Grievances Concerning the Grand Army of Europe

[Sarah Tintagyl]

Prime Minister Sarah Tintagyl stepped into the press room with a storm of flashing lights from the reporters who had been anxious to hear this speech for sometime now. Since the formation of the Grand Army of Europe, Hanseatic press had criticized its development, but the government had ignored the calls for what many in the Republic believed to be the encroaching of Europe by a foreign power. Sarah had feelings about the peacekeeping force as well, but it had taken a great deal of convincing of herself to finally bring her grievances, and the grievances of the entire Republic to the world's ears. No doubt there would be fierce criticism of her own theories on the situation, but if the people of the Hansa demanded their voices heard she could keep silent no longer. Stepping up to the podium, with Hanseatic flags on her left and right, she took a deep breath and began.

Ladies and gentlemen, for sometime now I have held my tongue and ignored the demands of my citizens to confront this issue, but I wish to bring to the world, the various grievances that that Hanseatic Republic has concerning the Grand Army of Europe and how this social advancement might be improved to better serve the European Continent. I will not deny that before I read into the details of the GAE Treaty in creating its organization that I pledged my support for a peacekeeping force on the continent, but upon reading further I am struck that the creation of the Grand Army is nothing more that the United Francoist Empire's desire to spread their influence to the European Continent.

Firstly, in the beginning of the GAE Treaty, there is clearly stated that the Grand Army is to support the Ferrous Pacific Brotherhood abroad. Is it truly fair for the deployment of European troops to assist in an alliance of nations that exist on the opposite side of Eurasia. Would not it be more logical for the nations consisting of the Grand Army to join the Ferrous Pacific or is the Grand Army just an extension of the Pacific Brotherhood in Europe? In any case, it would make much more sense for a pact to be signed joining both the Grand Army and the Ferrous Pacific in defense of one another. Therefore one would expect that if European Nations would support the Ferrous Pacific, that all members of the Ferrous Pacific would rush to the plight of European nations as well.

Secondly, concerning the leadership of the Grand Army was something that placed these feelings of uneasiness into Hanseatic minds from the start. The Commandant of the Grand Army is a leader not appointed by European nations, but by the Emperor of the United Francoist Empire. Mind you, he is consulted by a security council of European nations, but do these nations have any power to appoint or recall the commandant? No, only the Emperor, the Emperor of a non-European nation can recall him.

Lastly, the nations that have joined the Grand Army are provided with Imperial technology to modernize their military forces, far suppressing the military technology of countries not part of the Grand Army. This quick modernization will upset the balance of power between members and non-members, but more so would not these nations owe some support to the United Francoist Empire for providing this modern technology. I would like to know if this technology is given as a gift to nations or if by providing this power the Francoist Empire government expects something beyond the peacekeeping forces of Europeans patrolling among other Europeans.

This is not an attack on the philosophy behind the establishment of a peacekeeping force. However, it is hard for us to see cover what appears to be the start of massive Imperial influence on the European continent. The Hansa is not part of the GAE, however this military force influences the inter workings of all European politics, especially those of a militaristic nature. We are after all, part of the continent. As a proposal, we believe that European support for the Ferrous Pacific should be abolished, unless both parties sign a common pact. We believe that the commandant of the Grand Army should be native to a European country part of the GAE, and that the Commander should be appointed by European governments, not by a foreign power. Recently we have seen a doctrine created in the Americas against foreign colonization of their continent, why should we not have the same freedom from colonization in Europe? Europe is a continent of Europeans and should not be influenced by a government thousands of miles away. Thank you.

Sarah breathed a sigh of relief and left the stage. Questions would be later and she was expecting a lot of them.

[freakwars]

Perhaps the Europeans not in the pact should form a rival pact.

or a pact that will prevent Ferrous Pacific from gaining too much power.

Edited February 5, 2009 by freakwars

[Cody Seb]

General Vostok, Soviet Representative on the Grand Army of Europe Security Council, had these things to say;

"First, I will address the Andonians. Leave your grudges behind, also, you are not even on the European Continent, nor do you have any remaining ties. You dont have any business here.

Now, for the comments made by the Hansa. It is important to understand we entered into this pact by our own choosing, with full knowledge of all its aspects. The decision was ours to accept a UFE appointed Commandant, and we did.

