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As this qualifies as an emergency situation, I think it would be fair to put this to a vote among the RIA membership. I've been in two similar situations that could be considered a constitutional crisis in the past, and let the membership vote on it. If the majority vote to fight for Maroon, then you have a clear mandate.

Edited by Immortan Junka
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3 minutes ago, Mogar said:

I don't think that 11 years of maintaining the same sphere is worth giving up because some pricks decide they want to try to force us off personally, I can't imagine your alliance would respond any differently were the roles reversed.(not that they would be of course, since none of our alliances believe in forcing people off spheres or punitive actions against our opponents.)

Ah, went back a square. I never intended to imply that you or yours would find amending your charter and leaving the sphere as a fair or good option. I only want to implore that you do, in fact, have options and choices, and that TMD has made clear those choices which lead to peace. No one is forcing continuation of this war upon you, no one is demanding members to delete or leave any alliance. You are choosing to remain at war and risk member deletion because the alternative choices, to you, are worse than that; that choice is of your own volition.

 

To hurry along this discussion and prevent us going in circles: the appropriate conclusion is to reassert NG and friends are being pricks (I prefer the phrase, "playing the bad guys"), and accept you are making choices here that make a stand for your values but do prolong the war. With that resolution, no argument can be made against you.

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17 minutes ago, Erwin Schrodinger said:

To hurry along this discussion and prevent us going in circles: the appropriate conclusion is to reassert NG and friends are being pricks (I prefer the phrase, "playing the bad guys"), and accept you are making choices here that make a stand for your values but do prolong the war. With that resolution, no argument can be made against you.

If you actually wished to play the bad guys and not simply play destructively, you'd do something like Bipolar, not curbstomp the same alliances every six months for the past 4 years.

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4 hours ago, Williambonney said:

I am not a marooner nor am I a representative, but I have to ask Erwin,  if they accept your terms would your coalition be compensating any marooners for deleting their wonders?  :mellow:

The precedent set by Polar v NADC would hint at 'no'. Mostly because lolno, but also because 50mil should be no more than a drop in the bucket for anyone who has a PL wonder.

 

4 hours ago, Mogar said:

If you actually wished to play the bad guys and not simply play destructively, you'd do something like Bipolar, not curbstomp the same alliances every six months for the past 4 years.

We're talking about you and me here. In this scenario, we're the bad guys by virtue of the fact that what we are doing isn't very nice, and it is, in fact, destructive. In your proposed scenario of betrayal and deceit, we'd be the bad guys to our friends, but in your eyes, we'd be doing the "right thing" and be the "good guys". Makes for an interesting sort of contradiction in your post.

 

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4 hours ago, Immortan Junka said:

As this qualifies as an emergency situation, I think it would be fair to put this to a vote among the RIA membership. I've been in two similar situations that could be considered a constitutional crisis in the past, and let the membership vote on it. If the majority vote to fight for Maroon, then you have a clear mandate.


Little Rat, I would vote to stay.  I have a few billion dollars to burn, and NoR is such a soft target I almost believe I could dismantle them by myself.  

We have no crisis.  Just a dead world, and with it the death of moral pretense and what made politics tick.  NG wanted a war, made up the thinnest of excuses, gathered up a few really pathetic maroon "allies," and marched to war.  And I.... don't really care, except now I finally get to fight.  And I get to burn NoR.  And I get to have a little more fun before the plug is pulled on this plane.

The world, now, consists of a largely invincible group of alliances, going around and smashing everyone else, one at a time.  RIA knew it was next on the chopping block, right at the point that our "best friend" Polaris stabbed us in the back to suck off Oculus.  This war isn't about maroon, lol.  It's about the next batch of alliances to be removed.

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4 hours ago, Mogar said:

If you actually wished to play the bad guys and not simply play destructively, you'd do something like Bipolar, not curbstomp the same alliances every six months for the past 4 years.

The only true repeats were Sparta, NADC, and Invicta and the latter two came in of their own volition.  TTK,CRAP, Legion, Old Guard, KoRT, Alpha Wolves and RIA all hadn't fought in global wars for over 2 years.

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2 minutes ago, Monster said:

The only true repeats were Sparta, NADC, and Invicta and the latter two came in of their own volition.  TTK,CRAP, Legion, Old Guard, KoRT, Alpha Wolves and RIA all hadn't fought in global wars for over 2 years.

