Dazed and Confused

[Paradigm]

And that position would be?

Thats a good question but I'm guessing the position is something close to loose arms flapping and some strings going up into the rafters.

[cookavich]

And that position would be?

Hard to say.

<@ftwman[blackstone]> and Duffy never talks with Demeanor.

<@ftwman[blackstone]> They are faked.

<@ftwman[blackstone]> I'd have bets on a ctrl v error

[Nintenderek]

And that position would be?

A very bad one that I don't agree with at all that involves either total incompetence (Either a Ctrl V error, or NPO making up logs), or working with the NPO. There's no way around it. Somehow, I doubt NPO made up the logs, and a Ctrl V error of that size seems very unrealistic.

[Ragashingo]

If the logs were fake that would have been revealed long ago. I don't count fake logs as a valid option.

[glovedassassin]

I get the picture of one army running in circles and the other sitting on a hill with folding chairs and popcorn.

Enjoying my popcorn.

[zzzptm]

I'm mad as hell, and I'm not going to take it anymore!

[Bob Janova]

Oh Srqt, your sarcasm is as subtle () and delicious as ever.

[Windsor]

Very interesting indeed. Perhaps we are set up so that when we make a mistake, it simply causes confusion. Here's what we do know:

1. NPO has a history of launching witch-hunts. I know, because I participated in one long ago as a Pacifican. It's a tradition of sorts, used as a tool to solve an unknown internal problem. Upon the founding of BC, NPO has banned scores of people - none of which were BC spais. We found that mildly amusing.

2. NPO has a history of spying. To develop a CB due to the results of spying.... BASED on information gained from spying.... well.... that's just hypocritical, and should certainly be laughed at. We've seen some ridiculous practices come out of NPO..... most recently the dismissal of hundreds of would-be CN players that could have made some great contributions to our community. But a CB based on spied info? For spying?

3. The logs, from what little I know that were leaked, are tweaked. There is some originality to them, and there is some tampering as well. I will say that I've been away for a while, and those logs stayed on my computer. They were never posted in our forums, or anywhere else. There are other possibilities, but I don't even want to imagine them...

4. The screen shot of the new NPO war chest requirement was in fact, collected by one of our agents. It was info that was already known throughout the cyberverse, however, there were a few parties that rejected such info without proof. NPO was not the first to alter its war chest requirement, and it was part of a study on the escalation of hostilities across the community. BC never volunteers what it considers to be "extremely sensitive information" to any foreign government. But, since there are a few out there that are so... emo... then we're about to start doing so, and give them a legitimate reason to be.

5. The idea of BC being an undercover sting operation for NPO isn't a new one. This propaganda was created by NPO. We figured it would die off when you never hear about anyone being ZI or PZI for BC affiliation. [OOC]Today, when NPO catches ONE BC agent, they pull out tequila and fire pistols in the air like they're partying in Tijuana.[/OOC]

6. While I'd love to be able to answer all of your questions, the best way that I can address them is to take this at face value. NPO has been witch hunting since the Collusion's birth. They have now expanded their witch hunt into other alliances' domains. They have come to other alliances and bullied them into surrendering their sovereignty because they aren't satisfied with everyone's security measures. They have a spy operation that dwarfs ours.... which is why we've placed so much emphasis on strict OPSEC. The leak did not come from me - those logs stayed on my computer. I'm hard-pressed to find how such a leak would be beneficial to our cause.

7. Because such a leak would neither be beneficial to OV or BC, or TPF, then any well-informed intelligence agent would suggest that the logs were fabricated or attained through some very dirty methods. This is why you are confused - the only thing that makes any sense is that NPO is attempting to fabricate another war through a loose CB. It has done so many times before, and it is not above doing so now.

[zzzptm]

So you're saying NPO is getting desperate?

Hardly surprising, given their recent lame propaganda followed by utter silence when TORN and Valhalla hit peace mode.

[Windsor]

So you're saying NPO is getting desperate?

Hardly surprising, given their recent lame propaganda followed by utter silence when TORN and Valhalla hit peace mode.

When you kill off all of your enemies, you have to create them.

[Byron Orpheus]

When you kill off all of your enemies, you have to create them.

Or settle for the sub-par antics of our current enemies. How I wish sometimes that I had been around for "the old days", as I expect Pacifica and co. had much more worthwhile adversaries than the ones I see pathetically posturing around here these days.

[Windsor]

Or settle for the sub-par antics of our current enemies. How I wish sometimes that I had been around for "the old days", as I expect Pacifica and co. had much more worthwhile adversaries than the ones I see pathetically posturing around here these days.

What I'm hearing is, "I wish we hadn't trampled so many alliances in the past". This is you reaping what you've sowed. This is an example of others trying to correct your mistakes.

[deth2munkies]

When you kill off all of your enemies, you have to create them.

Funny, I remember a similar quote.

[Nintenderek]

Very interesting indeed. Perhaps we are set up so that when we make a mistake, it simply causes confusion. Here's what we do know:

1. NPO has a history of launching witch-hunts. I know, because I participated in one long ago as a Pacifican. It's a tradition of sorts, used as a tool to solve an unknown internal problem. Upon the founding of BC, NPO has banned scores of people - none of which were BC spais. We found that mildly amusing.

2. NPO has a history of spying. To develop a CB due to the results of spying.... BASED on information gained from spying.... well.... that's just hypocritical, and should certainly be laughed at. We've seen some ridiculous practices come out of NPO..... most recently the dismissal of hundreds of would-be CN players that could have made some great contributions to our community. But a CB based on spied info? For spying?

