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5 minutes ago, Liltrekkie said:

I cannot believe you wrote all that toxic waste. So now CLAWS has it out for poor ol' cobrasphere? Please, save it for someone who cares. I'll wager that not one person there gives a hoot about cobra, they just dont like your smug face. They dont need a CB to stomp you, they could stomp you at any time they felt like it. And yet, they dont. Yeah sure seems like they have it out for you. 

 

Also, you never condemn the whistleblower. There are laws to protect them you know, not that you care. And on that note, if he was approached by TDE and not the other way around, where are those screenshots? Oh wait, they dont exist, because it never happened. 

 

Nice try though. TIE was caught, he admitted to it. Stop the BS, stop the spin. Its over. TIE lost. No amount of spinning will change that L. 

 

No one is talking about that.

Do you not understand TDE was plotting against COBRA long before any of that happened, or are you just holding your maw ajar while LH shovels ungodly amount of lies into it?

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26 minutes ago, Tevron said:

It is pretty evident to me that the SDI decom is a literal response to unhappiness about Lucius' decom. If that isn't an attempt at provocation, I'm not sure what is. I said as much to Kapleo in his embassy on the GATO server when he brought up this recent development.

 

If you don't think KNB is connected to CLAWS, it doesn't make sense to mirror a term against Lucius that you've called unjust and drag their CB into this conflict. Doing so makes this a CLAWS issue because you mingle CBs. The inclusion of Lucius' nation in particular shows that his apology isn't genuine and could be seen as a violation of his agreement for peace.

 

If you do think KNB is connected to CLAWS you are instigating a war with them right now. 

 

Both of these don't make much sense for a group of alliances who want to not be at war with CLAWS. And in both scenarios the outcome is the same. As I advised Kapleo, it makes sense to punish TDE, it doesn't make sense to ask for wonder decoms and bring Lucius into the terms, because it effectively reignites the CB for the CLAWS-TIE war. I understand wanting to punish someone who got an ally rolled, tis' tradition. I don't understand why you'd try to force conflict with CLAWS and probably miss out on any justice you could gain.

 

If in seeming to emulate a precedent set by your allies is seen as a provocation, then maybe it can serve as an example that speaks volumes for how futile such demands can be.

 

It is not an unreasonable demand, given the extent of TDE's actual roguery against us, but I do understand why it would seem like such a !@#$%* term.

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9 minutes ago, Liltrekkie said:

TIE was caught, he admitted to it. Stop the BS, stop the spin. Its over. TIE lost. No amount of spinning will change that

 

This is the only accurate bit of your post and I suggest you heed your own wisdom because you are making very wild and uninformed speculations, bordering on what would be seen as straight up lying to people who are actually in the loop.

 

You are only being told what Hitchcock serves up and you've knocked that Kool-aid back like a champ! Congrats.

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1 minute ago, Johnny Apocalypse said:

 

This is the only accurate bit of your post and I suggest you heed your own wisdom because you are making very wild and uninformed speculations, bordering on what would be seen as straight up lying to people who are actually in the loop.

 

You are only being told what Hitchcock serves up and you've knocked that Kool-aid back like a champ! Congrats.

I'll admit that made me chuckle. Seriously though, the screenshots are public. Everyone can see for themselves what the truth is. LH isn't doing a thing, he doesn't have to with all this information that has been made public.

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23 minutes ago, Johnny Apocalypse said:

 

This is a straight lie. I know LH, if he's active there's rarely an instance where he "isn't doing a thing" lol

He literally isn't doing a thing. We've hardly spoken in the last few weeks. So it's the truth, something you have a hard time telling since all you know how to do is spin.

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27 minutes ago, Liltrekkie said:

He literally isn't doing a thing. We've hardly spoken in the last few weeks. So it's the truth, something you have a hard time telling since all you know how to do is spin.

 

Well, sucks he won't talk to his ally. If you wanna talk to him maybe you should be me (or like me), he spends an awful lot of time trying to get my attention by throwing verbal barbs out my way.

