Azaghul Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Methrage' timestamp='1315679144' post='2798190'] I didn't trick them into anything, I haven't even done tech deals with them during this war. One of their members continued doing their tech deals with Nicholai, because they didn't realize Non Grata were going after anyone who did tech deals with him as well. I had nothing to do with organizing that tech deal though. [/quote] You could have gotten your "friend" not to accept it because it's in bad form to get someone in trouble like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Azaghul' timestamp='1315679379' post='2798194'] You could have gotten your "friend" not to accept it because it's in bad form to get someone in trouble like that. [/quote] I'm not going to tell him to stop tech dealing or not accept aid if someone sends it, I don't see Non Grata stopping all business transactions because they are at war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nippy Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Methrage' timestamp='1315678013' post='2798178'] Me and Sigrun finished our last tech deal before the war with Non Grata started and we never started another one because of the war. The tech deal with Nicholai is with him, not me. [/quote] I've been tracking your tech deal partners long before the Non Grata thing started. You've been dealing tech to Siggy for a very long time now....the tech is often not paid out by the same nation receiving payment for the tech. Do try to keep up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickedj Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 As arexes said it boils down to what is war aid. Well lets look into the history books and see EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU IN THIS THREAD HAS SENT WAR AID TO THE DAMN ENEMEY AT ONE TIME OR ANOTHER Dont want it happening? learn how to use a sanction cus every alliance posting here has had someone aid someone whos at war and im tired of seeing all this crap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emphix Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 an "oversight" is still a mistake, you admitted it. Things could be kept simple. But whatever, just enjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='nippy' timestamp='1315679699' post='2798197'] I've been tracking your tech deal partners long before the Non Grata thing started. You've been dealing tech to Siggy for a very long time now....the tech is often not paid out by the same nation receiving payment for the tech. Do try to keep up. [/quote] Last tech deal I did with Sigrun was $4.5m paid to me, then 100 tech paid to her single slot deal. Although it ended before this war started. If they're doing tech deals with both of us, they don't neccecarily move at the same speed and start at the same time. So obviously we won't both be recieving money and sending tech at the same time always. Nice to know I have a stalker, but your observations mean nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azaghul Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Methrage' timestamp='1315679494' post='2798195'] I'm not going to tell him to stop tech dealing or not accept aid if someone sends it, I don't see Non Grata stopping all business transactions because they are at war. [/quote] That's because you don't have any respect or sympathy for your tech deal partners. If you did you wouldn't deliberately be dragging them into this. Edited September 10, 2011 by Azaghul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashoka the Great Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 This is a tangled mess (for me, anyway) that needs to be explained before I comment. As per usual, understand that despite whatever positions I have held within Nordreich, this opinion is mine and mine alone and may or may not represent those of other individuals within the alliance. Whew....OK, where was I? Oh yeah....the tangle.... Sigrun is a former member of Nordreich and she is someone who is worthy of respect. She certainly has mine. Olympus, CA's protector, is closely tied to Valhalla which is, of course, an ally of ours. (I happen to like Olympus on their own, btw, regardless of their ties.) Non Grata is a treaty partner of Nordreich's as well. Holding all of the principals in high esteem, it's difficult to comment for fear of offending one or more. Here goes, though.... First, I understand Sigrun's contention that tech deals are not aid, and I'm reasonably certain that she knows this is a minority position within the Cyberverse. Second, while I have supported punitive reparations in the distant past, I stopped doing so a long time ago. The alliance I belong to has stated many times that it will never pay nor seek reparations. Reparations are a pain, frankly. I would rather to do tech deals with a vanquished opponent as a means to helping them recover, rather than bleeding them dry for a reason that amounts to, "Because I can." There's no honor in that. So it is my hope that the two sides will quickly agree to end this silliness and part ways on the understanding the Non Grata was and shall continue to be justified in asserting that any aid to Methrage or his alliance constitutes aiding their enemy, and that they are justified in seeking to put an end to such aid. Aid stops. The parties shake hands and walk away. That's it. Do I expect that this will actually happen? Sadly, no. So many of the parties involved are too damn stubborn for their own good. T'would be nice to be pleasantly surprised, but I won't be holding my breath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Azaghul' timestamp='1315680013' post='2798204'] That's because you don't have any respect or sympathy for your tech deal partners. If you did you wouldn't deliberately be dragging them into this. [/quote] I thought you were smarter than this, but you're way off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AphexTwin Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 More and more stupidity. I only wish someone was in range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omniscient1 Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1315675417' post='2798141'] I think this all boils down to what one considers war aid. I think we have the majority of the community on our side. Not saying you are in the wrong per se but neither are we. I find it brave of you that you stand by your principles, and like I have said to you in our discussions, we stand by our own. [/quote] Nah, you just have the majority of nukes on your side. Not saying I necessarily disagree with your stance, but don't confuse military power for popular support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Frontier Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 History's greatest villain itt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heft Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Schad' timestamp='1315678985' post='2798186'] More than tripled in the span of a few hours, in fact. [/quote] And people are somehow surprised they didn't pay? Weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pd73bassman Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 I don't see what you are trying to accomplish here, you sent aid to a nation that is at war with NG. I don't care that you claim it is for a tech deal or not, the profit from the tech deal alone allows that nation to fund more military to use against NG so it doesn't matter what the aid was sent for. Also as it has been made clear here, NG told [b]everyone[/b] exactly what would happen if they were aided so you get what you ask for here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred von Tirpitz Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 Damnit. Methrage, now you have gone and gotten people i respect into your sodding mess. Grow up. I hope for a speedy and calm resolution to this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brenann Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 Why ANYONE would get involved with something regarding Methrage... not to mention while he is at WAR is beyond me. Poor judgement on behalf of the "tech dealers". How hard is it to check a war screen before pushing the send aid button? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewie Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Heft' timestamp='1315682599' post='2798237'] And people are somehow surprised they didn't pay? Weird. [/quote] The reason the aid level increased was because an additional WolfPack nation aided Methrage. Which would extend the level of war he was able to fight with at the low NS he currently resides at. Sigrun, I completely respect your principles and your decision to stand by them, I hope that we can work towards a mutually beneficial solution to end this conflict as I believe that this is not the best use for our collective resources, but know this, Non Grata will stand by it's current mandate with regards of different forms of aid, even tech deals, constituting war aid towards rogues currently attacking some of our lower tier members. I don't think that either one of our alliances really wants this war, and as other alliances have said, after 1 round of war I believe we will have gotten our "pound of flesh" as it were (hell, I'm getting 25k casualties off each failed GA ) and we will be able to walk away and prepare for future conflicts with alternative forces without significant damage being done to either alliance. I believe that this is a fair option to pursue. Edited September 10, 2011 by Stewie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriekfreak Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Heft' timestamp='1315682599' post='2798237'] And people are somehow surprised they didn't pay? Weird. [/quote] This isn't true. We asked 9mil which is 3x aided amount, after that (not minutes mind you) the demand lay at 5x aided amount per aid (15 mil). I'm not really sure why Schad would state such a thing since he was in those talks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schad Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1315685007' post='2798254'] This isn't true. We asked 9mil which is 3x aided amount, after that (not minutes mind you) the demand lay at 5x aided amount per aid (15 mil). I'm not really sure why Schad would state such a thing since he was in those talks. [/quote] The demand was $30m initially, actually. $15m was the offered compromise position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewie Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 $30m was for both members - $15m per member who aided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schad Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Stewie' timestamp='1315685941' post='2798258'] $30m was for both members - $15m per member who aided. [/quote] There weren't two members involved in that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nippy Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='Methrage' timestamp='1315680007' post='2798203'] Last tech deal I did with Sigrun was $4.5m paid to me, then 100 tech paid to her single slot deal. Although it ended before this war started. If they're doing tech deals with both of us, they don't neccecarily move at the same speed and start at the same time. So obviously we won't both be recieving money and sending tech at the same time always. Nice to know I have a stalker, but your observations mean nothing. [/quote] Right, right....good explanation as to why your tag-along nation is coordinating along with yours for the same tech deal, regardless of having no benefit from it. As to your cute little 'stalker' comment, it would be stupid to lose sight and forget about you. You're a loose cannon with a penchant for attacking people on a whim for the sake of attention. Everytime the Methrage attention meter reaches 0, you find some other way to defy convention, piss off an entire alliance, sound up the moralist orchestra, brag while doing damage, beg for money when you're finally shut down, then brag some more about some damage after you convince some oblivious idiots and some less oblivious ones to fund your ridiculousness. Your have far more detractors now than you ever have in the past, yet still consider brushing off their statements with a simple "your opinion isn't relevant" comment as the epitome of wit. You, sir, are a festering blemish. Yes, this community thrives on drama. We can do without yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan King Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 [quote name='sir pwnage' timestamp='1315674771' post='2798134'] Tech dealing with a nation that is at war is an act of war against the people that they are fighting[b][color="#FF0000"]*[/color][/b]. The fact that people don't USUALLY act on that is irrelevant. By tech dealing with Nicholai, you were aiding him in his war against NG. Reparations would not be an unjust expectation in this scenario. I don't know what they were asking for, but I think anything under 15mil would be reasonable. An apology is also, I think, well within the acceptable range as well. Enjoy being in a coalition with Methrage, I'm sure you'll realize why his crusades are always one-man very shortly [/quote] [b][color="#FF0000"]*[/color][/b]Unless they're aiding your side. Then the other side needs to be forced to pay reps and/or apologize before they're finally granted peace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Buscemi Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 Well that last batch of aid you sent to Methy was titled "War Aid" so can we cut the crap about it being "tech deals". Clearly that wasn't the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TypoNinja Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 No one is going to stand up and seriously claim tech dealing with a nation at war doesn't count as war aid. Because if they do the next time they are at war they'll find that their enemies all suddenly have [i]lots and lots [/i] of tech deals. I bet 3/50's become suddenly very popular. You really have to pay attention to the propaganda you attempt. When its that silly its just a waste of time. At least do us the courtesy of coming up with something that isn't completely ridiculous. [quote name='Steve Buscemi' timestamp='1315686694' post='2798266'] Well that last batch of aid you sent to Methy was titled "War Aid" so can we cut the crap about it being "tech deals". Clearly that wasn't the case. [/quote] And if that's the case, you really be up !@#$ creek now. Pleading member ignorance is one thing, we've all got plenty of members not active enough to know better, but actually calling it 'war aid' just sunk ya. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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