3. The logs, from what little I know that were leaked, are tweaked. There is some originality to them, and there is some tampering as well. I will say that I've been away for a while, and those logs stayed on my computer. They were never posted in our forums, or anywhere else. There are other possibilities, but I don't even want to imagine them...

4. The screen shot of the new NPO war chest requirement was in fact, collected by one of our agents. It was info that was already known throughout the cyberverse, however, there were a few parties that rejected such info without proof. NPO was not the first to alter its war chest requirement, and it was part of a study on the escalation of hostilities across the community. BC never volunteers what it considers to be "extremely sensitive information" to any foreign government. But, since there are a few out there that are so... emo... then we're about to start doing so, and give them a legitimate reason to be.

5. The idea of BC being an undercover sting operation for NPO isn't a new one. This propaganda was created by NPO. We figured it would die off when you never hear about anyone being ZI or PZI for BC affiliation. [OOC]Today, when NPO catches ONE BC agent, they pull out tequila and fire pistols in the air like they're partying in Tijuana.[/OOC]

6. While I'd love to be able to answer all of your questions, the best way that I can address them is to take this at face value. NPO has been witch hunting since the Collusion's birth. They have now expanded their witch hunt into other alliances' domains. They have come to other alliances and bullied them into surrendering their sovereignty because they aren't satisfied with everyone's security measures. They have a spy operation that dwarfs ours.... which is why we've placed so much emphasis on strict OPSEC. The leak did not come from me - those logs stayed on my computer. I'm hard-pressed to find how such a leak would be beneficial to our cause.

7. Because such a leak would neither be beneficial to OV or BC, or TPF, then any well-informed intelligence agent would suggest that the logs were fabricated or attained through some very dirty methods. This is why you are confused - the only thing that makes any sense is that NPO is attempting to fabricate another war through a loose CB. It has done so many times before, and it is not above doing so now.

Your opinion on these logs?

[2009-04-19 16:02:18] <Nintenderek> I would like someone from Blackstone's opinion on this post - http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t&p=1429352

[2009-04-19 16:05:52] <BEazy[FACE]> Maybe I should get out of here, if NPO is going to attack anyone who is too friendly to Blackstone :/

[2009-04-19 16:05:56] <BEazy[FACE]> Tongue

[2009-04-19 16:06:37] <Nintenderek> BEazy[FACE], that's not the point

[2009-04-19 16:06:57] <renamed> Hey guys Cheesy

[2009-04-19 16:06:59] <Nintenderek> It points out that Blackstone may actually be an NPO organization, meant to get CBs

[2009-04-19 16:07:01] <BEazy[FACE]> hence the sarcasm

[2009-04-19 16:07:06] <Nintenderek> I want someone from blackstone's opinion

[2009-04-19 16:07:15] <BEazy[FACE]> That's kinda funny

[2009-04-19 16:07:25] <BEazy[FACE]> in honesty after talking to Sev on multiple occasions

[2009-04-19 16:07:27] <ftwman[blackstone]> you want blackstone's opnion

[2009-04-19 16:07:31] <BEazy[FACE]> All I can do is lol to that

[2009-04-19 16:07:37] <Nintenderek> http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t&p=1429352

[2009-04-19 16:07:44] <BEazy[FACE]> but, I'm not in Blackstone and can't say

[2009-04-19 16:07:48] <Nintenderek> I want someone from Blackstone's opinion on that post

[2009-04-19 16:07:54] <ftwman[blackstone]> seeing as i'm the ranking officer, I'll look it over

[2009-04-19 16:08:04] <Nintenderek> Because it makes perfect sense

[2009-04-19 16:08:29] <BEazy[FACE]> :/

[2009-04-19 16:08:35] <ftwman[blackstone]> well, points 3,4,5 are entirely false

[2009-04-19 16:08:38] <ftwman[blackstone]> number 2

[2009-04-19 16:08:45] <ftwman[blackstone]> they do so not knowingly Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:09:12] <ftwman[blackstone]> and number one. You can count anyone in #ov, #ve, or any other channel i was in when i posted that screenshot Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:09:49] <Nintenderek> They all want answers to the post ftwman[blackstone]

[2009-04-19 16:09:55] <ftwman[blackstone]> <ftwman[blackstone]> well, points 3,4,5 are entirely false

[2009-04-19 16:09:58] <ftwman[blackstone]> <ftwman[blackstone]> number 2

[2009-04-19 16:10:00] <ftwman[blackstone]> <ftwman[blackstone]> they do so not knowingly Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:10:00] <ftwman[blackstone]> <ftwman[blackstone]> and number one. You can count anyone in #ov, #ve, or any other channel i was in when i posted that screenshot Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:10:13] <--| yetanothername has left #blackstonecollusion (Judge me now, for what I am... or am I to be blamed for a crime I didn't commit?)

[2009-04-19 16:10:26] <Nintenderek> You've also read the tattler, correct ftwman[blackstone] ?

[2009-04-19 16:10:34] <ftwman[blackstone]> A few times.

[2009-04-19 16:10:49] <Nintenderek> How about today?

[2009-04-19 16:10:59] |<-- King_Fatbott[A] has left irc.coldfront.net (Quit: Beware of programmers who carry screwdrivers.)

[2009-04-19 16:11:27] <BEazy[FACE]> Ninten, I like your new sig

[2009-04-19 16:11:34] <ftwman[blackstone]> I haven't looked at it today.

[2009-04-19 16:11:36] <sig> >:U

[2009-04-19 16:11:37] <away_srqt[RIA]> [16:08] <@Nintenderek> Srqt, they say your a liar

[2009-04-19 16:11:43] <away_srqt[RIA]> may I ask what I have lied about?

