The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) Anyway, I think the big problem is that roleplayers who happen to have lots of NS thinks this entitles them to easy victories and the ability to push smaller nations around without question. Now if I was a 100k nation, suddenly nobody would be questioning my decisions. But as a 14k player Im uppity and should be "wiped off the map." I happen to believe that numbers confers no inherent advantage and if you are going to try and take someone's territory you better do some damn good planning and roleplay. I listed having 15+ naval vessels in my OP from the start but never specified their location, and nobody thought to ask. In fact I had talked to rota days ago about posting my forces in the Crimea, and was waiting to ambush zoot once he finally initiated hostilities. He should have done a thorough analysis and not underestimated his opponent. Instead he decided to whine to the GMs to avoid the consequences of his negligence. Edited June 21, 2014 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEDCJT Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Given Tywin's statements and attitudes, I'm afraid I must reject the compromise proposal (not speaking for the others, ofc). But I commend you for taking the effort, nevertheless, Rota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Given Tywin's statements and attitudes, I'm afraid I must reject the compromise proposal (not speaking for the others, ofc). But I commend you for taking the effort, nevertheless, Rota. Thank you. I really want to wash my fucking hands with all of this though. From what I can see neither Tywin or Rudy want to even try to stop the conflicting OOCly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperator Azenquor Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 I listed having 15+ naval vessels in my OP from the start but never specified their location, and nobody thought to ask. In fact I had talked to rota days ago about posting my forces in the Crimea, and was waiting to ambush zoot once he finally initiated hostilities. He should have done a thorough analysis and not underestimated his opponent. Instead he decided to whine to the GMs to avoid the consequences of his negligence. Did that OP or any of the successive posts explain exactly how those ships managed to travel all the way to Crimea while getting through the blockade first, then managing to get there undetected by all of the nations bordering the Black Sea? Were the ships dismantled and shipped to Ukraine in packing crates or were they just moving so fast that they sailed right through the blockade? Did they 'reverse-rapture' themselves into position? There are quite a number of unanswered questions in that regard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus Wilding Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) Can I just say this? Yes? Cool. Alright, so first off, I'm gonna say this once and only once. I don't care what Tywin does OOC, as I explained to him earlier I was only going to stop him if he continued with his SOCSOV stuff. IC, I established that Bolsheviks and ultranationalists, in addition to SOCSOV, is not welcome within Alvonia and any government that declares itself to be one of those three. Tywin did so, and also notably did not ask me for the land in Poland. Is it my fault for not letting Mogar know to add that protectorate to the map? Maybe. That being said, I did not recognize Tywin in any way, shape, or form. From the very beginning I questioned his legitimacy and then demanded he change governments or face the consequences. These consequences never came because I deliberated with others on how exactly to proceed. Hell, a war post would have been up by 3:30 today if I hadn't reconsidered and rethought my entire strategy after realizing it was flawed. Again, if Tywin had simply PMed me and asked for Poland, I would have told him that as long as he isn't an ultranationalist, Bolshevik or SOCSOV I would hand over the land. That's it, no other strings attached. Also, to Tywin: I don't care about Poland. I keep it solely because I have a Polish population, and IC I'm safeguarding my brothers. Same deal with Germany, I only went in there to protect my German brothers. I have absolutely zero plans of expanding given I already have what I want. Taking Poland would overextend me more than I already am, and that's the last thing I need now. Furthermore, please stop calling me an imperialist. It's a tired insult and I am really quite tired of hearing it. As well as Tywin, I would like to know which rules I broke. I've been trying to not RP other people's citizens lately, but if I broke any others I apologize. EDIT: While I appreciate the effort, Rota, I don't like the idea of a compromise being mediated by a direct IC enemy. EDIT2: Also, I'm so incredibly tired of all this OOC ridiculousness. I want to damn well write, not come on the forums and have to answer 7 different OOC posts. Edited June 21, 2014 by Markus Wilding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) Did that OP or any of the successive posts explain exactly how those ships managed to travel all the way to Crimea while getting through the blockade first, then managing to get there undetected by all of the nations bordering the Black Sea? Were the ships dismantled and shipped to Ukraine in packing crates or were they just moving so fast that they sailed right through the blockade? Did they 'reverse-rapture' themselves into position? There are quite a number of unanswered questions in that regard. You do realize that the blockade only began after Ukrain sent the ship to Hawaii? And that I roleplayed scattering my ships before that? And that Ukraine and Hawaii had a positive relationship? In any case the roleplay is irrelevant to the fact that the rules entitle me to a navy, and does not say anything about how or where navies should be created. If Zoot had done his research or even lolspyrolled he might have saved himself from that headache. But Zoot cant stand losing. Edited June 21, 2014 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEDCJT Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) The ships of Hawaii are not the ships of Soviet Eurasia. And you DO need to roleplay the movement of naval ships. Edited June 21, 2014 by JEDCJT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperator Azenquor Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 So...you had the ships leave Hawaii and head to Ukraine then reclaimed those ships when you 'rerolled' into Europe? Quite...interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 The roleplay doesnt matter. I could have had menehunes build it, fact is, I get a 1:1 ship transfer from in game along with the points system. What I did was absolutely within the rules. But it disrupted someones plan, and he was to cocky to do the proper intelligence work beforehand (spyrolls, research). His