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[quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' date='26 April 2010 - 03:57 AM' timestamp='1272268610' post='2275803']
For the last time, the government didn't bail. The alliance failed and they declared it over, but one member, along with "fifteen others" decided to stay. Even if majority rules, as is supposedly true in democracy, the alliance still folded as 15 out of 100 is not a majority.[/quote]

When I did the merger with IAA one of the first matters I brought up for discussion with them and other partners is what would happen to anyone who decided to remain in the sssw18 AA. I could think of a few people who might be stubborn enough to stay and perhaps make another go at it. I wanted to make sure they were protected or at the very least would go untouched. And that no dubious "poaching rules" would be flaunted. The reason being that I cared about my members and wanted people kept safe no matter what they decided to do. Turns out everyone I thought might do that left either for IAA or other pastures. Though three relatively inactive and not terribly qualified folks remained. I say that not to say they were bad people just that they really didn't have too much of a clue on how to organize let alone run a government. And if our old AA is where they want to remain they have my support. And if they want to make a serious go at having the alliance come back they have my support as well.

Charles de Gaulle once said cemetaries are filled with indispensible people. So are the history books of alliances. But it is only those who dwell among the living (and within the AA) who ultimately decide their fate.

Edited by Taget
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Good to see the membership stepping up and taking on the responsibility of keeping the alliance going. While the reasoning behind the government leaving is different, this reminds me greatly of the TSO situation. I hope you can revive your alliance as successfully as MCXA did after that.

A good showing by UCN's allies to support the new version.

Regarding 'Even if majority rules, as is supposedly true in democracy, the alliance still folded as 15 out of 100 is not a majority': Before the government bailed out, there were 100 nations on the AA. There are now 55. That is a majority.

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Guys, I am getting disgusted by your words. The government did what they felt was best for UCN. Please stop bugging them about it, all you are doing is making them feel bad for something that happened in the past. That was the Old United Commonwealth of Nations, we are the New UCN. Please, stop talking about the past, it will not change anything that has happened.

Edited by erikjsch
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[quote name='TheFlyingLobster' date='25 April 2010 - 09:51 PM' timestamp='1272250280' post='2275361']
The membership fully supported this merge 110%. But after UCN decided on a suggested name and [b]flag[/b], and FEAR rejected it, it all went down the drain.[/quote]

To be fair, how could FEAR not reject replacing their flag? :awesome:

Good luck getting things worked out.

Edited by William Blake
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[quote name='nutkase' date='26 April 2010 - 06:51 AM' timestamp='1272289874' post='2275952']
Well done darkfox, pat on the back for you brother.

Ernesto, the alliance did not fail. You people as a government failed.
[/quote]

I find it rather amusing that all of you (As in, the outsiders looking in) seem to think that we simply gave up and ran away. This was not the case, you were not there, so stop acting like you were.

Obviously something was terribly, terribly wrong with UCN if all it took was my resignation to set off a chain reaction as it did. I feel like a parrot for repeating myself here, but as we've tried to tell you all, we had a plan to save UCN and her members, but we weren't given time to unveil it. The starter's gun was fired before we had time to get our runners in place, and we were left to play catch-up. I'm sorry that, due to RL issues, I was unable to take part in the alliance's government anymore, I don't exactly see how that makes me a bad person. I warned them several times that I was nearing the breaking point, but they seemed to ignore it. Anybody that talked to me in the time between April 15th and April 22nd knew that I was approaching the edge, because anybody that would listen was told so.

So, to all of you out there, stop acting like you know what happened, because you don't. You're taking opinions and rumors and reflecting them as fact, which is a poor show on your part. As for the New UCN that has sprouted up, I wish them luck, and ask them, what will happen when Darkfox leaves?

Edit: The vast majority of nations still on the UCN AA are ghosts, trust me. When I initiated a military drill a few months ago, we had 54 percent of nations respond within seven days. The rest never even checked the forums.

Edited by Ernesto Che Guevara
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[quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' date='27 April 2010 - 02:24 AM' timestamp='1272306260' post='2276194']
I find it rather amusing that all of you (As in, the outsiders looking in) seem to think that we simply gave up and ran away. This was not the case, you were not there, so stop acting like you were.

