Final Decision

[Sumeragi]

I'm tired of arguing with the rapacious vultures and the sanctimous hypocrites, so I give up the debate on getting my land back.

HOWEVER, I would like the land to be split in the following ways, as a last request:

Centurius gets Karagandy Province, East Kazakhstan, Baikonur City, Mangystau, and Aktobe.

The rest of Russian Turkistan can be split up between Cochin and Justinian.

The rest of the leftover land will be Coby's (he already made a protectorate, I believe). He may work with Cenurius, but NOT Keshav, on dealing with the land.

I will NOT back out of this request, meaning . I'm sick of how I've been wiped without a good reason (no bad feelings towards Sargun, however), and fed up with the greediness of the people who love taking opportunity of such misfortunes.

[LeVentNoir]

No. Land will be split up according to RP. Land is split up IC, by IC actions. People who have conducted RP get the rewards they have earnt themselves. I will not be asking people to retcon legal RP, and indeed, asking such a thing is asking the impossible. The RP they conducted was legal, and cannot be taken back by any force.

OOC has no effect on the map nor the RP.

Edited April 25, 2009 by LeVentNoir

[Centurius]

Jesus LVN let her decide what happens serious.

[LeVentNoir]

Jesus LVN let her decide what happens serious.

It has clearly been in the Map thread OP for some time that only IC RP can affect claims and territory.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

If you start a war and leave, the lay of your land is determined by the forces which invaded you, not by yourself in the departure. I stand 100% behind LVN's decision on this. If you do not wish people "taking opportunity of such misfortunes" then don't be belligerent.

[Cody Seb]

Who is Coby?

[Lord Frost]

Bye Sumer

Making more threads to complain over yourself doesn't make the Final decision any less Final.

Edited April 25, 2009 by Lord Frost

[Subtleknifewielder]

I was my hands of this. You people clearly have your minds made up about Sumer, and not for to her benefit.

Was I the only one trying to be objective? People HAVE made requests as to what tshould be done with their land, and ues, in war situations too.

[Bacharth]

I'm on the same page as Subtle. However, I won't be as nice as I was now if something like this happens to you.

[Generalissimo]

The Roleplay was unresolved, but it’s between Sargun and Sumeragi. Considering Sargun has yet to speak on the matter it is pretty much in Sumeragi’s hands, or at the very least Sumeragi has some say… unless we all want to roleplay the whole thing out from where we left off.

[Sumeragi]

Well let's see

1. The Russian stuff is no more. Even Sargun recognized it.

2. I have a rigth to do it my way, given how I was WRONGLY wiped.

3. There is no clear-cut RP of Central Asia. I'm making it clear.

Now, LVN, should I go to a higher court, or will you stop sticking your nose into this business?

[LeVentNoir]

Well let's see

1. The Russian stuff is no more. Even Sargun recognized it.

Neither of you have the power to declear it non cannon, as no godmods were involved, and RPers cannot retcon actions.

2. I have a rigth to do it my way, given how I was WRONGLY wiped.

Being on the map does not affect your RP. Other people made legit RP about taking your territory, no response was offered, so they won it.

3. There is no clear-cut RP of Central Asia. I'm making it clear.

And denying legit RP, something you cannot do.

Now, LVN, should I go to a higher court, or will you stop sticking your nose into this business?

I am a GM to sort this out. If you feel like I am being unfair then well, I can't stop anything you want to do it seems. However, I can say that you wanted a decision, I gave one, and you don't like it.

[Sumeragi]

And denying legit RP, something you cannot do.

There was no RP for central Asia concerning borders.

[LeVentNoir]

There was no RP for central Asia concerning borders.

There was plenty of RP about occupying land, those parties have posted where they have claimed to, and so what is not claimed will be left white.

[Lord Frost]

Any former altin Urdan territory not claimed by current asian powers and new players have all been declared protectorates

[Sargun II]

Neither of you have the power to declear it non cannon, as no godmods were involved, and RPers cannot retcon actions.