[2009-04-19 16:11:50] <Nintenderek> ftwman[blackstone], I'd suggest you read today's issue of it then

[2009-04-19 16:11:54] <Nintenderek> Before you start arguing

[2009-04-19 16:12:01] <Nintenderek> Because you get a special mention

[2009-04-19 16:12:06] <ftwman[blackstone]> I see

[2009-04-19 16:12:13] <Nintenderek> <ftwman[blackstone]> well, points 3,4,5 are entirely false

[2009-04-19 16:12:16] <Tlelaxue> So, I heard that Blacksonte gov has been leaking logs to the NPO

[2009-04-19 16:12:18] <Nintenderek> <ftwman[blackstone]> number 2

[2009-04-19 16:12:18] <ftwman[blackstone]> Go a link?

[2009-04-19 16:12:24] <Nintenderek> <ftwman[blackstone]> they do so not knowingly Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:12:25] <ftwman[blackstone]> got a link?*

[2009-04-19 16:12:33] <Nintenderek> <ftwman[blackstone]> and number one. You can count anyone in #ov, #ve, or any other channel i was in when i posted that screenshot

[2009-04-19 16:13:00] <Nintenderek> ftwman[blackstone]: - http://tattler.assimilator.org/?p=124

[2009-04-19 16:13:42] <away_srqt[RIA]> how are they false ftwman[blackstone]

[2009-04-19 16:13:49] <away_srqt[RIA]> that is exactly what OV is accused of doing

[2009-04-19 16:14:19] <ftwman[blackstone]> I know they are flase.

[2009-04-19 16:14:23] <ftwman[blackstone]> False*

[2009-04-19 16:14:35] <Nintenderek> Dude, the logs are right in front of you in the tattler

[2009-04-19 16:14:37] <away_srqt[RIA]> all i am saying in that thread is that OV is accused of those things

[2009-04-19 16:14:43] <away_srqt[RIA]> and they are in fact accused of those things

[2009-04-19 16:14:48] <ftwman[blackstone]> I am in charge of Blackstone's spying operations

[2009-04-19 16:14:52] <ftwman[blackstone]> I know who goes where.

[2009-04-19 16:14:57] <Nintenderek> Then you do a really !@#$%* job

[2009-04-19 16:15:15] <away_srqt[RIA]> as to the validity of the accusations if I thought the accusations were valid I probably would not have made that thread

[2009-04-19 16:15:15] <adcde> i deny

[2009-04-19 16:15:54] <ftwman[blackstone]> numbers 3,4,5 are absolute crap. One and two hold some truth.

[2009-04-19 16:16:03] <adcde> this is the most active ive ever seen for BC

[2009-04-19 16:16:04] <adcde> lol

[2009-04-19 16:16:12] <Cookavich[NpO]> Nintenderek, is it possible that someone inside Blackstone purposely leaked the logs to TPF?

[2009-04-19 16:16:20] <Nintenderek> I think it's very possible

[2009-04-19 16:16:33] <Cookavich[NpO]> that was my thought

[2009-04-19 16:16:35] <Nintenderek> I'm also still wondering about this post

[2009-04-19 16:16:36] <Nintenderek> http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...p;#entry1429346

[2009-04-19 16:16:47] <Nintenderek> and this one

[2009-04-19 16:16:48] <Nintenderek> http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t&p=1429352

[2009-04-19 16:16:49] <Ragashingo> Mine? !

[2009-04-19 16:16:53] <Tlelaxue> Dude, it's been obvious since the guy fawkes video that BC is nothing but an NPO front

[2009-04-19 16:16:57] <Blazix> whats up guys?

[2009-04-19 16:17:01] <Cookavich[NpO]> It appeared some of Duffy's logs came straight from a query with Demeanor

[2009-04-19 16:17:06] <ftwman[blackstone]> No, we are not. I can tell you that right now.

[2009-04-19 16:17:11] <ftwman[blackstone]> and Duffy never talks with Demeanor.

[2009-04-19 16:17:41] <Cookavich[NpO]> I could be mistaken, but it looked like they had logs of him doing just that

[2009-04-19 16:17:47] <Ragashingo> Meh, lets make this simple and direct. ftwman[blackstone] Is BC a front for any alliance that is unhappy with OV?

[2009-04-19 16:17:50] <away_srqt[RIA]> so you are saying that the accusations are 100% manufactured?

[2009-04-19 16:17:53] <sethb[OV-DepMoFO]> Duffy talks with Demeanor on a RL to RL basis, they are roughly the same age both have kids etc...

[2009-04-19 16:18:18] <Tlelaxue> DUFFY AND DEMEANOR ARE THE SAME PERSON!

[2009-04-19 16:18:23] <Tlelaxue> You heard it here first

[2009-04-19 16:18:24] <ftwman[blackstone]> Ragash. No.

[2009-04-19 16:18:40] <away_srqt[RIA]> Demeanor is the potface guy

[2009-04-19 16:18:41] <Ragashingo> Cool. I'm out. Someone hand me a summary when this is all done Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:18:43] <--| Ragashingo has left #blackstonecollusion

[2009-04-19 16:18:50] <ftwman[blackstone]> I know who potface is, but he's not Demeanor. Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:18:51] <Blazix> lol

[2009-04-19 16:18:58] <Blazix> interesting talk Wink

[2009-04-19 16:19:02] <adcde> very

[2009-04-19 16:19:11] <Blazix> lol

[2009-04-19 16:19:17] <Blazix> wasnt it abcde?

[2009-04-19 16:19:22] <Nintenderek> Wait, ftwman[blackstone], you know who a member of Blackstone's real identity is?

[2009-04-19 16:19:24] <adcde> no lol

[2009-04-19 16:19:30] <Blazix> k lol

[2009-04-19 16:19:48] <ftwman[blackstone]> I know only two. And that's because they've messed up.

