Announcement from those Dark Templar people

[Fort Pitt]

The members who continued the raid were not ex-high gov, they were never high gov. I was the only ex-high gov for DT in the raid. I stopped because I happened to be on IRC when Weitze decided to tell us that the guy was actually protected.


As for the reps, we're paying far more than the damages that occurred after the stop order. So if you think we're paying our fair share, you're wrong.

Edited September 22, 2011 by Fort Pitt

[zzzptm]

[quote name='MCRABT' timestamp='1316681766' post='2805817']
You missed the crux of his argument, if they hadn't screwed up in the first place the raids would never have happened period. Regardless they did, and the situation was allowed to unfold. I have it on good authority that DT did contact their nations to stop raiding but the messages were not picked up, this is where DT screwed up. Given that they both $%&@ed up a rationale thinker like myself would simply have said look we both $%&@ed up you guys pay the detriment due and that brings closure to the issue. But that is not what FOK choose to do which just seems to be a little silly to an independent bystander like myself. This was two decent alliances making stupid mistakes and allowing the situation to escalate where it needn't.

Now that I have solved that issue for everyone roll on winter time.
[/quote]


[OOC]Ol' Blue Eyes don't tell you no lies... [/OOC]

Thank you for your observation, MCRABT. It is a delicious dish of perspective, served with a wonderful reason sauce with a red wine base. Rustic presentation, which fits perfectly with the nature of the dish. Now, if only others shared your discernment and tastes... ah, but that word "if" is such a thief of reality!

Yes, let us let things pass as we chop wood. I hear Old Man Winter may be colder than usual this year...

[Spaarlaamp]

[quote name='Fort Pitt' timestamp='1316693611' post='2805852']
The members who continued the raid were not ex-high gov, they were never high gov. I was the only ex-high gov for DT in the raid. I stopped because I happened to be on IRC when Weitze decided to tell us that the guy was actually protected.


[b]As for the reps, we're paying far more than the damages that occurred after the stop order.[/b] So if you think we're paying our fair share, you're wrong.
[/quote]

If that is so, why did you roll over and accept this? Also what's the number?

[Fort Pitt]

We have far more important things to deal with than your everyday school bully, because you tripped over the foot they extended for you to trip over.


As people have said, winter is gonna be a cold one, better prepare.

Edited September 22, 2011 by Fort Pitt

[mmansfield68]

[quote name='zzzptm' timestamp='1316651158' post='2805571']
The tl;dr for those just joining us...

DT: OK, FOK?

FOK: OK.
[i]
(pause)[/i]

FOK: Not OK.

DT: Not OK?

FOK: Not OK.

DT: Ffffff...

FOK: Stop, OK?

DT: OK.

FOK: STOP! OK?

DT: OK! Ffffff...

FOK: Say you're sorry, now.

DT: Sorry, FOK, OK?

FOK: OK.

DT: [i](This thread.)[/i]

Everyone Else: ZOMG DRAMA TIME!!!

... aaaand now you're all caught up.
[/quote]
zzzptm wins the thread.

Also, best of luck to all involved.

[magicninja]

[quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1316619194' post='2805307']
Given the damages, no, they didn't. But say what you will.
[/quote]

I meant this thread. The reps were on the high side of fair but still fair.

[WarriorConcept]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1316684557' post='2805829']
I think he didn't miss the crux of his argument, it was just a little bit weird to talk about something not happening if another thing would not have happened. I mean if I FOK wouldn't existed, neither would iFOK and we would never have started trouble on Purple and Invicta would still be there. In my eyes it's very simple. Yes FOK messed up with authorizing the raid and the attacks that happened until then were not taken into account. The fact remains that DT continued to raid willingly even after they were instructed to stop attacking. This willingness is the key argument here. Both members that continued the raid were a) active every day, b) were (ex) high gov members. So they did read their message (I'm sure they also were told to stop on their forum or irc to stop attacking), but yet continued to attack. And those nations that choose to ignore the request to seize attacks are now paying the reps. I think that is an absolutely fine arrangement.

