A Close to the MK-TFD Affair

[C Mos]

[quote name='Fernando12' timestamp='1289689606' post='2512272']
They should get bad PR anyway. They are ZI-ing a Rob for a joke thread. Getting butt hurt is now cause for ZI.
[/quote]
You really can't be serious.

[Seerow]

[quote name='C Mos' timestamp='1289707882' post='2512510']
You really can't be serious.
[/quote]

It's Fernando, of course he's serious. The upside is nobody takes him seriously.


But he is tempting me to go post a fake DoW, on behalf of MK and GOONS, then go mass PM MK and GOONS telling them to attack, and see what happens. I'm betting there would be a fair bit of outrage and a lot of him running his mouth about what a terrible person I am for the next week or so. It seems like a potentially entertaining passtime.

[Lusitan]

[quote name='KingEd' timestamp='1289693020' post='2512342']
Not to mention that people aren't holding TFD accountable for not teaching their members that there's a chain of command and that an average member can't give orders to declare war on another nation. Moreover, said nation didn't even check TFD or OWF forums to validate said orders.

Strive to be better!

And alas, Well done MK.
[/quote]

Well, actually, out of 160 nations having such a small number of peope - 1 or 2 members - to follow an idiot's mess up is not really a bad mark. The day you reach out 100% effectiveness I'll salute you. I am not exactly sure who he sent the messages to, but I know he sent me one too, so I'll guess all alliance.

I'd like to thank MK for acting with class this whole process.

[C Mos]

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289708080' post='2512513']
It's Fernando, of course he's serious. The upside is nobody takes him seriously.


But he is tempting me to go post a fake DoW, on behalf of MK and GOONS, then go mass PM MK and GOONS telling them to attack, and see what happens. I'm betting there would be a fair bit of outrage and a lot of him running his mouth about what a terrible person I am for the next week or so. It seems like a potentially entertaining passtime.
[/quote]
Never noticed him before today and I'm starting to notice that.. I've never thought I could be shaking my head a lot.

Do it.

[Roi Loup]

$9m?! lots of damages or someones getting greedy

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289707809' post='2512508']
I'm sorry, I'm confused. How is acknowledging our [i]blatant extortion[/i] hurting our image? It's right there for everyone to see, Archon said it himself in the OP. We're just acknowledging that it happened. MK is a bunch of extortionists, it's what we do.

Next week we're planning to hold Halfinger up for ransom. We figure we can get at least 500 tech out of that one.
[/quote]
It's been sort of fun to watch Seerow try to resurrect his old MilCom glorydays over the past week. "Look, this is me being evil. Look, look. j/k. But, really . . . "

[Tygaland]

[quote name='Crowdog' timestamp='1289707430' post='2512501']
I understand you think we hurt our image with the beginning posts. In my last response you'll see that I asserted it as a necessary evil. For that reason, I apologize for your disturbance with our actions, but I don't apologize for behaving that way. We are free to act as we see fit as you say. But I do hope you are not so bold as to believe producing slanderous claims are the same as acting for the sake of independence.
[/quote]

I didn't say it hurt your image either, just that the announcement would have been better without it. What was posted at the beginning of this discussion was neither evil nor necessary, just needless stupidity.

[Seerow]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1289708938' post='2512520']
It's been sort of fun to watch Seerow try to resurrect his old MilCom glorydays over the past week. "Look, this is me being evil. Look, look. j/k. But, really . . . "
[/quote]

Nah back then I actually was evil. Now I'm just a bully and extortionist. There's a big difference. Really

But I guess going from being inactive for a long time to suddenly posting again is automatically trying to resurrect the 'glory days'. Nevermind the fact that I would never consider any time on the forums as glory days (all the fun of NPO milcom was 100% on IRC, OWF was a cesspool I usually avoided even back then)

[Prodigal Moon]

[quote name='Tygaland' timestamp='1289708964' post='2512521']
I didn't say it hurt your image either, just that the announcement would have been better without it. What was posted at the beginning of this discussion was neither evil nor necessary, just needless stupidity.
[/quote]
It's the new thing to do. Pretty much every PB alliance announcement is followed by at least 3 or 4 posts calling themselves evil or otherwise trying to pre-empt the handful of commenters who can't help making ridiculous accusations. Maybe it's just an attempt at being funny and in on a kewl trend. Unfortunately it look really defensive and desperate to avoid dealing with real arguments by throwing up straw men in advance.

