Tiberius Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Bernkastel' timestamp='1357837413' post='3073949'] I wasn't aware the opinion of maybe ten people (might be a slight overestimate) out of sixty something people constituted the opinion of the alliance. I don't think 1/6th of the alliance constitutes an opinion of the entire alliance. Entire ACTIVE alliance maybe but not the entire alliance. [/quote]Please do point to where you got this statement from out of my post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Namayan Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Cress' timestamp='1357836459' post='3073944'] Unless your a fellow member or ally we particularly don't care of your opinion on our business. To Bern: Irule is in peace mode and deleting hence why we aren't hitting him too. Also don't try and play all innocent not only did you coup you sent orders for our members to attack an ally. Joke coup or not you disrespected the choice of the members. [/quote] Cress, i find it amusing that GPF posted this in OWF but dont want the opinions of OWF. I cannot believe GPF would stoop low ever further after this OP. But, you have proven it wrong. If you really guys wanted only the opinion of your allies and your members as well as BFFs, you could have gone to their IRCs in private or at BFF forums, your allies embassies and your embassies to deal with your members. Not post this in OWF. Just remember when you post again, this is OWF where all planet bob can see and post. GPF forums are where you, your members, allies, friends can see and solve this matter privately. Allied forums are also where you can private discuss and get opinion of these matters with you and your allies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdman Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 O/ markfrancos O/ Cress O/ Cookies I do not think this guy is comming out of PM anytime soon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Namayan' timestamp='1357841520' post='3073986'] Cress, i find it amusing that GPF posted this in OWF but dont want the opinions of OWF. I cannot believe GPF would stoop low ever further after this OP. But, you have proven it wrong. If you really guys wanted only the opinion of your allies and your members as well as BFFs, you could have gone to their IRCs in private or at BFF forums, your allies embassies and your embassies to deal with your members. Not post this in OWF. Just remember when you post again, this is OWF where all planet bob can see and post. GPF forums are where you, your members, allies, friends can see and solve this matter privately. Allied forums are also where you can private discuss and get opinion of these matters with you and your allies. [/quote]We posted an announcement in Alliance Announcements, not in "Post for others opinion forums". Did we ask for your opinion? No. Are you entitled to your opinion? Yes. Do we care about what others think about us, bar our allies? No. The whole point of the announcement is to notify the world that Bern is on our ZI-List, but please keep telling me how the OWF works, it makes you look cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smurthwaite Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Hereno' timestamp='1357782831' post='3073512'] Oops. The 15m thing is pissing off GPF's membership again. Now you owe 90m and a sonnet. Sorry for the inconvenience! [/quote] [quote name='Ovidsidios' timestamp='1357782571' post='3073508'] Yeah, Bernkastel already looks bad enough. Besides, they'll take the rep and roll him anyway. [/quote] Edit for the sake of niceness: They aren't GOONs. Edited January 10, 2013 by smurthwaite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swatch0 Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1357780797' post='3073493'] I'm a bit surprised GPF went back on its word here; then again, I was surprised clemency was granted in the first place. And this is all over just $15 million? What a queer series of events. [/quote] Would 18m have been more reasonable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Swatch0' timestamp='1357851048' post='3074064'] Would 18m have been more reasonable? [/quote] 90 million is the Methrage standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KemMo Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 Perfectly reasonable terms and punishment in my opinion. Have fun, GPF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernkastel Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Birdman' timestamp='1357841670' post='3073990'] I do not think this guy is comming out of PM anytime soon... [/quote] I'll be chilling in peace mode permanently. I don't mind having what amounts to pretty much a permanent ZI on me. Edited January 10, 2013 by Bernkastel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cao Pai Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 SAY IT AIN'T SO BERN. SAY IT AIN'T SO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 The OWF post was to clarify the situation to the world regarding Bern's status as being on GPF's ZI list to avoid an unintentional mixup should Bern join another alliance. Further, BFF posted our statement to clarify for everybody where we stood, as there were rumors flying around. We wish GPF the very best of luck in this endeavor, and we wish Bernkastel all the luck in the world. May you both find agreeable terms to end this. And if it must lead to war, then so be it. War is the final step of diplomacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 In the headlines for all the wrong reasons again Bern? Heh something's never change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurunin Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Bernkastel' timestamp='1357852108' post='3074075'] I'll be chilling in peace mode permanently. I don't mind having what amounts to pretty much a permanent ZI on me. [/quote] You are 3k NS...you have a whole alliance and other people willing to pay off the reps for you or you could have converted it to tech deals. Or you could just take the war, have some fun fighting and then a single 3mil aid package would build you back up to current standing. It's literally rediculous how this is all playing out. Also those criticizing Mark...in the last thread a single trium was alrdy saying he was lobbying for an overturn of the decision of Mark's. There only needs to be two, not three triums to overturn the decision. Seriously you people act like its rocket science to understand this. Finally...and the most important...alliance sovereignty...it means you can say all you want about a certain alliance but they don't have to listen. Like if I were to say that goons should stop tech raiding. That doesn't mean they will nor have to give a single care what I say or anyone else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernkastel Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Lurunin' timestamp='1357854572' post='3074107'] You are 3k NS...you have a whole alliance and other people willing to pay off the reps for you or you could have converted it to tech deals. Or you could just take the war, have some fun fighting and then a single 3mil aid package would build you back up to current standing. It's literally rediculous how this is all playing out. [/quote] It doesn't matter. If I was 500 NS I would still hold to this. If I were 50,000 - same thing. I (nor anyone who respects my wish) should not have to pay reps or do something ridiculous and dumb. I've been pardoned, simply put and Mark should be a man of his word but it's become apparent he is not now. Everyone was supposed to walk away peacefully and put it all behind us and move on to a bright