Schattenmann Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Let's go ahead and get this out of the way using mode as predictor and save time in the future, but beware, spoiler: [spoiler] [img]http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100123025319/cybernations/images/thumb/0/09/Flag_of_FOK.svg/360px-Flag_of_FOK.svg.png[/img] FOK demands 30,000 tech in tribute from TSI [/spoiler] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorponok Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 FOK sure does love war Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crimson King Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='Antoine Roquentin' timestamp='1300999236' post='2674988'] I meant it more to be "DH and NPO aren't going to be friends." I didn't say otherwise. NPO hasn't tried to negotiate and it'd be a lie to say there was no bad blood before this. Not like we're totally unaccomodating. Also, ChairmanHal, man that is really paranoid considering very little in terms of reps will be taken overall and the only tech terms except for one alliance will be tech deals. In TCK's figure, he includes the Legion reps which were obviously going to go down from the initial figure which was meant to highlight their total evasion of the war. 108,000 when it's tech deals and only 18k of it is direct tech isn't as a big deal of a deal as you make it seem. In addition, not 7 chains, 2 chains. NpO-Legion-NPO NpO-STA-TPF. [/quote] Actually no, We asked for updated figures in regards to cash terms after Legion exited PM...the figure given for them was still 2 billion. 108k in tech dales with slot restrictions that guarantee that just about every slot in the aa's lower tier is tied up for 2 moths straight with outgoing tech to MK is a big deal, regardless of you trying to paint it otherwise. All of this belies the simple point that neither TSI nor NADC should be required to pay anything as both are not even direct allies of the central party still at war here. As far as the chains go, that only works if either of those treaties activated...they did not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolster Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='supercoolyellow' timestamp='1300999114' post='2674985'] Why? Is it for the big bad NPO keeping their upper tier in peace mode, or is it for not getting into the original war fast enough for you? Also Fok, this is disappointing to see, you're just band wagoning to get some one to abandon their friends, a friend who was attacked by a party that is purely just out for blood. [/quote] That's why you need lion-reppelent. Buy it now or face the fury of FOK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickenzilla Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Thanks FOK! You guys are my bread and butter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='The Crimson King' timestamp='1300999852' post='2675001'] Actually no, We asked for updated figures in regards to cash terms after Legion exited PM...the figure given for them was still 2 billion. 108k in tech dales with slot restrictions that guarantee that just about every slot in the aa's lower tier is tied up for 2 moths straight with outgoing tech to MK is a big deal, regardless of you trying to paint it otherwise. All of this belies the simple point that neither TSI nor NADC should be required to pay anything as both are not even direct allies of the central party still at war here. As far as the chains go, that only works if either of those treaties activated...they did not. [/quote] Keep asking then. Have they tried negotiating it down at all? I mean, TOOL and TSI knew what they were getting into by chaining in. I don't see it as bad. White peace was an option earlier on, but they chose instead to continue to fight us. Then why bring up the 7+ thing at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajdav Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='Timberland' timestamp='1300998805' post='2674979'] NADC gov came to me directly to discuss surrender terms, so we went ahead and set up a meeting, they were going to receive white peace from ALL of us. TOP/MK/UMBRELLA. At the end of the meeting NADC gov declined our terms. We told them we'd give them a 3 day extension to reconsider our offer and they declined again. [/quote]Right, it's ok to call an ally in to help you take on a much smaller opponent, but horrible etiquette to deny terms in order to continue defending one against a much larger alliance. Unless you were referring to us waffling? In which case, my point is proven. I was actually the one that organized the meeting, and from the second I started organizing it, we had decided to reject the terms. You assumed since we wanted to talk about your peace offer, we would be accepting it. Poor assumption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Sad to see FOK backing up this war of unwarranted aggression, but that's what happen with you have such allies and they ask for treaty activation, so I guess that FOK didn't had many options, politically speaking, since I don't think they were obligated to join this war via oA clauses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neneko Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='Kajdav' timestamp='1301000471' post='2675014'] Unless you were referring to us waffling? In which case, my point is proven. I was actually the one that organized the meeting, and from the second I started organizing it, we had decided to reject the terms. You assumed since we wanted to talk about your peace offer, we would be accepting it. Poor assumption. [/quote] Diplomacy mastery achieved! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardus Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='AndrewHG' timestamp='1300997417' post='2674933'] I'd say the MK nation at war with me with 44 aid cycles was grasping at straws. But hey. http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=396465 [/quote] I'd say I'm handling the four of you quite well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tromp Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) Oh boy. Here we go again! [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1300999433' post='2674992'] This is [i]definitely[/i] going to speed up peace talks. [/quote] I sure would hope the message we're sending here is clear. [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1300999836' post='2674998'] Let's go ahead and get this out of the way using mode as predictor and save time in the future, but beware, spoiler: [spoiler] [img]http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100123025319/cybernations/images/thumb/0/09/Flag_of_FOK.svg/360px-Flag_of_FOK.svg.png[/img] FOK demands 30,000 tech in tribute from TSI [/spoiler] [/quote] Don't worry Schatt. If we would've wanted to do such a thing I'm sure CoJ would have been our victim. Edited March 24, 2011 by Tromp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge X Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) LOLOLOLOLOLOL! Doomhouse is beating us Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo BAD! that is why they are activating another treaty! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!! I don't care what any of you have said for the last 152 pages. Anybody that is winning so hardcore don't ask for help. LOL! Too funny! It's peanut Butter Jelly Time!! [img]http://www.webpulp.org/Dancing_Banana.gif[/img] Banana Rama BayBee I love my sNOOG enemies... Edited March 25, 2011 by Judge X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardus Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='The Crimson King' timestamp='1300999852' post='2675001'] Actually no, We asked for updated figures in regards to cash terms after Legion exited PM...the figure given for them was still 2 billion. 108k in tech dales with slot restrictions that guarantee that just about every slot in the aa's lower tier is tied up for 2 moths straight with outgoing tech to MK is a big deal, regardless of you trying to paint it otherwise. All of this belies the simple point that neither TSI nor NADC should be required to pay anything as both are not even direct allies of the central party still at war here. As far as the chains go, that only works if either of those treaties activated...they did not. [/quote] NADC wasn't expected to pay anything. When they asked for terms we replied they need only surrender and not return to the war. When they refused those terms they were notified the simple surrender would be taken off the table in a few days in order to discourage holding out. They refused after a few days. Those terms are now off the table and something stiffer, but still beneficial to NADC, has taken its place. It is nowhere near the 108k tech you suggest. All of our reparation and tech-deal demands [i]combined[/i] don't add up to that. You should find new sources. Your current ones are inadequate and inaccurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neneko Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='Judge X' timestamp='1301001613' post='2675026'] LOLOLOLOLOLOL! Doomhouse is beating us Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo BAD! that is why they are activating another treaty! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!! I don't care what any of you have said for the last 152 pages. Anybody that is winning so hardcore don't ask for help. LOL! Too funny! B!tc3$ ain't $#!t but H30$ and Tricks... It's peanut Butter Jelly Time!! [img]http://www.webpulp.org/Dancing_Banana.gif[/img] Banana Rama BayBee I love my sNOOG enemies... [/quote] This thread is only 5 pages long. I'm fairly sure because I can count that on one hand so it's not too hard for me. Yeah we were lying about the winning stuff. We needed it to motivate our troops. We're surrendering any day now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardonic Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) [quote name='The Crimson King' timestamp='1300999852' post='2675001'] Actually no, We asked for updated figures in regards to cash terms after Legion exited PM...the figure given for them was still 2 billion. 108k in tech dales with slot restrictions that guarantee that just about every slot in the aa's lower tier is tied up for 2 moths straight with outgoing tech to MK is a big deal, regardless of you trying to paint it otherwise. All of this belies the simple point that neither TSI nor NADC should be required to pay anything as both are not even direct allies of the central party still at war here. As far as the chains go, that only works if either of those treaties activated...they did not. [/quote] If legion wants their number lowered perhaps they should actually talk to me, as of yet, the only person even remotely of legion I have talked to in IRC in months is a Mr. Pappajacky or whatever. [quote name='Judge X' timestamp='1301001613' post='2675026'] LOLOLOLOLOLOL! Doomhouse is beating us Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo BAD! that is why they are activating another treaty! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!! I don't care what any of you have said for the last 152 pages. Anybody that is winning so hardcore don't ask for help. LOL! Too funny! B!tc3$ ain't $#!t but H30$ and Tricks... It's peanut Butter Jelly Time!! [img]http://www.webpulp.org/Dancing_Banana.gif[/img] Banana Rama BayBee I love my sNOOG enemies... [/quote] You should be ashamed of yourself. Edited March 24, 2011 by Sardonic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 This war sets a new precedent: you are punished for not abandon your allies and "white" peace has a validity time, after that reparations are ok even if the alliance in question is just defending an ally in a defensive war. [i]And I think to myself, what a wonderful world...[/i] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge X Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1301001871' post='2675032'] You should be ashamed of yourself. [/quote] I am ashamed of myself. I have to fight baseless, honorless thugs and get my hands dirty daily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timberland Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='Kajdav' timestamp='1301000471' post='2675014'] Right, it's ok to call an ally in to help you take on a much smaller opponent, but horrible etiquette to deny terms in order to continue defending one against a much larger alliance. Unless you were referring to us waffling? In which case, my point is proven. I was actually the one that organized the meeting, and from the second I started organizing it, we had decided to reject the terms. You assumed since we wanted to talk about your peace offer, we would be accepting it. Poor assumption. [/quote] Heres for the poor assumption ? [quote][09:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> Anywho, I was curious as to whether TOP's latest offer had expired [09:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> [b]I believe we'd be interested[/b] 01[09:03] <Timberland[TOP]> about white peace, i can ask Jenko [10:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> You have been some very fine opponents [10:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> We've thoroughly enjoyed our wars with you all 01[10:03] <Timberland[TOP]> aww ty 01[10:03] <Timberland[TOP]> like wise [10:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> Yes [10:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> I'm sorry its taken us so many days to respond 01[10:03] <Timberland[TOP]> let me see if Jenko responds, its 4am for him right now 01[10:03] <Timberland[TOP]> [10:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> Many of our gov have been slamed by a wave of school work before spring break and exams [10:03] <Kochers[NADC|Gov]> Haha sure 01[10:03] <Timberland[TOP]> yeah i understand[/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neneko Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1301002214' post='2675044'] This war sets a new precedent: you are punished for not abandon your allies and "white" peace has a validity time, after that reparations are ok even if the alliance in question is just defending an ally in a defensive war. [i]And I think to myself, what a wonderful world...