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6 minutes ago, Johnny Apocalypse said:

 

Well, sucks he won't talk to his ally. If you wanna talk to him maybe you should be me (or like me), he spends an awful lot of time trying to get my attention by throwing verbal barbs out my way.

Or perhaps, he's doing what he's supposed to, and trying to get peace from people who can't even maintain their story, or make up their mind on whether they want individual peace or coalition peace. Something you've flip flopped on two or three times now. Maybe if you weren't so busy trying to spin a trail of tears about some spy network you may or may not have been involved in, you could get things done.

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2 minutes ago, Liltrekkie said:

Or perhaps, he's doing what he's supposed to, and trying to get peace from people who can't even maintain their story, or make up their mind on whether they want individual peace or coalition peace. Something you've flip flopped on two or three times now. Maybe if you weren't so busy trying to spin a trail of tears about some spy network you may or may not have been involved in, you could get things done.

 

i came here to address your exaggerated falsehoods while I wait for unanimous consensus from the coalition on our proposal that will result in the culmination of us accepting KNB's surrender.

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Ah crap, I'm barely waking up. Ok, so let's wrap this up. @Liltrekkie, I can understand you want to defend your ally's position, but you really are out of the loop. We were in talks with the Claws government yesterday and we provided them evidence that TDE did not act in the best interest of Claws; instead he was using Claws as a tool and sent them straight to war with the hopes of creating a conflict between Claws, Cobra and Cobra's allies. They admitted not being aware of the things I showed them, and I admit that was a relief, cause otherwise it would have implied they planned the whole thing together.

 

While it may look like we want to get back at Claws, it is not the case, as now seems clear to me that Claws is not to blame here. They were used by TDE just the way he used TIE, so it's only natural we want TDE to pay for the damage he caused and now that Claws knows TDE true colors, I don't think they'll oppose to those terms as fiercely as they did when they thought TDE was some sort of hero. Maybe they'll even want to join the beating, considering TDE just used them as cannon fodder for his "mission".

 

I could share screens, but I think it's better if this remains between Claws and us, unless they want this to go public. I think it would be prudent we all let Claws express themselves about this before we continue talking, because they and us are the only ones up to date with everything. 

 

Thanks everyone. 

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5 hours ago, Tevron said:

It is pretty evident to me that the SDI decom is a literal response to unhappiness about Lucius' decom. If that isn't an attempt at provocation, I'm not sure what is. I said as much to Kapleo in his embassy on the GATO server when he brought up this recent development.

 

If you don't think KNB is connected to CLAWS, it doesn't make sense to mirror a term against Lucius that you've called unjust and drag their CB into this conflict. Doing so makes this a CLAWS issue because you mingle CBs. The inclusion of Lucius' nation in particular shows that his apology isn't genuine and could be seen as a violation of his agreement for peace.

 

If you do think KNB is connected to CLAWS you are instigating a war with them right now. 

 

Both of these don't make much sense for a group of alliances who want to not be at war with CLAWS. And in both scenarios the outcome is the same. As I advised Kapleo, it makes sense to punish TDE, it doesn't make sense to ask for wonder decoms and bring Lucius into the terms, because it effectively reignites the CB for the CLAWS-TIE war. I understand wanting to punish someone who got an ally rolled, tis' tradition. I don't understand why you'd try to force conflict with CLAWS and probably miss out on any justice you could gain.


You took the words right out of my mouth, I can’t explain that any better or more crystal clear (and I tried). Appreciate the incite, Tevron.
 

5 hours ago, Johnny Apocalypse said:

 

Just because we are tightly-knit group, that doesn't mean that we do not also have the capacity to act autonomously and pursue things independently which we may not always share with each other. He's considered a rogue for trying to bait people into agreeing to have him spy on a foriegn entity, he is a rogue for launching spy ops on COBRA and then attacking us after being exposed. He is a rogue because he has openly stated to myself and my other allies that he was pursuing the destruction of COBRA.I  highly doubt that he will see that end, he'd be more of a persistent gnat for us to bat away, but a rogue is a rogue. Walks like a rogue, quacks like a rogue.....

