An Official Kaskus Announcement

[suryanto tan]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321903392' post='2848251']
Right.... you created an alliance to declare on us
[/quote]

No, we do not create Kaskus to declare on you.
Let's observe the timeline.

Sep. 12: Kaskus was founded.
Sep. 28: Non Grata declared war on UPN for attempting to negotiate the reparations.
Sep. 28: Kaskus said, "Ok, cool. Come on UPN and allies, you know what to do."
Sep. 29: UPN announced, "We are not calling in our allies. Our mistake, we deserved to be beaten."
Sep. 29: Kaskus said, "WTF?! What is wrong with you people. Fight back!"
Oct. 02: UPN surrendered after "taking the punishment".
Oct. 11: Kaskus announced her existence in OWF.
Oct. 11: Menotah announced Kaskus as her protectorate.
Oct. 16: Non Grata declared on SOS Brigade for the past grievances.
Oct. 16: Kaskus said, "Ok, cool. Now, let's see who going to help this poor alliance."
Oct. 16: Invicta and friends, "Wow, it is Non Grata. They are too big. We will not win. Let's sit this one out, as well."
Oct. 28: SOS Brigade surrendered.
Nov. 07: Kaskus declared war on Non Grata.

So, here you see, there is a line of events that lead to our decision to declare war on you. As tempting as it sounds, we do not make this alliance just so that we can declare on you.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321903392' post='2848251']
without a good reason.
[/quote]

Good reason is subjective. Many people in planet Bob do not consider your recent reasons for war as good reasons, either.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321903392' post='2848251']
You should be happy we didn't consider you all rogues. You were the one who attacked us, don't turn it around.
[/quote]

I am happy. Yes, we are the one who attacked you. But attacking you does not make us rogue. Just like when you attacked other alliances, that do not make you become a bunch of rogues.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321903392' post='2848251']
We have issued a statement about how we consider those who aren't here for the initial attack and we will follow through on that.
[/quote]

I understand fully. You are trying to take care of your own interest. Understandable move.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321903392' post='2848251']
I also have confidence in the white team senate to do what they have to do.
[/quote]

Me too.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321903392' post='2848251']
Senate sanction are always based on reciprocity, I'm sure one senator will return the favor we gave them before.
[/quote]
I have to disagree here. I had had the honor to serve in NEW government, and during my term we had received several requests for sanctions from other alliances. When the request is reasonable we usually approve, even when the alliance has done no favor for us in the past. But, there was once, an alliance (that I will not name it here) asked us to sanction a raid victim just because he fully retaliated against the raiders and their friends. We refused to give the sanction after we learn what actually happened.

I believe that the white team senates, our white team senates, will uphold their integrity and will not shamed their alliance honors by submitting to your political pressure.

[quote name='Steve Buscemi' timestamp='1321913795' post='2848340']
If you want him sanctioned as a rogue then you can do that. If you find a white senator that agrees with you, more power to you.
[/quote]

You misunderstood. No, I do not want him sanctioned. Just like I do not want any of my members to get sanctioned.

Despite your much superior military force, I do not find it necessary to tip the balance in my favor by using the senate sanctions against you. I believe in the ability of my members to fight the war against you.

I believe they can fight you fairly and I will not shame the reputation of my alliance by going down that road.

[quote name='Steve Buscemi' timestamp='1321913795' post='2848340']
When will you understand that there is no right or wrong here, just opinion, action, and reaction.
If you find someone in power that agrees with you, then stuff gets done. If not, then nothing happens.
[/quote]

Believe it or not, I understand it fully. More than you know I know.

Edited November 22, 2011 by suryanto tan

[Krath]

I was going to remain out of this thread. However. Who the heck are you people?

Level them NG

o/ NG

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='Lurunin' timestamp='1321917039' post='2848364']
DoE with a protectorate - http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=106368&st=0

DoW- http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=106517&st=0

usually if there is a rogue alliance they dont go through the trouble to draft up a treaty and then go rogue do they?

also it'd give them credibility not to be sanctioned as rogues
[/quote]

Err no, this has been done before.