[2009-04-19 16:20:07] <Nintenderek> How did they mess up?

[2009-04-19 16:20:37] <BEazy[FACE]> They told their identity?

[2009-04-19 16:21:13] <BEazy[FACE]> And Dem has kids?

[2009-04-19 16:21:27] <Nintenderek> BEazy[FACE], if they told their identity, they would be breaking the rules

[2009-04-19 16:21:34] * DJ_Arrow heard there was fun

[2009-04-19 16:21:37] <Nintenderek> They aren't allowed to tell their identity

[2009-04-19 16:21:42] <Blazix> welcome dj_arrow

[2009-04-19 16:21:44] <adcde> eh nobody's perfect

[2009-04-19 16:21:57] <Nintenderek> Yes, but that's the most important rule in Blackstone

[2009-04-19 16:22:07] <Nintenderek> Not to tell your identity to anyone, including your superiors

[2009-04-19 16:22:09] <ftwman[blackstone]> wrong Ninten

[2009-04-19 16:22:15] <ftwman[blackstone]> thats number 2 Smiley

[2009-04-19 16:22:21] <Blazix> lol

[2009-04-19 16:22:38] <adcde> Wink

[2009-04-19 16:22:39] <unavalible> hi guys

[2009-04-19 16:22:41] <adcde> hi

[2009-04-19 16:22:42] <Cookavich[NpO]> were the Duffy-Demeanor logs posted somewhere on Blackstone's forums were someone other than Demeanor could access them?

[2009-04-19 16:22:50] <ftwman[blackstone]> oh

[2009-04-19 16:22:52] <BEazy[FACE]> Ninten, someone might have a large mouth

[2009-04-19 16:22:55] <ftwman[blackstone]> i jsut read the demanor logs

[2009-04-19 16:22:55] <BEazy[FACE]> and say who they are

[2009-04-19 16:23:02] <ftwman[blackstone]> Demeanor*

[2009-04-19 16:23:04] <ftwman[blackstone]> They are faked.

[2009-04-19 16:23:13] <sig> :|

[2009-04-19 16:23:19] <sig> Based on

[2009-04-19 16:23:20] <ftwman[blackstone]> Demeanor has not used that tag in months.

[2009-04-19 16:23:22] <Nintenderek> There's a lot of things you can say about NPO, but faking logs is not one of them

[2009-04-19 16:23:30] <Cookavich[NpO]> Duffy didn't seem to think they were

[2009-04-19 16:23:37] <adcde> actually nintenderek

[2009-04-19 16:23:46] <Cookavich[NpO]> you would think he would come out and say if they were faked

[2009-04-19 16:23:47] <BEazy[FACE]> That's how Dem talks

[2009-04-19 16:23:47] <adcde> i am the living proof of some faking

[2009-04-19 16:23:50] <BEazy[FACE]> those are real logs

[2009-04-19 16:23:55] <adcde> from npo

[2009-04-19 16:23:58] <Nintenderek> It is also how Dem talks

[2009-04-19 16:24:01] <unavalible> myes

[2009-04-19 16:24:05] <Nintenderek> And I have seen him wearing the tag recently

[2009-04-19 16:24:16] <Cookavich[NpO]> also, Duffy never denied their legitimacy

[2009-04-19 16:24:17] <unavalible> demeanor[blackstone]

[2009-04-19 16:24:20] <Nintenderek> In other words ftwman[blackstone] , your just making !@#$ up now

[2009-04-19 16:24:25] <unavalible> lol

[2009-04-19 16:24:26] <ftwman[blackstone]> No

[2009-04-19 16:24:30] <unavalible> yes

[2009-04-19 16:24:33] <Cookavich[NpO]> yes

[2009-04-19 16:24:39] <ftwman[blackstone]> I haven't been logged in and see Demeanor use that tag in months

[2009-04-19 16:24:39] <adcde> how recently have u seen him wear that tag?

[2009-04-19 16:24:53] <ftwman[blackstone]> He's been away from CN and blackstone for over a week or two weeks now

[2009-04-19 16:24:56] <ftwman[blackstone]> He's back today.

[2009-04-19 16:24:56] <BEazy[FACE]> He's worn the tag before

[2009-04-19 16:25:01] <DJ_Arrow> don't you just hate when you run out of salsa but you still have chips?

[2009-04-19 16:25:08] <adcde> yes what ftwman just said is true

[2009-04-19 16:25:13] <BEazy[FACE]> I know it's crazy!

[2009-04-19 16:25:17] |<-- unavalible has left irc.coldfront.net (Quit: Good luck all!)

[2009-04-19 16:25:25] <Nintenderek> However, this has been going on for a while now

[2009-04-19 16:25:26] <Cookavich[NpO]> we don't know the date of the logs

[2009-04-19 16:25:28] <BEazy[FACE]> I think they said that those logs were over a month or two ago

[2009-04-19 16:25:33] <Nintenderek> And they never said when they got those logs

[2009-04-19 16:25:34] <Cookavich[NpO]> they could have been from awhile ago

[2009-04-19 16:25:37] |<-- Bilzey[RnR|MoFA] has left irc.coldfront.net (Ping timeout)

[2009-04-19 16:25:38] <Blazix> i think BS needs to prove that they are not a part of NPO

[2009-04-19 16:25:42] <Nintenderek> And I indeed saw him with that tag about 2 and a half weeks ago

[2009-04-19 16:25:56] <Nintenderek> and Blackstone was founded by former members of NPO

[2009-04-19 16:26:05] <BEazy[FACE]> Same with Vox :/

[2009-04-19 16:26:19] <ftwman[blackstone]> Who also happens to be a now gone member.

