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Final BFF Announcement, DoE


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Just making the point clear to those who didn't know. In case you didn't notice, I was the one who tried to rebuild it back up after you and everyone else packed bags. I was the one who asked everyone to put their differences aside and try to make this project of the past 5 years work. But no, I'm the bad guy here. Carry on.

Deebo, of all the ex-BFF gov (that didn't go on to re-form Wolfpack or FEAR), you and MoSW are the two that I still have a great amount of respect for. Rather than telling the alliance "hey, we disbanded, go get absorbed by INT" (without consulting the alliance, might I add; I was still a member of BFF when that happened, and found out about it via the forum post), you two stuck around and attempted to get things fixed.

 

Also, obligatory Chax is evil, for reason of mentioning my name in an OWF post...causing me to come back to this awful, awful place.

 

edit:

Oh, and Marx, our signing with TORN had nothing to do with the war; we just wanted some distance from BFF till things cooled down, and TORN was always a good ally to us in FEAR; it would have been difficult to sign with almost anyone else while still achieving that distance. It's almost a shame to see so many of GOONS so hostile toward FEAR, when we were allies not long ago; the people haven't changed, just the AA. Ah well, such is life under the treaty web.

Edited by thedon125
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Meanwhile, you've constructed comparisons of basic situations to say that a certain situation happened. Saying Europa was. a rebrand of UCN would be just as accurate as me claiming MI6 is a rebrand of GATO.

If either of us is dreaming, it is you.

 

Late here. UCN was disbanded without a vote by the membership by the people that went to form Europa. In the process they left most of UCN out to dry and gave them the choice between saving the alliance with a ton of work or to come with them to Europa. A few UCN members tried to keep the government intact and, by extension, the alliance intact. 

 

Having extensively worked with the members that tried to keep the alliance alive, they felt a bit betrayed by the whole situation and how it was handled. Governments are there to serve the members, not agendas. I get the argument that UCN was a relic and that it needed to be gone (or whatever that argument was). On the other hand: this was a place that people called home, they had fought and grown in it. Simply deciding that it was over one day was a hollow choice.

 

As Altheus said, this situation appears to have been handled more gracefully than other past indiscretions and I applaud that fact. That certainly doesn't mean that history can be rewritten. This did happen and it was a breach of the membership's trust. That is one thing I never try to betray over here in UPN, do you?

Edited by Dexomega
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Late here. UCN was disbanded without a vote by the membership by the people that went to form Europa. In the process they left most of UCN out to dry and gave them the choice between saving the alliance with a ton of work or to come with them to Europa. A few UCN members tried to keep the government intact and, by extension, the alliance intact. 

 

Having extensively worked with the members that tried to keep the alliance alive, they felt a bit betrayed by the whole situation and how it was handled. Governments are there to serve the members, not agendas. I get the argument that UCN was a relic and that it needed to be gone (or whatever that argument was). On the other hand: this was a place that people called home, they had fought and grown in it. Simply deciding that it was over one day was a hallow choice.

 

As Altheus said, this situation appears to have been handled more gracefully than other past indiscretions and I applaud that fact. That certainly doesn't mean that history can be rewritten. This did happen and it was a breach of the membership's trust. That is one thing I never try to betray over here in UPN, do you?

I agree totally.

 

And Chax, I hate to fight with you on technicalities and the past, but when you are straight up wrong that UCN and BFF were "totally different", I'm going to call you out. Read thedon's post above: "Rather than telling the alliance 'hey, we disbanded, go get absorbed by INT' (without consulting the alliance, might I add; I was still a member of BFF when that happened, and found out about it via the forum post)." Yes, that is very similar to UCN, and you can't deny that fact at all.

 

Good luck and I hope third time's the charm.

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Sure.

 

Even though our treaty announcements was trolled by Parandiac and Bern and also the reason why me and Ovi came out was of course Deebo making the comment "Those who killed the alliance reside in a specific re-branded alliance." So now I find ourselves even. But yes, good luck and may the new look bring peace and fun and new adventures.

 

Thank you, John. 

 

 

Deebo, of all the ex-BFF gov (that didn't go on to re-form Wolfpack or FEAR), you and MoSW are the two that I still have a great amount of respect for. Rather than telling the alliance "hey, we disbanded, go get absorbed by INT" (without consulting the alliance, might I add; I was still a member of BFF when that happened, and found out about it via the forum post), you two stuck around and attempted to get things fixed.

 

Also, obligatory Chax is evil, for reason of mentioning my name in an OWF post...causing me to come back to this awful, awful place.

 

edit:

Oh, and Marx, our signing with TORN had nothing to do with the war; we just wanted some distance from BFF till things cooled down, and TORN was always a good ally to us in FEAR; it would have been difficult to sign with almost anyone else while still achieving that distance. It's almost a shame to see so many of GOONS so hostile toward FEAR, when we were allies not long ago; the people haven't changed, just the AA. Ah well, such is life under the treaty web.

 

I'll drag you back again and again, Don. 

