DoorNail Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 A Good fight all around. Kaskus are hard, scrappy fighters. Much respect. As for Doornail: http://www.cybernations.net/war_information.asp?ID=718365 I tried :( As I said in that last PM to you Joe, you're a good fighter and I enjoyed it. The other two just got the scraps from what was left over from fighting you. I sense some butthurt in this thread yet, but what you fail to understand is that I don't give a damn what you think lol. All I ever wanted was peace and now we have it, suits me just fine. That was my objective, regardless of how anyone wants to word it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saniiro Matsudaira Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Peace in our time [for NSO [for now]]. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walshington Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 And yet another classy surrender document degenerates to refighting the war on page two. There are multiple other threads regarding this war which are still active -- maybe we confine the piss and vinegar to those threads, and leave this one with the sprit it was intended to have on page one? o/ combatants o/ peace o/ class, especially when put forward when it wasn't required Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banned Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 DoorNail fucked up. Period. There's no two ways of looking at it. Good intentions or bad is subjective and irrelevant, he directly ignored the warnings to not aid. This made the action itself bad and wrong. NEWs aid, SLs aid, NPOs aid: are all irrelevant to the case. When NPO declared war, the words were written on the wall: If Kaskus had any problems with NSO receiving aid, the onus is on them to 'do something about it.' You're failure to make the choice, or display the ability, is not our fault. It's the course of the war. This does not make us bullies. This does not make us bad guys. DoorKnob, this does not make us liars. This makes us leaders who've displayed the ability to lead our alliances to victory and deserved justice through both force and foreign ability. How can you possibly morally object to Doornail's aid, but find it morally perfectly acceptable when it goes in your favor? The lot of you want to say that you're not e-bullies, but is a clear demonstration of it. It's war, I get it. You open up logistics lines to your own troops, and attempt to cut them off for the other side. But to claim that what Doornail did was somehow morally objectionable, but that it happening the other way was perfectly fine, well... that's just disgusting propaganda, and there's really no way that you can spin yourself out of that. If the action one way was "bad and wrong", then it was just as "bad and wrong" the other way, and even trying to spin it the way that you're attempting to here really does make you bullies, bad guys, and liars. Despite all that... o/ peace, I guess. Kaskus has proven one thing, as the future era shows it's face, they're going to be quite a force to be reckoned with, and a hot commodity to have as partners on the battlefield. War doesn't bother me much, but I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a bloc with them in it a year or two from now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bit Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Congrats to all. it was fun, till we meet again. good war. now time for a bath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenMorningstar Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 How can you possibly morally object to Doornail's aid, but find it morally perfectly acceptable when it goes in your favor? The lot of you want to say that you're not e-bullies, but is a clear demonstration of it. It's war, I get it. You open up logistics lines to your own troops, and attempt to cut them off for the other side. But to claim that what Doornail did was somehow morally objectionable, but that it happening the other way was perfectly fine, well... that's just disgusting propaganda, and there's really no way that you can spin yourself out of that. If the action one way was "bad and wrong", then it was just as "bad and wrong" the other way, and even trying to spin it the way that you're attempting to here really does make you bullies, bad guys, and liars. Despite all that... o/ peace, I guess. Kaskus has proven one thing, as the future era shows it's face, they're going to be quite a force to be reckoned with, and a hot commodity to have as partners on the battlefield. War doesn't bother me much, but I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a bloc with them in it a year or two from now. He didnt find it morally objectionable. He found it an act of war. DoorNail got all kinds of butthurt when they beat the crap out of him for doing it. Which was well within their rights since it was an act of war. And we all see how great DoorNail is at negotiation. Which is to say he just pisses people off constantly and they dont feel like wwrking with him or cutting him any slack at all. People moan and complain constantly when we get aided by our DH buddies. But everyone knows thats the way we run. If they had the means to stop MK and Umbrella they would have tried (they are now finally trying, but thats another thread). Anyway hats off agian NSO. Good war, good outcome and you got them to admit defeat. All in all a successful venture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted February 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 How can you possibly morally object to Doornail's aid, but find it morally perfectly acceptable when it goes in your favor? The lot of you want to say that you're not e-bullies, but is a clear demonstration of it. It's war, I get it. You open up logistics lines to your own troops, and attempt to cut them off for the other side. But to claim that what Doornail did was somehow morally objectionable, but that it happening the other way was perfectly fine, well... that's just disgusting propaganda, and there's really no way that you can spin yourself out of that. If the action one way was "bad and wrong", then it was just as "bad and