "you" in the above statement is a general one, and not one aimed at any specific alliance.
Rest assured, that everything possible will be done to make sure this doesn't happen. We're not perfect, we don't claim to be. To deny this is to be NPO. We have and will admit our mistakes. NPO has not. See? We're different already.
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If the situation were reversed would you people begging for mercy for us? I'm betting many of you wouldn't. No, we won't EZI them or do any of the dastardly things they've done. But they're not getting a mere slap on the wrist this time. Sorry, but it just doesn't work that way. They were the ones who brought this mess on, why should we show mercy when we've only just begun? What would that solve? Would it make NPO any less of a threat to us or even those they consider allies? No. NPO wants what's best for NPO and only NPO. They've made that abundantly clear. If the recent ship jumping by their allies is in fact, the genuine article; then I suggest you look to that as a sign of the times and how heinous these actions are.
We don't expect everyone to agree with us, nor would we want you too. Just understand that this has been a long time coming and it's happening whether you like it or not. We respect anyone who wishes to stick by their Pacifican friends, side with us( reasonably), or even just stay out of it. It's how I'd want to be treated so that's how I'll try to treat everyone else except for those who have shown me a massive amount of disrespect... for they deserve only my contempt and not my sympathy. Until we feel that our point is adequately made, there will be no pity. There will be no mercy. There will be no remorse. For our enemy has stated several times, they have none. To do otherwise would be folly on our part as has been proven with NPO many times before.
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The punishment should fit the crime. Seeing as how we don't support EZI, then that will not ever be the case here. Although given the nature of their crimes against many of those who stand with us, it would certainly be fair according to their rules. Problem is, we're not fighting their war their way. We're fighting our war, our way.
Terms should be harsh, as this is indeed an object lesson in what happens when you treat people like dogs. We're all in this for our own reasons as well as those of our alliance. I ask you though, OP... where were these pleas for mercy when NPO was the one bringing the hammer down for far, far, less? No... we'll not stoop to their level. But these demands for mercy are absurd to say the least. Walk a mile in our shoes, then you'll see why many of us are so angry.
P.S. I'm sure you meant no disrespect by your post and I've tried my best to take care that I've shown you none in return. So really, in the end, I guess you could say that that's why we fight. I know that's why I and many of my friends do. I never heard anyone say anything about us being the number one big dog once this is over, all I've ever heard from my allies is what I post here. Everything else is personal opinion, and should be treated as such. Include myself among that number.
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*Applauds*
I love good theater. Especially if this is indeed fiction. These days it's so hard to tell. Please forgive me if I'm not taking anybody's word at face value on this.
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Imperial Decree
The New Polar Order prides itself on its treaties and values all of her allies. In recent times we have learned the real value of friendships and we have a select few treaties for a reason. We have many friends however that we do not hold treaties with, people who we have worked to establish a relationship, people who we have demonstrated our commitment to repair the damages of the past and who, given other circumstances we would hold treaties with.
Be extremely clear in all matters, the New Polar Order supports her allies and we will defend them as per the treaties we hold.
Of course there are situations that arise that conflict strongly with the outlook of Polaris and our commitment to fair play, justice and plain common courtesy. Some time ago we were removed from a treaty bloc for poor communications and for various other reasons which don't belong in this thread, we were punished and so we were forced to review our standings. We have re-modeled our alliance, at great cost, and I believe that most of CN views us positively.
Today, I have received information from a number of people re the conduct of the New Pacific Order in this current conflict with Ordo Verde. I can overlook many things and still support someone, but pending further investigations of the facts to hand, the New Polar Order hereby suspends all treaties and obligations to the New Pacific Order.
I swore to defend under the terms of my treaty, our obligations in the strictest terms finished when the NPO attacked. I still vowed we would attack anyone blind-siding them, band wagoning or otherwise. As our treaty is now suspended, we reserve the right to investigate further the actions as pertain to this matter and during this time we reserve the right to avoid any obligations previously promised if we so choose.
For those clamoring to the top of the hill, the New Polar Order does not support you either. This is not our war, not our agenda and of very little interest to us, except where it directly impacts our allies. Do not seek our approval or support, you will not get it. The Orders will never fight each other directly whilst I am Emperor.
This is a difficult time for all parties concerned and I look forward to the re-establishment of ties with our brothers in due course.
o/ Polaris
It's kind of like... NPO is the jock brother with the mullet and the Camaro and NpO is the cool brother that knows where to get beer and other party favors. Much respect should be given to Polaris for this course of action.
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Oh NPO, I'm sure we here can agree that we're flattered that you care for our success so much that you hope that we don't become you. Don't worry your pretty little heads about it though, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. Thanks though. It means a lot. Especially coming from an alliance who's leader recently admitted to doing the things they've punished so many for and then some. I really do love this "NPO demanding mercy" kick you guys are on though. Since mercy and temperance, are what you guys are known for.
In any event, we've only just begun this little shin dig and I'm sure it'll be a learning experience for both of us. Here's to enlightenment and the joys it brings.
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Honor doesn't quite fit what these guys just said. o7
Complete Geopolitical Collapse And You!
in Open World RP
Posted
So you're him... The Avenger... The Killer of Killers. Nice avatar...not too sure about the sig though. I like your style, dude. ( paraphrased classical references). In short, thanks Capt. Murphy.