[2009-04-19 16:26:19] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> lol

[2009-04-19 16:26:19] <adcde> so what would be the point of working for NPO?

[2009-04-19 16:26:22] <BEazy[FACE]> Sup MItch

[2009-04-19 16:26:24] <OverlordOeboema> dang lol

[2009-04-19 16:26:25] <BEazy[FACE]> long time no see

[2009-04-19 16:26:27] <mitchh|afk> hi

[2009-04-19 16:26:29] <Nintenderek> Because he was deployed over seas

[2009-04-19 16:26:31] <mitchh|afk> whats up

[2009-04-19 16:26:38] <BEazy[FACE]> Just chilling

[2009-04-19 16:26:39] <BEazy[FACE]> you?

[2009-04-19 16:26:40] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> ftwman

[2009-04-19 16:26:41] <Blazix> <adcde>: so what would be the point of working for NPO? -> spotting their enemies?

[2009-04-19 16:26:45] <Nintenderek> I think you have some explaining to do ftwman[blackstone]

[2009-04-19 16:26:45] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> did you pass the screenshots on?

[2009-04-19 16:26:48] <mitchh|afk> yeah, some homework

[2009-04-19 16:26:57] <ftwman[blackstone]> I'm posting them now

[2009-04-19 16:26:59] <adcde> how do they know? even the VIPs have no clue who i am in game

[2009-04-19 16:27:02] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> ninny nobody has to explain anything to you

[2009-04-19 16:27:06] <BEazy[FACE]> That sucks

[2009-04-19 16:27:14] <mitchh|afk> eh, its college

[2009-04-19 16:27:28] <BEazy[FACE]> What are you majoring in?

[2009-04-19 16:27:31] <Blazix> they have ur IP

[2009-04-19 16:27:31] <Nintenderek> VladimirStukov[TOP]: , unless he wants this conversation in the Tattler here soon, I'd suggest he explain himself

[2009-04-19 16:27:42] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> what?

[2009-04-19 16:27:44] <Cookavich[NpO]> it seems abundantly clear to me that the logs were at the very least leaked by someone affiliated with BC

[2009-04-19 16:27:47] <Blazix> and its used everywhere, in the forums too

[2009-04-19 16:28:00] <adcde> and what do they want to do with my ip? if i dont go on my alliance's forums they dont know who i am

[2009-04-19 16:28:10] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> ninny what are you talking bout

[2009-04-19 16:28:20] <ftwman[blackstone]> BSC does not have half of the people's Ips

[2009-04-19 16:28:24] <Nintenderek> VladimirStukov[TOP], you missed quite a bit before you entered the conversation

[2009-04-19 16:28:26] <BEazy[FACE]> Vlad, you missed alot

[2009-04-19 16:28:28] |<-- Atlas[blackstone] has left irc.coldfront.net (Quit: Good luck all!)

[2009-04-19 16:28:37] <Blazix> <ftwman[blackstone]>: BSC does not have half of the people's Ips -> LIES

[2009-04-19 16:28:46] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> whos gonna be in the tattler?

[2009-04-19 16:28:51] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> can i be in it?

[2009-04-19 16:28:55] <BEazy[FACE]> BC if I'm hearing this right

[2009-04-19 16:29:07] <--| alpreb[TOP] has left #blackstonecollusion

[2009-04-19 16:29:08] * DJ_Arrow was in the Tattler

[2009-04-19 16:29:15] <BEazy[FACE]> If VS is in the Tattler I want to be int there too

[2009-04-19 16:29:16] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> ninny ill give you screenshots of private TOP info if you post it in the tattler

[2009-04-19 16:29:17] <ftwman[blackstone]> I know at least half of us use proxies to access everything.

[2009-04-19 16:29:18] * sethb[OV-DepMoFO] is in the tattler

[2009-04-19 16:29:25] <sig> No, DJ_Arrow, you were in TWiP?

[2009-04-19 16:29:27] <Cookavich[NpO]> I do hope that Vox has not been passing anything of value along to BC

[2009-04-19 16:29:29] <DJ_Arrow> same thing

[2009-04-19 16:29:30] |<-- Tsar_Kalashnikov has left irc.coldfront.net (Quit: )

[2009-04-19 16:29:32] * mitchh|afk is in the tattler

[2009-04-19 16:29:32] <Blazix> k k

[2009-04-19 16:29:35] <Nintenderek> ftwman[blackstone], somehow I doubt that's true

[2009-04-19 16:29:43] <Nintenderek> I know I wouldn't use a proxy

[2009-04-19 16:29:46] <Nintenderek> People are lazy

[2009-04-19 16:29:59] <adcde> I thought i was lazy..guess i was wrong

[2009-04-19 16:30:01] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> i use proxy for my spy account

[2009-04-19 16:30:10] <Cookavich[NpO]> ^^

[2009-04-19 16:30:10] <Blazix> lol

[2009-04-19 16:30:19] <sig> My proxy traces to Malawi

[2009-04-19 16:30:21] <Nintenderek> Now answer the god damned question ftwman[blackstone], how did NPO get all that stuff

[2009-04-19 16:30:31] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> double agents?

