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The Third Court


Sargun II

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So, my funky friends, is this a like a Court where this funky DJ takes his complaints to? all of them?

if so, this Funky DJ would like to Accuse Tidy Bowl Man over the fact that his Bowl is, in fact, Not Tidy. It is a very messy bowl. This funky DJ uses as initial submitting evidence the clear and unquestionable fact that Tidy Bowl Man has a cat for his avatar. Cats, also known as kittens, felines, fuzzy wuzzy babehs, etc, are famous for their invididualistic and highly messy natures; getting into everything, clawing up paper and God knows the entire sock drawer, climbing up the backs of chairs to nom on hair, and getting tangled up in string. This has obviously led to the situation where Tidy Bowl Man's Bowl is now untidy, Messy, unbearable. This Funky DJ will see justice served :awesome:

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Back to being serious.


I have a question on "forced" actions. In this particular [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=69139"]the event[/url], you can see Korea accusing its neighbors of having military buildups on its borders, and the neighbor in question does not dispute it. Can I consider the military buildup as having actually happened, since the neighbor did not challenge the RP?

This shouldn't be a problem, but with the recent arguments about whether something happened or not, I figured I shouldn't take any chances.

Edited by Kankou
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A person can claim anything at all happened...from troop buildup on the border to aliens invading. Doesn't mean it's true or not, but they can claim it.

But something as big as a troop build-up would have to be RP'd by the other player for it to actually be true, and aliens invading...well, we all know that won't fly :P

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Discussed with Maelstrom on IRC and due to some sort of OOC agreement with India or some !@#$%^&* like that I let him have the roll, because I don't feel like we need to get involved with OOC agreements between players. While Cochin has the right to revoke Maelstrom's right to RP his citizens, the understanding is that Maelstrom is using his main character and an older established character, and thus it passes away from "Cochin citizen" to "Maelstrom's character". Maelstrom no longer has the right to RP any Cochin citizens that he did not already have established RP with, but as it is now he is free to use these specific characters.

He also failed his roll.

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[quote name='Subtleknifewielder' timestamp='1286474924' post='2478020']
A person can claim anything at all happened...from troop buildup on the border to aliens invading. Doesn't mean it's true or not, but they can claim it.

But something as big as a troop build-up would have to be RP'd by the other player for it to actually be true, and aliens invading...well, we all know that won't fly :P
[/quote]
I'll take that as a yes to my question. Thank you.

When the other side does not deny, and say OOC-wise he was on the verge of invading, pretty much seals it.

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I would like confirmation on this nuke issue. As per [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=93221&view=findpost&p=2478428"]this[/url] post of mine, I have crafted an IC response in case it is in fact canon. I hope the GMs would address the points I have raised namely:

1) 80S, 80E Airfield - It is an unclaimed part of Antarctica where there has been no history of nation building let alone an airstrip. Is it permissible for a new air strip to spawn out like this?

2) Is it permissible for a non nation state or an unestablished person to in fact conduct an attack on a nation?

3) Should not Mael have given me a chance to interdict the aircraft before it landed in Dragonisian City? Is not doing the landing without giving me a chance to respond, ie, two posts separated by mere 3 hours, an example of meta game?

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1. I believe that Maelstrom operates a group of people out of Antarctica. Regardless, he could have landed it elsewhere and the details here would mainly be for RP continuity as he operates out of Antarctica.
2. Maelstrom is RPing under some sort of limbo between a person and a state; his main character, Maelstrom Vortex, is an established person. Whether you believe him to be alive or not is your prerogative but he is using established characters.
3. He should have, but you responded appropriately about it. For further reference, it would be godmodding, not metagaming.

The attack itself is sort of legitimate but I'll be discussing it with Subtle and EM about future attacks of this type.

By the way I find your IC post completely legit.

