Ernesto Che Guevara Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 If popular opinion was with the Mushrooms, then where is the popular response to the popular response? Where are the masses counter-attacking TTE, NATO, TPF? Where are the crowds chanting down the efforts to preserve global stability? It is easy to measure the popular response against Mushroom Kingdom, you need only look at the war screens. But I see absolutely no evidence of any popular support for the Mushrooms in-game. Just goes to show Mushroom Kingdom ruled out of mass fear of their military might, rather than from any source of legitimacy, and that their most recent action was striking out against the world at large. I seem to recall retracting some of my statements about TOP and conceding that TOP was not attempting to help the Mushroom Kingdom's plots, and even engaging in tech deals with TOP members, and reaching out to TOP govt privately. So where exactly is this evidence of hatred for TOP, an alliance I once served with in Citadel? MQ is being hit by alliances. Retaliating would invoke a military response from those alliances and their allies, touching off what would likely be a global war. CCC/TTE and them can hit MQ without fear of retaliation because MQ is not an established alliance with treaty ties. Stop being so dense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berbers Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 It's all an elaborate ploy. We even restructured our boards, gave a lot of non-MK people member access, and released a bunch of gov archives as part of the ploy. You monster! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) MQ is being hit by alliances. Retaliating would invoke a military response from those alliances and their allies, touching off what would likely be a global war. CCC/TTE and them can hit MQ without fear of retaliation because MQ is not an established alliance with treaty ties. Stop being so dense. If that was the case, why didnt those secondary alliance strike until about a week later? It took time for people to realize that this was an attempt to destabilize the globe. A popular reaction against the 'shrooms rose up, and was represented by the several alliances who struck in defense of neutrality and stability. Meanwhile, very few nations or alliances rose to fight for Allachron in the first place. By every political and in-game measure, and other than a few biased friends of the Mushroom Kingdom on the OWF, the global consensus is that Mushqaeda is "bad, very bad indeed" in the words of the Great Ubuntu. This wasn't a war at all, but rather a police action against a handful of terrorists who thought they had more power than they do. Edited October 5, 2013 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potato Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 If that was the case, why didnt those secondary alliance strike until about a week later? Because they're scared of us. And not very bright. Speaking of not very bright, using Zulu as a reference to prove a point isn't exactly a stellar idea. Just a heads up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 If that was the case, why didnt those secondary alliance strike until about a week later? It took time for people to realize that this was an attempt to destabilize the globe. A popular reaction against the 'shrooms rose up, and was represented by the several alliances who struck in defense of neutrality and stability. Meanwhile, very few nations or alliances rose to fight for Allachron in the first place. By every political and in-game measure, and other than a few biased friends of the Mushroom Kingdom on the OWF, the global consensus is that Mushqaeda is "bad, very bad indeed" in the words of the Great Ubuntu. This wasn't a war at all, but rather a police action against a handful of terrorists who thought they had more power than they do. As somebody who was once closely allied to CCC, I can safely say that despite what I may think of their current military prowess, they're not stupid. In an event such as this, wherein they are facing (on an individual basis) a militarily superior foe, taking about a week to prepare your nations for combat is actually SOP. Build up improvements, buy up nukes if you don't have enough, etc. They weren't rooted on by popular opinion, and again, as much as it goes against my IC persona to speak kindly of our opponents, I must say that I highly doubt the actions of CCC, TTE and the others were motivated by popular opinion on these boards. That motivation came from within, whether it be for moral reasons or opportunistic "strike 'em while they're unprotected" reasons. You're not only an MQ/TOP detractor, but you're making the people you speak for seem like imbeciles who only act when "the public" wants them to. Again, I was allied to CCC. I may be on opposite ends of the world with them right now, but I know their motivations and I know their structure. They don't do what random posters tell them they should do. They do what they think is right or what is right for their allies. That's something nobody can really dispute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) As somebody who was once closely allied to CCC, I can safely say that despite what I may think of their current military prowess, they're not stupid. In an event such as this, wherein they are facing (on an individual basis) a militarily superior foe, taking about a week to prepare your nations for combat is actually SOP. Build up improvements, buy up nukes if you don't have enough, etc. They weren't rooted on by popular opinion, and again, as much as it goes against my IC persona to speak kindly of our opponents, I must say that I highly doubt the actions of CCC, TTE and the others were motivated by popular opinion on these boards. That motivation came from within, whether it be for moral reasons or opportunistic "strike 'em while they're unprotected" reasons. You're not only an MQ/TOP detractor, but you're making the people you speak for seem like imbeciles who only act when "the public" wants them to. Again, I was allied to CCC. I may be on opposite ends of the world