[2009-04-19 16:30:33] <Cookavich[NpO]> tis obvious

[2009-04-19 16:30:40] <DJ_Arrow> my proxy traces to sig

[2009-04-19 16:30:42] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> actually i gave it to NPO

[2009-04-19 16:30:43] <DJ_Arrow> >_>

[2009-04-19 16:30:46] <sig>

[2009-04-19 16:30:47] <Blazix>

[2009-04-19 16:30:49] <VladimirStukov[TOP]> my proxy is in BC

[2009-04-19 16:30:49] <sig> <3

[2009-04-19 16:31:00] <adcde> wait i dont even know what npo got lol

[2009-04-19 16:31:02] * DJ_Arrow makes sig internet slow

[2009-04-19 16:31:13] <sig> 12% by the way

[2009-04-19 16:31:17] <DJ_Arrow> lol

[2009-04-19 16:31:18] <Blazix> DJ_Arrow is having fun lol

[2009-04-19 16:31:23] <DJ_Arrow> always

[2009-04-19 16:31:32] <sig> Take THAT intelligent conversation

[2009-04-19 16:31:43] <ftwman[blackstone]> How NPO got all that stuff?

[2009-04-19 16:31:44] <DJ_Arrow> fun is what it's all about nowadays

[2009-04-19 16:31:50] <DJ_Arrow> b/c it sure ain't about change

[2009-04-19 16:31:50] <Cookavich[NpO]> yes, ftwman

[2009-04-19 16:31:59] <ftwman[blackstone]> most of the time, we post our stuff in here

[2009-04-19 16:32:11] <sig> In this channel? D:

[2009-04-19 16:32:14] <Nintenderek> and you don't kick NPO people out of the channel before you do that?

[2009-04-19 16:32:32] <Cookavich[NpO]> so, you're chocking this up to gross incompetence? Really?

[2009-04-19 16:32:41] <ftwman[blackstone]> No.

[2009-04-19 16:32:45] <Nintenderek> That's the most retarded mistake I've heard in a long time

[2009-04-19 16:32:49] <Cookavich[NpO]> then what?

[2009-04-19 16:32:52] <Blazix> thats ur ignorance

[2009-04-19 16:32:53] <adcde> mistake? lol

[2009-04-19 16:33:01] <BEazy[FACE]> Ninten, how do you know NPO people lurk in this chan? I've seen 1 NPO member in months

[2009-04-19 16:33:05] <Blazix> u guys need to do it in ur private channel

[2009-04-19 16:33:13] <adcde> beazy

[2009-04-19 16:33:15] <Blazix> different name?

[2009-04-19 16:33:16] <ftwman[blackstone]> NPO's tried about..... 15-20 times now to invade our forums

[2009-04-19 16:33:17] <Nintenderek> BEazy[FACE]: , someone gave those logs to them

[2009-04-19 16:33:21] <adcde> i see an npo member like everyday in here

[2009-04-19 16:33:21] <Cookavich[NpO]> Somehow the NPO got ahold of private logs between Demeanor and Duffy, how?

[2009-04-19 16:33:26] <ftwman[blackstone]> That

[2009-04-19 16:33:28] <ftwman[blackstone]> I do not know

[2009-04-19 16:33:36] <ftwman[blackstone]> Logs rarely get posted here.

[2009-04-19 16:33:37] <sig> If everyone's anonymous, how'd you know?

[2009-04-19 16:33:44] <Nintenderek> Your the !@#$@#$ head of your spy operation. You should know that

[2009-04-19 16:33:58] <Blazix>

[2009-04-19 16:33:59] <Cookavich[NpO]> they're private logs, sig

[2009-04-19 16:34:19] <ftwman[blackstone]> If those are legit, those are the leader's of blackstone. I'm the head of the spy divison, not the leader.

[2009-04-19 16:34:30] <Cookavich[NpO]> only people that had access to them were duffy and demeanor unless demeanor posted them on BC's boards

[2009-04-19 16:34:34] <sig> I'm not really even watching the conversation

[2009-04-19 16:34:47] <ftwman[blackstone]> They haevn't been posted anywhere.

[2009-04-19 16:34:54] <Nintenderek> So either Duffy gave them away, or Demeanor gave them away

[2009-04-19 16:34:56] <Nintenderek> Which is it?

[2009-04-19 16:35:03] <Nintenderek> I somehow doubt it was Duffy

[2009-04-19 16:35:06] <ftwman[blackstone]> I'd have bets on a ctrl v error

[2009-04-19 16:35:13] <sig> what

[2009-04-19 16:35:14] <Cookavich[NpO]> lol

[2009-04-19 16:35:20] <Cookavich[NpO]> yeah, that happens alot

[2009-04-19 16:35:30] <Nintenderek> ftwman[blackstone]: , your making Blackstone look worse and worse here

[2009-04-19 16:35:38] <Blazix>

[2009-04-19 16:35:40] <Nintenderek> Your honestly blaming this on a copy paste error?

[2009-04-19 16:35:43] <BEazy[FACE]> I have to agree with Ninten here

[2009-04-19 16:36:05] <Cookavich[NpO]> What's the obvious conclusion, ftwman?

[2009-04-19 16:36:20] <BEazy[FACE]> This is making me miss Sev more

[2009-04-19 16:36:29] <OmahaHusker[MK]> what happened to him?

[2009-04-19 16:36:35] <sig> Deployed overseas

[2009-04-19 16:36:37] <BEazy[FACE]> He got shipped off

[2009-04-19 16:36:42] <adcde> GUYS

[2009-04-19 16:36:43] <BEazy[FACE]> like 2 months ago?

[2009-04-19 16:36:45] <OmahaHusker[MK]> oh snap, i didn't know he was .mil

[2009-04-19 16:36:47] <Blazix> BS is a part of NPO?

[2009-04-19 16:36:54] <adcde> I THINK THE ALIENS HAVE DONE THIS

[2009-04-19 16:37:00] <Nintenderek> ftwman[blackstone]: , could you get Demeanor on IRC here? I would like to have a conversation with him

[2009-04-19 16:37:01] <adcde> they are watching from planet mars

[2009-04-19 16:37:18] <sig> adcde, that's so funny I didn't laugh

[2009-04-19 16:37:28] <ftwman[blackstone]> He has a job, and can't be on irc while there.

