Bjornoya Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Boo reps, more insults! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreddieMercury Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Newhotness' date='12 March 2010 - 04:22 AM' timestamp='1268368077' post='2222953'] so much for reading what people say. [/quote] I just find it fascinating that you could possibly miss all of the blustering people did about absolutely refusing to pay reps. It was quite nauseating at times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxfire99 Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Newhotness' date='11 March 2010 - 10:19 PM' timestamp='1268367862' post='2222951'] we said we wouldnt pay reps to echelon. i dont think we said that we wouldnt work with SBA. just goin by memory tho, i dont remember everyones post [/quote] Why would you pay reps to Echelon? I don't know whether you forgot what was said a couple days ago or if this is a weak attempt to spin what was said, but there were definatly people saying PC wouldn't pay reps. However, I support this action by PC. This is the best action they could have taken short of not raiding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newhotness Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 (edited) [quote name='FreddieMercury' date='11 March 2010 - 11:27 PM' timestamp='1268368345' post='2222960'] I just find it fascinating that you could possibly miss all of the blustering people did about absolutely refusing to pay reps. It was quite nauseating at times. [/quote] i never said i missed it. Reread my post. What i said was, from what i remember reading, i remember seeing people say they werent paying anything to Echelon. And that i dont remember anyone saying anything in regards to SBA. And then i went on to say that i dont remember everyones post exactly. So dont hold me to it, or make wild accusations like the one you just made about me trying to rewrite history [quote name='foxfire99' date='11 March 2010 - 11:27 PM' timestamp='1268368392' post='2222962'] Why would you pay reps to Echelon? I don't know whether you forgot what was said a couple days ago or if this is a weak attempt to spin what was said, but there were definatly people saying PC wouldn't pay reps. However, I support this action by PC. This is the best action they could have taken short of not raiding. [/quote]aw, yup. you hit the nail on the head. couldnt have been a mistake by me. i was trying to spin it. sorry about that Edited March 12, 2010 by Newhotness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omniscient1 Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Good call PC I am glad this happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffine Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Newhotness' date='11 March 2010 - 11:29 PM' timestamp='1268368492' post='2222964'] i never said i missed it. Reread my post. What i said was, from what i remember reading, i remember seeing people say they werent paying anything to Echelon. And that i dont remember anyone saying anything in regards to SBA. And then i went on to say that i dont remember everyones post exactly. So dont hold me to it, or make wild accusations like the one you just made about me trying to rewrite history [/quote] Echelon stated more than a few times that we were not looking to get any reps for ourselves, that it was all about SBA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parandiac Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Caffine1' date='11 March 2010 - 11:25 PM' timestamp='1268368275' post='2222958'] Give me a break, don't bring up old grudges here, especially in very poorly researched arguments. [/quote] oh, so i guess i can repost the logs that you bandied about to garner attention? please, it would be degrading. look around you, caffine. all i see is old grudges. old grudges kept me out of echelon when there was a clause that i could never hold a political office- and that was of my own volition. when i need another lesson on how to carry a grudge, i'll apply at echelon again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreddieMercury Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Newhotness' date='12 March 2010 - 04:29 AM' timestamp='1268368492' post='2222964'] i never said i missed it. Reread my post. What i said was, from what i remember reading, i remember seeing people say they werent paying anything to Echelon. And that i dont remember anyone saying anything in regards to SBA. And then i went on to say that i dont remember everyones post exactly. So dont hold me to it, or make wild accusations like the one you just made about me trying to rewrite history aw, yup. you hit the nail on the head. couldnt have been a mistake by me. i was trying to spin it. sorry about that [/quote] Fair enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x Tela x Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Thank you, PC. SBA didn't deserve the unwarranted aggression, and they didn't deserve the indifferent response to your mistakes. I'm glad that you're doing the right thing, even if it did take 40 pages to sink in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaGneT Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='FreddieMercury' date='11 March 2010 - 11:21 PM' timestamp='1268367994' post='2222952'] Lol wut, good luck trying to rewrite history on that one. [/quote] Hi. PC clearly had some internal discussions about this. It's clear that some minds were changed and some hearts softened. Now please find another bone to pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jackson Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='x Tela x' date='11 March 2010 - 11:32 PM' timestamp='1268368677' post='2222973'] Thank