GOON spy orders

[Beefspari]

[quote name='ChairmanHal' timestamp='1285252206' post='2462165']
Indeed, I think it's not too much of a stretch to say that GOONS appears to be the one that wears these:

the pants, in the relationship.
[/quote]
I'm confused. How can we wear the pants if MK is pulling the strings? Which one trumps the other?

Edited September 23, 2010 by Beefspari

[potato]

[quote name='ChairmanHal' timestamp='1285252206' post='2462165']
Yes and no.

Yes, people should be smart enough to realize that GOONS only has to make one IRC query before their friends jump to and start making moves. Sometimes they just simply volunteer. Spying. Bashing their critics in the forums. Whatever is required.

Indeed, I think it's not too much of a stretch to say that GOONS appears to be the one that wears these:

[img]http://www.performancetrendz.com/Images/Categories/mans-cotton-sateen-pants-jn05mp003f.jpg[/img]

the pants, in the relationship.

No, in that GOONS gives people on Planet Bob another reason to hate them every single day and they simply don't care. It makes it easier to root for the underdog, the underdog being whoever is opposing GOONS, even when that underdog has done something rather rash.
[/quote]

So, what you're basically objecting to is GOONS and friends being good allies for each other? Man, we [b]ARE[/b] evil!

[potato]

[quote name='DeadAnimal' timestamp='1285252666' post='2462172']
I think peoples' argument over morality skirts the issue of the 'cult of sucess.' Namely, the spy operations the GOONS conduceted were justified ex post facto because they were correct. If they had accused someone who didn't do it, and conducted spy operations there would be the usual crowd bleating about how it was a violation of soverigenty and GOONS should be paying reps.

Edit: Commas are evil.
[/quote]

For some odd reason (luck? logic?), GOONS are 3 out of 3. They don't spy people on a hunch. On each occasion, GOONS had circumstantial proof. Even STA, who isn't GOONS' best friend, agreed to it. Whether some people are too thick to realise GOONS actually have a bunch of proof isn't really of my business. I quite enjoy seeing morons getting caught red handed before getting crushed. And I quite enjoy other morons coming in here shouting "foul!" when everything is right in front of their eyes and all this have to do is 1+1=2 to realise that *gasp* GOONS might actually be in the right here. Whether it pleases them or not.

[potato]

[quote name='Beefspari' timestamp='1285253013' post='2462175']
I'm confused. How can we wear the pants if MK is pulling the strings? Which one trumps the other?
[/quote]

I don't know: I'd ask Archon if I were you.

[Heinlander]

[quote name='potato' timestamp='1285253490' post='2462179']
For some odd reason (luck? logic?), GOONS are 3 out of 3. They don't spy people on a hunch. On each occasion, GOONS had circumstantial proof. Even STA, who isn't GOONS' best friend, agreed to it. Whether some people are too thick to realise GOONS actually have a bunch of proof isn't really of my business. I quite enjoy seeing morons getting caught red handed before getting crushed. And I quite enjoy other morons coming in here shouting "foul!" when everything is right in front of their eyes and all this have to do is 1+1=2 to realise that *gasp* GOONS might actually be in the right here. Whether it pleases them or not.
[/quote]It helps that Methrage is a terrible person to give secret aid to because he drops hints like Biggie* drops beats. Seriously, don't give Methrage secret aid. He is very bad at keeping it that way.

[size="1"]Biggie referring to Prominently BIG, a well known musical artist in the Duchy of Tanstaafl[/size]

[Kowalski]

GOONS don't force anyone to help people, people enjoy helping GOONS just to stick it to the pathetic moralist whiners who can't wait to complain about how unfair GOONS are until they get proven wrong.

[Udelar Johnson]

[quote name='ChairmanHal' timestamp='1285252206' post='2462165']
Yes and no.

Yes, people should be smart enough to realize that GOONS only has to make one IRC query before their friends jump to and start making moves. Sometimes they just simply volunteer. Spying. Bashing their critics in the forums. Whatever is required.