wrong" the other way, and even trying to spin it the way that you're attempting to here really does make you bullies, bad guys, and liars. Despite all that... o/ peace, I guess. Kaskus has proven one thing, as the future era shows it's face, they're going to be quite a force to be reckoned with, and a hot commodity to have as partners on the battlefield. War doesn't bother me much, but I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a bloc with them in it a year or two from now. He made a choice, in spite of all warnings. This is not spin, this is not morally-driven, this is action; cause and effect. Words were said that to aid Kaskus further was an act of war -> DoorNail chose to aid Kaskus -> war got declared. And then to go further to events this morning, even when Kaskus finally agreed to peace - he decided that no it was not good enough and he decided he was going to try and further hold the war and denounce peace (so much for vying for peace??). He got off light in that I was prepared to bring the full event to a close with Kaskus despite him, but he deserves no defense. He got off light that it was I that responded and took control of the TSL situation and not Pacifica, who specifically wrote the words he spit on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chefjoe Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Congrats on peace to all Involved, especially to our allies in Pacifica o/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walshington Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Kaskus has proven one thing, as the future era shows it's face, they're going to be quite a force to be reckoned with, and a hot commodity to have as partners on the battlefield. War doesn't bother me much, but I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a bloc with them in it a year or two from now. I knew about this a year ago, and I FIRMly agree with you. Most of your CnG buddies do not, however. -_- I shall be kicking rocks and pouting, if anyone needs me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMC123 Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I think everyone aside from DoorNail realizes he messed up. Do we really need to bicker about it more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youwish959 Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 (edited) How can you possibly morally object to Doornail's aid, but find it morally perfectly acceptable when it goes in your favor? The lot of you want to say that you're not e-bullies, but is a clear demonstration of it. It's war, I get it. You open up logistics lines to your own troops, and attempt to cut them off for the other side. But to claim that what Doornail did was somehow morally objectionable, but that it happening the other way was perfectly fine, well... that's just disgusting propaganda, and there's really no way that you can spin yourself out of that. If the action one way was "bad and wrong", then it was just as "bad and wrong" the other way, and even trying to spin it the way that you're attempting to here really does make you bullies, bad guys, and liars. Despite all that... o/ peace, I guess. Kaskus has proven one thing, as the future era shows it's face, they're going to be quite a force to be reckoned with, and a hot commodity to have as partners on the battlefield. War doesn't bother me much, but I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a bloc with them in it a year or two from now. Get bent faggot. We don't deal in morals. Edited February 20, 2013 by youwish959 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esial Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 (edited) Glad the war is over. May we all move on to more important things than bickering over what has happened, and look towards the future. The past is best left where it is, dead and gone. That said, good war Kaskus. Glad Pacifica and Shangri-La were there to help out. Let us all look towards peace and now commence rebuilding. Edited February 20, 2013 by Esial Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoorNail Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I think everyone aside from DoorNail realizes he messed up. Do we really need to bicker about it more? You could say that again, Rayvon said that him and Tan hadn't spoken in a month, therefore what I did to get them back together for peace talks is a success and a victory no matter how it is spun. Mission Accomplished! lol, it's over, but the bawwing continues and the tears are quite yummy in my tummy. You miss me yet? :smug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longshadow Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 This is good to see. o/ The Orders and our allies o/ Kaskus Y'all fought well and I will say I enjoyed it all :wub: However I must say :wub: Jrenster I think we should just ignore the fly on the wall. He did nothing but get swatted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnsey Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Good to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenMorningstar Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 You could say that again, Rayvon said that him and Tan hadn't spoken in a month, therefore what I did to get them back together for peace talks is a success and a victory no matter how it is spun. Mission Accomplished! lol, it's over, but the bawwing continues and the tears are quite yummy in my tummy. You miss me yet? :smug: Rayvon did you have to let his alliance peace out? ZI seems a good punishment for him for having to listen to his crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush Sykes Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 No disbandment of Kaskus? My dream of a little less stupid in the FA realms of CN have taken a hit. Grats to my friends in NPO though! No grats to Rayvon though, he is mean to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cairna Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 You could say that again, Rayvon said that him and Tan hadn't spoken in a month, therefore what I did to get them back together for peace talks is a success and a victory no matter how it is spun. Mission Accomplished! lol, it's