Insulting either alliance and even threatening my allies was quite unnecessary and does not sit well with me. I have lost quite a bit of respect for several alliances over this event.
[/quote]

Curse you all for making me agree with kriekfreak but he does have the right idea.

[D34th]

[quote name='Fort Pitt' timestamp='1316694956' post='2805860']
We have far more important things to deal with than your everyday school bully, because you tripped over the foot they extended for you to trip over.


As people have said, winter is gonna be a cold one, better prepare.
[/quote]

The irony of an alliance who allows raid complaining about bully behavior is priceless.

[Dochartaigh]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316697227' post='2805873']
The irony of an alliance who allows raid complaining about bully behavior is priceless.
[/quote]

Heh. As much as I love Polaris, I know ya'll have proven you don't need to raid to be bullies, nor do you need to allow raids for complaints about being bullied to be ironic.

[D34th]

[quote name='Dochartaigh' timestamp='1316698341' post='2805881']
Heh. As much as I love Polaris, I know ya'll have proven you don't need to raid to be bullies, nor do you need to allow raids for complaints about being bullied to be ironic.
[/quote]

I'd love to hear about how Polaris bullied someone in the past 4 years. Please tell me a history... [img]http://i54.tinypic.com/35i4neq.gif[/img]

Also for your information, every single raid is nothing more than bully someone weaker than you and steal their [s]money for lunch[/s] tech/land while threaten to call your friends and [s]punch their face[/s] ZI'd them if they ever fight back.

[Spaarlaamp]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316698817' post='2805886']
Also for your information, every single raid is nothing more than bully someone weaker than you and steal their [s]money for lunch[/s] tech/land while threaten to call your friends and [s]punch their face[/s] ZI'd them if they ever fight back.
[/quote]

Yeah, that is exactly how every raid goes. [img]http://mta-pac.nl/forum/images/smilies/board/icon__facepalm.gif[/img]

[mmansfield68]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316698817' post='2805886']
I'd love to hear about how Polaris bullied someone in the past 4 years. Please tell me a history... [/quote]

You don't have to allow raiding to be a power-brokering bully. That's my most vivid recollection....

[img]http://socialmediafish.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/wallstreet.jpg[/img]

[D34th]

[quote name='mmansfield68' timestamp='1316699569' post='2805892']
You don't have to allow raiding to be a power-brokering bully. That's my most vivid recollection....

[img]http://socialmediafish.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/wallstreet.jpg[/img]
[/quote]

Sorry, but what this have to do with Polaris?

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1316673119' post='2805793']
Yeah they just got an apology too. Or did you mean something else Bob?
[/quote]

Maybe he means they have come off looking like idiots? You have to defend them but, do not tell me for a second that in private you were not wondering when FOK went completely stupid.

[WarriorConcept]

[quote name='The Big Bad' timestamp='1316699958' post='2805897']
Maybe he means they have come off looking like idiots? You have to defend them but, do not tell me for a second that in private you were not wondering when FOK went completely stupid.
[/quote]

The more drama the better.

[mmansfield68]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316699749' post='2805894']
Sorry, but what this have to do with Polaris?
[/quote]
Nothing, but you [i]did ask.[/i] During my tenure with Polaris we were fantastic power brokers, and did our fair share of bullying. It's what happens when you ascend to the #2 spot in the alliance rankings - power consumes you, and you want more.

We fell into that trap, and so has/does every alliance who ascends to the loftiest heights in CN. It's human nature.


Edit: CN

Edited September 22, 2011 by mmansfield68

[D34th]

[quote name='mmansfield68' timestamp='1316700343' post='2805901']
Nothing, but you [i]did ask.[/i] During my tenure with Polaris we were fantastic power brokers, and did our fair share of bullying. It's what happens when you ascend to the #2 spot in the alliance rankings - power consumes you, and you want more.

We fell into that trap, and so has/does every alliance who ascends to the loftiest heights in this game. It's human nature.
[/quote]

Please, re-read my reply to Dochartaigh and pay attention specially to the first line of it , thank you.