Now, you recognize the peacekeeping aspect of the Grand Army. Why then, would you be worried about imperialism when the Grand Army has pursued nothing of the sort and has remained peaceful for its entire existence thus far?

Now, the UFE does not demand anything in repayment for our technological upgrades.

One glaring flaw in your speech I see it the inability to recognize other regional pacts. While not in a consolidated bloc (although 3 of the 4 are), The United Kingdom, Ile De Noir, Gebiv, and Rebel Army are all in a similar pact, albeit without a commandant. Does anyone raise an eyebrow? No. I do not mean to say they should, I am merely pointing out that another very strong non-european nation is in a stabilizing bloc on the European continent and you have no worries. All that worries you is that it is headed by the UFE, and for no good reason.

You could, in fact, thank the UFE for liberating your lands, for without them you would still be a part of Greater Nordland. That is why I don't understand your trepidation regarding them.

As for your statements about us having to support Ferrous Pacific forces, many of us were already previously treatied to the UFE, head of the Ferrous Pacific, and did so anyway. That actually changed very little.

I will remind you however that I speak solely for myself and my nation and not as an ambassador of the Grand Army, although I think the others will agree with my points."

[Sarah Tintagyl]

General Vostok, Soviet Representative on the Grand Army of Europe Security Council, had these things to say;

"First, I will address the Andonians. Leave your grudges behind, also, you are not even on the European Continent, nor do you have any remaining ties. You dont have any business here.

Now, for the comments made by the Hansa. It is important to understand we entered into this pact by our own choosing, with full knowledge of all its aspects. The decision was ours to accept a UFE appointed Commandant, and we did.

Now, you recognize the peacekeeping aspect of the Grand Army. Why then, would you be worried about imperialism when the Grand Army has pursued nothing of the sort and has remained peaceful for its entire existence thus far?

Now, the UFE does not demand anything in repayment for our technological upgrades.

One glaring flaw in your speech I see it the inability to recognize other regional pacts. While not in a consolidated bloc (although 3 of the 4 are), The United Kingdom, Ile De Noir, Gebiv, and Rebel Army are all in a similar pact, albeit without a commandant. Does anyone raise an eyebrow? No. I do not mean to say they should, I am merely pointing out that another very strong non-european nation is in a stabilizing bloc on the European continent and you have no worries. All that worries you is that it is headed by the UFE, and for no good reason.

You could, in fact, thank the UFE for liberating your lands, for without them you would still be a part of Greater Nordland. That is why I don't understand your trepidation regarding them.

As for your statements about us having to support Ferrous Pacific forces, many of us were already previously treatied to the UFE, head of the Ferrous Pacific, and did so anyway. That actually changed very little.

I will remind you however that I speak solely for myself and my nation and not as an ambassador of the Grand Army, although I think the others will agree with my points."

Thank you General Vostok to responding to my concerns and I appreciate you helping to clear the fog from my eyes as well as my citizens. We have seen the blocs in Southern Europe as well and believe me we were worried about them as well and I apologize for only singling out the Grand Army in my speech, the Mediterranean Bloc when it was first conceived I thought that it was beginning to surround Isolationist Byzantium and were just as weary of their intentions, regrettably I did not voice my concerns.

Concerning the Ferrous Pacific I did not know that many of the nations of the Grand Army were treated to the UFE prior. When checking the past treaties and the members of the Ferrous Pacific Brotherhood I did not check on the European Alliances to the UFE and in that made a terrible mistake on your nations' past relations with them.

If your governments also accepted the UFE Commander then I have no room to object again because I am not apart of the Grand Army. Again I was voicing my concern of thinking that this could lead to an imperialist power on the continent, but your assurance puts me at ease General. Once again, thank you for addressing this.

[Cody Seb]

"It is no problem and I do not take offense. Hopefully this will also reassure others who have questions about the Grand Army."

[Triyun]

Nobody was forced to sign the Grand Army of Europe. The army is made up of many newer national governments along with many nations that lack military experience. The United Francoist Empire does not only have advanced technology, but veteran commanders who fought in multiple conflicts from the Japan War onwards. Our considerable experience in wartime operations and sustaining large scale operations. It only makes sense that the UFE be the commandant of the forces.

As far as aid to countries, we are not demanding anything in return. We offer them modern weapons at price levels which our other allies have. Furthermore it gives them access to technology in the first place. There are many countries which do not have export rights to these technologies.