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='suryanto tan' timestamp='1321938209' post='2848553']
No, we do not create Kaskus to declare on you.
Let's observe the timeline.

Sep. 12: Kaskus was founded.
Sep. 28: Non Grata declared war on UPN for attempting to negotiate the reparations.
Sep. 28: Kaskus said, "Ok, cool. Come on UPN and allies, you know what to do."
Sep. 29: UPN announced, "We are not calling in our allies. Our mistake, we deserved to be beaten."
Sep. 29: Kaskus said, "WTF?! What is wrong with you people. Fight back!"
Oct. 02: UPN surrendered after "taking the punishment".
Oct. 11: Kaskus announced her existence in OWF.
Oct. 11: Menotah announced Kaskus as her protectorate.
Oct. 16: Non Grata declared on SOS Brigade for the past grievances.
Oct. 16: Kaskus said, "Ok, cool. Now, let's see who going to help this poor alliance."
Oct. 16: Invicta and friends, "Wow, it is Non Grata. They are too big. We will not win. Let's sit this one out, as well."
Oct. 28: SOS Brigade surrendered.
Nov. 07: Kaskus declared war on Non Grata.
[/quote]

The problem you have is with the misconception that these wars were not justified. Both UPN and SOS were attacked by legitimate reasons, even our most vocal opponents have said as much. You declaring on us, is completely cooked up out of thin air. You are too dense to see this. You can keep on trying to twist your own words, but that doesn't gonna make it true suddenly.

Besides, this war won't prove anything in the long run. Yeah you are able to get beaten down and pester our lower range for a while. What does that prove? Literally nothing. I'm not even sure why I keep on responding to you since you crave for attention.

See you on the flip side.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321955744' post='2848891']
The problem you have is with the misconception that these wars were not justified. Both UPN and SOS were attacked by legitimate reasons, even our most vocal opponents have said as much. Y[b]ou declaring on us, is completely cooked up out of thin air. You are too dense to see this.[/b] You can keep on trying to twist your own words, but that doesn't gonna make it true suddenly.

Besides, this war won't prove anything in the long run. Yeah you are able to get beaten down and pester our lower range for a while. What does that prove? Literally nothing. I'm not even sure why I keep on responding to you since you crave for attention.

See you on the flip side.
[/quote]


This seems similar with a recent war..................We are in the era of declaring on people with out valid CB's, that doesn't make them rogues though, like you claim.

Edited November 22, 2011 by Hiro Nakara

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1321964989' post='2848934']
This seems similar with a recent war..................We are in the era of declaring on people with out valid CB's, that doesn't make them rogues though, like you claim.
[/quote]

Then Stukov's group aren't rogues either. It's either both or none. Make up your minds.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321965330' post='2848942']
Then Stukov's group aren't rogues either. It's either both or none. Make up your minds.
[/quote]


What part are you not getting? The part where these guys DoE well before hitting you or that fact that you just don't like it when someone hits you without a CB you deem valid?

[Commander shepard]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321955744' post='2848891']
What does that prove? Literally nothing.[/quote]


What does anything prove.

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1321965714' post='2848948']
What part are you not getting? The part where these guys DoE well before hitting you or that fact that you just don't like it when someone hits you without a CB you deem valid?
[/quote]

They DoE'd an entire month before WOH! Kaskus whole existence was based on being bored and declaring an alliance somewhat later. They counted on being able to draw NEW members to their ranks once they attacked. They looked for a target that would be somehow legit so they wouldn't be labeled as rogues by the rest of the OWF. Don't even think this is about the former 2 wars NG declared. This is about Kaskus being bored and nothing more.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321967584' post='2848969']
[b]They DoE'd an entire month before[/b] WOH! Kaskus whole existence was based on being bored and declaring an alliance somewhat later. They counted on being able to draw NEW members to their ranks once they attacked. [b]They looked for a target that would be somehow legit[/b] so they wouldn't be labeled as rogues by the rest of the OWF. Don't even think this is about the former 2 wars NG declared. This is about Kaskus being bored and nothing more.
[/quote]


No just No.......I'm amazed someone with your intelligence is even arguing about them being an alliance.