[ChairmanHal]

[quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1316667129' post='2805747']
BAM! We have a winner.

This entire 'issue' arose from the fact that after FOK sought to correct their mistake in authorizing the raid, the ones conducting the raid chose to ignore the messages they got to cease raiding. The reparations and apology are for the two days of attacks that ensued after DT messaged their nations to stop.[/quote]

OMG! Two *whole* days!!!

You didn't mean to do so, but you just undermined the justification for both the reparations amount and this thread. Wow.

[mmansfield68]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316700874' post='2805904']
Please, re-read my reply to Dochartaigh and pay attention specially to the first line of it , thank you.
[/quote]
I'm sure you'll agree that requesting a history (with a straight face) is more than a little over-the-top. This game is more than 4.5 years old. We were all there, we lived it, we know.

Shifting gears, I personally abhor tech raiding - have never done it - and never will. Sending your troops across foreign borders is an act of war, and should be reserved for war. That's just my personal position, but I don't look down on those who do. Both the prohibitive price and thirst for tech will always ensure that tech raiding is a part of CN.


Edit: CN

Edited September 22, 2011 by mmansfield68

[D34th]

[quote name='mmansfield68' timestamp='1316701748' post='2805910']
I'm sure you'll agree that requesting a history (with a straight face) is more than a little over-the-top. This game is more than 4.5 years old. We were all there, we lived it, we know.

Shifting gears, I personally abhor tech raiding - have never done it - and never will. Sending your troops across foreign borders is an act of war, and should be reserved for war. That's just my personal position, but I don't look down on those who do. Both the prohibitive price and thirst for tech will always ensure that tech raiding is a part of this game.
[/quote]

So summarizing what you said, as I expected, you don't have an example of Polaris acting like bullies in the past 4 years as you comrade Dochartaigh implied. Ok thanks.

[Beau Vine]

[quote name='mmansfield68' timestamp='1316700343' post='2805901']
During my tenure with Polaris we were fantastic power brokers, and did our fair share of bullying. It's what happens when you ascend to the #2 spot in the alliance rankings - power consumes you, and you want more.

We fell into that trap, and so has/does every alliance who ascends to the loftiest heights in this game. It's human nature.
[/quote]


Ah, yes. The ever power hungry MHA and GPA. When will the Menace fall, and stop oppressing the little folk.

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='ChairmanHal' timestamp='1316701293' post='2805906']
OMG! Two *whole* days!!!

You didn't mean to do so, but you just undermined the justification for both the reparations amount and this thread. Wow.
[/quote]

Maybe they thought DT loved getting bent over and paying reps? I mean, I thought we learned that last war.


Also, good on FOK for showing mercy, they didn't need to. Glad to see this concluded.

Edited September 22, 2011 by Il Impero Romano

[mmansfield68]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316702071' post='2805912']
So summarizing what you said, as I expected, you don't have an example of Polaris acting like bullies in the past 4 years as you comrade Dochartaigh implied. Ok thanks.
[/quote]
CIN
GUN
FIST
NADC

Ok, thanks.

[shahenshah]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1316684557' post='2805829']
I have lost quite a bit of respect for several alliances over this event.
[/quote]
Dude, what did you expect public apology to achieve? It tends to have the effect you talk about on all sides.

Edited September 22, 2011 by shahenshah

[Dochartaigh]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1316698817' post='2805886']
I'd love to hear about how Polaris bullied someone in the past 4 years. Please tell me a history... [img]http://i54.tinypic.com/35i4neq.gif[/img]

Also for your information, every single raid is nothing more than bully someone weaker than you and steal their [s]money for lunch[/s] tech/land while threaten to call your friends and [s]punch their face[/s] ZI'd them if they ever fight back.
[/quote]

On top of the list of alliances provided by mmansfield, I will include

the terms given to \m/ during the UjW, the beginning of the UjW (BoTS vs Gen[m]ay), FPI, BiPolar (if you want a more recent attempt), not to mention the many instances where Polaris allowed their allies to bully other alliances.