 

If you look at my post, you'll notice a recurring theme: the involvement of CLAWS through direct and indirect actions towards my sphere (and the fact that most nations who have gone rogue against us have come from CLAWS this past year). I could easily argue that the opposite were true and there was a concerted effort from CLAWS to pursue aggressive action against us and maybe even try to embed spies among us, as well as claim there exists a DM/Group chat somewhere where elements of CLAWS have been working against us for some time. But there exists no concrete evidence of that, I have only a sequence of events that have transpired with some small correlating links to draw such a conclusion. As such I won't be making that accusation. You, however, also lack evidence because what you "think" happened is objectively incorrect, so there exists no evidence to verify what you think happened vs. what actualy happened  (No spy network was establish, the idea was briefly entertained by Luc- end of "spy network")

 

Also, Point of order: TDE reached out to Lucius and TDE offered his services. Lucius' error was entertaining the idea but no "spy network" against CLAWS was truly pursued or established with the help of TDE, or anyone else for that matter. If Lucius planned to make a server as you claim? I would have refused the invite and advise him to not pursue that path because a) not cool, even if they had been belligerent b) It was clearly bait to encourage us to going along with it, to be used at a later date. Lucius saying "we need to trust each other" doesn't suggest which one of them reached out first, but if he did? Again, it was not with a view to asking him to start up a spy-network- they were old friends who Lucius was reconnecting with. I consider that to be much more likely than him going to TDE to directly ask "Help me set up a spy network within CLAWS with your access!" - You've seen the logs and you know this to be true.  It was offered to him by TDE (and to me, the guy he didn't know other than that I am the leader of Cobra), that's probably why Lucius stated the need for trust before entertaining the idea. As you said, he fessed up to entertaining the idea of pursuing a spy network but he had no success and did so unilaterally.

 

I've also not been trying to avoid geting hit by CLAWS, while they have some belligerent members who openly dislike us and vice versa? The idea I am avoiding CLAWS hitting me is also incorrect. As it suggests I would be doing so because I was under the impression that they were trying to genuinely pursue a means of initiating hostilities with us. Things have been frosty I won't deny that, however Jazzy himself has openly stated he did not want war to expand to us but expected as much when he hit TIE, suffice to say I'm sure he was pleasantly surprised to see we were being reasonable and cool-headed about it. I've had conversations with WC as well lately, despite our residence in opposing political spheres? I like to think we got on on some level.

 

 

What I have learned from what you are saying; is that you lowkey actually want us to be at war with CLAWS. You make a lot of accusations without evidence and you have made some telling statements that seem to be in favour of such an outcome. A sentiment that is not alien to you I am sure. I had no need to cover myself with a meatshield and Lucius certainly didn't take ownership to that end because I did not need protecting, his own alliance was in danger- ensuring their security following the declaration from CLAWS was his priority.

 

However if you have an axe to grind with us yourself? You may well have an opportunity soon, which will culminate with us collectively accepting KNB surrender and them getting peace, we are waiting on unanimous consent from our engaged parties before presenting it.

 

I sincerely think you and KNB might actually like it.

 

 

When I’ve fought with-and-against Methrage and Junka, they’d typically find themselves in a pinned-up position where they would begin to grovel.
 

It’s a phenomenon used only when you know your reputation is screwed. Walls, literally mountains of text hoping that a sentence or two in their desperation manifesto would pull them from the abyss. Props to whoever can handle digesting all these empty calories.
 

7 hours ago, Liltrekkie said:

 

Oh please, everyone knows how tight knit the cobrasphere is, I have no doubts that all of you are involved in some fashion or another.

 

 

 

So you're telling me, you considered TDE a rouge while he was affiliated with CLAWS, Mongoose, who is a KNB ally, and lastly, KNB. Through that entire point you considered him a rouge eh? Nah, no dice.

