The next DBDC raid target

[partymaster]

Don't worry brah.  I'll be coming for Polar's top two nations when I get my 25 nukes back.  You've got about 10 days to figure something out.  Here's my acknowledgement for you.   :smug:

Don't be so selfish, the rest of us need partners for the dance floor too, remember when you did this on the cruise? :P

[Dochartaigh]

Wait, CN still has only 3 philosophies??? What the hell... From what I have seen, those three have segmented into probably well over a dozen each depending on the alliance, nation, bloc, former alliance, former bloc, and reroll you talk to. Not to mention, where the hell is RealPolitick? That has been a major philosophy for years now?

[Auctor]

Wait, CN still has only 3 philosophies??? What the hell... From what I have seen, those three have segmented into probably well over a dozen each depending on the alliance, nation, bloc, former alliance, former bloc, and reroll you talk to. Not to mention, where the hell is RealPolitick? That has been a major philosophy for years now?

CN doesn't even have the "philosophies" that get talked about these days anymore, let's not go all modern here.

[DaFuzzy]

All this talk about dancing I had to go buy my my my boogie shoes.

 

Now someone better take me dancing so I can shake my groove thing....or I'm gonna burn this mother down.

Edited August 11, 2014 by DaFuzzy

[The Zigur]

Wait, CN still has only 3 philosophies??? What the hell... From what I have seen, those three have segmented into probably well over a dozen each depending on the alliance, nation, bloc, former alliance, former bloc, and reroll you talk to. Not to mention, where the hell is RealPolitick? That has been a major philosophy for years now?

 

Realpolitik is a strategy, not a philosophy... but it would fall under Francoism.

[Dochartaigh]

CN doesn't even have the "philosophies" that get talked about these days anymore, let's not go all modern here.

 

Pretty much yeah. But modernism would make a great philosophy! :O

 

 

Realpolitik is a strategy, not a philosophy... but it would fall under Francoism.

 

No...

[ChairmanHal]

You'd have to remind me of a recent example to justify this post.  That is pre-karma thinking.  Nobody has been EZI/PZI for years.

Demonstrably false, and not just because of reserve elevator.  

 

But hey, if you want to compare philosophies, there were aspects of pre-Karma thinking that were far superior than the b.s. that gets called "thinking" today.

 

not really much of a raid target if you know it's going nuclear...  

 

Cuba ponders recent events

 

yeah we're good.

Going nuclear has never stopped any of your people, including yourself, from raiding anyone.

 

No thanks, I don't even own a motorcycle. :smug:

Do you honestly really want to go there?   <_<

[TBRaiders]

Demonstrably false, and not just because of reserve elevator.  

What are you talking about?  Can you talk in specifics please?  Who has been EZI/PZI, and even more specifically, who has been EZI/PZI by DBDC or any of our allies?  I get you dislike us, but quit making stuff up.

[Farrin Xies]

Realpolitik is a strategy, not a philosophy... but it would fall under Francoism.

Yeah, no. Please stop trying so hard.

[IYIyTh]

francoism is on the tywin bingo card, isn't it?

[The Zigur]

Yeah, no. Please stop trying so hard.

 

Alliances are ultimately self-interested. That is to say, that each alliance will do what is best for its own member-nations, as promised in the social contract that they signed upon joining. From this we can understand international relations not as a clash of ideals or cross-alliance classes, but as a clash of interests between alliances that, for this purpose, can be considered single individuals.

 

-- Vladimir, The Meaning of Freedom

[Starfox101]

No thanks, I don't even own a motorcycle. :smug:

Spoken just like a true Ex-MKer.

 

You're about as bad as Rotavele, but none of your friends will find anything wrong with it. So that's what Schattenmann was referring to, eh?

 

 

No one actually being accountable for the things they say has led to a degradation of politics over the years.

Then we eagerly await the attack on Schattenmann and myself, considering we are the only Polars actively speaking out against DBDC.

 

Anyway, nobody even speaks out anymore in general. The fact is that DBDC is praised far, far more than they are criticized, and by attacking an alliance's upper tier for having nations speak out, it will only get more lopsided. I don't think you can realistically argue that attacking people for speaking out is good for the political world, can you? Because when are getting others attacked it tends to make you think twice. I personally don't care about my nation, but that doesn't mean I don't understand others do.