[2009-04-19 16:37:31] <adcde> sig

[2009-04-19 16:37:37] <adcde> im actually being serious

[2009-04-19 16:37:40] <adcde> so thanks for not laughing

[2009-04-19 16:37:43] <sig> I'm sure you are

[2009-04-19 16:37:50] <adcde> no for real

[2009-04-19 16:37:56] <BEazy[FACE]> I don't think BC is in anyway part of NPO

[2009-04-19 16:37:58] <Blazix> this channel is getting bigger and bigger Tongue

[2009-04-19 16:38:00] <sig> that's delightful

[2009-04-19 16:38:12] <BEazy[FACE]> I do know that Dem has a large mouth

[2009-04-19 16:38:14] <adcde> why thank you sig

[2009-04-19 16:38:18] <Nintenderek> Well I'm ending this conversation here, because I'm tired of your incompetence ftwman[blackstone]

[2009-04-19 16:38:20] <adcde> you wanna be my friend?

[2009-04-19 16:38:25] <Sethly|AwayZ> is it true that BC is a sister alliance of NPO? y/n?

[2009-04-19 16:38:28] <tarikmo> n

[2009-04-19 16:38:35] <ftwman[blackstone]> n

[2009-04-19 16:38:36] <Blazix> lol

[2009-04-19 16:38:36] <Nintenderek> However you tell Dem that I want to have a serious conversation with him when I get back

[2009-04-19 16:38:41] <BEazy[FACE]> lol Seth

[2009-04-19 16:38:46] <adcde> hates u

[2009-04-19 16:38:52] <Sethly|AwayZ> ;-P

[2009-04-19 16:38:58] <Blazix> BS needs to prove it then..

[2009-04-19 16:39:01] <Nintenderek> And I expect answers to all my questions

[2009-04-19 16:39:07] <Sethly|AwayZ> pics or it doesnt count

I took out the lines of people joining the channel, because there was almost half a page with just those alone and they had host masks, however, I think you can figure everything out with those logs. I want someone from Blackstone to answer the questions I ask in there.

[Byron Orpheus]

What I'm hearing is, "I wish we hadn't trampled so many alliances in the past". This is you reaping what you've sowed. This is an example of others trying to correct your mistakes.

I suggest some lessons in critical reading, then, since that is not at all what I said; although I suppose to be fair to you I wish we hadn't trampled so many alliances so that one at least could remain to position itself as a worthy adversary rather than the futile, underground, juvenile antics of the espionage-challenged that wring their hands in despair until they can convince others to do the dirty work that they lack the resolve and the power to perform under the power of their own sails-- the efforts (opposition is too good of a word to waste on such futility) we see in the present are, in the words of a quote that I am sure Sponge would appreciate given his recent Tattler article, "all sound and fury, signifying nothing".

You extremists speak of honor and whatever over-idealized misguided Platonics you have in your heads from a source that for lack of a better option I will have to assume is "Beginner's Guide to Moral Philosophy", yet you connive and whisper in dark places of the deeds that you dare not perform.

When you kill a king, you don't stab him in the dark. You kill him where the entire court can watch him die. Until you and your misguided ilk are able to find the fortitude to perform man's work instead of trading juicy pieces of gossip around the women's sewing circle, I suggest that you save your time and ours and take up a diary as a better way to vent your frustrations at being, at best, mediocre.

[deth2munkies]

I suggest some lessons in critical reading, then, since that is not at all what I said; although I suppose to be fair to you I wish we hadn't trampled so many alliances so that one at least could remain to position itself as a worthy adversary rather than the futile, underground, juvenile antics of the espionage-challenged that wring their hands in despair until they can convince others to do the dirty work that they lack the resolve and the power to perform under the power of their own sails-- the efforts (opposition is too good of a word to waste on such futility) we see in the present are, in the words of a quote that I am sure Sponge would appreciate given his recent Tattler article, "all sound and fury, signifying nothing".

You extremists speak of honor and whatever over-idealized misguided Platonics you have in your heads from a source that for lack of a better option I will have to assume is "Beginner's Guide to Moral Philosophy", yet you connive and whisper in dark places of the deeds that you dare not perform.

When you kill a king, you don't stab him in the dark. You kill him where the entire court can watch him die. Until you and your misguided ilk are able to find the fortitude to perform man's work instead of trading juicy pieces of gossip around the women's sewing circle, I suggest that you save your time and ours and take up a diary as a better way to vent your frustrations at being, at best, mediocre.

To clarify a few things:

You never stomped anyone, you had your goons do it for you.

The spy efforts have actually been successful in undermining the PR of many large alliances and play at least a small part in the current state of affairs. Non-conventional warfare on Bob has been taken to a new, refreshing level. The "Private channels ftw" doctrine being turned on its head inherently benefits those out of power over those in power as they reveal the inner mechanics of the current hegemony for all to see.

Thirdly, honor is as malleable a term as any here on Bob. Its meaning is derived from the masses, thus those in favor will be honorable until they commit some mortal sin (ie refusing to honor a treaty, treatying the other side, etc) that throws them in with the rest of the bunch. Staying in the good graces of the masses may not seem important, but it does have negative side effects that are starting to manifest.

Lastly, the tough guy "do something about it" defense went out with the last war, I would suggest you no longer use it, hence you be considered a joke like the rest of your alliance.

[WarriorConcept]

I can't believe I read all those logs just now.

[Byron Orpheus]

To clarify further:

To clarify a few things:

You never stomped anyone, you had your goons do it for you.

