Deuterium Dawn Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Does that not fit with your desire for chaos and blood? I notice that you are avoiding the issue of other alliances and continue speaking about the GPA, so I decided to do my research. GPA was attacked for accepting Lord Swampy, who had attempted to coup a NPO ally and was therefore a rogue individual. Does not sound so innocent now. A probationary, affiliate member, not a full member of the GPA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 A probationary, affiliate member, not a full member of the GPA. That is still harboring a fugitive and, if it led to war, I am certain GPA had plenty of time to correct the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkules Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Shaneprice: the threatening of One Vision's solidarityJonathan Brookbank: That sounds suspiciously like treason to me. Of course the extremists want to make this all about Pacifica, when really it is about the cancer of populism that is trying to kill our peace. When did GGA lose the right to consider changing or moving away from it's current allies? I mean, we have that right. I've discussed it many times with whatever alliance I was in at the time, leaving a certain ally or even bloc. Does that mean that I should have been executed for having an opinion? Doubt it. Also, the moment you said it was up to the Pacifica and their allies to ENFORCE the peace pretty much declared them the tyrants that you claim they aren't. They're enforcing their will and world view on us without our permission. Not much more tyrannical than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahman Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 While the New Pacific Order does flaunt it power, it does it with good reason. They have earned that power, that strength. The hard work of people went into making that organization what it is today, and the matter still stands that the minority are against it just to be against the power they have. Perhaps if you would work constructively for yourselves or an alliance of your choice (that is not directly at war with the NPO), you too would be successful instead of just posting in the OWF every other minute knocking the actions of a large CN alliance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 When did GGA lose the right to consider changing or moving away from it's current allies? I mean, we have that right. I've discussed it many times with whatever alliance I was in at the time, leaving a certain ally or even bloc. Does that mean that I should have been executed for having an opinion? Doubt it.Also, the moment you said it was up to the Pacifica and their allies to ENFORCE the peace pretty much declared them the tyrants that you claim they aren't. They're enforcing their will and world view on us without our permission. Not much more tyrannical than that. There is no will being enforced, only the mutual benefit of the majority. Clearly alliances are allowed to move away from certain allies (the other boards are proof of this) but there are proper ways of accomplishing this goal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkules Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 There is no will being enforced, only the mutual benefit of the majority. Clearly alliances are allowed to move away from certain allies (the other boards are proof of this) but there are proper ways of accomplishing this goal. What other way is there than to bring it up for discussion? Them deciding what is in the best interest of everyone and enforcing that belief is them enforcing their will on us. Especially since they view themselves as the majority and everything they do in "the majority's name" somehow seems to benefit them massively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 What other way is there than to bring it up for discussion?Them deciding what is in the best interest of everyone and enforcing that belief is them enforcing their will on us. Especially since they view themselves as the majority and everything they do in "the majority's name" somehow seems to benefit them massively. You act as if the NPO acts completely alone, when this is not at all the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta1212 Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 There will never be a time when everyone is happy with everything. A majority is better then nothing, and the minority should not go about attacking the majority just for being successful in their endeavors. Um... What else is the minority going to do? Give up and leave? The minority should always attack the majority. Asking the opposition to sit quietly and let the winner bask in the glory is just as silly as the opposition asking the winner to stop being good so they can beat them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkules Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 You act as if the NPO acts completely alone, when this is not at all the case. Indeed it's not. And look what happened when one of the leaders of one of those that helps them wants to try and move away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Um... What else is the minority going to do? Give up and leave? The minority should always attack the majority. Asking the opposition to sit quietly and let the winner bask in the glory is just as silly as the opposition asking the winner to stop being good so they can beat them. The minority does not have to be at odds with the majority, it chooses to do so because it values disorder over structure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahman Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Um... What else is the minority going to do? Give up and leave? The minority should always attack the majority. Asking the opposition to sit quietly and let the winner bask in the glory is just as silly as the opposition asking the winner to stop being good so they can beat them. The Minority can work