Jump to content

What's the oldest, still active, Treaty in CN?


Recommended Posts

[quote name='Aeternos Astramora' date='04 March 2010 - 11:02 PM' timestamp='1267743965' post='2214142']
It doesn't matter whether you hate each other. You don't break treaties. PC broke it. Breaking the treaty canceled it, but the breaking of the treaty still occurred. However, this is off-topic.

I think it would be awesome if the MCXA-IRON treaty was the longest treaty with a defensive close. I remember most of IRON being like "wtf?" when Freezer signed it saying that it was either treaty them or get rolled by FAN.
[/quote]

Get the $%&@ off your high horse, treaties are broken all the time. You're going to tell me that a treaty that was FORCED upon one of the parties is something that was to be kept and honoured? I don't think so. And as I said, neither party was going to honour that treaty, TPF just lost the draw on that one.

edit; and whether you like it or not, whether you want to believe it or not, that treaty was going to be broken by TPF. TPF had no intentions at all of honouring that treaty, if push came to shove. They were simply too slow, because, and trust me on this, there is no love for Poison Clan in TPF, and there is no love for TPF in poison clan, and there never has been anything close.

Edited by astronaut jones
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 131
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

[quote name='astronaut jones' date='04 March 2010 - 05:04 PM' timestamp='1267744073' post='2214144']
Get the $%&@ off your high horse, treaties are broken all the time. You're going to tell me that a treaty that was FORCED upon one of the parties is something that was to be kept and honoured? [/quote]
Yes. It has a cancellation period on it. USE IT! Breaking a treaty is totally dishonorable.

[quote]edit; and whether you like it or not, whether you want to believe it or not, that treaty was going to be broken by TPF. TPF had no intentions at all of honouring that treaty, if push came to shove. They were simply too slow, because, and trust me on this, there is no love for Poison Clan in TPF, and there is no love for TPF in poison clan, and there never has been anything close.[/quote]
Oh, sure it was. Of course, you can't prove it at all. It's completely impossible. Ironically, anybody on the TOP/IRON side of this war that says, "CnG was going to attack us anyway," is ridiculed by everyone on your side.

The fact remains that the PC-TPF treaty breaking was one of the most egregious in CN history.

Edited by Aeternos Astramora
Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Aeternos Astramora' date='04 March 2010 - 11:12 PM' timestamp='1267744548' post='2214153']
Yes. It has a cancellation period on it. USE IT! Breaking a treaty is totally dishonorable.


Oh, sure it was. Of course, you can't prove it at all. It's completely impossible. Ironically, anybody on the TOP/IRON side of this war that says, "CnG was going to attack us anyway," is ridiculed by everyone on your side.

The fact remains that the PC-TPF treaty breaking was one of the most egregious in CN history.
[/quote]

Only an idiot would expect an alliance to honour a treaty it was forced to sign. Only an idiot would be appalled when that treaty is broken.

Edited by astronaut jones
Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='astronaut jones' date='04 March 2010 - 05:14 PM' timestamp='1267744683' post='2214154']Only an idiot would expect an alliance to honour a treaty it was forced to sign. Only an idiot would be appalled when that treaty is broken.[/quote]
Are you saying TPF didn't expect PC to break the treaty? That's a separate issue. The fact is the PC did break the treaty.

Article 3: Cancellation
Either Party may cancel this agreement. Once one party notifies the other with their intent to cancel, the Pact stays in effect for 10 days. If either party breaks the pact, it is considered null and void.

You broke the pact when you could have canceled it. You might have been forced to sign it. I don't know. However, you still could have canceled it. It's right there.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='04 March 2010 - 06:02 PM' timestamp='1267743964' post='2214141']
No longer active.



Seeing as the original MHA-Gre MDP [b]did[/b] have a cancellation clause and was superseded by Harmlins, I would say that the above announcement included it.
[/quote]
Good point, you're right.

Edited by Sandwich Controversy
Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Aeternos Astramora' date='04 March 2010 - 11:17 PM' timestamp='1267744860' post='2214155']
Are you saying TPF didn't expect PC to break the treaty? That's a separate issue. The fact is the PC did break the treaty.

Article 3: Cancellation
Either Party may cancel this agreement. Once one party notifies the other with their intent to cancel, the Pact stays in effect for 10 days. If either party breaks the pact, it is considered null and void.

You broke the pact when you could have canceled it. You might have been forced to sign it. I don't know. However, you still could have canceled it. It's right there.
[/quote]

That's not what I said at all. I suggest you think a little harder.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Rocky Horror' date='04 March 2010 - 05:14 PM' timestamp='1267741108' post='2214082']
LoSS were made to disappear from alliance politics for ages, by the NPO, if I recall. I can find no record of it on the wiki, but I do have some recollection of a period where they were allowed to do nothing outside of their own AA.
[/quote]


LoSS never disbanded. As was mentioned, during Polar War II, some members ghosted NAAC, but I wouldn't really count that as a disbandment as I believe not everyone hopped over (I wasn't around then to know). Plus, it was before the FCC treaty.