 

Already did.My job was just gave a little push. 

 

No, you didn't. You didn't actually release any information. Once again, as always, you just stood on the sideline and let others do the work for you, work that, as I already stated, is inconclusive and actually doesn't prove anything. 

 

Yes he was kicked out of trium and then (like a week later) BFF fell apart. 

 

Therefore he wasn't govt.  :rolleyes:

 

Nope, read again. 

 

Late here. UCN was disbanded without a vote by the membership by the people that went to form Europa. In the process they left most of UCN out to dry and gave them the choice between saving the alliance with a ton of work or to come with them to Europa. A few UCN members tried to keep the government intact and, by extension, the alliance intact. 

 

Having extensively worked with the members that tried to keep the alliance alive, they felt a bit betrayed by the whole situation and how it was handled. Governments are there to serve the members, not agendas. I get the argument that UCN was a relic and that it needed to be gone (or whatever that argument was). On the other hand: this was a place that people called home, they had fought and grown in it. Simply deciding that it was over one day was a hollow choice.

 

As Altheus said, this situation appears to have been handled more gracefully than other past indiscretions and I applaud that fact. That certainly doesn't mean that history can be rewritten. This did happen and it was a breach of the membership's trust. That is one thing I never try to betray over here in UPN, do you?

 

The remaining active members of UCN and active government voted to disband. It wasn't gov's fault they couldn't be bothered to check into the discussions. You wouldn't know, you weren't there, and again for the hundredth time, stop acting like you were. The people who tried to keep UCN intact were actually not members of the alliance at the time (I believe one or two were), but were former members who came back after the fact. The simple idea that me leaving UCN caused that power vacuum and implosion proves just how broken the alliance was. 

 

I agree totally.

 

And Chax, I hate to fight with you on technicalities and the past, but when you are straight up wrong that UCN and BFF were "totally different", I'm going to call you out. Read thedon's post above: "Rather than telling the alliance 'hey, we disbanded, go get absorbed by INT' (without consulting the alliance, might I add; I was still a member of BFF when that happened, and found out about it via the forum post)." Yes, that is very similar to UCN, and you can't deny that fact at all.

 

Good luck and I hope third time's the charm.

 

And again, like UCN, the vast majority of members weren't active enough to keep up with things. We merged into Int because we had no idea how much longer our forums were going to remain up, we had no power to remask government members who had been banned, etc. I'd like to see anybody do better in that situation. 

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No, you didn't. You didn't actually release any information. Once again, as always, you just stood on the sideline and let others do the work for you, work that, as I already stated, is inconclusive and actually doesn't prove anything. 

 

Your mistake was think that I'm here to release any information, if people want information they just need to go look to the countless threads regarding the whole fiasco. Now, as longs as I am here I'll always be reminding people of how you tried to sell your allies and how you managed to destroy your own alliance in the process. It would be a tragic history if wasn't so hilarious.

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Deebo, of all the ex-BFF gov (that didn't go on to re-form Wolfpack or FEAR), you and MoSW are the two that I still have a great amount of respect for. Rather than telling the alliance "hey, we disbanded, go get absorbed by INT" (without consulting the alliance, might I add; I was still a member of BFF when that happened, and found out about it via the forum post), you two stuck around and attempted to get things fixed.

 

Also, obligatory Chax is evil, for reason of mentioning my name in an OWF post...causing me to come back to this awful, awful place.

 

edit:

Oh, and Marx, our signing with TORN had nothing to do with the war; we just wanted some distance from BFF till things cooled down, and TORN was always a good ally to us in FEAR; it would have been difficult to sign with almost anyone else while still achieving that distance. It's almost a shame to see so many of GOONS so hostile toward FEAR, when we were allies not long ago; the people haven't changed, just the AA. Ah well, such is life under the treaty web.

 

 

It's amazing how breaking off and signing with our enemies just before the war could be construed as FEAR being extremely opportunistic.

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Your mistake was think that I'm here to release any information, if people want information they just need to go look to the countless threads regarding the whole fiasco. Now, as longs as I am here I'll always be reminding people of how you tried to sell your allies and how you managed to destroy your own alliance in the process. It would be a tragic history if wasn't so hilarious.

 

BFF voted on the course of action, I wasn't the sole actor. Our "allies" engaged in a hostile act without consulting us. They negated the treaty and we still offered to protect them from any aggressive action no-questions asked. Nobody has disputed that, that's never been the issue at hand. The issue was our handling of the aggression clause in our treaty, which we saw as negated at that point. Anyway, that's all fine and dandy, but you came into this thread acting high and mighty like you yourself could actually release information. You're nothing but a parrot repeating information others have already released. That's what you are now and that's what you've been for years. Your despicable attempts at retaining relevancy are the joke of many around the globe, and I would "wish you out of Planet Bob" but I enjoy sparring with you too much. And you make damned-good propaganda. So I'm torn, dammit. 

 

Los Pollos Hermonos has a much better ring to it. I hope you are able to find the appropriate target market for your rebranding strategy.