Has there even been a global war in the past two years?  

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12 hours ago, Mogar said:

Do you have any evidence to back this up? Additionally there are quite a few alliances filled with communists you're allied to, when can we expect your attacks against them?

I don't think that choosing to avoid allying those who wish us harm is really considered apathy, nor do I feel that openly wishing to destroy communities in this world is a goal anyone should be aspiring to, I find it incredibly odd that NoR of all alliances would be supportive of such a goal.

 

I can't believe you'd even ask these pointless questions. They are the base actions of a desperate man trying cling to the side of a bowl while the rest of his turd of an alliance is goind down the drain. 

 

The questions you ought to be asking are as follows.

 

1) How high is the wall going to be?

2) If we mass execute all the pedophiles will we be lighter terms?

3) How much are we going to have to pay for the wall? (protip: It ain't gonna be cheap)

 

Any communist allied to NG is a good commie, the rest are travelers and scum. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, HeroofTime55 said:


Little Rat, I would vote to stay.  I have a few billion dollars to burn, and NoR is such a soft target I almost believe I could dismantle them by myself.  

We have no crisis.  Just a dead world, and with it the death of moral pretense and what made politics tick.  NG wanted a war, made up the thinnest of excuses, gathered up a few really pathetic maroon "allies," and marched to war.  And I.... don't really care, except now I finally get to fight.  And I get to burn NoR.  And I get to have a little more fun before the plug is pulled on this plane.

The world, now, consists of a largely invincible group of alliances, going around and smashing everyone else, one at a time.  RIA knew it was next on the chopping block, right at the point that our "best friend" Polaris stabbed us in the back to suck off Oculus.  This war isn't about maroon, lol.  It's about the next batch of alliances to be removed.

 

This man gets it. Either get someone to break Occulus internally, play nice, or prepare to get chopped. At this point I just want to see the world burn.

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1 hour ago, Erwin Schrodinger said:

We're talking about you and me here. In this scenario, we're the bad guys by virtue of the fact that what we are doing isn't very nice, and it is, in fact, destructive. In your proposed scenario of betrayal and deceit, we'd be the bad guys to our friends, but in your eyes, we'd be doing the "right thing" and be the "good guys". Makes for an interesting sort of contradiction in your post.

Thing is, I'd still consider you the bad guys in that situation, just hold a hell of a lot more respect for you actually having some balls and actually taking a genuine risk, something that has not happened in this game for quite some time. There's so much potential left in this world, and unlike many, I believe this world is worth continuing rather than slowly destroying it while focusing upon another one.

58 minutes ago, Monster said:

The only true repeats were Sparta, NADC, and Invicta and the latter two came in of their own volition.  TTK,CRAP, Legion, Old Guard, KoRT, Alpha Wolves and RIA all hadn't fought in global wars for over 2 years.

Oculus curbstomps != global war, as much as you'd like to portray them as such, I can't imagine more than half of your alliances are even capable of fighting more than a round or two before there are no targets left in range.

3 minutes ago, kerschbs said:

 

This man gets it. Either get someone to break Occulus internally, play nice, or prepare to get chopped. At this point I just want to see the world burn.

Might want to talk to your gov about cancelling that NPO treaty then, they vetoed a much more interesting war that would have had a lot more even sides.

6 hours ago, Immortan Junka said:

As this qualifies as an emergency situation, I think it would be fair to put this to a vote among the RIA membership. I've been in two similar situations that could be considered a constitutional crisis in the past, and let the membership vote on it. If the majority vote to fight for Maroon, then you have a clear mandate.

I'll actually reply to this, HoT's statement is the sentiment of the alliance, we can all simply log in every 2 weeks at 1k ns and still maintain control of the senate forever, since warchests and statistics are quite literally meaningless to the senate.

 

Edited by Mogar
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10 hours ago, Mogar said:

not to mention keeping any alliance at war for more than 2-3 months is incredibly harmful to player retention for those on the losing end, you know all of this of course, but at least you're attempting to feign ignorance as to what you are doing rather than openly admit the intended goal as Caustic has.

 

Not for nothing, but months of a beatdown is what keeps me around.

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1 minute ago, Thrash said:

 

Not for nothing, but months of a beatdown is what keeps me around.