Part of our VE surrender terms from GW3 was forced neutrality, which was enforced through three different bodies of power at 3 different times (VE, then WUT, then NPO), however, we were allowed to keep all of our treaties, but anything mutual defense was downgraded. Legitimately, we kept [i]real[/i] quiet, but we most certainly existed, and the FCC-LoSS sister treaty was valid through that time and is now, even though we're connected through Noir, which is an even stronger treaty :P

Link to post
Share on other sites

So aside from the bickering, we have discovered that the TTK-RIA NAP is the oldest active treaty, and IRON-MCXA MADP is the oldest active military treaty, am I right? Woo! :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Jens of the desert' date='04 March 2010 - 01:48 PM' timestamp='1267739505' post='2214033']
Also, read the wording of the treaty, we followed it to the letter.
[/quote]

Stop trying to e-lawyer, you just look like a fool. You didn't follow the spirit of the treaty and in my mind that's essentially all that matters.


[quote name='astronaut jones' date='04 March 2010 - 02:58 PM' timestamp='1267743718' post='2214132']
-snip-
[/quote]

Still had a treaty. If they hated them they should have canceled it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='astronaut jones' date='04 March 2010 - 04:58 PM' timestamp='1267743718' post='2214132']
I know I said that I was ordered to keep radio silence, but I still monitor these channels, as my spaceship is still flying high above planet bob, waiting for clearance to re-enter the atmosphere. It'll take 3 or 4 days they said, but whatever, in the meantime I have to say this.

No one in their right mind can say that the treaty between PC and TPF was signed out of anything other than fear, duress, or whatever other negative term you can think of. It was not a treaty that would have otherwise existed if it were not necessary for PC to get out of terms with TPF. Neither alliance liked each other, and neither alliance was going to honour that treaty.

Many of the people in Poison Clan, those that started Poison Clan, came from TPF, and virtually every single one left because of what they at the time thought was, for lack of a better phrase, TPF starting to suck !@#$@#$ $@!. There was no love for TPF in poison clan, and there was even less love for poison clan in TPF. To hold the breaking of that treaty over Poison Clan's head is just foolish, as, as I have stated already, that treaty would never have been signed if it was not for the fact that it had to be signed, or PC would have been held under terms for a very long time. Taking away raiding from PC would be like taking away tech from TOP.

So, yeah.. you can hold that over Poison Clan, you can hold that treaty over their head if you want to, but neither side cared for the other, neither side liked each other, that treaty would not have been signed if not for it being forced on PC, and it would have been broken by either side the very first chance they got. If PC waited, probably a DAY, TPF would have broke that treaty.
[/quote]

This absurdity keeps getting regurgitated and will continue to be parroted unless it's disputed. The notion that TPF wanted to roll PC ridiculous. If that was the case, TPF would have rolled them instead of pushing for the NAP. Or still rolled them after the NAP.

Also, I had no idea about the TTK-RIA NAP being so old. Nice to learn something in a thread for once.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='zzniperr' date='04 March 2010 - 06:46 PM' timestamp='1267746615' post='2214198']
So aside from the bickering, we have discovered that the TTK-RIA NAP is the oldest active treaty, and IRON-MCXA MADP is the oldest active military treaty, am I right? Woo! :D
[/quote]

If we're going off of continuous treaties, treaties that were once suspended shouldn't count.

It is much more interesting to find which treaties have literally stood with 100% continuity for the longest.

VE reformed in September, 2007, so the GOD treaty signed in October, 2007 is our oldest treaty, and probably one of the oldest in CN that has been 100% continuous.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I would still count treaties that were temporarily suspended due to war as continuous.

In any case I do not believe RIA or TTK have ever lost a war or accepted surrender terms, although both MCXA and IRON had their treaties suspended by the Karma War.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='04 March 2010 - 04:16 PM' timestamp='1267748382' post='2214250']


In any case I do not believe RIA have ever lost a war or accepted surrender terms.
[/quote]


RIA lost UJW iirc. I don't know about TTK.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Aeternos Astramora' date='05 March 2010 - 12:06 AM' timestamp='1267747794' post='2214232']
What's not what you said? I quoted you exactly and responded appropriately.
[/quote]

What I said and what you thought I said were two completely different things entirely. What I said and what you hoped I meant are even further apart.

I suggest you think over what I said. I never knew you were someone that needed everything spelled out to the last letter.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Mr Damsky' date='04 March 2010 - 03:55 PM' timestamp='1267747130' post='2214208']
Still had a treaty. If they hated them they should have canceled it.
[/quote]
The NAP had two methods of cancellation. One was a waiting period, one was a DoW. The NAP was specifically written (by TPF) to provide for that clause to be used in the future and PC happened to use it first.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I vividly remember signing the Blue Steel Accords way back in the day. Furytear was awesome. It was something that was a fairly big deal in those days, especially since it was with IRON. It's still hard to believe that is the oldest continuously active defense treaty in BOB today. However odd it may seem to me, it is definitely something I'm proud of and is real interesting to look back on things.

Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Choader' date='04 March 2010 - 05:14 PM' timestamp='1267751851' post='2214332']
The NAP had two methods of cancellation. One was a waiting period, one was a DoW. The NAP was specifically written (by TPF) to provide for that clause to be used in the future and PC happened to use it first.
[/quote]
Unless I see mhawk saying "Muahhahaha we're going to roll PC one day so we put this clause in. THEY'LL NEVER SEE IT COMING *evil laugh here*" then your argument is terrible and you're a fool.

Also it's a Non Aggression Pact you don't honor a [b]NON[/b] Aggression Pact by being aggressive.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...