[Tygaland]

[quote name='Prodigal Moon' timestamp='1289709420' post='2512528']
Maybe it's just an attempt at being funny and in on a kewl trend. Unfortunately it look really defensive and desperate to avoid dealing with real arguments by throwing up straw men in advance.
[/quote]

Yeah, that is how it came across to me.

[Epiphanus]

[quote name='Roi Loup' timestamp='1289708831' post='2512519']
$9m?! lots of damages or someones getting greedy
[/quote]
You are a little late to the party. Could have at least been fashionable.

[Drai]

[quote name='Epiphanus' timestamp='1289709684' post='2512533']
You are a little late to the party. Could have at least been fashionable.
[/quote]
Haha, the fact that he thinks $9 mil is a lot of damage is the best part. His delayed response is pretty humorous in itself though.

[SirWilliam]

[quote name='Drai' timestamp='1289709791' post='2512534']
Haha, the fact that he thinks $9 mil is a lot of damage is the best part.[/quote]

I was thinking the same thing. Unless the nation was tiny (which, iirc, it's not), $9 million covers only part of the damages sustained.

[JT Jag]

[quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1289710036' post='2512535']
I was thinking the same thing. Unless the nation was tiny (which, iirc, it's not), $9 million covers only part of the damages sustained.
[/quote]The nation in question was in the mid-range 4k infra area if I recall.

[Ardus]

[quote name='Prodigal Moon' timestamp='1289709420' post='2512528']
Maybe it's just an attempt at being funny and in on a kewl trend. Unfortunately it look really defensive and desperate to avoid dealing with real arguments by throwing up straw men in advance.
[/quote]
Doesn't really look defensive to me. Looks like a sarcastic and unfortunately accurate impression of the "moralists" (not to be confused with actual Moralists) who come out in every MK thread to declare whatever it is we're doing a despicable evil.

The positions and arguments expected to be (and which have been) generated by this thread against MK and TFD are utterly without merit. Mocking them ahead of time isn't a "straw man", as you put it. It's giving them the treatment they deserve: a healthy dose of public ridicule.

[Sal Paradise]

[quote name='Prodigal Moon' timestamp='1289709420' post='2512528']
[b]It's the new thing to do[/b]. Pretty much every PB alliance announcement is followed by at least 3 or 4 posts calling themselves evil or otherwise trying to pre-empt the handful of commenters who can't help making ridiculous accusations. Maybe it's just an attempt at being funny and in on a kewl trend. Unfortunately it look really defensive and desperate to avoid dealing with real arguments by throwing up straw men in advance.
[/quote]

There's nothing new about it. What's new is who's doing it. Like Tyga said, it's sad and desperate, and while members of MK will go off on how little they care about public opinion, their reaction to this announcement just proves how insecure and sensitive they are.

[Tygaland]

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1289710456' post='2512540']
Doesn't really look defensive to me. Looks like a sarcastic and unfortunately accurate impression of the "moralists" (not to be confused with actual Moralists) who come out in every MK thread to declare whatever it is we're doing a despicable evil.

The positions and arguments expected to be (and which have been) generated by this thread against MK and TFD are utterly without merit. Mocking them ahead of time isn't a "straw man", as you put it. It's giving them the treatment they deserve: a healthy dose of public ridicule.
[/quote]

I can't see more than a couple people doing what you claim. Or is everyone who disagreed with your actions at some point now filed away as a "moralist" who requires pre-emptive derision?

