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An apology on my Tech Raiding


Clash
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I made this post in another thread, and I'm quoting it here as it's relevant:

Personally, I think the decline in people joining TE is because if you aren't in a big alliance, you get tech raided to death and can barely play. You can't be in a small alliance, you certainly can't be unaligned. You just get killed and almost never make it over 2000ns. Not everyone wants to be in a big alliance, or in ANY alliance. Yet that's about the only place you can go and have a least a chance to make it big enough to get nukes, for example. In theory people who are months away from nukes in SE can get them in a couple of weeks in TE. There's some fun! In practice it doesn't always work that way.

I think people have gotten better at tech-raiding over the sessions, too. People watch the war screens, looking for nations who were just raided, because they will have low soldier counts. When I first started and was unaligned, I got hit by two and three people in a row. I got crushed and it stank. Some jerks will tech raid you two-three times in a row, because you were just the perfect size for them. This is why I joined an alliance in the first place.

When nations 50-100% bigger than you kill you, all the time, there's not much you can do to fight back. Cruise missiles, ooooo. That's fun, right. I think it's why so many people don't come back. If you have a good time, then you do. If you don't then why bother?

This is part of the reason why I support protectorate treaties for smaller alliances, and I don't give a crap what anyone else thinks about that. They will have at least a chance to get bigger nations and to have a bit of fun. They might have even fights, instead of mass tech raids. TPF will continue to do that as long as I have any input on it. And I don't much care what anyone else thinks about it, either.

Today I raided a nation that belonged to a smaller alliance, then offered peace of course as usual. Eh, I needed the land and wanted the tech. I won both GAs with a left-over deployment, always good. He gave me peace right away, which was also good for a tech raid - that's the best result. However he immediately deleted his nation right afterward, which isn't. Awww. I'm sure it wasn't just me, he'd probably been raided a bunch of times this session already and just got sick of it. But still, that sucks.

At any rate I feel awfully guilty for driving that poor fellow out of TE like that. My apologies to bdiah, wherever he's gone off to (probably SE, where it's probably safer). I hearby cease all tech raiding for the rest of the session out of guilt cause I'm most likely incredibly ebil. I also dedicate the first nuke I drop on someone this session to his memory.

That's all.

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aahw well... 90% of the players raid others... it could have been someone else... don't feel yourself that guilty mate... have fun the rest of the round :)

allthough he got an point in that pm that you keep getting raided when you haven't got any alliance.

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I made this post in another thread, and I'm quoting it here as it's relevant:

Today I raided a nation that belonged to a smaller alliance, then offered peace of course as usual. Eh, I needed the land and wanted the tech. I won both GAs with a left-over deployment, always good. He gave me peace right away, which was also good for a tech raid - that's the best result. However he immediately deleted his nation right afterward, which isn't. Awww. I'm sure it wasn't just me, he'd probably been raided a bunch of times this session already and just got sick of it. But still, that sucks.

At any rate I feel awfully guilty for driving that poor fellow out of TE like that. My apologies to bdiah, wherever he's gone off to (probably SE, where it's probably safer). I hearby cease all tech raiding for the rest of the session out of guilt cause I'm most likely incredibly ebil. I also dedicate the first nuke I drop on someone this session to his memory.

That's all.

Amen, Clash. I have also ceased all tech raiding for mostly the same reasons and I agree w/ you 100%. Its much more fun and honorable to flex your war skills by battling in fair, challenging wars. Just another reason, my friend, that I love fighting and playing along side of you in TPF:TE! -- Wasteland

Edited by Hunger
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sorry Clash but guess i'll have to disagree...TE is about, simply, war...you even sign up knowing that and all tech raiding is really is a mini-war. if you choose not to join an alliance that is your choice, if you havent really found an alliance that interests you can still join one and learn about other alliances through diplomacy/alliance wars

if you decide to play by yourself then you basically agree that you are free game to tech raiders/people trying to learn how to war. you can choose to either just accept that you lost or you can make it so the attacker loses more than he gained, i personally like the latter.

also with how TE is set up, if you choose to reroll your nation you can shoot up to 1700+ NS your first day (i should know, when i really got into TE, i logged onto my account which was in anarchy and had 4 wars going...i just simply attacked them back, rerolled and got back out there)

if you basically condemn tech raiding then all TE will become is another CN:SE/building contest with the occasional alliance war which would just be boring

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Contrary to popular mythology, I am not nor have I ever been against tech-raiding or any other kind of war. What I am against is violence w/o risk or consequences. I am against growing at the expense of others w/o considering how this affects the greater community. I am also against having independent nations disproportionately regarded as tech cows/punching bags for wimps who hide behind alliances looking for easy victims.

Doing so hurts us all. Having operated amongst the non-aligned for so long, I can tell you that there are nations out there who are fiercely independent and would never join one of your alliances. They are willing to endure what they must to stay out of your hierarchy and off of your message boards. But it becomes wearisome after a while and we all have our limits.

NONE stands as a compromise for non-aligned who wish to retain their sovereignty, but still have some means to secure a modicum of protection -- and connecting with the like-minded.