with them right now, but I know their motivations and I know their structure. They don't do what random posters tell them they should do. They do what they think is right or what is right for their allies. That's something nobody can really dispute. I wasn't talking about the treaty response from CCC or TTE. I'm talking about the secondary, non-treaty response, which amounts to a police action with the mandate of protecting global stability. Their unopposed entrance indicates the will of the international community in condemning the actions of terrorists. Edited October 5, 2013 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROMMELHSQ Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) If that was the case, why didnt those secondary alliance strike until about a week later? It took time for people to realize that this was an attempt to destabilize the globe. A popular reaction against the 'shrooms rose up, and was represented by the several alliances who struck in defense of neutrality and stability. Meanwhile, very few nations or alliances rose to fight for Allachron in the first place. :lol: If anything, it took people time to realize that this was not an attempt to destabilize the globe and was nothing but roguery actions from a group of bored people with no treaties. It took them days to know that the only risk they run by getting involved is few nukes fired their way from MQ and nothing else. That and what Che Guevara said. Police action my $%@ Edited October 5, 2013 by ROMMELHSQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I wasn't talking about the treaty response from CCC or TTE. I'm talking about the secondary, non-treaty response, which amounts to a police action with the mandate of protecting global stability. Their unopposed entrance indicates the will of the international community in condemning the actions of terrorists. Pretty sure TTE and CCC weren't tied to TDO, but okay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) :lol: If anything, it took people time to realize that this was not an attempt to destabilize the globe and was nothing but roguery actions from a group of bored people with no treaties. It took them days to know that the only risk they run by getting involved is few nukes fired their way from MQ and nothing else. That and what Che Guevara said. Police action my $%@ I understand your desire to protect your friends, in fact I have found TOP's actions for the most part honorable. However, the fact remains that even though they are your friends, Mushqaeda acted against the interests of the international community by attempting to upset global stability. The response was not only necessary, but also inevitable. War criminals must always be brought to justice. Entrance to the International Criminal Court, Casterly Rock, Kingdom of Pakalolo Edited October 5, 2013 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurius Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 I understand your desire to protect your friends, in fact I have found TOP's actions for the most part honorable. However, the fact remains that even though they are your friends, Mushqaeda acted against the interests of the international community by attempting to upset global stability. The response was not only necessary, but also inevitable. War criminals must always be brought to justice. Entrance to the International Criminal Court, Casterly Rock, Kingdom of Pakalolo A few alliances constitutes the international community? Don't fool yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Study our history, child. We made many a friend out of our foes. Does anyone else out there laugh and roll their eyes when someone calls anyone child on here? It could be Dajobo calling Steve Buscemi child and I would be like "god, what an idiot." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zacharias Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 If that was the case, why didnt those secondary alliance strike until about a week later? It took time for people to realize that this was an attempt to destabilize the globe. A popular reaction against the 'shrooms rose up, and was represented by the several alliances who struck in defense of neutrality and stability. Meanwhile, very few nations or alliances rose to fight for Allachron in the first place. By every political and in-game measure, and other than a few biased friends of the Mushroom Kingdom on the OWF, the global consensus is that Mushqaeda is "bad, very bad indeed" in the words of the Great Ubuntu. This wasn't a war at all, but rather a police action against a handful of terrorists who thought they had more power than they do. How could MQ destabilize the entire planet by attacking an alliance with zero ties to any alliance? A guy who leads a Zulu themed alliance shouldn't be a judge on the goodness of others. [ooc] If you don't know, look up what the Zulu did in the early 19th century[/ooc] It was an action by opportunists to attack a MK affiliate with zero ties to the outside world, excluding GPA. If they really wanted to keep the global world stabilized they would've also attacked Bear Force One. You know, the "terrorists" who attacked the NpO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Does anyone else out there laugh and roll their eyes when someone calls anyone child on here? It could be Dajobo calling Steve Buscemi child and I would be like "god, what an idiot." I didn't mean it as an insult, to clarify. It's one of those things that would have to be verbalized to be understood as a joke with the mannerism I intended. But I agree. haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laslo Kenez Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Does anyone else out there laugh and roll their eyes when someone calls anyone child on here? It could be Dajobo calling Steve Buscemi child and I would be like "god, what an idiot." much like your posting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ubuntu the Great Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Mushqaeda political dynamics is a very simple matter. They bad, they attack, they lose, we win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laslo