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[quote name='Sargun' timestamp='1286504524' post='2478439']
1. I believe that Maelstrom operates a group of people out of Antarctica. Regardless, he could have landed it elsewhere and the details here would mainly be for RP continuity as he operates out of Antarctica.
2. Maelstrom is RPing under some sort of limbo between a person and a state; his main character, Maelstrom Vortex, is an established person. Whether you believe him to be alive or not is your prerogative but he is using established characters.
3. He should have, but you responded appropriately about it. For further reference, it would be godmodding, not metagaming.

The attack itself is sort of legitimate but I'll be discussing it with Subtle and EM about future attacks of this type.

By the way I find your IC post completely legit.
[/quote]

Thank you for the clarification.

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ooc: Cochin, just a question, why would you fly to interdict an aircraft which was posting a valid and normal commercial transponder with a pre-filed flight path? I do not see F-15's scrambling for every commercial aircraft going in and out of most modern states. Additionally, I have not seen you having F15's interdicting all cargo aircraft. I assumed you simply would not interdict the aircraft because there was no reason to, but if you can provide a valid reason for it we can go back and re-do such a scenario, but I think your aircraft would have allowed them to pass all the same.

In short. why would you have stopped this particular aircraft which is following Cochinese law, using cochinese transponder, and cochinese registration... that is not using meta knowledge?

Edited by Maelstrom Vortex
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[quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' timestamp='1286505605' post='2478457']
ooc: Cochin, just a question, why would you fly to interdict an aircraft which was posting a valid and normal commercial transponder with a pre-filed flight path? I do not see F-15's scrambling for every commercial aircraft going in and out of most modern states. Additionally, I have not seen you having F15's interdicting all cargo aircraft. I assumed you simply would not interdict the aircraft because there was no reason to, but if you can provide a valid reason for it we can go back and re-do such a scenario, but I think your aircraft would have allowed them to pass all the same.

In short. why would you have stopped this particular aircraft which is following Cochinese law, using cochinese transponder, and cochinese registration... that is not using meta knowledge?
[/quote]

I may have, I may not have, but that is my prerogative to RP. There could be IC precedents I had created for such contingencies and so I might have legally did an interdiction. If I had godmodded on that of course you could call me out. However that is still my prerogative. I had to respond for the next step to be done by you. You did not give me the time or chance to do a response, hence the god mod. As a clarification, yes, the plane would have gone on to land in Bangalore. I could not have posted any interdiction ICly. So I might indeed have let the plane through and if you had won the rolls, Bangalore would be in stratosphere now. But then again the interdiction or letting through is my prerogative.

The problem here is the assumption, which is not permitted. You are not permitted to do the second stage of any RP without me posting a timely response. I think you would agree that 3 hours, especially considering the time zone difference is hardly the due response time to be waited.

Anyway I thank you for this. Now I have a precedent on something like this. Now I can in fact ensure that such a thing will not happen again.

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[quote name='Kankou' timestamp='1286503246' post='2478420']
I'll take that as a yes to my question. Thank you.

When the other side does not deny, and say OOC-wise he was on the verge of invading, pretty much seals it.
[/quote]
You assume wrongly. I said the movements have to be RP'd by the other person. THEY HAVE TO ACTUALLY MOVE THE TROOPS IN QUESTION, EXPLICITLY, AND IN CHARACTER.

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[quote name='king of cochin' timestamp='1286506197' post='2478474']
I may have, I may not have, but that is my prerogative to RP. There could be IC precedents I had created for such contingencies and so I might have legally did an interdiction. If I had godmodded on that of course you could call me out. However that is still my prerogative. I had to respond for the next step to be done by you. You did not give me the time or chance to do a response, hence the god mod. As a clarification, yes, the plane would have gone on to land in Bangalore. I could not have posted any interdiction ICly. So I might indeed have let the plane through and if you had won the rolls, Bangalore would be in stratosphere now. But then again the interdiction or letting through is my prerogative.

The problem here is the assumption, which is not permitted. You are not permitted to do the second stage of any RP without me posting a timely response. I think you would agree that 3 hours, especially considering the time zone difference is hardly the due response time to be waited.