The bolded sums everything up regardless of how butt hurt you are about being attacked.

1. They don't need a CB to hit you, this was the precedence set at the DH/NPO war.

2. Whether they declared existence 1 week before hitting you doesn't deflect away from they are an alliance.

3. You're sanctioning an alliance's members in warfare, (I'm okay with that) but don't try to justify your actions by calling them rogues when that's clearly not the case.

[Grealind]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321955744' post='2848891']
The problem you have is with the misconception that these wars were not justified. Both UPN and SOS were attacked by legitimate reasons, even our most vocal opponents have said as much. You declaring on us, is completely cooked up out of thin air. You are too dense to see this. You can keep on trying to twist your own words, but that doesn't gonna make it true suddenly.

Besides, this war won't prove anything in the long run. Yeah you are able to get beaten down and pester our lower range for a while. What does that prove? Literally nothing. I'm not even sure why I keep on responding to you since you crave for attention.

See you on the flip side.
[/quote]

You believe in your heart of hearts, and your alliances actions backed you up, that NG's wars against UPN and SOS were justified, correct? I'm just going to pretend you said yes, so that I can get on with my post.

Okay, so then what makes you so gosh darned exceptional that you get to determine what are in other peoples' hearts, and what they believe are justified? Declaration of Existence = Alliance. Ta dah! It's really not that hard for just about everyone else involved to grasp this concept, so why aren't you able to?

[porksaber]

[quote name='Anson' timestamp='1322003500' post='2849313']
Okay, so then what makes you so gosh darned exceptional that you get to determine what are in other peoples' hearts, and what they believe are justified?
[/quote]

I'd like to take this opportunity to shed some light on precisely [i]what[/i] makes Arexes so gosh darned exceptional.

Does he love me I want to know
How can I tell if he loves me so
Is it in his eyes ?
Oh no ! You'll be deceived
Is it in his sighs ?
Oh no ! He'll make believe
If you want to know if he loves you so
It's in his kiss
That's where it is

Is it in his face ?
Oh no ! That's just his charms
In his warm embrace ?
Oh no ! That's just his arms
If you want to know if he loves you so
It's in his kiss
That's where it is
It's in his kiss
That's where it is

Kiss him and squeeze him tight
Find out what you want to know
If it's love, if it really is
It's there in his kiss

I hope this has clarified matters. Have your people talk to my people.

We'll do lunch.

[ShouAS]

Can we not just sanction everyone in every alliance and be done with it?

[mrwuss]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1321973245' post='2849004']
No just No.......I'm amazed someone with your intelligence is even arguing about them being an alliance.

The bolded sums everything up regardless of how butt hurt you are about being attacked.

1. They don't need a CB to hit you, this was the precedence set at the DH/NPO war.

2. Whether they declared existence 1 week before hitting you doesn't deflect away from they are an alliance.

3. You're sanctioning an alliance's members in warfare, (I'm okay with that) but don't try to justify your actions by calling them rogues when that's clearly not the case.
[/quote]

DH had a CB. Stop trying to be Schat 2.0.

[Lord Caparo]

[quote name='mrwuss' timestamp='1322023709' post='2849550']
DH had a CB. Stop trying to be Schat 2.0.
[/quote]


if DH had a CB then So Have We.

[Grealind]

[quote name='mrwuss' timestamp='1322023709' post='2849550']
DH had a CB. Stop trying to be Schat 2.0.
[/quote]

What was their CB? NPO was just too powerful? Isn't that kinda what's been said here?