 

Our chicken appeals to all. Won't you stop by for a bite? 

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BFF voted on the course of action, I wasn't the sole actor. Our "allies" engaged in a hostile act without consulting us. They negated the treaty and we still offered to protect them from any aggressive action no-questions asked. Nobody has disputed that, that's never been the issue at hand. The issue was our handling of the aggression clause in our treaty, which we saw as negated at that point. Anyway, that's all fine and dandy, but you came into this thread acting high and mighty like you yourself could actually release information. You're nothing but a parrot repeating information others have already released. That's what you are now and that's what you've been for years. Your despicable attempts at retaining relevancy are the joke of many around the globe, and I would "wish you out of Planet Bob" but I enjoy sparring with you too much. And you make damned-good propaganda. So I'm torn, dammit

 

 

I never said that you were the only one to be blame, one more time you assume something that wasn't said. Also I see you changed your strategy, instead of try to avoid all the responsibility you're now trying to use the "It isn't just my fault!" line.  Also, if the better you can do to attack me is "You're irrelevant!" lines, doesn't even bother.  

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I never said that you were the only one to be blame, one more time you assume something that wasn't said. Also I see you changed your strategy, instead of try to avoid all the responsibility you're now trying to use the "It isn't just my fault!" line.  Also, if the better you can do to attack me is "You're irrelevant!" lines, doesn't even bother.  

 

I'm not avoiding responsibility for my parts in the fiasco. I'm just saying you're misinformed as to my involvement, like you are with most things. 

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Sure.

 

Even though our treaty announcements was trolled by Parandiac and Bern and also the reason why me and Ovi came out was of course Deebo making the comment "Those who killed the alliance reside in a specific re-branded alliance." So now I find ourselves even. But yes, good luck and may the new look bring peace and fun and new adventures.

 


children play tit for tat. you would have been better served to simply ignore what was said here and deal with any queries made about the situation on your own.

 

i truly regret introducing you to people at Europa, john. bringing you here was my biggest mistake, and i used to be in Echelon.

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Edit: Anyway, can we please not make this thread about BFF/FEAR/Chaxgate and keep it about the alliance declaring existence here? 

 

It would be wildly immature to simply say that "Deebo started it..."

 

But he totally did  :rolleyes:

 

Deebo, of all the ex-BFF gov (that didn't go on to re-form Wolfpack or FEAR), you and MoSW are the two that I still have a great amount of respect for. Rather than telling the alliance "hey, we disbanded, go get absorbed by INT" (without consulting the alliance, might I add; I was still a member of BFF when that happened, and found out about it via the forum post), you two stuck around and attempted to get things fixed.

 

Also, obligatory Chax is evil, for reason of mentioning my name in an OWF post...causing me to come back to this awful, awful place.

 

edit:

Oh, and Marx, our signing with TORN had nothing to do with the war; we just wanted some distance from BFF till things cooled down, and TORN was always a good ally to us in FEAR; it would have been difficult to sign with almost anyone else while still achieving that distance. It's almost a shame to see so many of GOONS so hostile toward FEAR, when we were allies not long ago; the people haven't changed, just the AA. Ah well, such is life under the treaty web.

 

C'est la vie indeed

 

It's amazing how breaking off and signing with our enemies just before the war could be construed as FEAR being extremely opportunistic.

 

Be that as it may, I believe our absence from the war or any other act (aid) should have been enough to substantiate thedon's statement. I guess not...

Edited by Ovidsidios
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It's amazing how breaking off and signing with our enemies just before the war could be construed as FEAR being extremely opportunistic.

Oh, I can absolutely see how that could be construed. Given that we were in BFF prior to breaking off, however, there's no way we would have known war was upon us until after FEAR formed, considering even Umbrella was caught off-guard. Sure, there were rumors, there had been rumors for the preceeding 6 months as well. :P

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It was not meant to be, good luck

 

Exactly this. No matter the reasoning, BFF is gone. LPH is the new hope of those former members, and I can only hope that at some point in the future we can normalize relations with our brothers in FEAR. We're a family, and we're bickering right now. That happens. I love Don too much to ever be mean to him too long. 

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It would be wildly immature to simply say that "Deebo started it..."

 

But he totally did  :rolleyes:

 

 

C'est la vie indeed

 

 

Be that as it may, I believe our absence from the war or any other act (aid) should have been enough to substantiate thedon's statement. I guess not...

 

I can't edit quotes anymore since these forums are broken but this is for the last part:

 

You don't have to fight for the other side to be a war dodger and an opportunist. 

 

Oh, I can absolutely see how that could be construed. Given that we were in BFF prior to breaking off, however, there's no way we would have known war was upon us until after FEAR formed, considering even Umbrella was caught off-guard. Sure, there were rumors, there had been rumors for the preceeding 6 months as well. :P

 

You may not have known when but you certainly knew who our foes were going to be. That wasn't a secret and anybody who wasn't deliberately playing blind or literally naive could see it.

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