 

Perhaps you love empty forums, or threads full of praises, and Tywinn. Suit yourself.

Edited August 12, 2014 by Starfox101

[The Pansy]

No thanks, I don't even own a motorcycle. :smug:

Low blow dude, low blow.

[The Zigur]

 

Perhaps you love empty forums, or threads full of praises, and Tywinn. Suit yourself.

 

Hey wait a second I was getting threats too

[ChairmanHal]

What are you talking about?  Can you talk in specifics please?  Who has been EZI/PZI, and even more specifically, who has been EZI/PZI by DBDC or any of our allies?  I get you dislike us, but quit making stuff up.

And now you move the goal posts...

 

Your original assertion was that no one has been EZI/PZIed since Karma.  Now you are saying that no one as been EZI/PZIed by DBDC or any of your allies, something completely different.  While we can debate whether or not throwing ultra high tech nukes at a nation that shouldn't be in your range in the first place and forcing them to take several months to rebuild (if they rebuild) because you are bored and it's "funny" is a lesser evil, there is no question that you are trying to change question because you know that you got the answer wrong.

[Auctor]

Then we eagerly await the attack on Schattenmann and myself, considering we are the only Polars actively speaking out against DBDC.
 
Anyway, nobody even speaks out anymore in general. The fact is that DBDC is praised far, far more than they are criticized, and by attacking an alliance's upper tier for having nations speak out, it will only get more lopsided. I don't think you can realistically argue that attacking people for speaking out is good for the political world, can you? Because when are getting others attacked it tends to make you think twice. I personally don't care about my nation, but that doesn't mean I don't understand others do.
 
Perhaps you love empty forums, or threads full of praises, and Tywinn. Suit yourself.

I was making more of a general statement than that, actually. I see the problem with this medium being more that there's a lot of yap and not a lot of bite. I'm not saying there wasn't a lot of empty hails back in the day - there was. But it was a completely different environment wherein people with things to say who were taking actual risks would post and not be immediately drown out by the chicken!@#$ we've come to tolerate today. It's ruined discourse here, as what we've substituted for it is 4-6 threads a week started by people that want everyone to remember they're alive but not add anything really productive to the global community and have turned it into a stage for self aggrandisement.

If rulers understood that the things they say can lead to consequences for them and their alliances, and I mean this for every part of the web, I don't think it would make the forum empty so much as give importance to what is posted in it. Edited August 12, 2014 by Auctor

[Artigo]

I was making more of a general statement than that, actually. I see the problem with this medium being more that there's a lot of yap and not a lot of bite. I'm not saying there wasn't a lot of empty hails back in the day - there was. But it was a completely different environment wherein people with things to say who were taking actual risks would post and not be immediately drown out by the chicken!@#$ we've come to tolerate today. It's ruined discourse here, as what we've substituted for it is 4-6 threads a week started by people that want everyone to remember they're alive but not add anything really productive to the global community and have turned it into a stage for self aggrandisement.

If rulers understood that the things they say can lead to consequences for them and their alliances, and I mean this for every part of the web, I don't think it would make the forum empty so much as give importance to what is posted in it.

 

Spot on.  Although to be fair, I can see why Starfox would have a problem with the way we approach his shit posting because no matter how right he believes he is, NBForrest and William Kreiger are the only ones who are going to lose.

[CubaQuerida]

Spoken just like a true Ex-MKer.
 
You're about as bad as Rotavele, but none of your friends will find anything wrong with it. So that's what Schattenmann was referring to, eh?
 
 

Then we eagerly await the attack on Schattenmann and myself, considering we are the only Polars actively speaking out against DBDC.
 
Anyway, nobody even speaks out anymore in general. The fact is that DBDC is praised far, far more than they are criticized, and by attacking an alliance's upper tier for having nations speak out, it will only get more lopsided. I don't think you can realistically argue that attacking people for speaking out is good for the political world, can you? Because when are getting others attacked it tends to make you think twice. I personally don't care about my nation, but that doesn't mean I don't understand others do.
 
Perhaps you love empty forums, or threads full of praises, and Tywinn. Suit yourself.