 

Considering Lucious already admitted his wrong doings, continuing to try and spin your story doesn't make sense. It's in the screenshots, Lucious said "we need to trust each other", so it sure sounds like Lucious reached out first. If any of what you were saying was true, it would have been stated in the CLAWS/TIE peace agreement. Here is what I think, I think the Cobrasphere leadership tried to create a spy network, Lucious reached out to TDE who they had a past with, who was in CLAWS at the time to make this happen. Meanwhile to limit potential damage, Lucious kept most of it 1 on 1 between him and TDE. I am sure somewhere, in some DM or group you all have, is all of you discussing the creation of a spy network. None of you are the poor little innocents you're trying to spin, now you've been backtracking since the information made its way back home and have been trying not to get yourselves hit by CLAWS. Lets not forget Lucious offered to create a discord with "up to 10 people" and I dont doubt you were one of them.

 

Personally, I have to give props to Lucious to allowing himself to be a meat shield for you JA. He sacrificed his nation, and countless others under his command so you wouldn't be hit too.

 
Lucious just isn’t smart enough to realize he’s being used. And dead aim Liltrekkie, 10/10.

 

Edited by Lord Hitchcock
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1 hour ago, Kapleo said:

Ah crap, I'm barely waking up. Ok, so let's wrap this up. @Liltrekkie, I can understand you want to defend your ally's position, but you really are out of the loop. We were in talks with the Claws government yesterday and we provided them evidence that TDE did not act in the best interest of Claws; instead he was using Claws as a tool and sent them straight to war with the hopes of creating a conflict between Claws, Cobra and Cobra's allies. They admitted not being aware of the things I showed them, and I admit that was a relief, cause otherwise it would have implied they planned the whole thing together.

 

While it may look like we want to get back at Claws, it is not the case, as now seems clear to me that Claws is not to blame here. They were used by TDE just the way he used TIE, so it's only natural we want TDE to pay for the damage he caused and now that Claws knows TDE true colors, I don't think they'll oppose to those terms as fiercely as they did when they thought TDE was some sort of hero. Maybe they'll even want to join the beating, considering TDE just used them as cannon fodder for his "mission".

 

I could share screens, but I think it's better if this remains between Claws and us, unless they want this to go public. I think it would be prudent we all let Claws express themselves about this before we continue talking, because they and us are the only ones up to date with everything. 

 

Thanks everyone. 


Do you really think running around and waving a sign that says ‘justice for Lucious’ is a reasonable justification for acting belligerent?

 

It’s a known secret for the peanut gallery to take a bia’s party’s assertion with a grain of salt... I’m afraid for you they have to go straight to the mining source for their desirable amount of consumption. 

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3 minutes ago, Lord Hitchcock said:


Do you really think running around and waving a sign that says ‘justice for Lucious’ is a reasonable justification for acting belligerent?

 

It’s a known secret for the peanut gallery to take a bia’s party’s assertion with a grain of salt... I’m afraid for you they have to go straight to the mining source for their desirable amount of consumption. 

Dude, shut up, let the adults finish talking. No one cares what you have to say in this matter. Go grow your nation or something. 

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28 minutes ago, Kapleo said:

Dude, shut up, let the adults finish talking. No one cares what you have to say in this matter. Go grow your nation or something. 


Sucks when people call out your !@#$%^&* 

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23 hours ago, Tevron said:

It is pretty evident to me that the SDI decom is a literal response to unhappiness about Lucius' decom. If that isn't an attempt at provocation, I'm not sure what is. I said as much to Kapleo in his embassy on the GATO server when he brought up this recent development.

 

If you don't think KNB is connected to CLAWS, it doesn't make sense to mirror a term against Lucius that you've called unjust and drag their CB into this conflict. Doing so makes this a CLAWS issue because you mingle CBs. The inclusion of Lucius' nation in particular shows that his apology isn't genuine and could be seen as a violation of his agreement for peace.

 

If you do think KNB is connected to CLAWS you are instigating a war with them right now. 

 

Both of these don't make much sense for a group of alliances who want to not be at war with CLAWS. And in both scenarios the outcome is the same. As I advised Kapleo, it makes sense to punish TDE, it doesn't make sense to ask for wonder decoms and bring Lucius into the terms, because it effectively reignites the CB for the CLAWS-TIE war. I understand wanting to punish someone who got an ally rolled, tis' tradition. I don't understand why you'd try to force conflict with CLAWS and probably miss out on any justice you could gain.


