kingzog Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Congratulations to two of my favorite alliances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tygaland Posted June 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 (edited) Ok, I can understand where you're coming from, however, I did take a look at the previous incarnation of the this treaty, and specifically, I was drawn to Article III, reprinted below for your convenience.Now, I certainly see your point that the following situation can happen: STA is MDP'd to NV. NV is MDP'd to alliance X. Alliance Y attacks Alliance X. So, there are two potential outcomes: (three, actually NV could cancel the MDP with Alliance X, but I don't think that's their style from what I've seen) NV's MDP with alliance X is activated. Therefore, NV is now engaged in a defensive action (especially if the wording is 'an attack on one is an attack on both' as is common in most MDP's) to assist Alliance X. Another school of thought is that NV is engaged in an aggressive action to 'defend' Alliance X (a school I don't ascribe to, but so I'm clear I'll address it) in which case your MDP, paragraph 3 of Article 3, would still cover. The article you reference is designed to make the treaty non-chaining. Meaning if NV went to war via the Aztec bloc and was subsequently attacked then our defence of NV via this treaty would become optional. The new clause, as I pointed out, allows us to go to war alongside NV even if they have not been declared upon by another alliance. For example: Example 1: Non-Chaining NV declares war on Alliance X via the Aztec bloc treaty Alliance Y attacks NV in defence of the alliance attacked by the Aztec bloc Under the non-chaining clause, any assistance to NV by the STA is voluntary as NV went to war via a 3rd party treaty even though their war against Alliance Y is defensive. Example 2: Optional Aggression Alliance X attacks an ally of NV not shared by the STA. NV defends their ally via their treaty but is outnumbered. No other alliances declare war on NV therefore not triggering the Defence clause of our treaty with them. Activating the oA clause the STA can attack those alliances at war with NV. Now, you have added an Optional Aggression clause. Forgive my long-windedness, but how exactly does an 'Optional' i.e. 'voluntary' aggression clause provide any more flexibility to defense than the bolded section of the previous version of this upgraded treaty cited above? I'm not trying to be obstinate, really. Ultimately, I see Article III as covering any anticipated situation quite well (I actually really like the way it's written), and I am failing to see how an 'optional aggression clause' adds any flexibility to the situation especially in light of Article III. See above. However, that being said, it is certainly the prerogative of both NV and STA to change the wording of an existing treaty to better reflect their true relationship and I wish you both well. If I have any further questions, I'll try to find you on IRC and I can stop mucking up this celebratory thread! Za' Sabir VI It is our prerogative, yes. And thanks for the example of e-lawyering I was referring to earlier. Edited June 26, 2009 by Tygaland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pd73bassman Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 This is good to see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drai Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 This pleases me. I would have to agree. Well played by both parties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vijaya Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Awesome people, awesome announcement, very all around o/ STA! o/ NV! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nosoup4you Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Excellent news! Congrats to both of you! o/ NV o/ STA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hizzy Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 MK beats NV to the punch.+1 MK used an oA clause written by me in their treaty. +9000!!! (for us) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buds The Man Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Dibs on BAPS. ORLY I would have thought you might go for some one else I love that Tyga guy. grrr baby, very grr. My day is now complete with a PA sighting very nice skirt you have there sir congrats to NV and STA on a nice treaty upgrade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Ghost Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 MK used an oA clause written by me in their treaty.+9000!!! (for us) How low can you get, MK? I mean really... Hizzy wrote it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owned-You Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 The Polar government would like to extend an official thanks to you for observing Nueva Vida's manipulations and machinations and bringing them to the attention of the Polar government. This new evidence will certainly demand a reconsideration of our ties to our friends Nueva Vida, now that it is clear they are...trying to...supplant us? Join our awesome bloc? It's a treaty upgrade dude. Relax. To help feed conspiracies (And more so for my own pleasure laughing at them) the Founder and first Emperor (He's reading these exact words in his head as I type them...crazy I tell you) was a high ranking member of NSO & currently presides in NpO. Clearly illustrating a sub-plot to the current hostilities and other drama indicating Vidia's secret plans to join Frostbite...and further yet create a Tiger-Jaguar Hybrid Army!!! You heard it here first folks. Also, I like this for obvious reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uralica Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 Awesomeness o/ STA o/ NV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heft Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 Our world has been shaken to its very core. There's no going back now. The rubicon has been crossed, the line traced, and sabers drawn. Nothing will ever be the same again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Mccole Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 Congratulations to two of my favorite alliances. you have bad taste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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