[suryanto tan]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321955744' post='2848891']
The problem you have is with the misconception that these wars were not justified. Both UPN and SOS were attacked by legitimate reasons, even our most vocal opponents have said as much. You declaring on us, is completely cooked up out of thin air. You are too dense to see this. You can keep on trying to twist your own words, but that doesn't gonna make it true suddenly.
[/quote]

Oh God, I thought I had explained it to you clearly the other day on the other thread. I couldn't care less whether your reason is justified or not. If anything, I respect the way Non Grata stand up to her name and character. It is not you attacking alliances that I have problem with. It is the lack of response from those alliances and their allies that make me worry. Someone has to fight you.

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1321955744' post='2848891']
Besides, this war won't prove anything in the long run. Yeah you are able to get beaten down and pester our lower range for a while. What does that prove? Literally nothing. I'm not even sure why I keep on responding to you since you crave for attention.

See you on the flip side.
[/quote]

To me, it proves that it is alright to fight you. It proves that you are not really that scary, not really that strong, and not that good at war. As you grow bigger and bigger, more and more nations are joining your alliance to share the fame and power. As a whole you look competent, but many among these nations would not last in a real war.

Crave for attention? Nah, you cannot be serious. Understand that every post we made here has a clear purpose.

See you.

[mrwuss]

[quote name='Lord Caparo' timestamp='1322024630' post='2849557']
if DH had a CB then So Have We.
[/quote]

Never said you didn't to begin with.

[mrwuss]

[quote name='suryanto tan' timestamp='1322031052' post='2849603']
Oh God, I thought I had explained it to you clearly the other day on the other thread. I couldn't care less whether your reason is justified or not. If anything, I respect the way Non Grata stand up to her name and character. It is not you attacking alliances that I have problem with. It is the lack of response from those alliances and their allies that make me worry. Someone has to fight you.



To me, it proves that it is alright to fight you. It proves that you are not really that scary, not really that strong, and not that good at war. As you grow bigger and bigger, more and more nations are joining your alliance to share the fame and power. As a whole you look competent, but many among these nations would not last in a real war.

Crave for attention? Nah, you cannot be serious. Understand that every post we made here has a clear purpose.

See you.
[/quote]


In a real war it would not be NG standing alone. This isn't a war, this is just boredom covered in pretty colors.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='mrwuss' timestamp='1322023709' post='2849550']
DH had a CB. Stop trying to be Schat 2.0.
[/quote]

Is your memory so bad that you forget I had pleasure to your forums and the inane postings of GOONS regarding the situation? You can tell others that you had a valid CB but that !@#$ lie doesn't wash with someone that knows. If you deem a valid CB as WE wanted to attack NPO and tried to goad them into fighting prior to pre empting them with a !@#$%* made up reason as valid, then more power to you.



You ushered in the era of declaring without CB's and I'm not particularly bothered, but I do dislike a Liar. Same goes for this alliance, they don't need a CB to hit NG, but that doesn't make them a rogue alliance either like kriekfreak was trying to imply.

Edited November 23, 2011 by Hiro Nakara

[mrwuss]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1322049061' post='2849659']
Is your memory so bad that you forget I had pleasure to your forums and the inane postings of GOONS regarding the situation? You can tell others that you had a valid CB but that !@#$ lie doesn't wash with someone that knows. If you deem a valid CB as WE wanted to attack NPO and tried to goad them into fighting prior to pre empting them with a !@#$%* made up reason as valid, then more power to you.



You ushered in the era of declaring without CB's and I'm not particularly bothered, but I do dislike a Liar. Same goes for this alliance, they don't need a CB to hit NG, but that doesn't make them a rogue alliance either like kriekfreak was trying to imply.
[/quote]


You keep trying to earn the favor of your past enemy by spewing !@#$%^&* all you want, it doesn't make it true.