The problem goes far beyond just you or any other individual speaking out against a political entity, in this case DBDC in general. You are absolutely entitled to your opinion and are free to voice it however you see fit. It is also anyone else's right to interpret that opinion however they want, be it a DBDC nation or just a random lurker.

But that's not the problem.

You inevitably complicate matters more than you may comprehend. I've had lengthy discussions with at least three different alliance leaders from involved sides (treaty or otherwise) about this exact topic within the last week, and all of them ended with us standing by our nations and hoping for a better tomorrow.

In speaking with them we discovered not only common ground and common interests, but a desire to see this and any subsequent conflicts avoided. If diplomatic progress is to be made, or even attempted, there has to be an understanding that both sides will work towards that goal, not just one side ceasing what the other side wants, out of fear or political pressure.

So we arrive at this point, where blatant statements made by non-governmental outliers of both DBDC and NpO have pushed this to the forefront, and carry some potentially heavy consequences if followed through. Obviously we have the issue of free speech but we also have the issue of perception, image and intent. These two cannot be in opposition to one another without adding a hugely complicating factor to this, namely trust. If the alliances trust each other, we know that things said by one "ponce" don't mean the entire alliance feels that way and they can be overlooked as 'spirited debate'. But if the alliances DONT trust each other, it leads to a very sophisticated diplomatic struggle, and all the while a military struggle hangs in the balance if things continue.

Don't think me blind or ignorant to this. As a leader of DBDC I'm keenly aware of my public presence and political implications of virtually everything myself and DBDC sets out to do or say. This situation doesn't take a miracle, it just takes two sides putting emotions and personal opinions aside for the greater good. Edited August 12, 2014 by CubaQuerida

[kerschbs]

No thanks, I don't even own a motorcycle. :smug:

 

Really classy Oya, you've out done yourself with this one.

 

(and that's coming from a DBDC fan, but this is pretty pathetic.)

[Willaim Kreiger]

 

Spot on.  Although to be fair, I can see why Starfox would have a problem with the way we approach his !@#$ posting because no matter how right he believes he is, NBForrest and William Kreiger are the only ones who are going to lose.

[i]Oh, the suffering.[/i]  Starfox can continue to post however he likes.  It is his sovereign right and Cuba, your de-facto leader, has even said as much.  I guess if you want to punish me and others because you don't like what he says, whatever.  You're really just validating everything he's saying by responding with raids on our upper tier.  But do whatever you think you must.  It's your right as a sovereign alliance.  

[Willaim Kreiger]

-snip-

I'm not sure where you see the sides.  If you look at Dajobo's posts in the thread, our official position is not that DBDC is evil.  Some of our members disagree with what you have done.  That is their prerogative.  If you, or your members, want to raid us for that, I guess that's yours.  

[TBRaiders]

Indeed.  However, when individuals attempt to do so through military action, they are declared "nuke rogues" and every attempt is made to run them off Planet Bob. Therefore, telling someone individually to "do something about it", is an invitation to suicide.

 

But you knew that already.

Hal this was your first post.  All your anger and angst is directed our way so I wanted some specific examples where we were causing a problem, but let's go back to your original goal posts.  PLEASE, give us just one example of ANYBODY who is doing any military action that is getting them chased off the planet.

[TBRaiders]

I'm not sure where you see the sides.  If you look at Dajobo's posts in the thread, our official position is not that DBDC is evil.  Some of our members disagree with what you have done.  That is their prerogative.  If you, or your members, want to raid us for that, I guess that's yours.  

1) It was a bit of IC fun.  We aren't attacking or planning to attack polar because of schatt and starfox.

 

2) Join DBDC

[Willaim Kreiger]

1) It was a bit of IC fun.  We aren't attacking or planning to attack polar because of schatt and starfox.

 

2) Join DBDC

Maybe, didn't seem that way based on the reactions of o ya and Cuba.  Your offer is tempting, but nearly eight years in the same place makes it hard to abandon close friends.  Plus, where is the fun when there's no challenge?

 

Edit: because I'm drunk in Paris before my flight home

Edited August 12, 2014 by Willaim Kreiger

[TBRaiders]

Maybe, didn't seem that way based on the reactions of o ya and Cuba.

IC forum where they have been staying IC.  Pretty sure our gov has talked with your gov and with your allies in TOP.  I am going to guess that you have some guys who can't stop playing the victim card well past its expiration date.