Buying wonders

[Yuri Armstrong]

At what point should a nation begin buying wonders? Should the manhattan project be the first wonder that you buy?

[knighta]

I would say around the 2999.99 infrastructure point. First two wonders should be stock market and social security system.

Edited February 19, 2011 by knighta

[Ironfist]

You can start generating a reasonable rate of return at 3999.99 infra, though some opt to buy their first at 2999.99 because they want to get their wonder clocks ticking.

Personally I'd prefer the 3999.99 set-up because it's wasting money until you've got the infra to generate a profit from.

[Iceknave]

It would also depend on whether you're using donation deals to fuel your nation's growth and whether or not your alliance is willing to help cover the costs of wonders.

If either of those are present, it can allow you to start picking up wonders earlier.

Another advantage to getting wonder early is that they're basically indestructible and as long as you're not forced into a position where it's impossible for you to recover from due to bill lock, it's a very nice way to ensure you have something to show for after a destructive war.

[Captain Nathan Brittles]

[quote name='Ironfist' timestamp='1298260259' post='2640167']
You can start generating a reasonable rate of return at 3999.99 infra, though some opt to buy their first at 2999.99 because they want to get their wonder clocks ticking.

Personally I'd prefer the 3999.99 set-up because it's wasting money until you've got the infra to generate a profit from.
[/quote]

Actually it's less an issue of infrastructure than it is of citizen count. A 3BR or FJ/AP with all the population modifiers isn't going to need the same infrastructure level that a 8BR with no population modifiers is going to need. They can probably get away with starting at the 3k jump, the 8BR, probably not so much.

[Ironfist]

[quote name='Captain Nathan Brittles' timestamp='1298274759' post='2640430']
Actually it's less an issue of infrastructure than it is of citizen count. A 3BR or FJ/AP with all the population modifiers isn't going to need the same infrastructure level that a 8BR with no population modifiers is going to need. They can probably get away with starting at the 3k jump, the 8BR, probably not so much.
[/quote]
Naturally, a good trade set increases the potential to raise a revenue but, at least in my opinion, "getting away with it" is not really the idea when buying wonders. It's about having most, if not all the econ improvements. That way the wonder is building upon a good foundation and generating a profit that it is meant to make.

So normally I would advise nations buy their first wonder at 3999.99, unless of course they buy it at 2999.99 before an impending infra jump.

[Captain Nathan Brittles]

[quote name='Ironfist' timestamp='1298277778' post='2640480']
Naturally, a good trade set increases the potential to raise a revenue but, at least in my opinion, "getting away with it" is not really the idea when buying wonders. It's about having most, if not all the econ improvements. That way the wonder is building upon a good foundation and generating a profit that it is meant to make.

So normally I would advise nations buy their first wonder at 3999.99, unless of course they buy it at 2999.99 before an impending infra jump.
[/quote]

You're missing my point. While infrastructure is tied to citizen count, it's not the only factor and it's citizen count that matters most. The 3BR or AP/FJ with all the population modifiers are going to have nearly all the economic improvements since they will have nearly the same citizen count at the 3k jump that a 8BR with no population modifiers will have at the 4k jump when you say all nations should be buying their first wonder. So if they have the same population (hence the same potential improvements) as the 8BR does at the 4k jump at the 3k jump what is the problem with them buying a wonder at the 3k jump?

[Ironfist]

[quote name='Captain Nathan Brittles' timestamp='1298320696' post='2640894']
You're missing my point. While infrastructure is tied to citizen count, it's not the only factor and it's citizen count that matters most. The 3BR or AP/FJ with all the population modifiers are going to have nearly all the economic improvements since they will have nearly the same citizen count at the 3k jump that a 8BR with no population modifiers will have at the 4k jump when you say all nations should be buying their first wonder. So if they have the same population (hence the same potential improvements) as the 8BR does at the 4k jump at the 3k jump what is the problem with them buying a wonder at the 3k jump?
[/quote]
Well yes, that's why I agreed with you. Citizen count is directly related to improvement slots. I'm saying I'd normally advise people to wait because not everyone has the optimal count. It's not a ring that everyone has access to. But yes, one ring could enable a quicker wonder purchase. I agree.

I didn't so much say that "all nations should buy at 4k", as much as I would advise them to because that's usually the mark the econ improvements are maxed out due to improvement slots. I probably worded myself badly as usual, but I'm not disagreeing with you.

Edited February 22, 2011 by Ironfist

[nippy]

Back to the original question....no, do NOT buy an MP as your first wonder. Not even war-hungry GOONS nations buy MPs first. Go with the SM and SSS as your first two, as mentioned earlier.