you, PC. SBA didn't deserve the unwarranted aggression, and they didn't deserve the indifferent response to your mistakes. I'm glad that you're doing the right thing, even if it did take 40 pages to sink in. [/quote] They also did not deserve the mistakes made by Echelon as well. Regardless, they should be a lot better off now considering all that has happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shodemofi-NPO Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Frankly I just can't understand the argument that Echelon or SBA is somehow at fault for not keeping up their wikis. They are under no obligation to do so. To be honest, they don't really have an obligation to even let you know they're protecting SBA. It helps to avoid incidents like this, but that's just one of the hazards of tech raiding. You might bite off more than you can chew. Seems this worked out though, so kudos to all involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x Tela x Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Thomas Jackson' date='11 March 2010 - 11:35 PM' timestamp='1268368856' post='2222978'] They also did not deserve the mistakes made by Echelon as well. Regardless, they should be a lot better off now considering all that has happened. [/quote] I won't claim that we didn't make any mistakes - but some of the trash being peddled as truth is pretty ridiculous. I'll just say that the whole mess was a HUGE misunderstanding..Possibly an epic understatement, but it covers the situation well. In the end, it looks like the proper actions are being taken for SBA - and that's what matters here. There are egos in Echelon and egos in PC that don't matter. SBA getting restitution is what matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jackson Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='x Tela x' date='11 March 2010 - 11:37 PM' timestamp='1268368993' post='2222982'] I won't claim that we didn't make any mistakes - but some of the trash being peddled as truth is pretty ridiculous. I'll just say that the whole mess was a HUGE misunderstanding..Possibly an epic understatement, but it covers the situation well. In the end, it looks like the proper actions are being taken for SBA - and that's what matters here. There are egos in Echelon and egos in PC that don't matter. SBA getting restitution is what matters. [/quote] Mistakes will happen, and hopefully both sides will learn from them. But you are correct, SBA being taken care of here is what matters, and in the end it is being done right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Frontier Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Congratulations on handling this intelligently. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augusta Antonia Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Glad to see SBA will be taken care of, but seriously...people congratulating PC and "good show" etc...come on...it's plaintively obvious that the ONLY reason PC is making good on reps to SBA is because of all the bad PR they received. Anyone who thinks otherwise or pretends it is for any reason other than that is living in the proverbial land of make believe... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxfire99 Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Newhotness' date='11 March 2010 - 10:29 PM' timestamp='1268368492' post='2222964'] aw, yup. you hit the nail on the head. couldnt have been a mistake by me. i was trying to spin it. sorry about that [/quote] The sarcasm is apreciated. Still, I find it unlikely that you just forgot. Firstly, it happened very recently. Second, the entire thread was right there to reference, had you so desired. And third, it makes no sense whatsoever. When have raiders ever paid reps to an alliances protector? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schad Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Augusta Antonia' date='11 March 2010 - 10:44 PM' timestamp='1268369384' post='2222995'] Glad to see SBA will be taken care of, but seriously...people congratulating PC and "good show" etc...come on...it's plaintively obvious that the ONLY reason PC is making good on reps to SBA is because of all the bad PR they received. Anyone who thinks otherwise or pretends it is for any reason other than that is living in the proverbial land of make believe... [/quote] If that's the case, is it a bad thing? Better that alliances respond to public pressure if a mistake is made and correct it than they don't. Edited March 12, 2010 by Schad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fernando Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Kilkenny' date='11 March 2010 - 10:01 PM' timestamp='1268366785' post='2222929'] You don't suppose the quick edit had anything to do with the fact that you raided their protectorate based on that wiki?? And they quickly fixed it so they didn't continue to have this problem? [/quote] Thank you for your reflection, however, someone posted my opinion already...more or less: [quote name='Parandiac' date='11 March 2010 - 10:22 PM' timestamp='1268368094' post='2222954'] from personal experience as a former leader of your alliance, he's an unreasonable person. i'm sure that a lot of the minions in echelon are blinded by the aura of his genius, but there's a good reason that a manipulative person was not allowed to hold a government position in echelon. PC made a firm statement regarding the acting MoFA because of his aptitude in his job. how is this spineless? the FA team in Echelon could have done a little better job with keeping their protectorates documented. [font="Arial Black"][size="5"][u][i][b]a quick edit after the fact and then lies about the timing is pretty bad form.