fleet deserves to be at the bottom of the ocean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shave N Haircut Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 No. It's bullshit and it won't be allowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Right, sinking the Babylonian fleet would be a huge setback for the invasion plans for the majority of the community, and since it is a popularity contest, the majority must always win. Got it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogar Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 No crossing characters/nations. What happens to your in Barfistan, stays in Barfistan. If you reroll your nation and go right back to your old tricks, you deserve to get smashed. You need to remember that a new nation is a fresh slate, so don't roll a new nation to go pick fights with the enemies of your old nation. naval ships would fall under this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 The roleplay is fucking whiped. Why are all of you still fucking arguing about it? Jesus fucking christ. To say you guys didn't LIKE to argue would be a understatement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 The Roleplay is GONE. He's not in that region anymore. No one wants to give a little to compromise, so the whole thing is over with. Go put this effort into your roleplays and stop until someone breaks another rule. God damn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 naval ships would fall under this. Disagree. Using prior designs I CREATED is not continuing Hawaii. I put hours into my work and you cant tell me that I cant repeat my use of those designs just because they were previously used. Thats like saying North Korea cant use SCUDs because Russia previously created them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shave N Haircut Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Disagree. Using prior designs I CREATED is not continuing Hawaii. I put hours into my work and you cant tell me that I cant repeat my use of those designs just because they were previously used. Thats like saying North Korea cant use SCUDs because Russia previously created them. You're wrong. This is over. On a side note, I give you a second chance and this is how you pay me back? How grateful of you to go right back to what you did before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 I agreed not to break any rules, I did not agree to rollover to bullies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) I agreed not to break any rules, I did not agree to rollover to bullies. Stop arguing with her and go roleplay your new state. She's only trying to get you to argue more, she likes to argue. Stop giving her your time, and go roleplay. Edited June 21, 2014 by Rotavele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shave N Haircut Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Stop arguing with her and go roleplay your new state. She's only trying to get you to argue more, she likes to argue. Stop giving her your time, and go roleplay. There is no new state, he's been Retconned out for breaking his agreement and that's final. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 Why do GMs always suck at defining things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) There is no new state, he's been Retconned out for breaking his agreement and that's final. His nation was retconned, he isn't banned. You do not have the power to ban players or make agreements to ban them despite being a GM. Its currently a vote procedure. If you want him out the community, put up a vote and we vote him out, not you. If you'd like to try, feel free but I know about 10 people who will be recognizing him regardless and you can try to kick us out too. You will not force a player out, GM or not, and that is final. Why do GMs always suck at defining things Stop. Nothing good can come from saying things like that at this point. You also pose the threat of swinging more people to vote yes if she puts you up for a vote. Seriously, stop it. Edited June 21, 2014 by Rotavele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shave N Haircut Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 His nation was retconned, he isn't banned. You do not have the power to ban players or make agreements despite being a GM. Its currently a vote procedure. If you want him out the community votes him out not you. If you'd like to try, feel free but I know about 10 people who will be recognizing him regardless and you can try to kick us out too. You will not force a player out, GM or not, and that is final. News Flash: He's already been voted out. It was an act of the GM that he was allowed back, and it was under certain conditions, and it was made clear that if he were to break them that he would be thrown right back out. It was against the will of the community to let him back in, and I'm now yielding that the Community was right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) Honestly Id only want to play anyway near CDT, since I will get rolled for OOC reasons by myself anywhere else. I could easily cut a path through Muscovy with a new nation but then people would whine about OOC targetting. Ive come to realize even more how much I dont like people who bandwaggon, and only a few people outside CDT resist that inclination. Its not even "real" infras being busted and people still act like cowards and pressure the GMs to make decisions go their way. Edited June 21, 2014 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted June 21, 2014 Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 News Flash: He's already been voted out. It was an act of the GM that he was allowed back, and it was under certain conditions, and it was made clear that if he were to break them that he would be thrown right back out. It was against the will of the community to let him back in, and I'm now yielding that the Community was right. God at least TBM didnt act that self righteous. NEWS FLASH: TBMs vote count was fraudulent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted June 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2014 News Flash: He's already been voted out. It was an act of the GM that he was allowed back, and it was under certain conditions, and it was made clear that if he were to break them that he would be thrown right back out. It was against the will of the community to let him back in, and I'm now yielding that the Community was right. The community did not vote for him to come back in and majority would have at that point in time. You do not speak for the community, although you are supposed to. However he is a roleplayer and will be recognized as such. You can let him back in, but you can't take him out. The community does. A GM is to serve the community, not a weapon of power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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