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Nemesis Announcment


draov

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I would not refer to him as "WC" as that is WarriorConcept to me and WorldConqueror wouldn't qualify to collect WarriorConcept's used tissues.

You forgot to congratulate Nemesis on this new government of theirs!

Here: i'll do it for you:

Congrats guys! this is AWESOME!

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I don't have any particular soft spot for Nemesis but the fact that they've selected a government without a founder in, after so long in existence, is not laughable but is actually a sign of alliance maturity.

Respect.

I would not refer to him as "WC" as that is WarriorConcept to me and WorldConqueror wouldn't qualify to collect WarriorConcept's used tissues.

Also, I was just going to offer WorldConqueror some Midol, but you have, in a much more articulate fashion, summed up what the rest of the more intelligent members of the OWRP were thinking. Well done.

I haven't found myself in such utter agreement with you in quite a while but this post does it for me. :awesome:

That's what I was thinking, too. :awesome:

Also T.Hubb!

Okay, this thread is complete now.

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Look's like WC has found a new target alliance.

I'll attempt to address his original point. A turnover of government is actually a sign of alliance health, because it means that there's more than three people who are active and informed enough to take up those roles. Considering the alliance you're a part of, I'd have thought this year's events would have brought home to you how having a clique of immovable figures at the top of alliance government can result in bad decisions – the NPO IOs and Emperor coming into Karma were the ultimate 'faded all-star alliance'.

I don't have any particular soft spot for Nemesis but the fact that they've selected a government without a founder in, after so long in existence, is not laughable but is actually a sign of alliance maturity.

I have many, it just depends which one happens to cross my bridge at the time.

Unfortunately you seem to have missed my point. I'm not saying that a change in government is bad thing. I am saying that Nemesis was built upon the reputations of the original triumvirate, and now they are gone Nemesis is lacking any redeeming features. Whatever your opinion of the original triumvirate (and my opinion of it is not too flattering) you have to admit that they were Nemesis's drawcard.

Considering the alliance you were up until recently a part of, I would have thought you would recognize the utility of stability of government.

You are yet to state a single reason that leads you to believe they are incompetent. None of what Blacky has said is definitive proof of their competence, but when you have active leaders who have been elected into governments time and time again in various alliances around the Cyberverse it starts to build up a case for those people being competent at the very least. Particularly when it's put up against your rebuttal which so far appears to amount to 'they're not the original government' and nothing else. Provide some substance to your point because aside from Blacky administering various tests to each member of the government and publishing the results for all to see I can't see what else you're expecting him to do.

Ok, off the top of my head, I seem to remember daggarz leading an alliance that fell in a heap, Nemesis has stagnated for a month, daggarz's performance in this thread, squandering the political capital they inherited to allow Nemesis to become an uninteresting generic alliance, the issues with your allies in the war, allowing Blacky to spread that mess over the OWF, Blacky. And I keep asking exactly what Nemesis has actually done since its founding since it is fairly easy to avoid screwing up if you aren't actually doing anything.

People's initial opinions on Nemesis were built upon that perhaps. Then again, a lot of people have either taken the time to read OWF posts, looked at our actions in and after the Karma war, and taken time to know Nemesis outside of the original triumvirate and are far more qualified to make an assessment than someone who seems to know nothing of Nemesis' workings or actions at all. Maybe you have an over-inflated view of the original trio, or maybe you simply do not know enough of the current trio, but Yawoo has been in the Triumvirate for as long as the originals were now and is simply one of the best leaders I've ever worked under.

Your opinion is made up vastly of assumptions that others hold the same views as you, and where gaps in your knowledge appear you seem to fill them with what fits your point.

[Edit: confidence =/= competence]

I have read a lot of Nemesis's OWF posts, and Blacky and Randleman's posts are the ones that stick out (and yes I know Randleman is no longer in Nemesis), and they didn't exactly endear you to me. And yes, I saw your actions in the Karma war, not sure why you'd think I'd be impressed. You keep telling me my negative opinion of you is based on nothing. Yet you can give me no examples of something to build a positive image on.

I would not refer to him as "WC" as that is WarriorConcept to me and WorldConqueror wouldn't qualify to collect WarriorConcept's used tissues.

Also, I was just going to offer WorldConqueror some Midol, but you have, in a much more articulate fashion, summed up what the rest of the more intelligent members of the OWRP were thinking. Well done.