to become a new majority perhaps? It does not have to fight the bigger powers, but peacefully grow until it too becomes a big player in CN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkules Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 The minority does not have to be at odds with the majority, it chooses to do so because it values disorder over structure. Um..no. We just don't want to toe the Pacifican party line. That by itself puts us at odds with them and because that could potentially mean opposition they see us as a threat. That line of thinking is a lot of what lead to the current state of affairs, Pacifica believing that those that opposed their view were threatening them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 The Minority can work to become a new majority perhaps? It does not have to fight the bigger powers, but peacefully grow until it too becomes a big player in CN This is more or less the idea behind my "Domination and Subordination" essay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahman Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 (edited) Well perhaps if these people that are deemed "security threats" by the NPO did not actively rouse up people against them and request people help attack them they wouldn't be on these lists. If you make threats against an organization or if you begin writing your beliefs in a way that make you seem zealous in your hatred for said organization, then you need to expect some kind of action on their part. Be it a pre-emptive strike or merely being watched by the organizations people closely. *edit* To Orpheus: I'll have to read that essay sometime then, but, since I do not like reading when I'm tired and out of my own house it will have to wait for a better time Edited April 17, 2009 by bahman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkules Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 The Minority can work to become a new majority perhaps? It does not have to fight the bigger powers, but peacefully grow until it too becomes a big player in CN And the majority will what? Sit still? Let their power fade without a fight? Rarely, if ever, does this method of the minority gaining power work. There WILL be a fight, even if it's over before it begins and the former majority has already lost too much power to possibly win they still won't accept their defeat so to speak until they have been truly defeated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahman Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 The majorities power does not have to necessarily fade. It can be maintained while the Minority gains power from new people on CN before they join up with the Majority. The Minority also still holds rights, such as the right to exist and such. You can slowly grow in power without stagnating and eventually hold as much power, if not more, then the Majority. You could also accept your place, it is you who has chosen to remain part of the Minority. You have your reasons of course, but you can live in this position peacefully and still have your nation flourish. If you do not actively fight the Majority out of envy of their power (or other reasons other then defense) then you are almost assured of your right to grow. If you are already on a large Organizations bad side however, the only thing you can do is apologize for causing disruption and commit to a life of peaceful growth and hope they accept that. Or you can reroll and start your CN life anew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekJones Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 (edited) The majorities power does not have to necessarily fade. It can be maintained while the Minority gains power from new people on CN before they join up with the Majority.The Minority also still holds rights, such as the right to exist and such. You can slowly grow in power without stagnating and eventually hold as much power, if not more, then the Majority. You could also accept your place, it is you who has chosen to remain part of the Minority. You have your reasons of course, but you can live in this position peacefully and still have your nation flourish. If you do not actively fight the Majority out of envy of their power (or other reasons other then defense) then you are almost assured of your right to grow. If you are already on a large Organizations bad side however, the only thing you can do is apologize for causing disruption and commit to a life of peaceful growth and hope they accept that. Or you can reroll and start your CN life anew There have been plenty of alliances that have contested the majority, or have come close to rivaling the majority in power, or at the very least, represent a change of pace from the dominating hegemony (FAN, GOONS, NpO, Polar, MK, GPA etc.), and they've all been under attack from the majority, some of them in eternal war. FAN, GOONS, and \m/ weren't even allowed to exist after the ending of those wars. Alliances can't even grow to a level that can rival the hegemony unless they become part of the majority bloc in today's CN. Did GPA contest the majority politically? Or did they simply grow too large? What threat did they pose to the majority? Edited April 17, 2009 by DerekJones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahman Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Well then in this case, certain precautions must be taken. MDP's with other Minorities that are growing and perhaps even some of the Majority alliances can help this cause Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Well then in this case, certain precautions must be taken. MDP's with other Minorities that are growing and perhaps even some of the Majority alliances can help this cause It is a source of humor, for me at least, that the inadequacies of those not in a position of influence are somehow the fault of those with influence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkules Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Well