FCC Declaration of War

[TheAmplified42]

Jesse, I thought ancap colors were gold and black, what's with the red in your avatar?

He is no longer an ancap, but an anrchist without adjectives, IIRC. He has moved towards Mutualism.

[Anarcho Jesse]

Jesse, I thought ancap colors were gold and black, what's with the red in your avatar?

Functionally what Amp said. I think all socioeconomic theories are valid in the context of anarchism so long as they remain voluntary at their very premise, but I'm more of a preferential mutualist in terms of what I think will work best.

[mhawk]

I could ask the same of you when you type "The Hard Six" or when you made a total fool of yourself when you resigned your leadership position. And then felt really sorry and asked NPO if you guys could be friends again.

The fact we are all in this war is more than enough that we entered this willingly, which would be the very definition of taking a gamble based on strategic situations.

[SoxNation]

haha alright calm down guys, i want an honorable war no trolling, all love.

Iron will feel my love which i express with my troops

[Kurt Christ]

Functionally what Amp said. I think all socioeconomic theories are valid in the context of anarchism so long as they remain voluntary at their very premise, but I'm more of a preferential mutualist in terms of what I think will work best.

Ah, I actually consider myself a mutualist, although the economic side of anarchism has never been quite as interesting to me as other factors.

Edited April 26, 2009 by Kurt Christ

[schurick]

So we drop our treaty with them and we are cowards and bleh, bleh. Alright we will listen to you. We honor our other treaties binding us and declare war. Now because we declared we are doing the wrong thing? Please explain how this is a lack of reason and sensibility.

here is the best that I can explain it.

OOC: it is just the way this game works

IC: in their eyes you stepped on the same rake twice. It is a well known fact Friends/treaties>infra (what about tech? ). Dropping a treaty at the sign of war was bad and dishonorable. Whether you agree with what you have signed, you should honor it. Just because they disagreed with the treaty does not mean it was a bad one (or a good one). It is what your alliance chose to do, it is how they are set up and who they feel closer to.

But if you were going to leave the war, then so be it and stick to your guns. Coming back into it because people made fun of you was just really bad. You already got what ever rep you were going to get from dropping it, and thus people assume they have seen your true colors. In their lust for blood, of course they will goad you into honoring it. But you can't save face, you can not unring the bell you rang. And fighting with the party you abandoned for what ever reasons were stated, just shows indecisiveness and generally poor judgment.

at least that's the way I understand it.

[Näktergal]

The easier answer is that "the other side" is ALWAYS dishonorable, evil, and vile. They go around shooting nuns and kicking babies while seeking to spread their tyranny across the face of the globe. Meanwhile, "the good guys" are heroic defenders of Truth, Justice, and the CN Way, who stand against evil in all its forms, drawing a line in the sand and saying THE BUCK STOPS HERE. In betweeen fighting the forces of evil, the heroes also take time out to donate to charity, find homes for orphans, and otherwise just act like stellar awesome people.

And which side is "good" and which side is "evil" depends entirely on which side YOU are on.

No matter WHAT you do, no matter how honorable or dishonorable, it's going to be praised by your allies and utterly mocked by your enemies. This happens EVERY WAR. It's even more amusing when you notice that whenever some alliance that is getting BASHED by the enemy either pulls out of the war or switches sides, you'll hear everyone who has just spent days talking about how they have **** for honor or how they leave their allies out in the cold or are otherwise the lowest scum in the game are suddenly being praised by those same people for making the honorable choice, or for showing their great wisdom, or for making the hard but necessary choices. We always knew you could do it! Meanwhile, the alliances that have been preaching brotherhood and friendship and man, these guys are awesome in every thread are now suddenly talking about how they always knew they could never trust you, how you've yet again proved your lack of honor, how you're easily-led fools, etc.

The chest pounding is the same every single war - which is part of why I sort of stopped listening to it (let alone participating in it!) years ago.

Personally, I think there are cool people on both sides of the war, there are cool alliances on both sides of the war, and this entire mess is nothing more than an expression of CN's need to fight a major war every few months.

Though, considering where I wound up on the field, I think I'm supposed to point out now how Karma are the paragons of justice in a world that cries out for it while the Hegemony are the evil Lords of Darkness who seek to plunge the world into a hellish nightmare of chaos and damnation. So, you know, pretend I just did that.