Ah, and the legendary master of switching sides appears. I'm flattered you think attacking me is a good way to show your newly-discovered anti-NPO feelings that, of course, you held the entire time.

And I'll have you know I have quite a collection of those tissues, all vacuum sealed and labelled with the date and time of use.

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Ok, off the top of my head, I seem to remember daggarz leading an alliance that fell in a heap, Nemesis has stagnated for a month, daggarz's performance in this thread, squandering the political capital they inherited to allow Nemesis to become an uninteresting generic alliance, the issues with your allies in the war, allowing Blacky to spread that mess over the OWF, Blacky. And I keep asking exactly what Nemesis has actually done since its founding since it is fairly easy to avoid screwing up if you aren't actually doing anything.

Finally we're getting somewhere. The only alliance I recall Daggarz leading was an innovative concept where new members were required to duel with a current member for acceptance once a member limit was reached. Sure he could have made a generic alliance, recruited noobs and trundled along with 50 inactive members at 5k ANS but he tried something interesting and tried to bring something new to the Cyberverse. Guess he should have just gone with dull and safe. I'm not sure why you believe Nemesis to be a generic and uninteresting alliance to be honest. Maybe we don't interest you? So what? We're not trying to. Nemesis is a tight knit community and I don't agree with generic at all. I can count the alliances on 1 hand that enforce a rigourous Q&A session spanning over 72 hours before entry, and then enforces activity levels and contribution to the alliance from all members lest they face expulsion. It's different before you're even in the alliance.

As for allowing Blacky to post that thread, nobody in the alliance had any idea he planned to do it. It's similar to me blaming NPO if you decided to randomly declare war on me tomorrow. Nemesis doesn't restrict it's member's rights to free speech, however you can be sure that Blacky was reminded of the responsibilities that go with that right after he posted the thread. Not the greatest idea no, but I'd rather have an alliance alive with differing opinions and debates than a brainwashed mass who are either inactive or just follow the grain their entire lives.

I have read a lot of Nemesis's OWF posts, and Blacky and Randleman's posts are the ones that stick out (and yes I know Randleman is no longer in Nemesis), and they didn't exactly endear you to me. And yes, I saw your actions in the Karma war, not sure why you'd think I'd be impressed. You keep telling me my negative opinion of you is based on nothing. Yet you can give me no examples of something to build a positive image on.

Shock horror, you don't appreciate Blacky's posts. Someone who is vocally anti-NPO. I have no idea who Randleman is by the way, we have no previous members by that name, and no vocal OWF posters that resemble it. As for our actions in the karma war, we had the highest blitz ratio at 102% of any alliance in the war on either side. We defended our allies without hesitation, and fought with honour against everyone we encountered. Aside from fighting for the NPO I'm not sure what more we could have done in your eyes. I'm sure you'll let me know.

I was telling you that your negative opinion of our elected government was based on nothing other than 'they aren't the original government' because that's all you had said until your latest post, not about your opinion of our alliance. At least now you provided an opinion on them, albeit directing all of the vitriol at one government member only. As for your opinion of our alliance, you seem to be expecting something groundbreaking and I'm not sure what's given you the impression we're at all interested in meeting those expectations. It amuses me no end that NSO is lauded by some for their innovative policies regarding ZI listed members and white peace when it's something Nemesis has been practicing since our inception.

Edited by Poyplemonkeys
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WorldConqueror, that's a rather poor show, friend.

Here's a tip that might help make you a better commenter:

If you don't like an alliance and really have it out for them, wait until they actually screw up, collect your indisputable facts, and hammer them mercilessly with them. Trying to debate things that fall closer to the category of opinion only shows your bias.

If some time passes where they don't screw up, perhaps you should revise your opinion.

Crapping on someone's government announcement isn't usually well received either, even between foes. Had you just voiced your disapproval with that first post, that probably would have been sufficient to let them know you weren't friends, but to continue on like you did didn't score you any points for yourself or your alliance.

Remember, when dealing with people, even when dealing with those you don't like: being a gentleman never goes out of style.

That's all I wanted to say.

Also, congrats to Nemesis on their new government.

Edited by Kzoppistan
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Considering the alliance you were up until recently a part of, I would have thought you would recognize the utility of stability of government.

I'm not sure what point you were trying to make, but the composition of the Grämlins Conclave changes almost every month. Recently, it has been more stable (two incumbents re-elected in the last two months) and the alliance has been doing less well.

