A New Way of Going About Purged Nations

[hawk11]

As someone who has been purged from the map twice, I would like to raise a complaint about the way we go about doing this practice in CNRP. Let me begin by saying that purging is a necessary practice for the upkeep of the CNRP map. Without purging, we would end up with 100-day inactive squatters who have long removed themselves from the CNRP community. It's a practice that works, and it's a practice I am not arguing against in the slightest.

To address my recent purge: yes, it is a fair purge. I'm 28 days inactive, it is a done deal. I'm not arguing this point either. However, I'm going to raise a grievance that the current way we go about purging people isn't community-friendly whatsoever: it's sniping people who have been inactive. If my current purge is the norm, then we make no effort to directly contact people who are inactive anymore. I did not really receive any notice from anyone that I was approaching the inactive point, but I am acknowledging that it is not the community's responsibility to coddle the player. However, therein lies the problem: we're a community. Competition within the community is healthy for the game, and it keeps things from stagnating, but I feel the practice of sitting quietly by, hoping for a nation to go 25 days inactive so you can claim their land/make it a protectorate isn't beneficial to keeping the community friendly.

So, I'm making this appeal to the community: from now on, let's be nicer to each other. Yes, the map is something that's exciting to compete on, and the race for the biggest, most powerful nation in the game is probably one of the most exciting competitions we have in CNRP; however, let's not be jerks to each other. Our community is usually at odds with each other in the first place over unscripted wars and strange tech rules; let's not make purging a point of contention also. I suggest we come up with a new way of going about purging people. I was thinking that at the 20+ point, a player who notices a player slipping to that point contacts a GM, who then contacts that player. That player has X amount of days to post an actual RP (not just a post supporting something or some !@#$%^&*), where X is the amount of days left until they hit the maximum allowed days inactive. If they're caught after the inactive day, they have 24 hours to post an RP, unless they're caught Y days after the maximum amount of days, Y being an agreed upon amount of days where it's unacceptable. Thoughts?

[Centurius]

I agree

[hawk11]

Awesome. Go team.

[Subtleknifewielder]

I support the idea.

Edited April 15, 2010 by Subtleknifewielder

[Voodoo Nova]

I'm down for this.

[Fizzydog]

I definitely agree.


Somewhat.

[Yawoo]

I don't support this.

If a nation is close to being inactive then I don't think they deserve a PM. Everyone knows the risks of the 25 days of inactivity. I understand RL is hectic, but there are ways of accessing the forums besides your home computer. A public library springs to mind, as does an internet cafe. Most mobile phones now have access to the internet which can be used to access these forums.

If a PM was sent out every time someone goes inactive, and then said inactive person posts, but repeats again, where do we cut the inactive person off? One time? Two times? Either way, someone will not be happy, so just keep it the current system which is a good method without bureaucracy.

[Sargun II]

I don't support this either. Why should somebody at 23 days of inactivity be warned that they are about to go inactive so they can make a handful of posts and then go 23 days inactive again? I understand if you have a busy life and might be temporarily away, but at the same time you can have a ten minute chat with somebody you trust to say "in case something happens, do X". Perhaps even, during the time you try to make the OOC post saying you'll be away for three weeks, post a short little IC statement to extend your life while you are temporarily away.

[Bacharth]

If they do it too many times, it should be a community decision that they should be purged then.

[Subtleknifewielder]

[quote name='Vince Sixx' date='14 April 2010 - 06:56 PM' timestamp='1271296549' post='2260737']
If they do it too many times, it should be a community decision that they should be purged then.
[/quote]
Also supported.

[iamthey]

Considering how lax the activity requirements are, I refuse to believe that anyone is really so busy that they can't make a single one line IC post within the span of almost a month. 99% of the time I think its that people have just forgotten entirely. (I was purged myself almost a year ago as I had basically stopped thinking about the game entirely). The current system exists to incentivize at least some awareness on the part of everyone as there exists a very real risk that your land and the time you have invested will be pounced on and thereby erased by everyone at the 25 day marker. While this is a harsh aspect of the game's mechanics I don't see how holding everyones hand when it comes to activity will improve activity or make the game any better. Personally this could be a fine idea on an informal level, if friends of the particular player want to send them a courtesy PM that would be great, but making it an institutional aspect of the game idk.