Some say that these people don't contribute to the alliance system, role-play, etc. I say so what? There is a place for independent nations and we need them. We all know how difficult it is to get and keep trades. We should should not drive our trading partners away by eating our own. We should in fact defend our trading partners, even if they are non-aligned.

OOC: There is an old interview with Admin who explained that he intended for rivalries to emerge around the color teams.

I think that would be something to consider: Which color team is safest and which is neglectful of its members' security? Which color has solid, reliable trades? Which one is growing and which is shrinking? Which color is it safest to be an independent nation?

Edited by Walford
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i would but you outta my range lol :P

not to mention if i attacked you i get jumped instantly by 3 other TPF >.> <.< lol

I lol'd!

Really what happened, happens...But it could have been that he just wanted to re-roll, this is of course possible even if not likely.

You just never really know what happens once you move on to other raids, the irony is TE is about WAR/raiding and if people

can't understand that the chances of surviving in that atmosphere with out maintaining that mentality and or joining an alliance of some kind,

then they are probably better off quitting TE, albeit an unaligned nation in SE isn't any better off.

BG.

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Being non-aligned in Standard is considerably worse. In TE, there is the option of alliance people turning on each other. In Standard, they just sit there and stew, waiting for the next major war and consume the non-aligned in the meantime.

Planet Bob has been a post-apocalyptic world for a long time now. Many don't even remember what it was like when non-aligned were largely left alone so long as they didn't start anything -- and there were thousands more nations than there are now.

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Being non-aligned in Standard is considerably worse. In TE, there is the option of alliance people turning on each other. In Standard, they just sit there and stew, waiting for the next major war and consume the non-aligned in the meantime.

Planet Bob has been a post-apocalyptic world for a long time now. Many don't even remember what it was like when non-aligned were largely left alone so long as they didn't start anything -- and there were thousands more nations than there are now.

Yeah i remember when i first started i was unalligned for about a month till i was raided, then i joined TPF.

Things have just got worse since then, guess its the cost of Tech and growth of so many large nations.

c'mon BG i was in TPF...i know how you all work, crushing every lil man's hopes and dreams ;)

True that! :P

BG.

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I believe Clash is too generous ^_^

Fundamentally, weak ones whether it's a human, animals, nations, etc, it gets perish by the stronger ones. After all, "our history on this planet is the result of evolution, and most important part of evolution is survival of the fittest." If Clash force bdiah to extinction, "it would just be another group [or individual] in the long history of our planet that wasn't fit for survival."

But again, I truly believe Clash has a kind heart :wub: .

Edited by Jarhead
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Contrary to popular mythology, I am not nor have I ever been against tech-raiding or any other kind of war.

Lol - There are Myths about Walford ??? :blink:

Who ?

I didn't even
:unsure:

I'z heard Lolz & Yawnz - Myths ?, nah - neva heard them
:lol1:

..... and most important part of evolution is Survival of the fittest

.....

Correct :rolleyes:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Raiding is such an integral part of TE - it should be compulsory

No Raids = You're Deleted
:awesome:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

My attitude towards raids is as Follows

  • Make up a list of targets
  • Send said list to said targets
    • Tell them they needs more soldiers
    • Voila - Moar Casualties !! Yay :)

    [*]If anyone wants to see my latest list - it's Here

    • Kill, Kill, Maim, Burn :ehm:

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Fundamentally, weak ones whether it's a human, animals, nations, etc, it gets perish by the stronger ones. After all, "our history on this planet is the result of evolution, and most important part of evolution is survival of the fittest."
Survival of the fittest is one thing, but a paradigm in which success is only granted to those with the most weapons and who are most ruthless in using them actually puts a limit to what the community as a whole can achieve and thus what we as individual can hope to attain.

TE is is fine for experimenting with warfare and blowing off steam, because our nations expire. In Standard, there is no civilization; it is only gang warfare fighting over rubble. Entire classes of people have been driven away as we have exchanged a nation simulation for a one-dimensional war game. Not only have many of the independent-minded been hounded out of existence, thousands who were interested in role-play, economic development, diplomacy have left us as there is no place for them.

Let there be a Survival of the Fittest in Standard. Let us consider whether those who are driving off our trading partners, keeping the total number of nations stagnant for nearly 3 years and leaving no room for civilization should be permitted to do what they do with impunity.

There is no central law or government here, and I am against that. But we can collectively, in groups or as individuals choose to make unprovoked aggression unprofitable and help foster growth and civilization here once again.

If there are going to be gangs of criminals in a lawless world, let there also be vigilantes who keep them in check. We don't operate in a vacuum; we need each other and not just as tech-cows and punching bags.

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Lol - There are Myths about Walford ??? :blink:

Who ?

I didn't even
:unsure:

I'z heard Lolz & Yawnz - Myths ?, nah - neva heard them
:lol1:

Correct :rolleyes:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Raiding is such an integral part of TE - it should be compulsory

No Raids = You're Deleted
:awesome:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

My attitude towards raids is as Follows

  • Make up a list of targets
  • Send said list to said targets
    • Tell them they needs more soldiers
    • Voila - Moar Casualties !! Yay :)

    [*]If anyone wants to see my latest list - it's Here

    • Kill, Kill, Maim, Burn :ehm:

Crap. I'm next. :(

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