Lastly in regards to Ferrous Pacific, Ferrous Pacific is a global defense bloc, the GAE is designed to focus specifically on European Affairs and European Security. Of course they are asked to support the FPB thought. The FPB is the center of our international relations and our strongest bloc, it only makes sense that we not create something that would violate our commitment to that bloc.

[Mirreille]

Thank you General Vostok to responding to my concerns and I appreciate you helping to clear the fog from my eyes as well as my citizens. We have seen the blocs in Southern Europe as well and believe me we were worried about them as well and I apologize for only singling out the Grand Army in my speech, the Mediterranean Bloc when it was first conceived I thought that it was beginning to surround Isolationist Byzantium and were just as weary of their intentions, regrettably I did not voice my concerns.

'Isolationist' Byzantium? Byzantium is a member of the Grand Army of Europe itself, and probably the UFE's strongest supporter at the present time. I really think you are off base in saying the Pax Mediterranea was created to counter Byzantium. That nation formed out of former Rebel Army territories, and at least previously they were treatied with both Gebiv and my nation.

Also, the Scandanavian Union is a bloc as well, i'm not sure how you could have forgotten that. Europe is, and perhaps always will be divided.

[KaiserMelech Mikhail]

My grievance is that it is not led by this guy:

"Everyone on that continent is now an enemy of the Europublic."

[Sarah Tintagyl]

'Isolationist' Byzantium? Byzantium is a member of the Grand Army of Europe itself, and probably the UFE's strongest supporter at the present time. I really think you are off base in saying the Pax Mediterranea was created to counter Byzantium. That nation formed out of former Rebel Army territories, and at least previously they were treatied with both Gebiv and my nation.

Also, the Scandanavian Union is a bloc as well, i'm not sure how you could have forgotten that. Europe is, and perhaps always will be divided.

Before Byzantium joined were they not predominantly isolationist it seemed many of their reactions to the world seemed as though they were following a isolationist policy. Forgive me if I sounded brash when I said that the Pax Mediterranea was formed for that reason. As these European Blocs are built up, one cannot wonder how long until warfare begins to break out between factions. Factions themselves are a matter that concerns me and I would imagine concerns the rest of the continent, what worries me is that the blocs have created a balance of power that might be off set.

I fully understand that the SU is another faction and would be interested in any ideas or further pacts that could unite our continent further, whether militarily, economically, or politically.

My greatest concern was that foreign nations hold important power in many of these blocs. As the Soviet general said concerning Pax Mediterranea and as I said on the UFE in the Grand Army and that if war would erupt between said blocs that it would eventually spill over to other continents that these foreign powers reside in.

Edited February 5, 2009 by Sarah Tintagyl

[The Confederation]

The Kingdom of Prussia respects each nation's right to choose who they ally with. Though we are somewhat concerned seeing foreigners somewhat dictate military policy in Europe, I can also see the advantages of diversification in our humble portion of the world.

Indeed, the Prussian people feel the gap forming between nations in Europe, and are eternally grateful for their nation's true neutrality.

[Justinian the Mighty]

You could, in fact, thank the UFE for liberating your lands, for without them you would still be a part of Greater Nordland. That is why I don't understand your trepidation regarding them.

It is unfortunate to see that the nations of Europe have already forgotten that Russian nations began the march towards freedom. Slavorussian men fought and died in Nordland for the independence of nine countries, and their sacrifice has already been forgotten. The UFE was but one factor in the defeat of Nordland it took a coalition to free Europe, not one nation.

[Triyun]

I do not think anyone minimizes the RUSSIAN role in the war. We certainly haven't.

[Lavo]

My greatest concern was that foreign nations hold important power in many of these blocs. As the Soviet general said concerning Pax Mediterranea and as I said on the UFE in the Grand Army and that if war would erupt between said blocs that it would eventually spill over to other continents that these foreign powers reside in.

"One matter to note is, and I think this is a crucial factor that has been overlooked, that Pax Mediterranea was not at all created due to European politics and issues. Both the RA and Gebiv already were treaty'd, via the PAC, Gebiv and Ile de Noir have been longstanding historic allies, and finally, Ile de Noir and the RA have had strong relations for the longest time. In fact, much of if not all, of Ile de Noir's tanks are RA Merkavas. If I have heard your brilliant address correctly, you're main problem is the influence and polarizing effect the Grand Army of Europe has on European politics, policies, and issues. Pax Mediterranea was created to form a closer bond between three friends and brothers, and not due to any sort of geographical or continental aims."