[SoxNation]

Nak, I always knew you went both ways

[Crowdog07]

Double post, my bad. My internet has been sketchy lately. It seems to be going around

Edited April 26, 2009 by Crowdog

[Crowdog07]

The fact we are all in this war is more than enough that we entered this willingly, which would be the very definition of taking a gamble based on strategic situations.

I see the strategy. Fight a war you know you are going to lose, or condemn your alliance to it's political death by knowingly and publicly abandoning the only treaty that could be activated at that point. I love willingly being pulled into wars through treaties.

[Peppermint_Pig]

[g-money]

Just like Mom used to make!

[Republic of Roma]

This is a rare event indeed. I don't even recall the FCC ever making a DOW before in the two years I've been on CN.

[delgursh]

here is the best that I can explain it.

OOC: it is just the way this game works

IC: in their eyes you stepped on the same rake twice. It is a well known fact Friends/treaties>infra (what about tech? ). Dropping a treaty at the sign of war was bad and dishonorable. Whether you agree with what you have signed, you should honor it. Just because they disagreed with the treaty does not mean it was a bad one (or a good one). It is what your alliance chose to do, it is how they are set up and who they feel closer to.

But if you were going to leave the war, then so be it and stick to your guns. Coming back into it because people made fun of you was just really bad. You already got what ever rep you were going to get from dropping it, and thus people assume they have seen your true colors. In their lust for blood, of course they will goad you into honoring it. But you can't save face, you can not unring the bell you rang. And fighting with the party you abandoned for what ever reasons were stated, just shows indecisiveness and generally poor judgment.

at least that's the way I understand it.

Hey schurick...theres more to everything all the time. I'm confident the actions IRON took were correct. I feel fine with the way things were handled. Granted I would have liked to have jumped into the war right away, but I dont think, based on the circumstances at the time, that we made any horrible decisions. Yes, some that we regret for not taking sooner, but we all know would have come about anyway.

[LoveaLot]

Let's just keep this clean and respectful and have some fun k?

[schurick]

Hey schurick...theres more to everything all the time. I'm confident the actions IRON took were correct. I feel fine with the way things were handled. Granted I would have liked to have jumped into the war right away, but I dont think, based on the circumstances at the time, that we made any horrible decisions. Yes, some that we regret for not taking sooner, but we all know would have come about anyway.

ello delgursh,

Never said they were horrible, just bad.

sometimes you have to choose between a rock and a hard place, kind of the same way I felt about Legion's actions. I am not saying that what your alliance did was right or wrong. I am sure you had the best intentions in mind, even if the rest of the world may not agree with them. And as long as you personally feel that the alliance is doing the right thing, isn't that really all that matters?

To me, being in an alliance is like getting married, "for better or for worse, in sickness and in health..." and if you just can't agree with them anymore, you can always get a divorce.

[Peppermint_Pig]

War isn't merely an inevitability, as some people suggest. By that logic, justifications for one's actions may be disregarded completely. Many will claim that they felt they did the 'correct' thing. To be loyal to allies, to defend one's 'honor'. How is it then that the FCC avoided so many pointless conflicts? It's more than a desire for self-preservation, as alliances both big and small are willing to justify aggression on these grounds, whether or not this happens to be their true motive. If war is correct, why not be correct all the time? Perhaps there is more to the situation than some let on?

Applying ethical standards consistently tends to be recognized as the truly 'correct' thing to do, and not to disregard them for the sake of convenience, or personal gain at the expense of others. I'm unsure how war and subsequent negotiations for peace can ever resolve to prevent future wars if there is no conscious recognition of this.

[LOLtex]

ello delgursh,

Never said they were horrible, just bad.

sometimes you have to choose between a rock and a hard place, kind of the same way I felt about Legion's actions. I am not saying that what your alliance did was right or wrong. I am sure you had the best intentions in mind, even if the rest of the world may not agree with them. And as long as you personally feel that the alliance is doing the right thing, isn't that really all that matters?

To me, being in an alliance is like getting married, "for better or for worse, in sickness and in health..." and if you just can't agree with them anymore, you can always get a divorce.

Divorce is the easy way out.