future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurunin Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 That's the problem with democracies, the democratic process can overturn any and all decisions no matter how final you think they may be. Democracy prevailed in this occasion, good or bad. Regardless of what Mark decided, he was overruled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernkastel Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Lurunin' timestamp='1357862010' post='3074228'] That's the problem with democracies, the democratic process can overturn any and all decisions no matter how final you think they may be. Democracy prevailed in this occasion, good or bad. Regardless of what Mark decided, he was overruled [/quote] They should remove his power then because in the face of democracy, he cannot win. Might as well remove the government too. Democracy is horribly overrated and leads to awful decisions in good places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 [quote name='Lurunin' timestamp='1357854572' post='3074107'] Also those criticizing Mark...in the last thread a single trium was alrdy saying he was lobbying for an overturn of the decision of Mark's. There only needs to be two, not three triums to overturn the decision. Seriously you people act like its rocket science to understand this. [/quote] If his decision was not final and subject to review it should not have been posted as a fait accompli. No matter how you want to phrase it, this is a massive screw up. The pardon was pronounced publicly by the supposedly legitimate leader of the alliance, and if it isnt good then why should anyone care what else GPF has to say afterwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurunin Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I never said it wasn't a mistake. Neither have GPF though as they have come out and accepted that exact notion. But it still stands that the decision was overruled its happened before with others and it'll happen again in the future with others as well. It's not often that gov will have differing opinions over some things but here is where they figured leniency was not in their alliance's best interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nishiyoshi Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Bernkastel' timestamp='1357861620' post='3074220'] It doesn't matter. If I was 500 NS I would still hold to this. If I were 50,000 - same thing. I (nor anyone who respects my wish) should not have to pay reps or do something ridiculous and dumb. I've been pardoned, simply put and Mark should be a man of his word but it's become apparent he is not now. Everyone was supposed to walk away peacefully and put it all behind us and move on to a bright future. [/quote] There are plenty of things that are 'supposed' to happen. You were 'supposed' to let yourself burn as a martyr, but are hanging out in PM. You are well respected by enough people that there are people more than willing to pay a token fee for your freedom. The very principles you are claiming to uphold, you are stomping all over and spitting on. I would have definitely respected your decision to burn for the sake of principle (even though your ZI would be as meaningless as the reps that others have offered to pay), but now have no respect for you hiding out in PM. This is all just for the sake of posterity and to not let bad precedents get set. Which is worse? Letting people think they can coup whenever they want for 'lolz'? Or showing weakness by admitting to a mistake and then publically correcting and getting hammered over it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthey Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Bernkastel' timestamp='1357861620' post='3074220'] It doesn't matter. If I was 500 NS I would still hold to this. If I were 50,000 - same thing. I (nor anyone who respects my wish) should not have to pay reps or do something ridiculous and dumb. I've been pardoned, simply put and Mark should be a man of his word but it's become apparent he is not now. Everyone was supposed to walk away peacefully and put it all behind us and move on to a bright future. [/quote] You are honestly lucky your actions even have a price tag. Get over it, and make your amends rather than acting like a spoiled child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernkastel Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='nishiyoshi' timestamp='1357888883' post='3074661'] There are plenty of things that are 'supposed' to happen. You were 'supposed' to let yourself burn as a martyr, but are hanging out in PM. You are well respected by enough people that there are people more than willing to pay a token fee for your freedom. The very principles you are claiming to uphold, you are stomping all over and spitting on. I would have definitely respected your decision to burn for the sake of principle (even though your ZI would be as meaningless as the reps that others have offered to pay), but now have no respect for you hiding out in PM. This is all just for the sake of posterity and to not let bad precedents get set. Which is worse? Letting people think they can coup whenever they want for 'lolz'? Or showing weakness by admitting to a mistake and then publically correcting and getting hammered over it? [/quote] I'm a very careful person so I like to calculate what the best course of action can or will be. Staying in peace mode was by far the cheapest option. If someone wanted to rebuild me, it would take approximately far more than some of you think to build me back to where I am completely and I wouldn't accept any less than what is necessary. It would also not be in my best interests to go to war on GPF as that would be $2-4mil a day in varied expenses. Unfortunately, as much as I don't like to run away from my fights, I'm more conscious of what the best option is and it's simply not anything but being in peace mode. Maybe it all is for the sake of posterity. I admitted my mistake and gave back everything peacefully but an even greater tragedy is at work here. An alliance leader's absolute word and law isn't absolute and isn't law. He went back on his pardon. His word is useless and so is GPF's democratically elected government. It's all about the seven or eight active people out of 60-something. Woo boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markfrancos Posted January 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 there is more than that, lots of people are just active in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dilber Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) As King of GPF, Bernkastel can make it payable to either myself or my heir, Pansy, in tech if that is more your style. Thanks in Advance! Edited January 11, 2013 by Dilber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernkastel Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='markfrancos' timestamp='1357903807' post='3074715'] there is more than that, lots of people are just active in game. [/quote] Yeah, a whole 17 people out (3 of whom left) of 65 filled out that war chest survey. That's double the forum activity though so I guess you do have some point to that. But still, 2/3rd of your alliance not taking part in a war chest survey doesn't exactly give you much to go on. Edit~ It was actually around 15 people, my bad. Had to go look. Edited January 11, 2013 by Bernkastel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Black Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) You still poking tiger bern? Any chance either party would consider renegotiating the terms? Edited January 11, 2013 by Muddog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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