Edited April 15, 2010 by iamthey

[loannes]

No. You can't be too busy to get online and post "Congratulations, (nation)" once every 25 days.

Also, I second Sargun's statement.

[Acca Dacca]

It is common courtesy, but like being nice...it isnt required on these boards. Sorry, mate.

[Executive Minister]

[quote name='hawk_11' date='14 April 2010 - 08:03 PM' timestamp='1271289801' post='2260633']
Our community is usually at odds with each other in the first place over unscripted wars and strange tech rules; let's not make purging a point of contention also... Thoughts?
[/quote]

I can honestly say that I have not ranked purges up there along with tech rulings and scripted wars as a primary point of contention in CNRP.

[V The King]

*Shrugs*

I think both camps have a valid point to be made. On one hand, I've always found out to be very unfriendly and anti-community to essentially hope a neighbor goes inactive so you can gobble up his/her land without a fight. On the other hand, I believe that having someone go inactive for three weeks then be reminded to post, then going off again harms the RP, insofar you have a [i]de facto[/i] inactive nation taking up room.

Middle ground? I believe courtesy reminders should be sent - I used to do that at times. But if a person goes inactive a second time after his nation was narrowly saved, then he should expect no community service.

[SpacingOutMan]

[quote name='V The King' date='15 April 2010 - 01:14 AM' timestamp='1271308466' post='2260978']
*Shrugs*

I think both camps have a valid point to be made. On one hand, I've always found out to be very unfriendly and anti-community to essentially hope a neighbor goes inactive so you can gobble up his/her land without a fight. On the other hand, I believe that having someone go inactive for three weeks then be reminded to post, then going off again harms the RP, insofar you have a [i]de facto[/i] inactive nation taking up room.

Middle ground? I believe courtesy reminders should be sent - I used to do that at times. But if a person goes inactive a second time after his nation was narrowly saved, then he should expect no community service.
[/quote]

This speaks many volumes on how this policy should be used in the future...

[Triyun]

The other side of the problem tbh is that there are some nations with huge $@! land that their size doesn't justify really. I don't mean to pick on them, but there will be a scramble and high demand for land when one nation occupies an entire region. If you limit the size of nations back to their sphere of influence (in terms of total square miles/kilos, not counting distance from the capital) you can reduce the total demand for land and thus the need for stricter purging rules.

[Lynneth]

[quote name='Triyun' date='16 April 2010 - 04:51 PM' timestamp='1271429477' post='2262807']
The other side of the problem tbh is that there are some nations with huge $@! land that their size doesn't justify really. I don't mean to pick on them, but there will be a scramble and high demand for land when one nation occupies an entire region. If you limit the size of nations back to their sphere of influence (in terms of total square miles/kilos, not counting distance from the capital) you can reduce the total demand for land and thus the need for stricter purging rules.
[/quote]
Limiting to sphere of influence doesn't do much. For me, it'd be roughly 36 million square miles. That's 94.31 million square kilometers.
(radius squared times Pi)
>>At 17,075,400 square kilometres (6,592,800 sq mi), Russia is by far the largest country in the world, covering more than a ninth of the Earth's land<<
Surface area of earth: 148,940,000 km²
I could thus technically occupy more than 70% of the world map without problems.

Now, let's take a relatively small nation, 500 sq m in radius (1,000 in diameter)
500*500 is 250,000; times Pi is 785,398.something, more than twice Germany's area, which is 357,021 km².

You see the problem?
But I do agree some people hoard land too much for silly reasons ("I want land", "I'm keeping it for a friend who may never return to RP", things like that).
People who don't need all the land they have are, imo:
Shadowsage (Holy American Empire),
SpacingOutMan (United Mechodamian States),
Lavo_2 (Rebel Army)
Drakedeath&Malatose/VektorZero (Slavic Federation),
possibly Justinian (Slavorussia),
Imperator Azenquor (Vauleo-Buryatia),
probably Cochin (Kingdom of Cochin),
potentially Martens (Deutschland),
Mudd (Tahoe) and Jedcjt (FSA) may count, as well, though the US [b]is[/b] that big IRL. And some countries are just large.

But yeah, that's some of those who don't necessarily need all the land they have, in my opinion. People who could do with less, letting new RPers come in.