[/b][/i][/u][/size][/font] [/quote] And... [quote name='FreddieMercury' date='11 March 2010 - 10:27 PM' timestamp='1268368345' post='2222960'] I just find it fascinating that you could possibly miss all of the blustering people did about [i]absolutely refusing to pay reps[/i]. It was quite nauseating at times. [/quote] Read Above. [quote name='x Tela x' date='11 March 2010 - 10:32 PM' timestamp='1268368677' post='2222973'] Thank you, PC. SBA didn't deserve the unwarranted aggression, and they didn't deserve the indifferent response to your mistakes. I'm glad that you're doing the right thing, even if it did take 40 pages to sink in. [/quote] 40 pages of mind numbing BS, childish finger pointing, and idiocy did NOTHING to help the situation. Neither did having "members" / "ambassadors" / "diplomats" (hey, whatever you want to TRY and write them as, they are not ACTIVE GOVERNMENT) act as your MOFA, or pretend like he is for 3 days...I'm glad to have less of a headache over something that should have been settled more amicably. P.S. No, I'm not sad that Echelon decided to ban specific members of our alliance from your chat room, but grow up and grow a pair. Also, let you leaders lead, and your members be members. P.P.S. "It's discouraging to think how many people are shocked by honesty and how few by deceit.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamemaster1 Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 There were definitely mistakes made on both sides, some more "intentional" then others. Good show, PC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush Sykes Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Augusta Antonia' date='11 March 2010 - 11:44 PM' timestamp='1268369384' post='2222995'] Glad to see SBA will be taken care of, but seriously...people congratulating PC and "good show" etc...come on...it's plaintively obvious that the ONLY reason PC is making good on reps to SBA is because of all the bad PR they received. Anyone who thinks otherwise or pretends it is for any reason other than that is living in the proverbial land of make believe... [/quote] Coming from someone who served in government of an alliance that totally renegged on agreed terms(ironically enough, negotiated by Tela on AE's behalf at the time), this is pretty rich. I suppose that restitution only matters, and is the only important thing, if it serves your own agenda. Edit: to the OP... This is why I love my allies. Twisted and CK Edited March 12, 2010 by Rush Sykes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newhotness Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='foxfire99' date='11 March 2010 - 11:45 PM' timestamp='1268369470' post='2222997'] The sarcasm is apreciated. Still, I find it unlikely that you just forgot. Firstly, it happened very recently. Second, the entire thread was right there to reference, had you so desired. And third, it makes no sense whatsoever. When have raiders ever paid reps to an alliances protector? [/quote] just drop it. youre trying to make something out of nothing. FreddieMercury, who also raised the same question, understood what i was saying in my post. why cant you? why does everything have to have some sort of hidden meaning? did you ever stop to think that i dont spend my days staring at OWF? just because something was posted recently doesnt mean its fresh on my mind. take it for face value and move on. you wont find what youre looking for here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augusta Antonia Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Schad' date='11 March 2010 - 11:49 PM' timestamp='1268369679' post='2223001'] If that's the case, is it a bad thing? Better that alliances respond to public pressure if a mistake is made and correct it than they don't. [/quote] Oh I completely agree, however it's utter foolishness to applaud PC for doing what they should have done to begin with as if they are being righteous rather than caving to public pressure...Call it for what it is, not for what PC & Company's PR spin wants it to be seen as... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augusta Antonia Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Rush Sykes' date='11 March 2010 - 11:52 PM' timestamp='1268369867' post='2223006'] Coming from someone who served in government of an alliance that totally renegged on agreed terms(ironically enough, negotiated by Tela on AE's behalf at the time), this is pretty rich. I suppose that restitution only matters, and is the only important thing, if it serves your own agenda. [/quote] Please elaborate??? I'm honestly not sure what you're referencing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fernando Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 [quote name='Augusta Antonia' date='11 March 2010 - 10:44 PM' timestamp='1268369384' post='2222995'] Glad to see SBA will be taken care of, but seriously...people congratulating PC and "good show" etc...come on...it's plaintively obvious that the ONLY reason PC is making good on reps to SBA is because of all the bad PR they received. Anyone who thinks otherwise or pretends it is for any reason other than that is living in the proverbial land of make believe... [/quote] I don't really see us handling our business in our way, in good time, as a good show, in good faith, and being fair seeing as what has transpired, what bad PR is there. In all honesty, our friend are our friends, allies our allies, enemies enemies, ect. Nothing is new, and new friends were gained in the process. Did you gain something from trying to bring down the resolution of so many peoples good time the past few days? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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