[Triyun]

"One matter to note is, and I think this is a crucial factor that has been overlooked, that Pax Mediterranea was not at all created due to European politics and issues. Both the RA and Gebiv already were treaty'd, via the PAC, Gebiv and Ile de Noir have been longstanding historic allies, and finally, Ile de Noir and the RA have had strong relations for the longest time. In fact, much of if not all, of Ile de Noir's tanks are RA Merkavas. If I have heard your brilliant address correctly, you're main problem is the influence and polarizing effect the Grand Army of Europe has on European politics, policies, and issues. Pax Mediterranea was created to form a closer bond between three friends and brothers, and not due to any sort of geographical or continental aims."

And the UFE and UESR were allies prior, same with Dutch Republic, Franzharia were our longtime friends despite the attack by Nordland, and we've aided the Byzantine's since they came to power. What is the difference there?

[Lavo]

And the UFE and UESR were allies prior, same with Dutch Republic, Franzharia were our longtime friends despite the attack by Nordland, and we've aided the Byzantine's since they came to power. What is the difference there?

"It's missions, scale, ties with other blocs, centralized control/possible loss of sovereignty, and naming."

[Sarah Tintagyl]

"One matter to note is, and I think this is a crucial factor that has been overlooked, that Pax Mediterranea was not at all created due to European politics and issues. Both the RA and Gebiv already were treaty'd, via the PAC, Gebiv and Ile de Noir have been longstanding historic allies, and finally, Ile de Noir and the RA have had strong relations for the longest time. In fact, much of if not all, of Ile de Noir's tanks are RA Merkavas. If I have heard your brilliant address correctly, you're main problem is the influence and polarizing effect the Grand Army of Europe has on European politics, policies, and issues. Pax Mediterranea was created to form a closer bond between three friends and brothers, and not due to any sort of geographical or continental aims."

That was why I wrote the speech yes, but you must understand that much of this information I have been told from the various nations and factions of Europe I am hearing for the first time. Again, stating from things I learned from the GAE, these countries allowed the UFE to name their own commander of this army and have been allied to Ferrous Pacific for sometime. I will not lie, I still find that a foreigner leading a European Army makes me uneasy, but I will not let that uneasiness get in the way of diplomacy with the other nations of Europe. I hope that the GAE will continue to provide peacekeeping missions as they have done in the past and any and all my accusations are proven wrong.

Concerning RA's statement, again, I was not planning on negotiations with the Pax Mediterranea and do not know much of RA's, Gebiv's, or Ile de Noir's histories. Again my only concern is the protection of European countries on the continent. I also understand that I do not have the force contribute to this, however I only voice the concerns I see going on in Europe. If countries and blocs are able to show me something better than my perceived reality then I am quite fine with it. But as it was said before, Europe is slowly being divided into factions, which could cause many problems in the future.

[freakwars]

"First, I will address the Andonians. Leave your grudges behind, also, you are not even on the European Continent, nor do you have any remaining ties. You dont have any business here.

We have no grudge against the GAE, and excuse me if we take an interest in the continent on which our culture was born.

We were merely suggesting that, since the Hansa was saying that they were worried that the GAE would gain too much power they should make an equally large bloc, that could hold the power of the GAE in check. This would result in peace.

[Triyun]

"It's missions, scale, ties with other blocs, centralized control/possible loss of sovereignty, and naming."

Sovereignty is always the state's choice to give up to a international organization and agreement. This goes for an economic or military blocs. Centralized control is a standard part of military blocs, and makes a lot of sense as it improves coordination (OOC: NATO supreme allied commander), as for the name I don't see how names matter at all.

[Cody Seb]

We have no grudge against the GAE, and excuse me if we take an interest in the continent on which our culture was born.

We were merely suggesting that, since the Hansa was saying that they were worried that the GAE would gain too much power they should make an equally large bloc, that could hold the power of the GAE in check. This would result in peace.

You could be charged with conspiracy. You called for the non-members to create an opposing bloc, which would not result in peace, hence the word opposing.

[Subtleknifewielder]

We have no grudge against the GAE, and excuse me if we take an interest in the continent on which our culture was born.