Again, what is with the complaints from RFI, who have decided to set the new standard on wonder decommissioning terms of surrender?  I don't get it.  I mean, I agree, I am disturbed by the development, but you guys are the ones who pioneered it, so it's a bit ironic coming from your sector.

Stop whining.  Own up to the new world your crew decided to pursue.

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25 minutes ago, HeroofTime55 said:


Again, what is with the complaints from RFI, who have decided to set the new standard on wonder decommissioning terms of surrender?  I don't get it.  I mean, I agree, I am disturbed by the development, but you guys are the ones who pioneered it, so it's a bit ironic coming from your sector.

Stop whining.  Own up to the new world your crew decided to pursue.

 

As someone who doesn't really care about the development, I think the point isn't that it's being employed, but that it's being employed as a tit for tat measure. CLAWS imposed it on Lucius so now COBRA is trying to impose it on KND (who COBRA view as intrinsically linked to CLAWS), not because they think it's a good or acceptable to do, but simply as an attempt to fire across the bow of CLAWS.

 

Who knows, maybe COBRA will embrace it and make it a standard practice on all their engagements, but I doubt it.

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2 hours ago, James Spanier said:

 

As someone who doesn't really care about the development, I think the point isn't that it's being employed, but that it's being employed as a tit for tat measure. CLAWS imposed it on Lucius so now COBRA is trying to impose it on KND (who COBRA view as intrinsically linked to CLAWS), not because they think it's a good or acceptable to do, but simply as an attempt to fire across the bow of CLAWS.

 

Who knows, maybe COBRA will embrace it and make it a standard practice on all their engagements, but I doubt it.

 

On this point, I'd like to address that we have since decided against it for the reason of not wanting to perpetuate precedents we don't agree with or set overly punitive terms (if any). As well as the fact we are looking to bury hatchets via alternate means, so to demand the decommissioning of an SDI would fly in the face of that end.

 

Hope this clears that up.

Edited by Johnny Apocalypse
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5 hours ago, HeroofTime55 said:


Again, what is with the complaints from RFI, who have decided to set the new standard on wonder decommissioning terms of surrender?  I don't get it.  I mean, I agree, I am disturbed by the development, but you guys are the ones who pioneered it, so it's a bit ironic coming from your sector.

Stop whining.  Own up to the new world your crew decided to pursue.

 

Wonder decom terms pre-exist my entry into Planet Bob even, surely you remember them in your storied past. RFI has not set a new standard, not only because the CLAWS-TIE peace was their own, but also because wonder decoms have existed for a long, long while.

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28 minutes ago, Tevron said:

 

Wonder decom terms pre-exist my entry into Planet Bob even, surely you remember them in your storied past. RFI has not set a new standard, not only because the CLAWS-TIE peace was their own, but also because wonder decoms have existed for a long, long while.

 

Think his point is more they've been off the cards for some time and to see the term make a come back is the issue.

 

Slippery slopes and such.

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4 hours ago, Tevron said:

 

Wonder decom terms pre-exist my entry into Planet Bob even, surely you remember them in your storied past. RFI has not set a new standard, not only because the CLAWS-TIE peace was their own, but also because wonder decoms have existed for a long, long while.


They have not been on the table since the far ancient past, which was quite a dark era.  While their return is not the first time we've seen such things, their re-introduction does, in fact, constitute a new precedent.  CLAWS and by extension RFI decided that was the path they wanted to proceed with.  Naturally, you see fit to shift the blame elsewhere, but no, my friend, this one's all yours.

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8 hours ago, Tevron said:

 

Wonder decom terms pre-exist my entry into Planet Bob even, surely you remember them in your storied past. RFI has not set a new standard, not only because the CLAWS-TIE peace was their own, but also because wonder decoms have existed for a long, long while.

You're the one who talked me out of that. Now it looks like you're ok with it cause it was done before. Come on Tev. I listen to you, this doesn't help.

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