If both the aggressor and the defender declare it non-canon then yes, we can.

If you don't like it, make a rule against it. Then try to grandfather it. I'm sure you'll be very impartial.

[Bacharth]

I agree with Sargun. If all parties involved in an RP want to make it null and void, they should be able to.

[LeVentNoir]

I agree with Sargun. If all parties involved in an RP want to make it null and void, they should be able to.

They have not had that power to date, are you saying that RPers should gain it? There has been no RP which has not descended into a OOC flamefest or godmods which was retconed.

I'm just thinking of the precedent this sets, and the consequences of "Nah, this RP was not fun, it never happened"

[Lord Frost]

They have not had that power to date, are you saying that RPers should gain it? There has been no RP which has not descended into a OOC flamefest or godmods which was retconed.

I'm just thinking of the precedent this sets, and the consequences of "Nah, this RP was not fun, it never happened"

I see this precedent as being more along the lines of "Crap that wasn't smart, OK IT DIDN'T HAPPEN! *spam forums with complaints until opposing side gets tired of whining*"

[King Kevz]

I have to agree here there is No retconning AT ALL. You have to accept the consequences of your actions its that simple.

[Subtleknifewielder]

They have not had that power to date, are you saying that RPers should gain it? There has been no RP which has not descended into a OOC flamefest or godmods which was retconed.

I'm just thinking of the precedent this sets, and the consequences of "Nah, this RP was not fun, it never happened"

I see this precedent as being more along the lines of "Crap that wasn't smart, OK IT DIDN'T HAPPEN! *spam forums with complaints until opposing side gets tired of whining*"

Interesting views. I'm seeing this as "whoops, I did not possess a piece of information I should have known IC." Also as "Whoops, RL came up, I need to at least postpone this."

[Sargun II]

I'm seeing it as "oh, Sargun - the person I ATTACKED - agrees that it never happened"

You're acting as if Sumeragi singlehandedly called for a retcon. This is both her and I agreeing on it. The precedent this sets is "if the involved parties both agree that this is a bad thing and this does not affect anybody else then it can be retconned". You and Frost are only involved in sending troops, there's no actual involvement other than a treaty activation. I could understand if it was a full-scale invasion and you were going to gain large tracts of land, but in this case the only thing that would happen is me pushing her troops out, teaching her a lesson and leaving.

Besides, I don't exist as an RP entity anymore until I finish up finding land. As far as I'm concerned Artemis dropped the war.

[Lord Frost]

And we dropped her. She has also attempted to come back as another nation (see Daima), only continuing to legitimize Altin Urda's wipe, no to mention all 3 mods ending the issue (see: page one of this thread)

[Tahsir]

Being a person that can claim a successful IC RP retcon, of some magnitude a few months back, because it was bad if the IC was left to go on, that this is just people arguing for position on a situation that should of never happened in IC.

Hence why we have a retcon rule on super weapons, of all kinds, but things like this are case by case. The case here is that both sides saw it was bad IC rp, and dismissed the RP.

Edited April 28, 2009 by Tahsir Re

[Sir Keshav IV]

I'm tired of arguing with the rapacious vultures and the sanctimous hypocrites, so I give up the debate on getting my land back.

HOWEVER, I would like the land to be split in the following ways, as a last request:

Centurius gets Karagandy Province, East Kazakhstan, Baikonur City, Mangystau, and Aktobe.

The rest of Russian Turkistan can be split up between Cochin and Justinian.

The rest of the leftover land will be Coby's (he already made a protectorate, I believe). He may work with Cenurius, but NOT Keshav, on dealing with the land.

I will NOT back out of this request, meaning . I'm sick of how I've been wiped without a good reason (no bad feelings towards Sargun, however), and fed up with the greediness of the people who love taking opportunity of such misfortunes.

I see what you did there and I am touched

Guess I RP'ing taking the land and giving the rest is going to be wiped out now isn't it