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Finally we're getting somewhere. The only alliance I recall Daggarz leading was an innovative concept where new members were required to duel with a current member for acceptance once a member limit was reached. Sure he could have made a generic alliance, recruited noobs and trundled along with 50 inactive members at 5k ANS but he tried something interesting and tried to bring something new to the Cyberverse. Guess he should have just gone with dull and safe. I'm not sure why you believe Nemesis to be a generic and uninteresting alliance to be honest. Maybe we don't interest you? So what? We're not trying to. Nemesis is a tight knit community and I don't agree with generic at all. I can count the alliances on 1 hand that enforce a rigourous Q&A session spanning over 72 hours before entry, and then enforces activity levels and contribution to the alliance from all members lest they face expulsion. It's different before you're even in the alliance.

And his experience with that makes him competent? Interesting me would be nice, but at least bring something to the table. I mean, the thing you hold up as something different and interesting about Nemesis is your admissions process? That you admit is used by other alliances? I mean, come on, give me something. What is the culture of Nemesis? What does it mean to be a member of Nemesis? What are its goals? Why does it exist now that its original purpose of being a Hoo/Bob/Soccerbum cheerleading squad is gone? There must be something in there you are proud of, right?

As for allowing Blacky to post that thread, nobody in the alliance had any idea he planned to do it. It's similar to me blaming NPO if you decided to randomly declare war on me tomorrow. Nemesis doesn't restrict it's member's rights to free speech, however you can be sure that Blacky was reminded of the responsibilities that go with that right after he posted the thread. Not the greatest idea no, but I'd rather have an alliance alive with differing opinions and debates than a brainwashed mass who are either inactive or just follow the grain their entire lives.

Ok, so maybe you couldn't have stopped the thread being posted, but how long Blacky keep posting there? Quite a while, IIRC. Not the actions of a highly competent government. And surely the needs of your alliance should come before a members desire to show off their shiny new opinion?

Shock horror, you don't appreciate Blacky's posts. Someone who is vocally anti-NPO. I have no idea who Randleman is by the way, we have no previous members by that name, and no vocal OWF posters that resemble it. As for our actions in the karma war, we had the highest blitz ratio at 102% of any alliance in the war on either side. We defended our allies without hesitation, and fought with honour against everyone we encountered. Aside from fighting for the NPO I'm not sure what more we could have done in your eyes. I'm sure you'll let me know.

Wait, so you say I should take your OWF posts into account, yet when I do you say its no surprise I don't like them? So what was your point again? And the other one was Rickyman, good old Rickyman1984. Which I'm sure you knew. The very fact that your blitz percentage is 102% shows somebody screwed up the numbers somewhere. Yay, you defended your allies. Unless you are being compared to ODN, that's not particularly impressive, it is simply expected. And IIRC, some of your former allies weren't happy with your conduct in the war.

I was telling you that your negative opinion of our elected government was based on nothing other than 'they aren't the original government' because that's all you had said until your latest post, not about your opinion of our alliance. At least now you provided an opinion on them, albeit directing all of the vitriol at one government member only. As for your opinion of our alliance, you seem to be expecting something groundbreaking and I'm not sure what's given you the impression we're at all interested in meeting those expectations. It amuses me no end that NSO is lauded by some for their innovative policies regarding ZI listed members and white peace when it's something Nemesis has been practicing since our inception.

Because you made it about the competence of your current government. As I explained before, my original post was making the point that Nemesis had lost its only drawcard, and now all those lofty expectations for the alliance have come crashing down. But you kept pushing for an opinion on this government, and I gave it. You addressed 3 of my points, free feel to address the others. I'm not asking for something groundbreaking, I'm asking for a reason for Nemesis to exist now that its cult heroes have left it, a reason beyond "cuz we is friends an we wubz each overss hugglehuggle".

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WorldConqueror, that's a rather poor show, friend.

Here's a tip that might help make you a better commenter:

If you don't like an alliance and really have it out for them, wait until they actually screw up, collect your indisputable facts, and hammer them mercilessly with them. Trying to debate things that fall closer to the category of opinion only shows your bias.

If some time passes where they don't screw up, perhaps you should revise your opinion.