I don't think many people have much of an issue with this announcement as opposed to the other recent incident. So, it did come across as desperate when you carpet-bombed the discussion with the stupid comments you did.

[Ardus]

[quote name='Tygaland' timestamp='1289710874' post='2512543']
I can't see more than a couple people doing what you claim. Or is everyone who disagreed with your actions at some point now filed away as a "moralist" who requires pre-emptive derision?

I don't think many people have much of an issue with this announcement as opposed to the other recent incident. So, it did come across as desperate when you carpet-bombed the discussion with the stupid comments you did.
[/quote]
Except nearly every MK thread is "carpet-bombed", as you put it, with supportive statements by members and friends. None of this is new or different. It's the same old, same old--various posts of varying seriousness to open a thread. You're reading too much into it.

[Tygaland]

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1289711130' post='2512544']
Except nearly every MK thread is "carpet-bombed", as you put it, with supportive statements by members and friends. None of this is new or different. It's the same old, same old--various posts of varying seriousness to open a thread. You're reading too much into it.
[/quote]

The posts were not supportive of you, per se. They were complete nonsense about extortion, accusations of which no one had levelled at you over this announcement and no one but people with an extreme axe to grind would. I can only see two or three people who fall into that category here so I'm not sure it warranted the pre-emptive strike you deployed.

Because a larger number of people took issue with your recent issue with NSO you all decided to try and make light of that by posting nonsense in this discussion. While it may have been done in jest and for your own entertainment it reeked of desperation and cast a negative shadow over what was a routine announcement about an issue handled as it should be. Which was my only point to make on this topic.

[Seerow]

[quote name='Tygaland' timestamp='1289711625' post='2512549']
The posts were not supportive of you, per se. They were complete nonsense about extortion, accusations of which no one had levelled at you over this announcement and no one but people with an extreme axe to grind would. I can only see two or three people who fall into that category here so I'm not sure it warranted the pre-emptive strike you deployed.

Because a larger number of people took issue with your recent issue with NSO you all decided to try and make light of that by posting nonsense in this discussion. While it may have been done in jest and for your own entertainment it reeked of desperation and cast a negative shadow over what was a routine announcement about an issue handled as it should be. Which was my only point to make on this topic.
[/quote]


There was already a topic [url=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=94630&view=getnewpost]here[/url] that was indicating any demands made by MK would be considered extortion by some.

Us, already being aware of that fact, cannot and should not be faulted for taking the opportunity to laugh at the absurdity of it, even before the accusations (that we knew were coming because they had already been made elsewhere) were posted in this topic.





Er I mean we're terrible extortionists, why are you still harping on about this? We freely admit it, why are you turning it into such a big deal?

[Tygaland]

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289711942' post='2512553']
There was already a topic [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=94630&view=getnewpost"]here[/url] that was indicating any demands made by MK would be considered extortion by some.

Us, already being aware of that fact, cannot and should not be faulted for taking the opportunity to laugh at the absurdity of it, even before the accusations (that we knew were coming because they had already been made elsewhere) were posted in this topic.
[/quote]

You are really going to trot out TheAUT as representative of popular opinion? I'm sure he is delighted he prompted you to go on a pre-emptive carpet-bombing to cut him off at the pass. Good lord...

[quote]
Er I mean we're terrible extortionists, why are you still harping on about this? We freely admit it, why are you turning it into such a big deal?
[/quote]

You are trying way too hard.

[img]http://splog.nationallampoon.com/files/2009/05/white-guy.jpg[/img]

[kevin32891]

Glad I'm not Holmes.

[Chief Savage Man]

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289707809' post='2512508']
Next week we're planning to hold Halfinger up for ransom. We figure we can get at least 500 tech out of that one.
[/quote]

I'll give you 1000 tech to not accept ransom.

[ChairmanHal]

Here we are again...I suppose this should be getting old, but...

I would like to submit that MK's idea of damage control actually does more damage than if they just let it go. But please, continue to talk about how butthurt your detractors are.

[lebubu]

We don't have to talk about it, they're showing it.