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An Announcement from TLR and NPO


Voodoo Nova
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[quote name='Wentworth' timestamp='1316542106' post='2804571']
Funny, the leaders of Pacifica that tried to control your posting and made threats to you I am certain are no longers the leaders.[/QUOTE]
Mary was an IO throughout that period of time. There were no visible objections that I saw.

[QUOTE]...hope that people change, some for better some for worse.[/quote]
Nothing has given me any reason to believe the NPO has changed for the better.

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[quote name='Blacky' timestamp='1316498128' post='2804361']
I am in TLR.
Who can see what's wrong with this treaty?

I have spent my entire CN political career opposing the NPO and everything they stood/stand for.
I guess I'm going to have to rethink my position in TLR.


So... Any offers for this old man looking for a new place to rest his head?
[/quote]

Join ODN, you'll fit right in :P

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[quote name='Blacky' timestamp='1316544023' post='2804583']
Mary was an IO throughout that period of time. There were no visible objections that I saw.


Nothing has given me any reason to believe the NPO has changed for the better.
[/quote]


And admittedly, you don't see everything our IO's do.

But anyway, have a good day.

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Blacky or anyone else, I am here, if you have concerns, talk to me.

Out of our gov, there is one remaining and that person is Emperor Mary. While I know many like to attribute the past to her, she has been one absolutely influential and vocal about us needing to do things "right" and this whole "at any cost" is not acceptable.

I am not telling you I can change your mind, I am telling you I am willing personally to talk about your issues with the NPO. Maybe there will be a resolution, maybe not, the offer stands.

All the hubub aside regardless of any intentions by any side, I do appreciate the convo Xiph. Everyone else, not everything is hate, good or evil. Some things just exist.

Quick note: VERY VERY VERY few IO disagreements are ever seen beyond our highest private channels.

Edited by Brehon
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[quote name='wickedj' timestamp='1316549616' post='2804626']
NPO said something mean about me in 2007 therefore i still hate them
[/quote]

I regret nothing!

Edited by Mary the Fantabulous
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[quote name='Wentworth' timestamp='1316545214' post='2804595']
And admittedly, you don't see everything our IO's do.
[/quote]
That makes two of us then.
Unless I'm wrong about you being rank-and-file

[quote=Brehon]Out of our gov, there is one remaining and that person is Emperor Mary. While I know many like to attribute the past to her, she has been one absolutely influential and vocal about us needing to do things "right" and this whole "at any cost" is not acceptable.[/quote]
Should I take your word for it or use her record as a judge of character?

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@Blacky: You know how much I like and respect you, man, and have for years. But in this instance I have to say that you're being unreasonable. You're far from the only one who's had a long term beef with Pacifica- in fact, my own record with them is just as long and colored, possibly even more than yours. You have absolutely no more reason to hate them than I and well over a dozen others in TLR do. At first I reacted exactly as you have- but then I started talking to NPO members from multiple levels. After all, I hadn't had contact with NPO in years. What grounds did I really have to judge the alliance as it stands today? It soon became clear that NPO's not what it once was. I fully support this treaty and think they ought to get a shot, moreover there're people there I really like once I got to know them. I've seen them then and I've seen them now, and the differences are readily apparent to anyone who'll simply go talk to them. If you're not seeing them, it's likely because you're not looking. You can't see with your eyes closed, my friend.

At this point Karma was a long time ago, and I can pretty well guess you haven't spoken with NPO since. How, then, do you have any measure by which to guage who they are? Actually attempting to communicate a little will go a lot further than an armful of assumptions, my friend. Others who've voiced the same objections (including myself, as I noted) did so and got a surprise in regard to the quality of the alliance and the people there.

As for our forums...the first messages about this went out well over a month ago, man. Correcting issues regarding getting on the forum is the work of a few days at most. It's not an excuse.

-Drac

Edited by Dracule Mihawk
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[quote name='Blacky' timestamp='1316549866' post='2804628']
That makes two of us then.
Unless I'm wrong about you being rank-and-file


Should I take your word for it or use her record as a judge of character?
[/quote]

As much as he is a rank and file member, I am not. I am telling you IO disagreement RARELY are known by anyone outside the IO's themselves.

You should not take my word for it, I am willing to talk about anything you want to talk about. Certainly hold her past against her, but then talk about it as well. What one can do as an IO changes as Regent and certainly changes upon being the Emperor. In fact as Emperor they are finally able to do what they feel is right vs following their orders. Am I saying Mary simply followed her Orders, in part yes, all IO's do. But now if there is something she doesn't agree with, she can simply so no.

This is easy for me to see and know because yes, I am a Pacifican. But I also know this Emperor and have worked with her. I know what she doesn't agree with and I know she is the core behind what is not acceptable in the NPO. Top of that list is how we handle ourselves and our allies.

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[quote name='Londo Mollari' timestamp='1316541607' post='2804563']
It would be the height of naievete to assume that TLR's government and membership have not been heavily influenced by my values and thinking, and even that I do not still communicate with my friends as often as I take time to muster a little activity. It would be foolish to assume that I would abandon my children. They have left the nest, or perhaps the nest has left them, but they have done well and I am proud of them.


[/quote]


I look forward to when we finally print our "What Would Londo Do" bracelets.