Crapping on someone's government announcement isn't usually well received either, even between foes. Had you just voiced your disapproval with that first post, that probably would have been sufficient to let them know you weren't friends, but to continue on like you did didn't score you any points for yourself or your alliance.

Remember, when dealing with people, even when dealing with those you don't like: being a gentleman never goes out of style.

That's all I wanted to say.

Also, congrats to Nemesis on their new government.

This is all well and good. However, you seem to be missing the point that I made my comment, and was then drawn into a debate that was elaborated on and expanded by Nemesis members.

However, I do recognise that: being patronizing never goes out of style.

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This is all well and good. However, you seem to be missing the point that I made my comment, and was then drawn into a debate that was elaborated on and expanded by Nemesis members.

However, I do recognise that: being patronizing never goes out of style.

It's too bad you see it that way.

Edit: I wasn't being patronizing, I was passing on advice that was given to me one time, and has served me well since. That you reacted the way you did suggests you have hostility issues. Good luck getting that sorted out.

Edited by Kzoppistan
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Wait, so you say I should take your OWF posts into account, yet when I do you say its no surprise I don't like them? So what was your point again? And the other one was Rickyman, good old Rickyman1984. Which I'm sure you knew. The very fact that your blitz percentage is 102% shows somebody screwed up the numbers somewhere. Yay, you defended your allies. Unless you are being compared to ODN, that's not particularly impressive, it is simply expected. And IIRC, some of your former allies weren't happy with your conduct in the war.

Based on your inane arguments, I can't say I'm too broken up about you not liking me or Nemesis.

Why does it exist now that its original purpose of being a Hoo/Bob/Soccerbum cheerleading squad is gone? There must be something in there you are proud of, right?

What are you even arguing? That it was Hoo's personal alliance and should've gone away when he retired? Do you know what Nemesis going strong after Hoo, Bum, and Bob left means? It means it's not a Hoo cult and it's developed it's own community and identity. Your irrational hatred aside, Nemesis is more solid now than at just about any point in it's history. Nemesis is a tight knit group that has a lot of fun, isn't that enough of a reason to exist?

What can they be proud of? Nemesis can be proud of it's insane activity levels and in standing up for it's members when other alliances would have cast them aside (I can speak with personal experience on this, as I'm sure many others who have been/are in Nemesis can)

Those are just two things off the bat, but I'm sure you'd rather continue with your ridiculous tirade so don't let me stop you.

edit: switched nations to alliances, it was a typo. Sue me.

Edited by Rickyman1984
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Heh, nice edit there. Few seconds earlier and I woulda had it. But in answer to your question, I wouldn't know, be sure to inform me of the verdict when next seasons CN fashions are released.

Wow, how coincidental, they just have. Conveniently I happen to have the quarterly review, CN Vogue, right here. Let's see... oh, look at that, the main article is:

"How airing legitimate grievances gains more respect from the community than spewing vitriol."

But they do have a discount coupon for those that keep the world entertained by raising drama. I'll go ahead and sign you up.

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What are you even arguing? That it was Hoo's personal alliance and should've gone away when he retired? Do you know what Nemesis going strong after Hoo, Bum, and Bob left means? It means it's not a Hoo cult and it's developed it's own community and identity. Your irrational hatred aside, Nemesis is more solid now than at just about any point in it's history. Nemesis is a tight knit group that has a lot of fun, isn't that enough of a reason to exist?

What can they be proud of? Nemesis can be proud of it's insane activity levels and in standing up for it's members when other alliances would have cast them aside (I can speak with personal experience on this, as I'm sure many others who have been/are in Nemesis can)

Those are just two things off the bat, but I'm sure you'd rather continue with your ridiculous tirade so don't let me stop you.

edit: switched nations to alliances, it was a typo. Sue me.

It was a last-ditch attempt to get somebody to speak up about what Nemesis has to offer. That somebody that is no longer a member had to do it is kind of weird. So it's not a Hoo cult. What is it? That is a reason to exist, yes, but it's a reason to exist for every conceivable alliance under the sun. I wanted something that was specific to Nemesis, that couldn't be stretched to apply to any alliance, like GDI, /b/, NMBLA, DRDavidBanner's alliance. All of those were or could be tight-knit and having fun, doesn't really make a compelling case that they should, however. And yes, I'm going to extremes to make my point, but it seems I have to to get any kind of meaningful response. It took how long for somebody to finally give this half-hearted attempt at showing what makes Nemesis a good alliance?

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