We were merely suggesting that, since the Hansa was saying that they were worried that the GAE would gain too much power they should make an equally large bloc, that could hold the power of the GAE in check. This would result in peace.

Not necessarily. It could also ensure that the next great war will make the Nordic wars look like church picnic.

You could be charged with conspiracy. You called for the non-members to create an opposing bloc, which would not result in peace, hence the word opposing.

Actually, opposing does not necessarily lead to hostility. It cold just mean a form of balance, like many forces in nature are balanced.

The points each of you make do not take everything into consideration.

[Mirreille]

That was why I wrote the speech yes, but you must understand that much of this information I have been told from the various nations and factions of Europe I am hearing for the first time. Again, stating from things I learned from the GAE, these countries allowed the UFE to name their own commander of this army and have been allied to Ferrous Pacific for sometime. I will not lie, I still find that a foreigner leading a European Army makes me uneasy, but I will not let that uneasiness get in the way of diplomacy with the other nations of Europe. I hope that the GAE will continue to provide peacekeeping missions as they have done in the past and any and all my accusations are proven wrong.

Concerning RA's statement, again, I was not planning on negotiations with the Pax Mediterranea and do not know much of RA's, Gebiv's, or Ile de Noir's histories. Again my only concern is the protection of European countries on the continent. I also understand that I do not have the force contribute to this, however I only voice the concerns I see going on in Europe. If countries and blocs are able to show me something better than my perceived reality then I am quite fine with it. But as it was said before, Europe is slowly being divided into factions, which could cause many problems in the future.

I almost replied again earlier, and then decided to refrain, because I was going to say you seem to be unaware of the past histories of many of the states in Europe. I don't mind saying it now since you have come right out and said it yourself.

I would say Europe has split into 4 groups, roughly; mostly older states in the south and west, the Scandanavian union of mostly newer states, the G.A.E. which is a bit of a mix of both, and of course neutral Prussia. You should not be that upset, since being split up is the norm for Europe, not the exception. I would be more concerned with how those states get along, not whether they are treatied with each other.

Edit: One minor correction: We only have 500 RA merkava types currently, out of 8000. We certainly would not mind more of them in the future though.

Edited February 6, 2009 by Mirreille

[DeSchaine]

You could be charged with conspiracy. You called for the non-members to create an opposing bloc, which would not result in peace, hence the word opposing.

Charged? How and why? Conspiracy to do what wrong against whom? What specific law governs the ability of nations to create power blocs? Would such a thing result in war instantly? If so, why? It would be nothing more than an effort to protect them selves against a stronger power, which, if you declared war on them for making the pact, they would be proven justified.

[Triyun]

Charged? How and why? Conspiracy to do what wrong against whom? What specific law governs the ability of nations to create power blocs? Would such a thing result in war instantly? If so, why? It would be nothing more than an effort to protect them selves against a stronger power, which, if you declared war on them for making the pact, they would be proven justified.

There is a difference between creating a bloc to oppose and creating a bloc to defend oneself. By creating a bloc to oppose you are actively taking action against another rather than moving to secure your own security. The Grand Army of Europe has not gone on a war of conquest, if this was a UFE conspiracy to take over Europe, I would have just ordered it done. It would not have been that hard to continue the last war into all of Europe and remove Gebiv and the Nordlanders permanently.

[DeSchaine]

The two things are not mutually exclusive. They could be taking action to defend themselves against you. It doesnt matter if the GAE is an army of conquest or not. Some could see the power that such a bloc embodies as a threat and create an opposing bloc to defend against it. (OOC: Lets face it, IG, that is SO true, though it usually gets perverted somewhere along the line.)

[Sarah Tintagyl]

Gentlemen, I did not voice my concerns to create any such bloc to limit either the Mediterranean Bloc or the Grand Army of Europe. I simply put what I found to be unsettling for the public to see and every country has explained their reasoning for the creation of such pacts. Ile de Noir has brought up a very good point however, Europe is divided between blocs and it should be our new concern to establish some kind of permanent peace between the various European factions. But again I want to assure that nothing I said was meant to be an attack on various states ideologies.

Correct me if I am wrong, but all these blocs were created for the continuation of peace on the European continent, therefore as long as all countries are in support of their said bloc, we should only be trying to continue to unite the various blocs for a stronger sense of peace.