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[quote name='Dracule Mihawk' timestamp='1316551723' post='2804649']
*snip*
[/quote]
ODN reworked their image but they put in work. I don't think the NPO has either changed their attitude or their image. Unlike you (by your own admission), I have grounds to base my opinions of the NPO ranging from this thread, to a few days and weeks ago. All inclusive, I have no reason to believe they've changed for the better, however I hold no ill-will towards you believing they have. Also, the idea that I haven't spoken to NPO since the Karma war is untrue.

Edited by Blacky
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[quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1316553563' post='2804665']
In fact as Emperor they are finally able to do what they feel is right vs following their orders. Am I saying Mary simply followed her Orders, in part yes, all IO's do. But now if there is something she doesn't agree with, she can simply so no.[/quote]

Right here is an argument that Mary does not have the character to stand up for what she feels is right. Is the NPO allowed to publicly denounce their leadership like this? I guess you really have changed!

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This conversation is really funny. Am I the only one who was apart of C&G that still doesn't like NPO? I mean, no offense Pacifica, but where's the fun in changing a rivalry that works? It just works better this way for the both of us I think.

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[quote name='Stumpy Jung Il' timestamp='1316555158' post='2804688']
This conversation is really funny. Am I the only one who was apart of C&G that still doesn't like NPO? I mean, no offense Pacifica, but where's the fun in changing a rivalry that works? It just works better this way for the both of us I think.
[/quote]
See: Blacky's postings for the last few pages.

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[quote name='Vol Navy' timestamp='1316556102' post='2804709']
I find it hilarious that some people still hate NPO this much from CnG. My God you've done far worse to them the past two and a half years than you ever experienced at their hands.
[/quote]

Well I don't like to get involved in things like this since I am not involved, but this needs mentioning. Two Wars have been fought against NPO. Karma, and this most recent one where they got curb stomped. That hardly equates to multiple wars of abuse, and the alliances that were forced off of bob.

Edited by BloodFury
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[quote name='Stumpy Jung Il' timestamp='1316555158' post='2804688']
This conversation is really funny. Am I the only one who was apart of C&G that still doesn't like NPO? I mean, no offense Pacifica, but where's the fun in changing a rivalry that works? It just works better this way for the both of us I think.
[/quote]
You aren't alone. All that has changed is the willingness of the NPO to be used, and the willingness of others to use the NPO. In a years time or so the NPO will be back to its previous pariah status and everyone will suddenly remember their myriad of past crimes. I guess that makes you a forward thinker!

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[quote name='Vol Navy' timestamp='1316556102' post='2804709']
I find it hilarious that some people still hate NPO this much from CnG. My God you've done far worse to them the past two and a half years than you ever experienced at their hands.
[/quote]
Your alliance protects United Equestria. You've subjected the world to far worse than anything NPO or its enemies have ever done to each other.

So I guess you really know what you're talking about. Carry on.

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[quote name='RandomInterrupt' timestamp='1316556747' post='2804721']
You aren't alone. All that has changed is the willingness of the NPO to be used, and the willingness of others to use the NPO. In a years time or so the NPO will be back to its previous pariah status and everyone will suddenly remember their myriad of past crimes. I guess that makes you a forward thinker!
[/quote]
At this point, past crimes aside, I don't understand it because the last thing this world needs is to lose another one of its strongest, and last, real rivalries.

Edited by Stumpy Jung Il
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[quote name='RandomInterrupt' timestamp='1316556747' post='2804721']
You aren't alone. All that has changed is the willingness of the NPO to be used, and the willingness of others to use the NPO. In a years time or so the NPO will be back to its previous pariah status and everyone will suddenly remember their myriad of past crimes. I guess that makes you a forward thinker!
[/quote]
Yessss... I can feel your anger. It makes you strong.

EDIT: You should channel your anger into accepting that tech deal offer from me.

Edited by Ardus
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[quote name='Blacky' timestamp='1316549866' post='2804628']
That makes two of us then.
Unless I'm wrong about you being rank-and-file


Should I take your word for it or use her record as a judge of character?
[/quote]

You are correct as Brehon stated, I am a rank and file member. Brehon is also right in saying no one really sees IO disagreements outside of the IO's. Personally I wouldn't have it any other way. I do take solace in knowing that every voice of every Pacifican is heard. That may be different from the NPO that you recall, but your version of NPO is not the one I am a member of.


[quote name='Blacky' timestamp='1316554678' post='2804681']
ODN reworked their image but they put in work. I don't think the NPO has either changed their attitude or their image. Unlike you (by your own admission), I have grounds to base my opinions of the NPO ranging from this thread, to a few days and weeks ago. All inclusive, I have no reason to believe they've changed for the better, however I hold no ill-will towards you believing they have. Also, the idea that I haven't spoken to NPO since the Karma war is untrue.
[/quote]

My apologies if I came off as attacking you personally, that was not my intention whatsoever. You are entitled to your opinion as much as I am mine and I respect that, allies or not. I would urge you to take Brehon up on his offer, and to come visit our embassy we share. Look, when I saw Jgoods and such posting good things about us I almost did a double take. When I left Bob that wasn't how it was. However I saw after searching that their words were genuine and let the hate turn to indifference. The more I looked, the more I saw; indifference turned to like soon after.

I have laid to rest any past bull !@#$. The future is what we make it.

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[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1316556857' post='2804724']
Yessss... I can feel your anger. It makes you strong.

EDIT: You should channel your anger into accepting that tech deal offer from me.
[/quote]
Why would I be angry? I don't even understand you people.

Also I don't know what the deal with that aid is, but I accepted before I read the note so I'll be sending it back in 10 days.

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