How much did your current AA pay to keep us from sending you into a ballhole of forgotten scrub?


You can be Schat 2.0 and Methrage 2.0 all at the same time.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='mrwuss' timestamp='1322065213' post='2849761']
You keep trying to earn the favor of your past enemy by spewing !@#$%^&* all you want, it doesn't make it true.

[b]How much did your current AA pay to keep us from sending you into a ballhole of forgotten scrub?[/b]


You can be Schat 2.0 and Methrage 2.0 all at the same time.
[/quote]


Hahahahahahahahahaha, you're honestly defending this line, You followed others like a sheeple in that war with no reason, this is fact, not spewing !@#$.

Not a penny, LoSS has paid absolutely ZERO, although if you fancy having a shot at me then please feel free to try mrwuss. I'd like a laugh.

Thanks and you can be a bumbling idiot and a lair at the same time.


Back on topic Kriekfreak do you consider this guy a rogue who joined you to fight this alliance for you?

[url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=395020"]Nation joined after conflict began[/url]

or this guy?

[url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=220194"]Nation joined after conflict began?[/url]

Edited November 23, 2011 by Hiro Nakara

[Trigger]

[quote name='suryanto tan' timestamp='1322031052' post='2849603']
To me, it proves that it is alright to fight you. It proves that you are not really that scary, not really that strong, and not that good at war. As you grow bigger and bigger, more and more nations are joining your alliance to share the fame and power. As a whole you look competent, but many among these nations would not last in a real war.
[/quote]

Oh, I think we have proven ourselves quite competent at war. As our previous individual alliances and now as NG. Sure, as with any large group there are going to be exceptions within...those that aren't as strong. But I think we have done nicely what was expected with the number difference. We have beaten you down to low NS range while basically no damage has been done to us. I suppose I could say that it proves you are not very good fighters either. However, I know what to expect next. Its the same comedy we heard from Methrage. I'm waiting with amusement to hear you thump your chest and brag how great you are as you soon begin fighting new nations with minimal wonders, no SDIs, and probably no MPs. Yes, you are truly a great fighting force yourself... one to be feared. Hope I don't lose too much sleep tonight.

[Sardonic]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1322049061' post='2849659']
Is your memory so bad that you forget I had pleasure to your forums and the inane postings of GOONS regarding the situation? You can tell others that you had a valid CB but that !@#$ lie doesn't wash with someone that knows. If you deem a valid CB as WE wanted to attack NPO and tried to goad them into fighting prior to pre empting them with a !@#$%* made up reason as valid, then more power to you.
[/quote]
You really were the worst goon.

Let me state, definitively, the reasons we struck NPO.

Reasons NPO was preempted:
Fan's reason: Vengeance
Umbrella's (roquentin's really): Concerned about NPO not being involved in the conflict, and coming out a powerful force because of it.
MK: Historical grievances, lack of NPO atonement for said grievances.
GOONS: War, money.


Anyway, no, couscous does not have a terribly valid CB here, they are just a band of mass rogues, DoE or not.

[Zoomzoomzoom]

The nations joining Non Grata aren't doing it for some goddamn war. They're doing it because they legitimately want to be members. They didn't even declare war the day they joined. It simply was not their reasoning.

At least when those of us in PC joined NEW to fight we did it because we disliked the decision to not honor the PC-NEW treaty. Where is that NEW-Kaskus treaty that is causing Jeff to jump over? Oh right, it doesn't exist.

Anyone joining Kaskus is joining simply because they want to take a glorified shot at NG and not because our wars have been fought for "superficial reasons."

We don't buy your reason for war and we stated the repercussions of what would happen if others joined.


EDIT: I've also seen two reasons for Kaskus attacking NG:

1. Superficial CBs against UPN and SOS
2. UPN's and SOS' allies not entering to give NG a fair fight.


Which one is it? D:

Edited November 23, 2011 by Zoomzoomzoom