Indeed, I think it's not too much of a stretch to say that GOONS appears to be the one that wears these:

[img]http://www.performancetrendz.com/Images/Categories/mans-cotton-sateen-pants-jn05mp003f.jpg[/img]

the pants, in the relationship.

No, in that GOONS gives people on Planet Bob another reason to hate them every single day and they simply don't care. It makes it easier to root for the underdog, the underdog being whoever is opposing GOONS, even when that underdog has done something rather rash.
[/quote]

Thank you for recognizing that we do more to get our allies what they want than anyone else. Here's a clue: they don't want to sit around buying infra, paying bills, and collecting taxes. Otherwise, they wouldn't have allied with us.

[Hyperion321]

Does goons even have anyone big enough to hit this guy. If not, why are we talking about this.

[Andre27]

[quote name='Hyperion321' timestamp='1285255506' post='2462195']
Does goons even have anyone big enough to hit this guy. If not, why are we talking about this.
[/quote]

JimKongil hit the largest GOONS nation. The other GOONS are 75k max so it will take at least two weeks of war to get them involved.
So what happens is what always happens, Goons called on their allies.

[mrcalkin]

Wait, I thought GOONS were [i]in[/i] my pants, not wearing them

[Il Impero Romano]

Feigned outrage is bob's global warming. Threads like this are killing this planet.

Nothing, and I mean not a single thing, happened here that deserves 28 pages. I get it, many of you think this type of sentiment worked in the Vox era so it will work for you now in whittling away at the support for those whom the preponderance of strength lies, but it will never happen, simply because you choose to scream over every little thing that should otherwise be counted as normal day to day operations. Sure, you may get the leanings of some, but it will never be enough. Far to many people have reasonable minds. It worked back then because there was stuff to actually rail against, it wont work now because your freaking out over a nation who aided a rogue secretly being outed and attacked, the difference cannot be any more clear.

Edited September 23, 2010 by Il Impero Romano

[mrcalkin]

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1285257685' post='2462214']
Feigned outrage is bob's global warming. Threads like this are killing this planet.

Nothing, and I mean not a single thing, happened here that deserves 28 pages. I get it, many of you think this type of sentiment worked in the Vox era so it will work for you now in whittling away at the support for those whom the preponderance of strength lies, but it will never happen, simply because you choose to scream over every little thing that should otherwise be counted as normal day to day operations. Sure, you may get the leanings of some, but it will never be enough. Far to many people have reasonable minds. It worked back then because there was stuff to actually rail against, it wont work now because your freaking out over a nation who aided a rogue secretly being outed and attacked, the difference cannot be any more clear.
[/quote]

But he was [b]unjustly[/b] outed as someone who aids rogues, therefore it doesn't count!

[Haquertal]

[quote name='mrcalkin' timestamp='1285257800' post='2462217']
But he was [b]unjustly[/b] outed as someone who aids rogues, therefore it doesn't count!
[/quote]

You forgot GONS

And I completely agree with this statement, it doesn't count!!!

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='mrcalkin' timestamp='1285257800' post='2462217']
But he was [b]unjustly[/b] outed as someone who aids rogues, therefore it doesn't count!
[/quote]

Oh ho, I guess they got GOONS there.

Wait, no one can [i]reasonably [/i]think that there is anything unjust about spying on a nation who is unaligned and suspected of aiding a low level persistent nuclear rogue with a WRC near bill lock.

[Thrash]

[quote name='potato' timestamp='1285253490' post='2462179']
For some odd reason (luck? logic?), GOONS are 3 out of 3.
[/quote]

Technically, they're not 3 out of 3. They've already said that they have attempted to aid other "suspects" to see if the slots were available. So, they may be 3 for 3 on the actual spy attempts, but not 3 for 3 in their accusations.

[D34th]

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1285257685' post='2462214']
Feigned outrage is bob's global warming. Threads like this are killing this planet.