[/i] [/quote] Did you just redefine the word new or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyriq Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) More pressure on the middle and lower tiers to force NPO into coming out to play. Makes sense. Too bad there is talk of reparations for the other parties involved, though I could see it as an either/or lever; you pay reps or you get NPO to play in the top tiers. Really two lines of thought permeating both narratives that I don't quite get: 'NPO deserves to be protected', coming from the invicto-sphere; 'alliances not named NPO in the invicto-sphere deserve reps', coming from DoomHouse. Yes, NPO is a threat that needs to be neutralized, I get that, but punishing their allies further by leveling reps? Really, the whole situation is close to becoming quite untenable. Edited March 24, 2011 by eyriq Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='eyriq' timestamp='1301002547' post='2675055'] Yes, NPO is a threat that needs to be neutralized, I get that, but punishing their allies further by leveling reps? Really, the whole situation is close to becoming quite untenable. [/quote] And then what are you going to do about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Except the reps are mostly tech deals and cash and are pretty light in general except taking up TSI's aid slots or NADC's. If we were demanding tech from NPO instead of getting the top tiers, like in Karma, that makes sense but we're not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardus Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1301002214' post='2675044'] This war sets a new precedent: you are punished for not abandon your allies and "white" peace has a validity time, after that reparations are ok even if the alliance in question is just defending an ally in a defensive war. [i]And I think to myself, what a wonderful world...[/i] [/quote] My objective is to reduce and conclude this war as quickly as possible. Such is in the interest of all, though foes refuse to recognize it. We will structure incentives and forces toward this end. To not do so would be the greatest evil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crimson King Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Antoine Roquentin' timestamp='1301000370' post='2675010'] Keep asking then. Have they tried negotiating it down at all? I mean, TOOL and TSI knew what they were getting into by chaining in. I don't see it as bad. White peace was an option earlier on, but they chose instead to continue to fight us. Then why bring up the 7+ thing at all? [/quote] Keep asking what exactly? You said that GOONS has lowered their terms for Legion since they released top end. I simply stated that is not the case since we requested updated figures post release and they numbers given were the same. The only point I was making was that if goons chose to lower the reps figure to Legion since that time the top end release was not the impetus for such a move. As far as not seeing the reps as bad, naturally you don't. I think it is a foregone conclusion that those individuals asking for reps do not see them in a negative light. Furthermore White peace was not on the table for some of the alliances being asked tech reps at any point. As you said, some of them never tried to broker terms prior to being offered what they were. The 7+ thing was simply to make a generic point that these alliances are not even remotely close to the center of a conflict in which the centralized alliance is already at peace with no cash or tech reps demanded of them. It was not supposed to be a triple checked hard fact stat but rather a means to make an overall point. I am glad we could ignore the point made and instead argue the semantics. [quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1301001684' post='2675027'] NADC wasn't expected to pay anything. When they asked for terms we replied they need only surrender and not return to the war. When they refused those terms they were notified the simple surrender would be taken off the table in a few days in order to discourage holding out. They refused after a few days. Those terms are now off the table and something stiffer, but still beneficial to NADC, has taken its place. It is nowhere near the 108k tech you suggest. All of our reparation and tech-deal demands [i]combined[/i] don't add up to that. You should find new sources. Your current ones are inadequate and inaccurate. [/quote] Initial tech terms you requested: TOOL: 30k NADC 36k CD: 30k (amongst other things) TSI: 12k Now far be it from me to do simple math, but I am pretty damn sure that adds up to 108k tech. Source = you [quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1301001871' post='2675032'] If legion wants their number lowered perhaps they should actually talk to me, as of yet, the only person even remotely of legion I have talked to in IRC in months is a Mr. Pappajacky or whatever. [/quote] See above. I never claimed that Legion could not negotiate the terms, but was rather dismissing the claim that Roq made that the 2 billion figure had already decreased or had been lowered due to release of top end. This was not the case. Edit: spelling Edited March 24, 2011 by The Crimson King Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1301002214' post='2675044'] This war sets a new precedent: you are punished for not abandon your allies and "white" peace has a validity time, after that reparations are ok even if the alliance in question is just defending an ally in a defensive war. [i]And I think to myself, what a wonderful world...[/i] [/quote] Getting people out by taking white peace off the table is nothing new. It was in used in Bi-Polar to get a number of alliances out. There is nothing new in play here despite people thinking it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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