memoryproblems Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 The Big Bad Wolf pretended to be Little Red Riding Hood's grandmother, but pretending alone didn't make it true.For all the talk, I'm afraid that I just don't buy this "we're a legitimate alliance" stuff. I notice Londo has a slot opening next update, I'll see if we can't take care of that. I wish I could tell you that I'm shaking in my boots about your threats, but I just have a difficult time becoming too bothered by them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) This isn't about CoJ or the way it tried to conduct itself. DBDC are stating our beliefs and the way we choose to operate in the twisted new system. We didn't twist the landscape to the way it is now, but we are all living in it. As of right now, the only official wars are DBDC/MQ vs TDO and GOP. TTE declared war on MQ, and is pursuing those targets it declared on. We generally don't have a problem with this. What we do have a problem with is alliances that choose to interject themselves into a situation thinking all they have to do is peace out their top tier and they're cool to hit whoever they decide to call a rogue. We are clarifying to the world that DBDC is not going to accept this doctrine. The alliances include, but are not limited to, Fark, TPF, RnR, IRON and NATO. None of these alliances made the distinction of: as you so eloquently put it. Therefore if we're throwing out the term rogues, it's a two-way street. Either these alliances are fully involved, or the nations at war with DBDC and our tech sellers (a really low tactic in any way, especially one you aren't even "involved" in) are operating independent of their AA. Having spoken directly to the nations involved, they are being ordered to strike at DBDC and affiliated targets. So either there is a distinct lack of DOW by these other major AA's, or they're taking cheap shots at nations on the DBDC they think we don't care about. Or as RnR so eloquently put it: To: CubaQuerida From: Garion Date: 10/6/2013 10:08:34 AMMessage: We fought at worse odds. Have a nice day. Let's be more blunt: You're an Umbrella spinoff alliance created with a lulz factor of over 9000 at the same time that goofy AAs were proliferating from MK at the outset of the Equilibrium War. Despite your staying power, you have continued to conduct yourselves outside of the expectations of an alliance, and you have been very quiet. For all intents and purposes, 99% of us haven't been following you and regard DBDC as tiny AA of rogues who raid willy-nilly. As such, you don't warrant or deserve a declaration of war. I know that DBDC has a protection treaty and a treaty with LPH, and you know it, but you don't act like an alliance and no one is paying attention to you. If someone had asked CoJ to sanction you as rogues, we wouldn't have, just like we didn't sanction Methrage for Poison Clan, because we believe that alliances don't have to fit an exact mold. Your problem is that principled AAs like CoJ are few and far between, and the crowd you run with are the antithesis, and can expect the least cooperation and understanding from even the most reasonable AAs out there. It is this simple: You can't go around attacking people without following the standard inter-alliance system for 10 months and then come out here and start crying foul when it happens to you. Edited October 7, 2013 by Schattenmann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 HEY! Don't say mean things about bean! I like bean! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tayloj7 Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 On the contrary, it seems as though quite a few people are paying attention to us. :) A Sir Hoppington sponsored Fun Fact: DBDC is an Umbrella spin-off of sorts no doubt, but you may be surprised to know it was actually created after I left the GOP [and in a fairly large advance of the subsequent spinoffs that may have been inspired in part by DBDC, although I believe ours was the only one at the time to officially annouce a DoE] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshuaR Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 Let's be more blunt: You're an Umbrella spinoff alliance created with a lulz factor of over 9000 at the same time that goofy AAs were proliferating from MK at the outset of the Equilibrium War. Despite your staying power, you have continued to conduct yourselves outside of the expectations of an alliance, and you have been very quiet. For all intents and purposes, 99% of us haven't been following you and regard DBDC as tiny AA of rogues who raid willy-nilly. As such, you don't warrant or deserve a declaration of war. I know that DBDC has a protection treaty and a treaty with LPH, and you know it, but you don't act like an alliance and no one is paying attention to you. If someone had asked CoJ to sanction you as rogues, we wouldn't have, just like we didn't sanction Methrage for Poison Clan, because we believe that alliances don't have to fit an exact mold. Your problem is that principled AAs like CoJ are few and far between, and the crowd you run with are the antithesis, and can expect the least cooperation and understanding from even the most reasonable AAs out there. It is this simple: You can't go around attacking people without following the standard inter-alliance system for 10 months and then come out here and start crying foul when it happens to you. Although the original DBDC was an Umbrella spinoff, only l0c0, tayloj, and noob cake are recent former members, and as tayloj just mentioned, he'd been away from Umbrella for quite a long time when he went to DBDC. The only other comment is that this thread doesn't seem to me decrying what others are doing to DBDC, which indeed would be hypocritical. I