over, but the bawwing continues and the tears are quite yummy in my tummy. You miss me yet? :smug: Yes, you threw your alliance under the bus to get our attention. Yes, our declaration of war and subsequent decimation of your stats brought negotiations back to the table. Peace was then achieved. You'd be a brilliant strategist if it weren't for the fact that you complained the whole time for entirely foreseeable results and then tried to hold off peace [i]based[/i] off the results of your actions. Kaskus and PPO are very lucky to have such an impressive character as their ward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenoCore Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 It was a lot of fun :D especially with Pollard <3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGekkeJapanner Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Good to see this come to an end. Thanks Kaskus, for giving me something to spend tax money on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 NSO finally won a war by they own efforts, ops... they didn't. :( May be next time. Congrats Kaskus for fighting for two months against overwhelming odds, despise the dumb decisions you guys make from time to time, you have my respect. o/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Bad Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Nice to see this done. A war that never had to happen. I hope Kaskus can rebuild and get organized so that something like this never happens again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banned Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 So much getting worked up over previous aspects of my last post, I'm not going to bother quoting it all. I don't have a problem with DoorNail being dragged into the war, as I said, that's the nature of war. You establish logistics lines for your side, and you cut logistics lines for the other team. Whether or not I find that cheap and dirty, it is so universally. Of course Doornail dragged himself into the war by sending aid to his allies. However, as stated, to call that "bad and wrong" as was done, and then to in the same breath paint the picture as it perfectly acceptable for people supporting the other side to do the exact same thing, well that is an argument or morals, and quite frankly, morals are universal, whether they can be enforced or not. I really don't have a problem with what Doornail did, or that it was used as a reason to bring Kaskus' protectee into the conflict. He involved himself in the war. I wouldn't have a problem if Kaskus attempted to similarly cut off NSO's supply lines in a similar fashion has they been on the other side of the war. As stated, I don't have a problem with it, I'm not even really that bothered that NSO makes the argument "well we could do it, and they couldn't, because we were winning and they just didn't have the power to enforce any of that." Particularly when an ally aids another ally but doesn't want to jump into the mix of combat, well, it's agreed that they put themselves in it. All that said though, "it's bad and wrong" for one side, and "perfectly acceptable, don't like it do something about it" and thinking that such a "moral" argument could be made, well it's an oxymoron that just doesn't stand. I'm not the one that brought "morality" into it, I just commented about the blatant spitting in the face of logic. I'll also admit that I'm not personally a fan of NSO, but that doesn't drive an intent to come in here to trash-talk you guys. If that was the goal, I would have been in here talking about how it was finally nice to see NSO be able to get their &^$* together long enough to put this thing away. So, just for the sake of making myself perfectly clear, do I think that NSO was justified in lining up the firing squad on DoorNail? Absolutely. If using clauses in a protectorate treaty is what he intended, then he may as well have just fired off those joint defensive clauses that most of them contain, and jumped in the thing like a man. Was it "bad and wrong" for him to aid Kaskus? No, not by any means. DoorNail serves as a disgrace to his alliance for not manning up for war right from the start of that conflict. I've run a micro, and had our protectors found themselves at war, you better believe that would have been an instant cause for an activation of defense and aggression clauses, and we'd have been in that mix. Why? Simply look back at the history. Larger alliances have raided unprotected alliances in the past, and if it wasn't for protectors, a lot of alliances might not have ever got off the ground. They're your friends, and that support should be expected in both directions. And that means more than aid. The way that DoorNail handed things, he certainly hasn't earned anybody's respect. However, I think that the way that NSO handled just about every other aspect of this war... well, they really haven't either. Not that you need my respect, or anybody else's. You can be fine sitting in your corner with your usual allies, but the argument that I was responding to doesn't stand, which is all that I was pointing out, and not saying that "such and such side was right" or "such and such side was wrong". In this case, I think both parties had their faults. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WorldConqueror Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 NSO finally won a war by they own efforts, ops... they didn't. :(May be next time. Congrats Kaskus for fighting for two months against overwhelming odds, despise the dumb decisions you guys make from time to time, you have my respect. o/When's the last time STA won a war 'by they own efforts'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cairna Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 NSO finally won a war by they own efforts, ops... they didn't. :( May be next time. Congrats Kaskus for fighting for two months against overwhelming odds, despise the dumb decisions you guys make from time to time, you have my respect. o/ Nobody ever does. It's good to see that the quality of your trolling hasn't changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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