Obviously something was terribly, terribly wrong with UCN if all it took was my resignation to set off a chain reaction as it did. I feel like a parrot for repeating myself here, but as we've tried to tell you all, we had a plan to save UCN and her members, but we weren't given time to unveil it. The starter's gun was fired before we had time to get our runners in place, and we were left to play catch-up. I'm sorry that, due to RL issues, I was unable to take part in the alliance's government anymore, I don't exactly see how that makes me a bad person. I warned them several times that I was nearing the breaking point, but they seemed to ignore it. Anybody that talked to me in the time between April 15th and April 22nd knew that I was approaching the edge, because anybody that would listen was told so.

So, to all of you out there, stop acting like you know what happened, because you don't. You're taking opinions and rumors and reflecting them as fact, which is a poor show on your part. As for the New UCN that has sprouted up, I wish them luck, and ask them, what will happen when Darkfox leaves?
[/quote]

You didn't have a plan to save UCN, you had a plan to merge UCN.

You were not given time to unveil it? please you people resigned not removed as your trying to imply.

Which was left to past members to try and save so don't play the innocent victim.

This is no "new" UCN, its UCN continuing without you and other former govt whom tried to disband a alliance without any kind of transparency which from what I remember used to be fully.

Edited by nutkase
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When the whole government leaves yes, something is wrong. I have seen it before, it does not mean the Alliance failed. The Alliance is there still and I suspect they will grow and become very strong now!
As a member of an alliance that has gone through growing pains... I see a strong great future for those that remain to rebuild the forums, the government, the essence of this fine alliance.

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[quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' date='26 April 2010 - 03:12 PM' timestamp='1272312754' post='2276297']
The whole government didn't leave, just me. The other two members were couped before they could do anything.

Our plan to save UCN was in place if the merger had failed. Again, you weren't there, stop acting like you were and shut your mouth.
[/quote]


Umm, Coup? When did this happen? Because from what I remember they disbanded, and left. I do not see a coup in that anywhere.

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[quote name='monkeybum' date='26 April 2010 - 04:45 PM' timestamp='1272314683' post='2276339']
This whole debate has seemed to outlived its usefulness. I see no point in continuing arguments over semantics.
[/quote]
Agreed.

Best of luck to the new alliance. I'm still a bit confused over the name thing, but Erik and Joamer are still my friends regardless of this debacle, and I wish them luck.

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I think the Problem with the older gov was that they let mostly inept newcomers get into important positions without proper training, thus leading to a mass govt resignation. Chax was one of the oldest members and when he left, the other two resigned (or couped). If there are coup logs, it shows that some old/former UCN members are just hungry power grabbers after all. I remember when the govt almost fell apart back in Fall Elections of 09. Fortunately, cooler heads prevailed (thanks to Fox, Jonny, MoSW, and Bori) even tho newer members got a lot of the govt positions. I'd trust Joamer and Fox, but if Chax is tellin the truth on Erik and Moth planning a coup, shame on them. Don't make me come back and rage all over the UCN forums again...

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[quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' date='26 April 2010 - 03:12 PM' timestamp='1272312754' post='2276297']
The whole government didn't leave, just me. The other two members were couped before they could do anything.

Our plan to save UCN was in place if the merger had failed. Again, you weren't there, stop acting like you were and shut your mouth.
[/quote]
Che, the reamaining two members were the ones that disbanded the government. Stop acting like the disbandment of UCN was not on your part. The day you left 75% of the gov did.

I love ya man, but if I was still at UCN this would not have flown. And you can't say I wasn't there. I know more about UCN than most of it's members.

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@Gulag, it wasn't Moth planning the coup, he was the supplier of the logs.

@Musta, I still don't see what I could have done differently. I was fed up and needed time to clear my head. I resigned, and when I came back from the speech tournament Sunday I found all this going on.

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How on Earth is ANY of this Che's fault? I am good friends with Che in the sense that we spend all of our free time together, I can attest that he left the alliance, and then left town for 3 days, in that 3 days, all of the happened. All he did was leave the alliance, and had been talking about it to I and several other members. This was not surprise that he was going to leave, but with his resignation, many others resigned too. Are you all really putting Che on trial because he could no longer handle the pressure of leadership, and had to step-down?

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