Call me old fashioned, I liked back when the side doing the curbstomp could simply admit they won and shake hands after 2 or 3 rounds, it led to a much quicker war cycle, more wars overall with less length would be a wonderful change of pace, and actually test alliance's activity levels.

Edited by Mogar
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Just now, Mogar said:

Call me old fashioned, I liked back when the side doing the curbstomp could simply admit they won and shake hands after 2 or 3 rounds.

 

That's boring. Rebuilding is what puts life back into the world. It gives you something to do. You have to actually think and not just pay your bills. You also get to click on more things.

 

Invicta is always accepting of a curbstomp. It's who we are. Everything can be replaced. Pixels are just that.

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Just now, kerschbs said:

 

This has literally not happened in any major war in over a decade.

http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/NpO-SNX_War
Is the most recent example I can think of, plenty more I could find within the past 3 years, just because you're curb stomping doesn't mean you have to be punitive about it, logically it makes sense to want your enemy to survive, then you can do it again in a few months or become buds and roll someone else.

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1 minute ago, Thrash said:

I'm overjoyed wrecking NG nations. It's just a shame that Buscemi is such a pussy and hit PM and bought of range. He's always been an infra hugger, was really hoping to get a piece of him this time.

I have been enjoying padding my casualties personally,

 
Ranked #246 of 5,055 Nations (Top 4.87%)


It's too bad I was banned for your sins, I'd be top 10 easily right now, was #35 before then.

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This comes off as a terrible idea and incredibly childish. But I mean, what else is new. <_<

 

1 hour ago, Monster said:

The only true repeats were Sparta, NADC, and Invicta and the latter two came in of their own volition.  TTK,CRAP, Legion, Old Guard, KoRT, Alpha Wolves and RIA all hadn't fought in global wars for over 2 years.

 

I really hate democracy. 

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Just now, Bernkastel said:

This comes off as a terrible idea and incredibly childish. But I mean, what else is new. <_<

 

 

I really hate democracy. 

Yeah, how dare you guys defend your allies, what a bunch of jerks NADC is.

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3 hours ago, Mogar said:

 

Might want to talk to your gov about cancelling that NPO treaty then, they vetoed a much more interesting war that would have had a lot more even sides.

 

 

 

Can we get some deets on this?  Sounds interesting :D

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19 hours ago, Kaiser Hanssen said:

 

If they'd made this thread a mere few days ago, they'd've seen NoR, NG and TLR.

I'm not sure if you are talking about the senators or the current election rankings, TLR did indeed have their guy in the top 5 a few days ago, but he wasn't a senator, the current rankings do not show the current senators, but rather who the senators will be next term if no one else voted.

 

(Apologies if you understand this an I misinterpreted your point, but it does seem to be a somewhat common misconception.)

 

10 hours ago, Erwin Schrodinger said:

 I only want to implore that you do, in fact, have options and choices, and that TMD has made clear those choices which lead to peace. No one is forcing continuation of this war upon you, no one is demanding members to delete or leave any alliance. You are choosing to remain at war and risk member deletion because the alternative choices, to you, are worse than that; that choice is of your own volition.

 

To hurry along this discussion and prevent us going in circles: the appropriate conclusion is to reassert NG and friends are being pricks (I prefer the phrase, "playing the bad guys"), and accept you are making choices here that make a stand for your values but do prolong the war. With that resolution, no argument can be made against you.

I feel that there is a fundamentally flawed assumption here; that activity and member retention would not be drastically harmed if we were to surrender and accept your terms, which it would be. Claiming that it is our decision belies the fact that our alliances (and by extension our entire world) would suffer harm (in the form of losing members) regardless of our decisions, the only difference is, if we fight for as long as possible we lose the guys who don't like war/are sitting in PM and get bored/can't fight and are just getting curbstomped/noobs who aren't used to or prepared for a long tough war, if we surrender and give in to your demands we lose many of those who have fought long and hard for us, who have been a part of TTK and active members for, in some cases called this alliance home for as much as 10 years, who would likely lose the desire to go on if their gov were to accept such a term on their behalf (assuming myself and Merick were personally inclined to accept them, which we are not). So why would we make such a decision?

 

So no, it is not as a result of our decisions that communities are harmed, it is as a result of yours.

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