Anyway I thank you for this. Now I have a precedent on something like this. Now I can in fact ensure that such a thing will not happen again.
[/quote]

I agree with you that if you have an IC motive to do so you have a right to interdict. If you had one we could have simply gone back and did the scene, no harm done. But as we have both acknowledged, it wasn't going to happen based on IC motivators. That said, things turned out ideally despite the slight breach in etiquette which expedited things for which I apologize. The IC ball is now in your court.. and you have some data to work with.

As you have pointed out though.. you now have a very good reason to stop and inspect just about any cargo aircraft for a while.. but if you want to do that regularly you may want to make that policy as I did in the old days of the Empire.. just consider the impact of increased security on your people. (It made mine more paranoid :-P. Not necessarily a bad thing.)

Edited by Maelstrom Vortex
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[quote]
Burgundaholmr still had 40,000 troops and 400 Panther tanks. It was true that these tanks were from a by-gone era, but this was the best that the Burgundians had. This was supplimented by the thousands of 8.8 cm FlaKs, which would be enough to at least keep the Walloon tanks stalled until the RPGs can come into play. Over a thousand Panzerwerfers and 500 V-2s on Meillerwagens were also to be used, useful in spreading chaos.

One factor that helped the Burgundians was that Germany was heavily militarized, so almost noone seemed to care that the relatively light arms were moving to the Wallonia-German border. [/quote]

I mean really.. he has roughly 3000 NS, he's bill locked, he's put absolutely no prior role play into any of this, and now he's pulling thousands of AA guns and 500 V2 Missiles out of his butt?

How much longer are you all going to allow him to keep getting away with this sort of nonsense.

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[quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' timestamp='1286506967' post='2478499']
I agree with you that if you have an IC motive to do so you have a right to interdict. If you had one we could have simply gone back and did the scene, no harm done. But as we have both acknowledged, it wasn't going to happen based on IC motivators. That said, things turned out ideally despite the slight breach in etiquette which expedited things for which I apologize. The IC ball is now in your court.. and you have some data to work with.

As you have pointed out though.. you now have a very good reason to stop and inspect just about any cargo aircraft for a while.. but if you want to do that regularly you may want to make that policy as I did in the old days of the Empire.. just consider the impact of increased security on your people. (It made mine more paranoid :-P. Not necessarily a bad thing.)
[/quote]

You recent announcement and demands for the return of pieces of India gives him all the reason he needs to detain anyone he feels like for as long as he likes.

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I shall be ignoring any and all rulings that the GMs or the Mod that attempts to stop me from RPing what I have done. The GM court is supposed to be a place where conflicts between players are supposed to be addressed, not some sort of American court where even the bystanders start filing suits when the actual parties involved have already solved the problem.

DotCom has kept his manners when he first asked me for a closed war. His behavior has been very different from the likes of good-for-nothing trolls like Zoot or Tidy Bowl Man, which is why I accepted his request. Since this is a closed RP, no one else should have a say on whatever I do unless dotCom is the one bringing up the issue. I hope the GMs and the Mods sees sense in denying TBM's filing.

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You know Sargun, you ought to just start wiping people off the map when they refuse to accept GM rulings. The problem here is Karl hasn't actually done anything. He's waved his magical wand and conjured up an entire zerg rush of V-2 Missiles out of no where. This has nothing to do with me being polite, dotcom accepting it, Zoot, or the tooth fairy. This has everything to do with Karl magically conjuring 500 freaking V-2 missiles without a drop or speck of role play and several thousand anti-tank guns.

And doing so with a nation that in game is a pile of rubble and by his own confession, bill locked.

Didn't the GMs already decide not to comment on the fact he was launching V-2 missiles off the deck of a cargo ship just a few days ago? Top that off with him scritchy scrawling a few lines of rp to bring him right into the heart of London and back.

Seriously, yall really should put your foot down at some point.

Suggested solution: Reduction in number of V-2 to a reasonable sum of 20.

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