read this thread as a warning that DBDC considers itself a real alliance and will defend itself accordingly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 Alliances do not attack other alliances without declarations of war.Correction: Fark, TPF, RnR, and TTE do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tayloj7 Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 Thanks JoshuaR, that's pretty much it :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkeyeNation Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 Correction: Fark, TPF, RnR, and TTE do. Attacking rogues that are hiding in an alliance isn't the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londo Mollari Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 The Big Bad Wolf pretended to be Little Red Riding Hood's grandmother, but pretending alone didn't make it true. For all the talk, I'm afraid that I just don't buy this "we're a legitimate alliance" stuff. I notice Londo has a slot opening next update, I'll see if we can't take care of that. I wish I could tell you that I'm shaking in my boots about your threats, but I just have a difficult time becoming too bothered by them. The Phoenix Hungers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHAYD Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Correction: Fark, TPF, RnR, and TTE do. Not our problem that you choose to accept nuke rogues that are/were in war against TDO, Terran Empire, or Green Old Party. That kind of stuff caused wars in the past. Also, I don't consider the DumbBird alliance as an alliance. You're just a band of rogues. Edited October 7, 2013 by HHAYD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tick1 Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 On the contrary, it seems as though quite a few people are paying attention to us. :) A Sir Hoppington sponsored Fun Fact: DBDC is an Umbrella spin-off of sorts no doubt, but you may be surprised to know it was actually created after I left the GOP [and in a fairly large advance of the subsequent spinoffs that may have been inspired in part by DBDC, although I believe ours was the only one at the time to officially annouce a DoE] GOONS West for life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tayloj7 Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 MQ declared war, as an entire alliance, on TDO. How can they be hiding in an alliance if the entire alliance is doin it? And if you're claiming the entire alliance is a rogue... well I don't see how this could be a rogue action unless you are saying any alliance that doesn't have treaty partners are all rogues in which case GPA would be a bunch of rogues [albeit peaceful rogues] better go attack them quick!! CCC and TTE declared on MQ so okay that makes sense, the rest have just been using the term rogue to randomly attack MQ nations (most likely to get revenge for past transgressions) from their AA's, which have not officialy declared war..... To me that sounds a heck of a lot more like the action of rogues Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londo Mollari Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Not our problem that you choose to accept nuke rogues that are/were in war against TDO, Terran Empire, or Green Old Party. That kind of stuff caused wars in the past. Also, I don't consider the DumbBird alliance as an alliance. You're just a band of rogues. Excuse me, but Mushqaeda had a DOE, a DOW, and 50 members. That was not a rogue act, that was a highly coordinated and concerted war effort. What TPF and others are doing is attempting to hunt down former members of Mushqaeda without having articulated a clear motivation or rationale. I have personally been threatened with eternal war by TPF, although no reasons have been given. For that matter, TPF did not even state any reasons for attacking us in the first place. I think it makes them feel tough or something, lol. Wars in the game have become very uncommon, and Mushqaeda already had to be at war with several others alliances comprising many many times its NS for TPF to gather the courage to attack us, but gather it they did. It might be easy to pass judgement on TPF for being so cowardly, but we should really be celebrating TPF for showing up. Gold star for participation TPF, Gold star. Edited October 7, 2013 by Londo Mollari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garion Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 To: CubaQuerida From: Garion Date: 10/6/2013 10:08:34 AMMessage: We fought at worse odds.Have a nice day.[/center]Me replying to your threats should prove what, exactly?Correction: Fark, TPF, RnR, and TTE do.R&R and R&R's allies and friends declared on a number of rogues before they moved to the DBDC AA. It is in DBDC's rights to accept them as full members, as it is in our rights to consider our business not done yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Attacking rogues that are hiding in an alliance isn't the same thing. Not our problem that you choose to accept nuke rogues that are/were in war against TDO, Terran Empire, or Green Old Party. That kind of stuff caused wars in the past. Also, I don't consider the DumbBird alliance as an alliance. You're just a band of rogues. R&R and R&R's allies and friends declared on a number of rogues before they moved to the DBDC AA. It is in DBDC's rights to accept them as full members, as it is in our rights to consider our business not done yet.I really hope you're all being intentionally dense. Not only did MQ declare existence, they declared war as a unit. That is not a rogue action. By your logic, EQ was a rogue coalition, and any Competence alliances are free to redeclare wars on those alliances should they wish with no consequence. Edited October 7, 2013 by Neo Uruk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Coulson Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 Hmmm, I thought you were just a sham AA MK and then MQ used to hide its larger nations in and to funnel money to rogues while claiming plausible deniability. Is that not the case? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadie Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) The Phoenix Hungers Excellent dig there. If i was given an opportunity to go back and change one and only one thing, it would be to stop that saying before it began. I might try to replace it with The Felix Mungers. Excuse me, but Mushqaeda had a DOE, a DOW, and 50 members. That was not a rogue act, that was a highly coordinated and concerted war effort. What TPF and others are doing is attempting to hunt down former members of Mushqaeda without having articulated a clear motivation or rationale. I have personally been threatened with eternal war by TPF, although no reasons have been given. For that matter, TPF did not even state any reasons for attacking us in the first place. I think it makes them feel tough or something, lol. Wars in the game have become very uncommon, and Mushqaeda already had to be at war with several others alliances comprising many many times its NS for TPF to gather the courage to attack us, but gather it they did. It might be easy to pass judgement on TPF for being so cowardly, but we should really be celebrating TPF for showing up. Gold star for participation TPF, Gold star. Since EZI hasn't been policy for TPF in the neighborhood of a half-decade, I doubt that threat was recent. If it wasn't though, the only way it could have happened is if you had followed the rogue-to-deletion plan stated by others in MQ. In regards to are reasoning for attacking MQ nations, we both know that line of attack is a load. TPF wouldn't tell our plans to you any more than MQ would tell their plans to us. Also, a minor correction of your facts. TPF hit MQ before the others, not after. Edited October 7, 2013 by Roadie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link Gaetz Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 I really hope you're all being intentionally dense. Not only did MQ declare existence, they declared war as a unit. That is not a rogue action. By your logic, EQ was a rogue coalition, and any Competence alliances are free to redeclare wars on those alliances should they wish with no consequence. You really think that if you say something over and over, people will start believing you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 You really think that if you say something over and over, people will start believing you?I'm not the one doing so. MQ has a basic organization, forums, etc. They made a DoE and DoW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Smurf Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 Excuse me, but Mushqaeda had a DOE, a DOW, and 50 members. That was not a rogue act, that was a highly coordinated and concerted war effort. What TPF and others are doing is attempting to hunt down former members of Mushqaeda without having articulated a clear motivation or rationale. I have personally been threatened with eternal war by TPF, although no reasons have been given. For that matter, TPF did not even state any reasons for attacking us in the first place. I think it makes them feel tough or something, lol. Wars in the game have become very uncommon, and Mushqaeda already had to be at war with several others alliances comprising many many times its NS for TPF to gather the courage to attack us, but gather it they did. It might be easy to pass judgement on TPF for being so cowardly, but we should really be celebrating TPF for showing up. Gold star for participation TPF, Gold star. Just to clarify, are you referring to this thread as the DoE/DoW? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHAYD Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) A traditional alliance DoE. Then DoWs sometime later. Your alliance DoWed just as it declared its existance. That's not a normal case. And thus deserves a non-normal treatment. Edited October 7, 2013 by HHAYD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hereno Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 I hope I'm wrong but I don't see this going well for any extended period of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 8, 2013 Report Share Posted October 8, 2013 Someone should hit neo uruk. He was a mushqaeda nation who slipped out of the war and supposedly join NSO, in the false belief that gives him protection from his crimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Smurf Posted October 8, 2013 Report Share Posted October 8, 2013 Someone should hit neo uruk. He was a mushqaeda nation who slipped out of the war and supposedly join NSO, in the false belief that gives him protection from his crimes. Bahahhaa is that for real? Didn't NSO attack me/kaskus for doing the same thing recently? Didn't Rey just give me shit for this like 2 days ago? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubaQuerida Posted October 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2013 I hope I'm wrong but I don't see this going well for any extended period of time. We're big boys, and know our way around wars and politics. This is us trying to be nice and let everyone know where we stand. No active threats, and limited name-calling. Some of you get it, some don't, “If you can’t explain something simply, you don’t understand it well enough.” Also, life is so much easier when I see "This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by Tywin Lannister. View it anyway?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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