[Voodoo Nova]

[quote name='Lynneth' date='16 April 2010 - 12:57 PM' timestamp='1271437038' post='2262914']
Limiting to sphere of influence doesn't do much. For me, it'd be roughly 36 million square miles. That's 94.31 million square kilometers.
(radius squared times Pi)
>>At 17,075,400 square kilometres (6,592,800 sq mi), Russia is by far the largest country in the world, covering more than a ninth of the Earth's land<<
Surface area of earth: 148,940,000 km²
I could thus technically occupy more than 70% of the world map without problems.

Now, let's take a relatively small nation, 500 sq m in radius (1,000 in diameter)
500*500 is 250,000; times Pi is 785,398.something, more than twice Germany's area, which is 357,021 km².

You see the problem?
But I do agree some people hoard land too much for silly reasons ("I want land", "I'm keeping it for a friend who may never return to RP", things like that).
People who don't need all the land they have are, imo:
Shadowsage (Holy American Empire),
SpacingOutMan (United Mechodamian States),
Lavo_2 (Rebel Army)
Drakedeath&Malatose/VektorZero (Slavic Federation),
possibly Justinian (Slavorussia),
Imperator Azenquor (Vauleo-Buryatia),
probably Cochin (Kingdom of Cochin),
potentially Martens (Deutschland),
Mudd (Tahoe) and Jedcjt (FSA) may count, as well, though the US [b]is[/b] that big IRL. And some countries are just large.

But yeah, that's some of those who don't necessarily need all the land they have, in my opinion. People who could do with less, letting new RPers come in.
[/quote]

Lavo is actually fairly liberal with his land, as is Shadow. I don't think land size is the issue, as much as it is we have people with a ton of land that barely RP.

[Triyun]

I would point out that Keshav (yes I had a big empire to but I was substantially bigger and as I recall I gave Manchuria to him, and some land to Hawk in the past too, although that doesn't totally obsolve me) will at the end of the current RP posses 90 percent of China and all of continental SE Asia, where his SoI includes Northern China pretty much. Territory like that makes scraps worth way more when its not really justified controlling that huge an amount of land.

I don't think it is necessary that you have Russia, China, the US, and Canada represent their modern borders. I would say Lavo has shown a willingness to give up land. But for their NS and size I would say Cochin and Keshav should open up their neighborhood a bit.

[king of cochin]

[quote name='Triyun' date='16 April 2010 - 11:09 PM' timestamp='1271439524' post='2262937']
I would point out that Keshav (yes I had a big empire to but I was substantially bigger and as I recall I gave Manchuria to him, and some land to Hawk in the past too, although that doesn't totally obsolve me) will at the end of the current RP posses 90 percent of China and all of continental SE Asia, where his SoI includes Northern China pretty much. Territory like that makes scraps worth way more when its not really justified controlling that huge an amount of land.

I don't think it is necessary that you have Russia, China, the US, and Canada represent their modern borders. I would say Lavo has shown a willingness to give up land. But for their NS and size I would say Cochin and Keshav should open up their neighborhood a bit.
[/quote]

Perhaps you should make yourselves better aware of RP history , because if you do you would find that I have always been willing to downsize my nation if there are nations that ask me for land. In fact you yourself should know, because you had asked me for land and i had given it to you, but you did not accept.

Yes I have a large SoI, but I dont just hog the land, what land I have I do a lot of RPs based on it. As regards Keshav, since I originally started on land ceded by him, one cannot accuse him either of hogging land to others' detriment.

[Triyun]

That is true as far as land in China goes, but that was a protectorate as I recall. It was a really small portion of land. I would have accepted but got side tracks for the other things. I'm more talking though about holding as formal chunks of territory multiple nations. You could say for example hold North China, South China, India one of these have a quite large nation and open up the rest to protectorates from others.

[king of cochin]

Again I ask you to check my RP history. I have always downsized my nation when people who want land genuinely ask for it, for eg: mongolia, half it was protectorate, half was my land. Gave it all to curristan when he asked for it.

When my nation go too big, eastern kazakhstan and kyrghztan which were my lands were made into protectorates and now belong to other nations.

So any argument that I hog land would be proven to be baseless.

As long as I feel I cannot contribute creatively to a territory, or if there is someone who can do a better job of it, i would further reduce my land, but until then, my nation stays big. If you read some of my RPs you would realize there are various storylines going on with respect to those territories,