Read: When we all work together it is friendship, when you do it we call it being a bully.

The spy efforts have actually been successful in undermining the PR of many large alliances and play at least a small part in the current state of affairs. Non-conventional warfare on Bob has been taken to a new, refreshing level. The "Private channels ftw" doctrine being turned on its head inherently benefits those out of power over those in power as they reveal the inner mechanics of the current hegemony for all to see.

Read: We enjoy our basements because we can say whatever we want and then, whenever asked what strength we actually have to accomplish our goals, can say "Hegemony! Hegemony!".

Lastly, the tough guy "do something about it" defense went out with the last war, I would suggest you no longer use it, hence you be considered a joke like the rest of your alliance.

It was not a tough guy do something about it defense so much as do not mistake being more agile than the leviathan as equating to being stronger.

[deth2munkies]

To clarify further:

Read: When we all work together it is friendship, when you do it we call it being a bully.

Read: We enjoy our basements because we can say whatever we want and then, whenever asked what strength we actually have to accomplish our goals, can say "Hegemony! Hegemony!".

It was not a tough guy do something about it defense so much as do not mistake being more agile than the leviathan as equating to being stronger.

Right. I don't even need to refute your first point, all I need to do is link any one of the 4-5 GGA threads from the last few weeks to have your own members refute the point that you had any large part in any military operation ever. I'm calling you insignificant in the larger spectrum, not attempting to label your kind of action.

Read: I'm going to ignore his points and keep spouting the same drivel like he didn't make an argument.

Your "king" analogy is the same thing as the tough guy defense. You basically say action cannot take place behind closed doors and you must back up your words publicly, which on Bob means by beating someone down in a war, which equates to...DING! Tough guy defense.

[Windsor]

Nintenderek: Give us some time to complete our investigation. I promise you that your questions will be answered to the best of our ability, as soon as we possibly can. Mind you, this is a favor that we are doing just for you.... something that we don't have to do. Although, I strongly encourage you to review those logs yourself... perhaps a look at 16:30:21 might get you to do that. If I'm going to review them, you should definitely do so as well.

Now, on to Byron:

I suggest some lessons in critical reading, then, since that is not at all what I said; although I suppose to be fair to you I wish we hadn't trampled so many alliances so that one at least could remain to position itself as a worthy adversary rather than the futile, underground, juvenile antics of the espionage-challenged that wring their hands in despair until they can convince others to do the dirty work that they lack the resolve and the power to perform under the power of their own sails-- the efforts (opposition is too good of a word to waste on such futility) we see in the present are, in the words of a quote that I am sure Sponge would appreciate given his recent Tattler article, "all sound and fury, signifying nothing".

You extremists speak of honor and whatever over-idealized misguided Platonics you have in your heads from a source that for lack of a better option I will have to assume is "Beginner's Guide to Moral Philosophy", yet you connive and whisper in dark places of the deeds that you dare not perform.

When you kill a king, you don't stab him in the dark. You kill him where the entire court can watch him die. Until you and your misguided ilk are able to find the fortitude to perform man's work instead of trading juicy pieces of gossip around the women's sewing circle, I suggest that you save your time and ours and take up a diary as a better way to vent your frustrations at being, at best, mediocre.

I'm having fun watching you eloquently assist us. By your standards, we are too inferior to cause a GW, and therefore, the source of the madness is derived from a higher power, such as NPO. Which basically backs-up what I've said.

A lesson in critical reading would highlight this for you. Keep up the good work. I know you can.

[Byron Orpheus]

Your "king" analogy is the same thing as the tough guy defense. You basically say action cannot take place behind closed doors and you must back up your words publicly, which on Bob means by beating someone down in a war, which equates to...DING! Tough guy defense.

Really all I am doing is calling the extremists' bluff. They need this binary relationship with the NPO to fuel their relevancy; there will never be true action because then they would have nothing to focus all their rhetoric on and the community at large would realize just how pathetic the whole bunch is.

[deth2munkies]

Really all I am doing is calling the extremists' bluff. They need this binary relationship with the NPO to fuel their relevancy; there will never be true action because then they would have nothing to focus all their rhetoric on and the community at large would realize just how pathetic the whole bunch is.

Actually, most of them were quite relevant to the global political scheme before they took upon themselves the mantle they now bear. In a world where their "side" "wins", they should have no problem integrating themselves back into the standard alliance system and becoming relevant from that end again.

As I've said before, the current stance of non-conventional warfare comes from the stagnation inherent in having one power bloc consisting of nearly 1/3 of the NS of the entire Cyberverse.

[Windsor]

Really all I am doing is calling the extremists' bluff. They need this binary relationship with the NPO to fuel their relevancy; there will never be true action because then they would have nothing to focus all their rhetoric on and the community at large would realize just how pathetic the whole bunch is.

Nevermind the cause or reason for our existence. When you have a dancing plethora of alliances that exist without a cause or purpose, and then an alliance with a cause or purpose comes along, that's a hard fact to ignore. You'll get over it.

Edited April 20, 2009 by Windsor

[Byron Orpheus]

Nevermind the cause or reason for our existence. When you have a dancing plethora of alliances that exist without a cause or purpose, and then an alliance with a cause or purpose comes along, that's a hard fact to ignore. You'll get over it.

I am sure we will all get over it. All this tension will be forgotten when your movement is a footnote on Pacifica's victory list.

[Windsor]

I am sure we will all get over it. All this tension will be forgotten when your movement is a footnote on Pacifica's victory list.

You would know about that, I'm sure. In the meantime, it's very clear that you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to our goals and objectives. If you'd like some education, you're welcome to click on my sig. If not, then keep doing what you're doing.