then in this case, certain precautions must be taken. MDP's with other Minorities that are growing and perhaps even some of the Majority alliances can help this cause This assumes we are all united. We are not. However, the majority still acts to crush any who are growing large enough that should other members of the "Minority" join them could threaten their grip on the world. To say that is other than tyranny is foolish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 This assumes we are all united. We are not. However, the majority still acts to crush any who are growing large enough that should other members of the "Minority" join them could threaten their grip on the world. To say that is other than tyranny is foolish. The only tyranny here is that those who achieve success receive constant flaming for their efforts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahman Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 So you whine and complain that the Majority is too strong. Well, they have worked their collective butts off getting to that point as Orpheus has said. You just need to work harder, to the point that it may seem impossible since you continuously say it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphysics Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Freedom through oppression, love it! All this majority/minority nonsense should stop. There is no majority in Bob because those who you deem as having power do not represent the majority of the nations nor alliances in the realm. They are a small minority of influence which as been able to gain enough power and leverage to control events around them. This influence, like all things deemed perfect, is crumbling apart and will find itself being dismantled in time. The GPA incident puts a big smudge on your theory. That act of violence was a complete farce and the you really should review and understand it before even making any additional commentary towards it. There was no threat to be had from a Neutral alliance. The powers that be simply didn't like the way GPA was the top alliance statistically and knocked them down and out. As well, the whole 'reason' they attacked was the fault of a certain someone whom escaped the beating of GPA and quickly cruised into a tC alliance. I think the OP would receive a more hearty debate if they lost the air of arrogance and stopped using the lolScholar approach to debating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Orpheus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 The GPA incident puts a big smudge on your theory. That act of violence was a complete farce and the you really should review and understand it before even making any additional commentary towards it. There was no threat to be had from a Neutral alliance. The powers that be simply didn't like the way GPA was the top alliance statistically and knocked them down and out. As well, the whole 'reason' they attacked was the fault of a certain someone whom escaped the beating of GPA and quickly cruised into a tC alliance. I have addressed the issue of the GPA fairly thoroughly, in my opinion. They harbored a fugitive and were attacked, in part, for that reason; although it is certainly interesting how some people have conveniently ignored that bit of history and insisted that GPA was attacked for absolutely no reason. I think the OP would receive a more hearty debate if they lost the air of arrogance and stopped using the lolScholar approach to debating. I would debate better if I didn't believe in my arguments and argued poorly? I do not know what a lolScholar approach is, but if it can be compared to my own style of writing and debate I assume that it has something to do with debating well-- for if I debated poorly not so many people would be angry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkphysics Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I have addressed the issue of the GPA fairly thoroughly, in my opinion. They harbored a fugitive and were attacked, in part, for that reason; although it is certainly interesting how some people have conveniently ignored that bit of history and insisted that GPA was attacked for absolutely no reason.I would debate better if I didn't believe in my arguments and argued poorly? I do not know what a lolScholar approach is, but if it can be compared to my own style of writing and debate I assume that it has something to do with debating well-- for if I debated poorly not so many people would be angry. Do some more 'research' if you want to know about the lolScholar method of debating. Oh, and never do assume people's inability to fathom your willfully blind sycophancy for the NPO as anger. It's just been a long time since we had a lolScholar student in here. As for the GPA. They had a reroll enter their academy. This reroll was never a full member and was only able to get into the academy. The GPA had not even had a chance to thoroughly review their application to even determine if they were a 'wanted fugitive', nor was the reroll admitting their status. As well, the only members in GPA who knew the origin of the reroll (namely Kurushio (sp?), bailed out of GPA in the nick of time so to speak and became a very vocal part of NATO, a tC alliance. You see, they were not harboring jack squat. People found out about this 'extremely dangerous' fugitive and rained hell on the GPA for it. Regardless of the fact the 'extremely dangerous' fugitive was only in a probationary academy program and wasn't even allowed to fly the GPA aa yet (was GPA Academy or something like that). Low and behold though, the dinner bell rang and the wolves came to the GPA's doorstep demanding justice for their tremendous misdeeds. Funny how the person who knew all along about the despicable, 'dangerous' reroll later became a member of tC alliance and for what I know was left untouched from the issue ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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