Nothing, and I mean not a single thing, happened here that deserves 28 pages. I get it, many of you think this type of sentiment worked in the Vox era so it will work for you now in whittling away at the support for those whom the preponderance of strength lies, but it will never happen, simply because you choose to scream over every little thing that should otherwise be counted as normal day to day operations. Sure, you may get the leanings of some, but it will never be enough. Far to many people have reasonable minds. It worked back then because there was stuff to actually rail against, it wont work now because your freaking out over a nation who aided a rogue secretly being outed and attacked, the difference cannot be any more clear.
[/quote]

You are looking too far into it, people are just bored. That's why this thread reached 29 pages already or the Grämlins one reached 150, just the boredom.

[Beefspari]

[quote name='Thrash' timestamp='1285258784' post='2462233']
Technically, they're not 3 out of 3. They've already said that they have attempted to aid other "suspects" to see if the slots were available. So, they may be 3 for 3 on the actual spy attempts, but not 3 for 3 in their accusations.
[/quote]
I don't think anyone's threatening or talking bad about us checking nations for clues. Just supposedly "spying on every nation with an FAC." Which of course hasn't happened.

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1285258879' post='2462234']
You are looking too far into it, people are just bored. That's why this thread reached 29 pages already or the Grämlins one reached 150, just the boredom.
[/quote]

Normally I would agree, however this particular mindset has been a running theme for a very long time now, and its getting to the point where its suffocating this venue for no ones gain.


[quote name='Thrash' timestamp='1285258784' post='2462233']
Technically, they're not 3 out of 3. They've already said that they have attempted to aid other "suspects" to see if the slots were available. So, they may be 3 for 3 on the actual spy attempts, but not 3 for 3 in their [b]accusations[/b].
[/quote]

You mean [i]investigations[/i], not [i]accusations[/i].

Also, please tell me where there is a problem with investigating wrongs being done against them in a manner that does not violate the nation in question or deprive him of anything.

Edited September 23, 2010 by Il Impero Romano

[Thrash]

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1285259034' post='2462236']
Also, please tell me where there is anything wrong with investigating wrongs being done against them in a manner that does not violate the nation in question or deprive him of anything.
[/quote]

No, it does do no harm to the nation, but what's going to happen when the aid slot test fails? An immediate spy attempt?

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='Thrash' timestamp='1285259638' post='2462242']
No, it does do no harm to the nation, but what's going to happen when the aid slot test fails? An immediate spy attempt?
[/quote]

On an unaligned nation, yes. Why would that not be the next logical step in an investigation where they have established reasonable cause to believe he was the one to send the aid (i.e. rationale for the suspicions that the original slot test was founded upon then the subsequent failure of the slot test itself). What is possibly wrong with that?

If the nation was aligned, the proper extra steps would be taken, as we saw with NSO.

[mrcalkin]

Their precious spy slots though ;_; Can't anyone think of them?

[Augustus Autumn]

Ok, so let me get this straight.

1. GOONS says they'll view aid sent to Methrage as an act of war.
2. JimKongIl, knowing the consequences, sends aid to Methrage and gets caught.
3. GOONS is now at war with JimKongIl.

What's the problem here?

[Thrash]

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1285259883' post='2462244']
On an unaligned nation, yes. Why would that not be the next logical step in an investigation where they have established reasonable cause to believe he was the one to send the aid (i.e. rationale for the suspicions that the original slot test was founded upon then the subsequent failure of the slot test itself). What is possibly wrong with that?

If the nation was aligned, the proper extra steps would be taken, as we saw with NSO.
[/quote]

I suppose I see your point and there was due diligence done in Jim's case (plenty of evidence).

[The Warrior]

Have fun JKI. I know you will!

[Heinlander]

[quote name='Ferrozoica Hive' timestamp='1285260178' post='2462248']
Ok, so let me get this straight.

1. GOONS says they'll view aid sent to Methrage as an act of war.
2. JimKongIl, knowing the consequences, sends aid to Methrage and gets caught.
3. GOONS is now at war with JimKongIl.

What's the problem here?
[/quote]That debate was largely settled after 6 pages when all the detractors quietly slinked away when Beefspari posted the spy logs.

Now the discourse has degenerated into the predictable anti - GONS vitriol.