Kenez Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Mushqaeda political dynamics is a very simple matter. They bad, much like your posting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 How could MQ destabilize the entire planet by attacking an alliance with zero ties to any alliance? A guy who leads a Zulu themed alliance shouldn't be a judge on the goodness of others. [ooc] If you don't know, look up what the Zulu did in the early 19th century[/ooc] It was an action by opportunists to attack a MK affiliate with zero ties to the outside world, excluding GPA. If they really wanted to keep the global world stabilized they would've also attacked Bear Force One. You know, the "terrorists" who attacked the NpO. MQ threatened to set a precedent, which left unpunished, would have lead to weakened global stability. As a lulz alliance Mushroom Kingdom was personified by this last action, and they were completely shut down within two weeks. I've noticed there were others endorsing warfare with neutrals, but with the overwhelming response by the international community, these would-be war criminals must stick to raiding only nonaligned nations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 MQ threatened to set a precedent, which left unpunished, would have lead to weakened global stability. As a lulz alliance Mushroom Kingdom was personified by this last action, and they were completely shut down within two weeks. I've noticed there were others endorsing warfare with neutrals, but with the overwhelming response by the international community, these would-be war criminals must stick to raiding only nonaligned nations. How does it feel to have been subservient to what you call a "lulz" alliance for over three years? Also, why are we being charged with the crime of being you/coalition leaders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Ilyani Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 How does it feel to have been subservient to what you call a "lulz" alliance for over three years? Also, why are we being charged with the crime of being you/coalition leaders? Chax, what's the point arguing with someone who literally bases their political opinions on what shitposters in OWF threads say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 (edited) How does it feel to have been subservient to what you call a "lulz" alliance for over three years? Also, why are we being charged with the crime of being you/coalition leaders? I don't remember ever being subservient to any lulz alliance. Edited October 6, 2013 by Tywin Lannister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurius Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 MQ threatened to set a precedent, which left unpunished, would have lead to weakened global stability. As a lulz alliance Mushroom Kingdom was personified by this last action, and they were completely shut down within two weeks. I've noticed there were others endorsing warfare with neutrals, but with the overwhelming response by the international community, these would-be war criminals must stick to raiding only nonaligned nations. Do you really think this has changed anyone who did it before from still advocating a war against neutrals? You really overestimate your pull. Also you and your ilk need to make up your mind, either they are terrorist and thus not subject to the laws of war or international law in general and can't be considered war criminals or they are state actors subject to international law(I might add this world has no such law) who can commit war crimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Do you really think this has changed anyone who did it before from still advocating a war against neutrals? You really overestimate your pull. Also you and your ilk need to make up your mind, either they are terrorist and thus not subject to the laws of war or international law in general and can't be considered war criminals or they are state actors subject to international law(I might add this world has no such law) who can commit war crimes. If you want to be technical, they fall under the category of state terrorists since they are comprised of nation-level rulers. State terrorism involves acts of terror committed or supported by a state against foreign states or people. Thus, they are simultaneously considered war criminals and terrorists. Furthermore, they utilize asymmetric tactics and even false-flag and ghost. They had no legitimate casus belli against TDO. I am building a case for the world court that will be published at the right time, and there is no doubt Mushqaeda operators will be found guilty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurius Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 If you want to be technical, they fall under the category of state terrorists since they are comprised of nation-level rulers. State terrorism involves acts of terror committed or supported by a state against foreign states or people. Thus, they are simultaneously considered war criminals and terrorists. Furthermore, they utilize asymmetric tactics and even false-flag and ghost. They had no legitimate casus belli against TDO. I am building a case for the world court that will be published at the right time, and there is no doubt Mushqaeda operators will be found guilty. Which World Court? Who gave it legitimacy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auctor Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 I'm assuming it's the one we all play basketball in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zacharias Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 MQ threatened to set a precedent, which left unpunished, would have lead to weakened global stability. What precedent, exactly? I've noticed there were others endorsing warfare with neutrals, but with the overwhelming response by the international community, these would-be war criminals must stick to raiding only nonaligned nations. How does five alliances constitute the international community? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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